(Thread IKs:
fart simpson)
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Ardennes posted:It is about loving both France and Australia for the benefit of guess who. France loses a big contract, which weakens their ability to act as a independent arms supplier, while Australia has to buy some old US subs it probably can't use without US permission. In addition, Australia has to dump an ungodly sub on a whole new set of submarines that it probably doesn't really need (conventional subs would have been fine for defense). Don't forget antagonizing their biggest trading partner!
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Apr 21, 2023 10:44
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| # ? May 25, 2024 18:03 |
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or are they actually that fuckin' retarded that they believed the u.s. promise of the latest and greatest nuclear subs (which we can't even build for ourselves on schedule because our capacity has been so degraded by neoliberalism)
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Apr 21, 2023 10:46
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Oneiros posted:i guess i haven't heard what aus's incentive in all this was. obviously the u.s. just wanted to gently caress france (and good, europe should be destroyed) but i dunno why aus has been playing along I think the implication is enough, most of the West's financial system is tied to the US, which means the US has effective ownership of their population. The only way to avoid it is completely switching gears toward BRICS but that is far easier said than done. The US is just going to keep on pulling poo poo like this until something finally breaks. Oneiros posted:or are they actually that fuckin' retarded that they believed the u.s. promise of the latest and greatest nuclear subs (which we can't even build for ourselves on schedule because our capacity has been so degraded by neoliberalism) Admittedly, the Virginia class is probably okay for a country like the US, it just makes no sense for Australia, especially considering the ridiculous plan they agreed to. Ardennes has issued a correction as of 10:50 on Apr 21, 2023 |
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Apr 21, 2023 10:47
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Ardennes posted:(conventional subs would have been fine for defense). thats the main issue right? conventional subs are better for defending australia but cant provide support to america in a war against china making australia both integrated into and dependent on us military strategy Megamissen has issued a correction as of 10:56 on Apr 21, 2023 |
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Apr 21, 2023 10:54
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Megamissen posted:thats the main issue right? snipes at france aside, that is likely the entire issue
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Apr 21, 2023 11:04
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Megamissen posted:thats the main issue right? On the strategic side yes, although the US by loving around so much, and meant that Australia wont have a real replacement for the Collins class until the 2040s while they could have at least had some more modern conventional French submarines to support US operations a decade or more earlier. The big winner as always is the American MIC.
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Apr 21, 2023 11:05
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I'm still surprised that people think Australia is ever going to take delivery of any theoretical subs after paying up. What are they going to do, ask for a refund? They'll pay the USA hundreds of billions to rent some US subs, with US crews, under US command. Some might call this protection money but (loud thump, silence)
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Apr 21, 2023 11:09
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Oneiros posted:or are they actually that fuckin' retarded that they believed the u.s. promise of the latest and greatest nuclear subs (which we can't even build for ourselves on schedule because our capacity has been so degraded by neoliberalism) I can assure you that nothing Australia does is decided by Australia.
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Apr 21, 2023 11:13
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DancingShade posted:I'm still surprised that people think Australia is ever going to take delivery of any theoretical subs after paying up. What are they going to do, ask for a refund? That is more or less how it is going to be. I assume there will be a ceremony where an Australia flag is placed on it and then the sub immediately goes to start operating with the rest of the 7th fleet.
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Apr 21, 2023 11:15
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Go look up what happened to Whitlam and you'll see why. We're a colony.
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Apr 21, 2023 11:17
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France was going to sell Australia nuclear submarines but nuclear submarines were thought of as being politically untenable in Australia (historically Australia and New Zealand were very anti nuclear) so France was asked to modify their submarines to be diesel electric. This led to delays and cost increases, which were the supposed rationale for ditching France and going for AUKUS. It really was that dumb. The French submarines were actually being built and would have been delivered lol Australia gave France €550m in compensation for cancelling the deal, though I suspect France are still annoyed. France’s motivation was partly to increase their Asia Pacific presence because it’s probably the most important region in the world. Also one of their largest colonies, New Caledonia, seems to be really done with their poo poo. Incidentally, AUKUS was just randomly announced one night and was never popular (not that this matters): https://johnmenadue.com/guardian-essential-poll-aukus-support-collapses-3-in-4-oppose/ quote:Reflecting the diminishing public support for the AUKUS deal, a new Guardian Essential Poll has found that only one quarter of Australians support paying the $368bn price tag to acquire nuclear submarines. For decades Australians were gung ho about going to war – almost any war. Today – despite the best efforts of the Nine Media (Peter Hartcher in particular) and other media – they are now far more hesitant. quote:The latest Nine Newspapers Resolve survey (18 March 2023) suggested a more complex reaction. The survey was based on a longer question than researchers generally use with a long preamble throwing together the number of submarines; the cost and the size of the order. Then it asked Do you support or oppose the purchase of these submarines?
