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(Thread IKs: skooma512)
 
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Stairmaster
Jun 8, 2012

https://www.statnews.com/2023/07/24/rise-in-cancer-young-people/

crossposting from the biosphere collapse thread because this is great news for the insurance industry

quote:

When both the nurse and the doctor broke down in tears as they delivered the news, Chris Gosline knew that something difficult lay ahead.

It was 5 a.m., after a long night in the emergency department at Beverly Hospital, where he’d gone for help with severe pain in his shoulder. A scan had detected tumors on his liver. Turns out, there’s a nerve connection that makes shoulder pain a possible sign of liver disease.

Further testing over the next couple of weeks clarified the cause: Gosline had stage 4 colorectal cancer, which had spread to his liver.

Gosline is in his mid-40s, healthy, and fit. This wasn’t supposed to happen.

But it did, and it’s part of a worldwide trend. An array of cancers — colorectal chief among them — are striking people younger than 50 at higher rates than in previous decades, prompting new screening guidelines, new research, and growing concern.

Why is this happening?

That’s “the very hard question that none of us really know the answer to,” said Timothy Rebbeck, professor of cancer prevention at the Harvard T.H. Chan School Of Public Health.

Theories abound, although none has firm data behind it.

But experts share a belief that the rise in cancer among younger adults may be driven by changes in the way many of us have lived our lives over the past half century.

“People born in 1990 have over double the risk of getting colon cancer compared to those born in 1950. And quadruple the risk of getting rectal cancer,” said Dr. Kimmie Ng, director of the Young-Onset Colorectal Cancer Center at the Dana-Farber Cancer Institute.

That means that at age 35, someone born in 1990 will face quadruple the risk of rectal cancer and double the risk of colon cancer when compared with the risk faced by a 35-year-old who was born in 1950.

Whether it’s sitting all day, consuming cured meats and sugar-sweetened drinks, taking antibiotics, or staying up late with the lights on, these practices — their effects probably interacting — seem to have had a profound impact on the internal workings of our bodies, disrupting metabolism and boosting inflammation.

Starting early in life and accumulating over the years, these behaviors can promote cancer in some people, in ways that are little understood.

A flurry of research is underway to get to the bottom of it. But one thing is clear: Genes alone are not to blame.

Despite the overall increase in cancer, the incidence of hereditary cancers likely hasn’t changed, said Dr. Andrew T. Chan, a gastroenterologist and chief of the Clinical and Translational Epidemiology Unit at Massachusetts General Hospital.

“The underlying genetic risk profile for cancer hasn’t shifted over the last several decades,” Chan said. “This points to the idea that cancer is very much also a disease of environment and lifestyle — it’s not just about your genes.”

But genes may play a role in how any individual responds to a given risk factor.

“The hypothesis is that there are susceptible people out there who are now being exposed to more risk factors or exposed to those risk factors earlier,” Rebbeck said.

Cancer remains about 20 times more common among older people than among the young. But doctors are concerned about the upward trend, as they increasingly diagnose malignancies once infrequently seen in anyone under 50.

Colorectal cancer has increased in people younger than 50 by about 2 percent a year since the 1990s. The rise is seen “in both men and women and in all races and ethnicities and around the world,” said Ng, of Dana-Farber.

Breast cancer has also shown an accelerating increase among women under 50, rising only slightly from 2000 to 2015 but increasing by 2 percent a year from 2015 to 2019.

Recognizing these trends, in 2021 the US Preventive Services Task Force lowered the recommended age to begin colon cancer screening to 45, and this year it proposed that breast cancer screening start at age 40 instead of 50.

Still, the trend isn’t limited to these two cancers. An analysis of data from 44 countries, published last fall, showed that more than a dozen cancers have increased among people under 50. The most common cancer types trending upward were breast, colorectal, uterine, kidney, and thyroid cancers among women, and colorectal, kidney, liver, prostate, and thyroid cancers among men (although increased screening may account for the last two). But other cancers have also increased in many countries, said Dr. Tomotaka Ugai, an instructor at Harvard Medical School who led the research.

Pancreatic cancer, an especially deadly disease with only a 10 percent survival rate, is also increasing among young people, said Dr. Brian M. Wolpin, director of the Gastrointestinal Cancer Center at Dana-Farber. According to National Cancer Institute data, pancreatic cancer among men younger than 50 increased 6.5 percent a year from 2017 to 2019; the yearly increase among women was 2.4 percent from 2000 to 2019. Pancreatic cancer is expected to strike 64,000 Americans this year, compared with 300,000 breast cancer cases and 153,000 colorectal cancers.

