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Runa posted:I think about these pages all the time whenever the question of "what is a Gundam" comes up It's especially funny because the Gamma Gundam was the original name for the Rick Dias, because it was built out of Gundarium Gamma. As for El5n being in on the plan, the take I saw that I tend to agree with is "he placidly accepted his phone back because Norea's just playing the game same as him and he got got, that's just how it goes sometimes."
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Apr 20, 2023 20:19
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Kchama posted:You two seem to be agreeing with each other, not disagreeing. i have reread this convo a few times and i can't figure out how it wasn't a disagreement with me saying "bringing these things around isn't a thing you casually do just in case, this was part of plan a" via "actually they totally could have stored those easily and conveniently" but you seem to be right so i must be being stupid about something
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Apr 20, 2023 20:21
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ninjewtsu posted:i have reread this convo a few times and i can't figure out how it wasn't a disagreement with me saying "bringing these things around isn't a thing you casually do just in case, this was part of plan a" via "actually they totally could have stored those easily and conveniently" but you seem to be right so i must be being stupid about something He was agreeing that they were part of the plan, the only quibbling was over how exactly they were hidden before being used.
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Apr 20, 2023 20:27
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I think the only real point of contention was "was the entire thing planned from the word go" or "was there a broad "Shaddiq fucks everything up" concept and the specifics were done on the fly", which isn't really all that significant of a dispute.
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Apr 20, 2023 20:32
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The answer to all of this will be "it's going to be very fun when Shaddiq bites off more than he can chew with all of his scheming and gets pretzeled inside his cockpit like he's Iok."
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Apr 20, 2023 20:33
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To be entirely fair to Shaddiq, he at least appears to be relatively good at being a scheming opportunistic ratfuck man, unlike Iok who was a walking brain contusion who was constantly being led by the nose at all times.
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Apr 20, 2023 20:41
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There hasnt really been any pushback and Sarius was a bit too trusting (and really he didnt want to dig that deep, might find something inconvenient)
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Apr 20, 2023 21:07
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https://twitter.com/gundam_info/status/1648885490366689280?t=hJexnd-IL0mPpS9xrC7sYw&s=19 Gotta get that Dawn of Ford radio, see if Ford has made it into the Benerit Group.
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Apr 20, 2023 22:26
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Kanos posted:To be entirely fair to Shaddiq, he at least appears to be relatively good at being a scheming opportunistic ratfuck man, unlike Iok who was a walking brain contusion who was constantly being led by the nose at all times. On the other hand, Iok was loyal, personally brave, and willing (to a fault) to put himself at risk whenever things got dangerous. Also, much less of a Nice Guy (tm).
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Apr 20, 2023 23:20
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Shaddiq is a way less frustrating and annoying character to see on screen than iok
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Apr 20, 2023 23:51
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Iok was a hate sink, he existed to make what wrestling people call cheap heat. He wasn’t really a character so much as a lever to use on the audience. Shaddiq is actually, like, a dude with motivations and actual characterization, not a stick the writers poke the audience with.
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Apr 21, 2023 00:24
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That 25 episodes' worth of catharsis was so worth it though. 
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Apr 21, 2023 00:34
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https://twitter.com/AsagiKurosagi/status/1645461611866636289
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Apr 21, 2023 01:14
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Babysitter Super Sleuth posted:Iok was a hate sink, he existed to make what wrestling people call cheap heat. He wasn’t really a character so much as a lever to use on the audience. Shaddiq is actually, like, a dude with motivations and actual characterization, not a stick the writers poke the audience with. All this doesn't preclude Shaddiq from also being a hate sink. I'm pulling for his smug face to get pushed in. Eventually his scheme won't go to plan and I want to see him break down.
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Apr 21, 2023 02:39
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this show owns i missed that apparently martin was the one to tell the guards about nika tho, i thought they just arrested them because of something else
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Apr 21, 2023 03:01
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Omnicrom posted:All this doesn't preclude Shaddiq from also being a hate sink. I'm pulling for his smug face to get pushed in. Eventually his scheme won't go to plan and I want to see him break down. Similarly I will be hooting and hollering when Elan Five puts his earrings onto Classic Elan and gets him shoved into the incinerator.
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Apr 21, 2023 03:14
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Babysitter Super Sleuth posted:Iok was a hate sink, he existed to make what wrestling people call cheap heat. He wasn’t really a character so much as a lever to use on the audience. Shaddiq is actually, like, a dude with motivations and actual characterization, not a stick the writers poke the audience with. He was more a lever to be used on the plot. The director needed a complete moron to undermine Tekkadan in the Mobile Armor arc, and thus, Iok was created.
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Apr 21, 2023 03:30
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Booky posted:this show owns I actually don't think he was the one who told the guards, because he was still on the phone with the police when they showed up and he looked super shocked when they arrived. I think they were coming after her anyways since Shaddiq's gang captured her in the middle of about to confess to the police. I think Martin was telling them about it on his own unaware of what happened. So he got beat to the punch and couldn't protect House Earth as a result from the consequences.