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Apr 21, 2023 11:53
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Oneiros posted:lmfao i hadn't heard that the us/aus sub deal had devolved to dumping our secondhands on them It's good for the entertainment value. Aukus sub deal exposed Macron is a little cuck that he is. I think he recalled the ambassador and sheepishly sent him back next week. Also piss off regional power Indonesia. The best thing is the Anglo think tanks are so ignorant I haven't heard a single one of them say this will piss off Indonesia and push them toward China.
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Apr 21, 2023 12:45
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About using the submarine "co-development" deal to destroy partner countries' military industry and thus making them completely rely on the US MIC, they have done it many times. Just off the top of my head they did it to Taiwan's own indigenous anti ship missile program. The US strong armed Taiwan into cutting their own program and greatly increase the order of Harpoon. The Harpoon was scheduled to deliver around 2020 but then they delaied it to around 2030. Alot of the same replace and delay tactic to destroy the smaller and competing MIC. I am sure they did the same to most if not all of the Japanese home grown programs. Consider Japan now can't even make subsonic missile themselves and have to spend all their increased military budgets on Tomahawks. It's hilarious really.
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Apr 21, 2023 12:59
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stephenthinkpad posted:About using the submarine "co-development" deal to destroy partner countries' military industry and thus making them completely rely on the US MIC, they have done it many times. Just off the top of my head they did it to Taiwan's own indigenous anti ship missile program. The US strong armed Taiwan into cutting their own program and greatly increase the order of Harpoon. The Harpoon was scheduled to deliver around 2020 but then they delaied it to around 2030. Alot of the same replace and delay tactic to destroy the smaller and competing MIC. I am sure they did the same to most if not all of the Japanese home grown programs. Consider Japan now can't even make subsonic missile themselves and have to spend all their increased military budgets on Tomahawks. Everything getting made by the same small factory, run by some old geezers and a robot arm with an annual net profit of 500 billion spacebucks. Who programs the robot arm? I don't know, some Chinese student they hired on an internship then kicked out once he was done.
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Apr 21, 2023 13:12
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stephenthinkpad posted:About using the submarine "co-development" deal to destroy partner countries' military industry and thus making them completely rely on the US MIC, they have done it many times. Just off the top of my head they did it to Taiwan's own indigenous anti ship missile program. The US strong armed Taiwan into cutting their own program and greatly increase the order of Harpoon. The Harpoon was scheduled to deliver around 2020 but then they delaied it to around 2030. Alot of the same replace and delay tactic to destroy the smaller and competing MIC. I am sure they did the same to most if not all of the Japanese home grown programs. Consider Japan now can't even make subsonic missile themselves and have to spend all their increased military budgets on Tomahawks. those TW harpoons are $4.2M each their cheapest (lol) even funnier all this are happening at time when SK and japan are now posting record overall trade deficits
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Apr 21, 2023 13:45
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Imagine what guided weapons Taiwan, home of TSMC, could have come up with if allowed to develop them domestically unhindered. Nah lets buy some yank trash using technology from the 80s at a premium price. I'm sure it'll be fine. No refunds!
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Apr 21, 2023 13:53
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https://twitter.com/PDChina/status/1649400089016950786?t=U1uYLbZEcsSTE-_ResEJ6A&s=19 lol
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Apr 21, 2023 14:24
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I hate to say it, Elon was right. He made twitter funny again
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Apr 21, 2023 14:40
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Ghost Leviathan posted:Go look up what happened to Whitlam and you'll see why. We're a colony. the GG who dismissed Whitlam went to the US for school where he got familiar with Concepts in Action right?
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Apr 21, 2023 15:03
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Put custom titles to Western media and then removed them all is a good troll, I got to admit.