The behaviors that predispose people to pancreatic cancer at any age seem to be magnified in the young, Wolpin said. For example, while smoking will increase the risk of pancreatic cancer for anyone, that effect is especially strong at younger ages.

Obesity, as defined by BMI or body-mass index, remains the prime suspect in the search for the cause of early-onset cancers, especially for colorectal cancer, for several reasons. One is circumstantial: The average BMI rose in parallel with early-onset colorectal cancer, increasing at the same rate over the same time period.

The habits that can cause people to gain weight — lack of exercise, poor diet, sweetened beverages — also boost cancer risk.

But even independent of those factors, experts say, carrying excess fat by itself can fuel cancer by affecting hormones, insulin, and metabolism.

“The actions of obesity are to change hormones, to change inflammation,” Rebbeck said. “So obesity itself can be an outward sign of things going on in your body that are associated with cancer.”

Obesity may induce “a low grade inflammatory environment within the lining of the colon,” said Dr. Joel B. Mason, professor of medicine and nutrition at Tufts University. “And by doing so, it provokes certain changes in the cells that line the colon and that ultimately can lead precancerous and cancerous tumors to develop.”

Localities identified as economically disadvantaged bear a disproportionate burden of early-onset colorectal cancer and those same areas also have higher rates of obesity, Mason said. “Is it merely the lifestyle that’s associated with being economically or socially disadvantaged? Or is it specifically obesity itself? Or is it both these factors?”

Still, says Ng, not every study supports the notion that obesity leads to cancer in the young.

“And anecdotally, I can just tell you that so many of my young patients that we see are perfectly fit,” she added. “They’re marathon runners, they have healthy diets, they are not obese. And so it does go beyond just obesity.”

Chris Gosline is one of her patients.

When Ng told Gosline that he had stage 4 colorectal cancer a year ago, he was stunned. “I’m not overweight. I’ve been running my whole life. I eat well, I don’t smoke, I don’t drink heavily. I don’t do drugs of any sort,” he said. “You feel like you’re following all the rules , doing right by your body, then out of nowhere….”

Plus, going back generations his family has no history of cancer.

Gosline started a chemotherapy regimen that involves eight weeks of infusions followed by a four-week break. He’s also switched to a low-carbohydrate diet that limits sugar and red meat, and includes healthy oils like avocado.

A year after his diagnosis, Gosline, who is 45 and lives with his wife and son in Manchester-by-the-Sea, says he’s responding well to the chemo. The tumors in his colon and liver are not visible on scans. But no one has spoken of remission or told him he could stop the chemo. “No one knows exactly what the future holds,” he said.

Gosline has been able to continue working through treatment. He owns a company that operates solar farm battery storage units.

“I haven’t slowed down at all,” he said. “I keep pushing through.” When he’s undergoing chemo, he continues the infusions at home, carrying around a bag of medicine for 48 hours.

When an infusion is done, he goes running. “I’ll start a run and feel terrible. When I’m done with the run it feels very helpful. … I’m in the best shape of my life right now, very fit.” He runs four to five miles every other day with weekly longer runs.

“There’s a lot of us out there, come to find out,” Gosline said. “People living a healthy profile. Then, out of nowhere it’s, boom, you have cancer. … There’s something going on out there, some variable.”

Ng is among those investigating what those variables may be. “We do think that it may be other changes in the environment,” Ng said. “Is it increasing antibiotic use? Is it components of these ultra processed foods that have emerged with modern lifestyles, that is changing the microbiome?”

The community of microbes that live in the intestines, known as the gut microbiome, is critical to health, and plays a role in digestion and in stimulating the immune system. The microbiome can be disrupted by chronic stress, a poor diet, and antibiotics, among other things, and such disruption could be a factor in promoting cancer.

The role of obesity gets complicated when it comes to breast cancer. Women who were overweight as children have a lower risk of cancer throughout their lifetime, while after menopause obesity increases the risk, said Heather Eliassen, professor of nutrition and epidemiology at the Harvard T. H. Chan School of Public Health. After menopause when the ovaries stop producing estrogen, Eliassen said, fat tissue converts other hormones into estrogen, which fuels the growth of cancer cells.

Some of the increase in breast cancer results from changes in reproductive choices, especially having a first child later in life, as many women do these days, she added.