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Apr 21, 2023 03:48
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Nothing says that cut to Martin was at literally the same time. More likely the show was just using the Kuleshov effect, showing Martin immediately after the others getting arrested to imply what happened.
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Apr 21, 2023 03:57
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Kchama posted:I actually don't think he was the one who told the guards, because he was still on the phone with the police when they showed up and he looked super shocked when they arrived. I think they were coming after her anyways since Shaddiq's gang captured her in the middle of about to confess to the police. I think Martin was telling them about it on his own unaware of what happened. So he got beat to the punch and couldn't protect House Earth as a result from the consequences. I think you're misremembering. Martin wasn't in the room when the cops came in and it cut from that to Martin looking at his phone all guilty after they explicitly said they were looking for Nika Nanaura on suspicion of terrorism, and they had a scene where Martin confronts Nika about what she's up to and she blows him off.
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Apr 21, 2023 03:59
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Hellbore posted:I think you're misremembering. Martin wasn't in the room when the cops came in and it cut from that to Martin looking at his phone all guilty after they explicitly said they were looking for Nika Nanaura on suspicion of terrorism, and they had a scene where Martin confronts Nika about what she's up to and she blows him off. Waffleman_ posted:Nothing says that cut to Martin was at literally the same time. More likely the show was just using the Kuleshov effect, showing Martin immediately after the others getting arrested to imply what happened. They were also taking in House Earth as well. I mean, it could go either way as it was ambiguous. He surely was not in the same room, but he could have been in a nearby room. It would just be a weird time effect to cut to him having just finished the call and having the phone still in his hand like he just made a call AFTER they bust in and arrested everyone if he finished the call presumably a while before that. It makes more sense that Grassley is using nabbling Nika as a terrorist to gather up all of House Earth, since they're Suletta's backers and keeping Miorine out of his grasp. I do agree he was turning Nina in though.
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Apr 21, 2023 04:07
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Kchama posted:They were also taking in House Earth as well. I mean, it could go either way as it was ambiguous. He surely was not in the same room, but he could have been in a nearby room. It would just be a weird time effect to cut to him having just finished the call and having the phone still in his hand like he just made a call AFTER they bust in and arrested everyone if he finished the call presumably a while before that. It makes more sense that Grassley is using nabbling Nika as a terrorist to gather up all of House Earth, since they're Suletta's backers and keeping Miorine out of his grasp. I do agree he was turning Nina in though. I think the sequence of events from
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Apr 21, 2023 04:15
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Hellbore posted:I think the sequence of events from Yeah, Martin made the cliche tattletale dob-in thinking they'll just take Nika away and everything goes back to normal nice and clean, because he didn't expect the corporate thugs to just round up everyone and decide who's guilty later (typically; All of them).
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Apr 21, 2023 04:24
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So Nika was given the chance to go to school, according to her flashback. She's tied to Dawn of Fold so I'm wondering if Shaddiq knew about her association before she arrived and arranged to have her go to school so he'd had a point of contact with the group. They already know who he is and refer to him as The Prince so they've likely done jobs for him beforehand. I'm just wondering if Shaddiq maintained a network among the Earthborn war orphans and set up the Dawn of Fold alliance with Grassley on his own or if they were already associates and he's just taken the partnership for himself.
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Apr 21, 2023 04:41
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They might just intend to interrogate Earth House cause they have nothing on them, but I could be wrong. I doubt Shaddiq would want to turn in Nika cause she could reveal unpleasant things.
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Apr 21, 2023 06:25
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Neddy Seagoon posted:Yeah, Martin made the cliche tattletale dob-in thinking they'll just take Nika away and everything goes back to normal nice and clean, because he didn't expect the corporate thugs to just round up everyone and decide who's guilty later (typically; All of them). To be fair he had no way of knowing that somebody had lobbed a pail of poo poo at the fan.
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Apr 21, 2023 09:47
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It's been a WHILE since we got one of these, but gundaminfo accidentally put the synopsis blurb up early with the "waiting for premiere" video. (Link is provided for proof, but there's obviously nothing else there.) (REAL SPOILERS, obviously)Episode 15: Pursued by the Benerit Group's garrison forces, the Dawn of Fold which perpetrated the attack on Plant Quetta is forced to evacuate its hideout. Guel, who was captured by Olcott, is now a prisoner at the hideout. Having slain his own father, Guel remains sunk in deep despair.
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Apr 21, 2023 11:09
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Bob! You know with the big Eri and Suletta stuff last week I feel like a weight has heen somewhat lifted off my chest since I'm no longer fretting over it. Can't wait for that weight to be replaced with something equally distressing. Arc Hammer fucked around with this message at 13:26 on Apr 21, 2023 |
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Apr 21, 2023 13:08
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I rewatched episode 14 this morning because So Much Happened, and I’m starting to think El5n was in on it. When Sophie and Norea walk up to him hitting on Suletta, he holds out his hand to get his phone before Norea offers him the phone. When Sophie and Norea bust up the Rumble Ring, he says "those are the suits from Plant Quetta," which he wasn’t at (granted, he could have heard about that incident through other means, even if the facts are being suppressed). When the Gunvolvas appear, he says “nobody told me about those.” Lastly, when Norea tells him to raise his Permet score or he’ll die, the line read sounds like it’s an order from a commanding officer (again, there’s a caveat here that I don’t speak Japanese so I could be misinterpreting this.) It wasn’t a great idea to rewatch this episode because it’s got me feeling bad all over again. That poor nameless kid hit me harder this time than the first time.