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Apr 21, 2023 15:50
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https://amp.theguardian.com/politics/2021/sep/11/declassified-documents-show-australia-assisted-cia-in-coup-against-chiles-salvador-allendequote:For 18 months from 1971, according to the US-based National Security Archive, Asis apparently conducted covert operations in Chile – including handling CIA-recruited Chilean assets in Santiago and filing intelligence reports to CIA headquarters in Langley, Virginia. https://johnmenadue.com/alex-mitchell-gough-whitlams-dismissal-and-the-cia/ quote:Canberra journalist Bill Pinwell provided the information that the CIA referred to the Governor-General as “our man Kerr” while Jonathan Kwitny of The Wall Street Journal explored Kerr’s links to the CIA fronts known as the Congress for Cultural Freedom and the Asia Foundation.
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Apr 21, 2023 16:42
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https://twitter.com/redstreamnet/status/1649346174892032000
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Apr 21, 2023 18:46
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DiscountDildos posted:https://twitter.com/PDChina/status/1649400089016950786?t=U1uYLbZEcsSTE-_ResEJ6A&s=19 westoids are gonna complain about certain
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Apr 21, 2023 19:03
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quick question if anyone knows: is red. the new redfish? i've been seeing them pop up and they seem very similar.
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Apr 21, 2023 19:34
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death to amerikkka
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Apr 21, 2023 20:37
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tristeham posted:death to amerikkka
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Apr 21, 2023 21:11
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the decadent east https://twitter.com/wwwYQ6661308579/status/1648972856498200576 the progressive west https://twitter.com/clairebearian/status/1649510109611974656 Some Guy TT has issued a correction as of 01:23 on Apr 22, 2023 |
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Apr 22, 2023 01:21
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Some Guy TT posted:the decadent east Those kids have delicious nutritious meals, but at what cost?
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Apr 22, 2023 01:52
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KomradeX posted:Those kids have delicious nutritious meals, but at what cost? well fed kids with no lunch debts dont make for good child labor
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Apr 22, 2023 01:54
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riddle me this tankies if australia doesnt get those submarines how are they going to deal with these https://twitter.com/CGMeifangZhang/status/1649514717814173702
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Apr 22, 2023 02:01
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Palladium posted:well fed kids with no lunch debts dont make for good child labor (adjusts victorian era top hat) You want to starve the kids to keep them thin, that way they can squeeze between all the dangerous moving parts of the machines on the factory floor. Plump ones get sucked into the wheels of the steam press. Nobody wants that. You have to send another kid in with a mop and bucket to clean it while still in operation because we're not turning that off and losing profits, absolutely not my good sir.
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Apr 22, 2023 02:15
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https://twitter.com/Orgetorix/status/1649552510254718979 smdh at china making a mockery of norms and good practice in regard to space exploration not like elon musk now to take a nice long sip of coffee while i check to see what spacex has been up to lately
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Apr 22, 2023 02:17
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Some Guy TT posted:riddle me this tankies if australia doesnt get those submarines how are they going to deal with these don’t like the paint job on this, 6/10 do better china
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Apr 22, 2023 02:27
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opening Pandora’s launchpad is not worth the risk
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Apr 22, 2023 02:30
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https://twitter.com/adam_tooze/status/1649378446378688519
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Apr 22, 2023 02:30
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DiscountDildos posted:https://twitter.com/PDChina/status/1649400089016950786?t=U1uYLbZEcsSTE-_ResEJ6A&s=19 hah still got mine bitches, china affiliated all day baby
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Apr 22, 2023 02:53
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https://twitter.com/CollinSLKoh/status/1649262638030028801
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Apr 22, 2023 03:01
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I'm juat going to assume this guy is dumb and wrong based solely on hi. Having the Ukrainian flag in his name
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Apr 22, 2023 03:21
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https://www.abc.net.au/news/2023-04-21/army-projects-drastically-cut-in-defence-shakeup/102254536quote:The federal government has confirmed its long-awaited response to the Defence Strategic Review (DSR) will include reducing the number of infantry fighting vehicles (IFVs) from 450 to 129 and cancelling a planned second regiment of self-propelled Howitzers. quote:Recommendations for army projects in review: The rapid erosion of Australian military capability steams ahead. No subs, a quarter of the original planned IFVs, just 30 artillery and everything else going to "himars" which will almost certainly be money spent on products never received by Australia. The good news is the US MIC is going to benefit at the expense of the usual suckers - Germany & South Korea who are going to lose planned sales. May as well all go home and just run up the US flag in a decade.
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Apr 22, 2023 03:28
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quote:deployed with great propaganda effect by Ukraine against Russia's invading forces.
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Apr 22, 2023 03:31
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