During pregnancy, breast tissue changes in ways that can protect against the mutations that lead to cancer — provided the pregnancy happens early in life. But when decades elapse between the start of menstruation and the first pregnancy, women accumulate damage to the DNA in their breast tissue. Then, pregnancy “can fuel the growth of cells that may be harboring mutations,” Eliassen said, leaving women at higher risk of breast cancer for five or 10 years after a pregnancy.

So women who bear their first child in their mid- to late 30s or early 40s are at greater risk than women who never become pregnant. And women who never have a pregnancy are at greater risk than those who have their first child in their 20s.

To make matters worse, Eliassen said, the type of breast tumors that form before menopause tend to be harder to treat and more aggressive.

This is true of many early-onset cancers, including in the colon: They tend to be more aggressive. That may be because they’re detected later — most young people don’t screen for cancer or suspect it as the cause of symptoms.

But there are also hints that early-onset cancers are biologically different from cancers later in life.

Chan, the Harvard epidemiologist, said his young adult patients who undergo colonoscopies to check on a gastrointestinal complaint often find they already have polyps, a precursor to colon cancer. “We’re finding polyps at 25 or 30 years old,” he said. “It’s clear that there is something different happening even before someone turns 25.”

Strangely, colon cancer tumors in young people typically form on the left side of the colon and in the rectum, Ng said, while no such pattern is seen in the old. No one knows why. And young people with metastatic colon cancer, even if they are more fit and receiving more intensive therapy, have survival rates no better than older people, according to recent research at Dana-Farber.

“The very youngest patients do seem to have a biologically different disease,” Ng said.

But experts caution that none of this bad news should leave people feeling helpless. While the roots of cancer may form early in life, Chan said, “I don’t think anyone should think there’s a point of no return.”

We already know a lot about the clear risks to health, Rebbeck said. Ample data show that certain things are bad for you — ultraprocessed foods, cigarettes, alcohol, sugar-sweetened beverages, lack of physical activity, inadequate sleep.

“Sleep, diet, exercise — those things are actionable,” Rebbeck said. “And so they are very important because you may be able to do something about them.”

Experts see reason to stay hopeful. Treatment for both colon cancer and breast cancer has improved and survival rates keep going up.

And there is lots of promising research underway. Dana-Farber’s Beyond CRC Project is enrolling early-onset colon cancer patients in a study that will gather detailed information on lifestyle and diet, analyze tumors, and collect blood and stool samples.

The National Cancer Institute and Cancer Research UK have listed early-onset cancer as one of the “grand challenges” for researchers and will award $25 million next year to a winning team.

“It is encouraging that so much attention is being paid to the early-onset cancer issue,” Rebbeck said. “There is scientific progress being made, and I hope we will have answers.”

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La Louve Rouge
Jun 25, 2017

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS

In Training posted:

I didn't know the Dems passed a bill undoing the retirement benefit prefunding for USPS that bush used to assassinate the department. That's pretty based. Thank you Brandon.

You rear end. I had to go back and reread the entire awful article to confirm they in fact did not do that but instead did some wonk bullshit that doesn't solve anything longterm

Centrist Committee
Aug 6, 2019

Stairmaster posted:

https://www.statnews.com/2023/07/24/rise-in-cancer-young-people/

crossposting from the biosphere collapse thread because this is great news for the insurance industry

beginning to think capitalism is bad for me

Nodelphi
Jan 30, 2004

We are all quite capable of believing in anything as long as it's improbable.

Ham Wrangler
A surgeon buddy of mine is so worried about cancer (he has a family history of it a mile long) that he pays out of pocket to get a full body MRI every year. It’s about $900.

Pittsburgh Fentanyl Cloud
Apr 7, 2003


https://www.wpxi.com/news/local/inmate-dies-allegheny-county-jail/O5YCYJ453JA65E4Y5N5WGOACRA/

quote:

PITTSBURGH — An inmate at the Allegheny County Jail died after being found unresponsive Sunday morning.

Around 7 a.m., correctional staff found the 59-year-old man unresponsive, according to information provided by the jail. Staff members performed lifesaving measures until paramedics arrived. The man was pronounced dead around 7:20 a.m.

He was incarcerated on Jan. 11 after being brought in on retail theft, theft by unlawful taking, evading arrest and disorderly conduct, according to a release. On April 28, the jail said the man was committed by the courts to Torrance State Hospital. He has been housed in the jail’s mental health unit, where there are currently 31 inmates awaiting transfer to Torrance.