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Apr 21, 2023 13:49
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I don't think I buy that, mostly because El5n doesn't seem to be getting anything out of working with Shaddiq and the DoF girls. His immediate response to Norea's threat is "I changed my face to stay alive, there's no way I'm dying in vain" and that seems to be his entire worldview in a nutshell. El5n is a dude who seems to be totally committed to looking out for number 1 and shows no interest at all in getting involved in anything that doesn't directly benefit him or keep him alive. I don't say he can't or won't eventually throw in with Shaddiq or another, different antagonist faction (the show has plenty of them), but in this incident he didn't get anything out of it and that seems to color everything he does. In his introductory scenes he's described as "even more twisted than el0n" and that twistedness means that I don't think he cares a wit about whatever Shaddiq is foisting, and his actions still line up with that interpretation as well. He could just hold out his hand because he realizes the DoF girls took his phone (in the previous episode he realizes it's gone in the same scene they take it) and assumes they were screwing around and that's nice but he wants it back now. He's also still a proxy for Peil so I have to assume that he heard about the Ur and Thorn, his line about the Gunvolvas could easily be read as almost sarcastic (as in "I figured something was going to happen because I recognize a poo poo-stirrer when I see one, but I didn't expect that!") As for Norea's line I didn't get that feeling at all. That line wasn't an order, it was a threat. She and Sophie just killed someone and now she's threatening El5n ("Raise your permet score or you'll die next"). It doesn't seem like she's saying "raise your permet score so this looks good" because firstly she doesn't say that, she just gave him a death threat in a battle where they killed someone and she's attacking indiscriminately, and secondly if putting on a realistic show is important he's already doing that by dodging and fighting back without using his GUND weaponry.
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Apr 21, 2023 17:40
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Yeah he held his hand out to say "I know you took it, give it back" I'm pretty sure, and the line about the gundovolas was basically him going "im a gundam pilot, peil's supposed to be keeping me in the know about this sort of stuff, no one told me you could do this poo poo with GUND" The permet score raising I think was a little bit of a pride thing, like "we're here to kill you dude, stop playing around"
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Apr 21, 2023 17:52
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Norea would have no reason to pickpocket Elan's phone if they were literally working together. Or to have to do recon on Pharact in first place when they could just get that information from its pilot. Especially considering she wasn't even able to do that because she couldn't access the GUND format without Elan. Her handing him back his stolen phone and neither commenting on it is just an understated comedy beat.
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Apr 21, 2023 18:43
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El5n seeing them kidnapping Sarius clues him in on what they were doing which is not something that would be of interest to him if he was working with them from the start. Its probably one of the more interesting things about this because we have no clue how he's going to use the info. Is he giving it to Piel, is he going to take it to earth house or try to use it directly on Shadiqq to blackmail him? I dont see him sitting on it at any point.
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Apr 21, 2023 20:39
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I don't think any of the other groups know that DoF and Shaddiq are linked.
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Apr 21, 2023 20:44
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BlitznBurst posted:Norea would have no reason to pickpocket Elan's phone if they were literally working together. Or to have to do recon on Pharact in first place when they could just get that information from its pilot. Especially considering she wasn't even able to do that because she couldn't access the GUND format without Elan. Her handing him back his stolen phone and neither commenting on it is just an understated comedy beat. Everyone’s making strong counter-arguments, but this one’s the most solid. Cao Ni Ma posted:El5n seeing them kidnapping Sarius clues him in on what they were doing which is not something that would be of interest to him if he was working with them from the start. Its probably one of the more interesting things about this because we have no clue how he's going to use the info. Is he giving it to Piel, is he going to take it to earth house or try to use it directly on Shadiqq to blackmail him? I dont see him sitting on it at any point. That’s true, he seems to be the only guy who knows why this attack was carried out, and by whom.
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Apr 21, 2023 20:53
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X-Ray Pecs posted:Okay one thing about this episode popped into my head last night: doesn’t Norea just walk up to El5n and give him his phone back? Was El5n in on the whole thing? I don't think he was in on it, he just doesn't care and wants to see how things unfold.
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Apr 21, 2023 20:55
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MonsterEnvy posted:I don't think any of the other groups know that DoF and Shaddiq are linked. True, but it shouldn't be difficult to put 2 and 2 together depending on Shaddiq's response to this. He saw 2 people drag Sarius out, any contradictions to this is going to make him suspicious
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Apr 21, 2023 20:59
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Apr 22, 2023 06:36
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https://twitter.com/G_Witch_M/status/1649684464136773632?s=20
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Apr 22, 2023 09:36
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She looks grumpy.
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Apr 22, 2023 09:48
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