They let this guy fuckin die over shoplifting

Zodium
Jun 19, 2004

Nodelphi posted:

A surgeon buddy of mine is so worried about cancer (he has a family history of it a mile long) that he pays out of pocket to get a full body MRI every year. It’s about $900.

hmmm ... cancer rates up. mri use up. coincidence?

Spaced God
Feb 8, 2014

All torment, trouble, wonder and amazement
Inhabits here: some heavenly power guide us
Out of this fearful country!




If they had their way he wouldn't have even made it to a jail cell

In Training
Jun 28, 2008

La Louve Rouge posted:

You rear end. I had to go back and reread the entire awful article to confirm they in fact did not do that but instead did some wonk bullshit that doesn't solve anything longterm

https://www.congress.gov/bill/117th-congress/house-bill/3076

"The bill repeals the requirement that the USPS annually prepay future retirement health benefits."

insane clown pussy
Jun 20, 2023


let that be a warning to any would-be thieves

Pittsburgh Fentanyl Cloud
Apr 7, 2003


https://triblive.com/local/report-on-allegheny-county-jail-deaths-finds-no-trends-or-common-factors-that-led-to-them/


quote:


A report commissioned by Allegheny County Jail found “no significant trends or common factors that would show a particular weakness or gap in operations” that led to 27 inmate deaths at the jail over five years.

Father Wendigo
Sep 28, 2005
This is, sadly, more important to me than bettering myself.

Stairmaster posted:

https://www.statnews.com/2023/07/24/rise-in-cancer-young-people/

crossposting from the biosphere collapse thread because this is great news for the insurance industry

Eh, probably nothing. Who can say what causes colorectal cancer?

*cracks open his 12th cold, refreshing Diet Coke of the day*

mawarannahr
May 21, 2019

Nodelphi posted:

A surgeon buddy of mine is so worried about cancer (he has a family history of it a mile long) that he pays out of pocket to get a full body MRI every year. It’s about $900.

you can do this? I should look into it. I will Never do it.

The Demilich
Apr 9, 2020

The First Rites of Men Were Mortuary, the First Altars Tombs.



Covid exacerbates everything as well lol
Biden let it riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiip

WrasslorMonkey
Mar 5, 2012


lol, if you're lucky your bank has an app, and if you're lucky it supports Zelle, and if you're lucky the person you need to send money to has a bank with an app that supports Zelle and they have set it up.

mila kunis
Jun 10, 2011

ah hell yeah, robert moses simulator 2

Justin Tyme
Feb 22, 2011


WrasslorMonkey posted:

lol, if you're lucky your bank has an app, and if you're lucky it supports Zelle, and if you're lucky the person you need to send money to has a bank with an app that supports Zelle and they have set it up.

this is the greatest economy on earth, allowing bright entrepreneurs to get in on the "giving money to other people" business by siphoning off usage fees

imagine going to a drug store in the 1800's and some guy runs up to you at the counter offering to take the money from your hand and put it into the hand of the clerk for a modest nickel fee

mawarannahr
May 21, 2019

mila kunis posted:

ah hell yeah, robert moses simulator 2

where's the jolyon sim?

sonatinas
Apr 15, 2003

Seattle Karate Vs. L.A. Karate

WrasslorMonkey posted:

lol, if you're lucky your bank has an app, and if you're lucky it supports Zelle, and if you're lucky the person you need to send money to has a bank with an app that supports Zelle and they have set it up.

I tried to send money to people using anything that wasn’t a check and it’s like might as well be 1960. nobody has any of this poo poo set up.

F_Shit_Fitzgerald
Feb 2, 2017
Probation
Can't post for 35 minutes!

Capitalist efficiency at work. That's one fewer mouths to have to feed on gummint funds.



(I joke but realtalk: poo poo like this is why I'm a prison and cop abolitionist.)

Pittsburgh Fentanyl Cloud
Apr 7, 2003


WrasslorMonkey posted:

lol, if you're lucky your bank has an app, and if you're lucky it supports Zelle, and if you're lucky the person you need to send money to has a bank with an app that supports Zelle and they have set it up.

also if someone steals your money via Zelle you have no recourse iirc

Pittsburgh Fentanyl Cloud
Apr 7, 2003


F_Shit_Fitzgerald posted:

Capitalist efficiency at work. That's one fewer mouths to have to feed on gummint funds.



(I joke but realtalk: poo poo like this is why I'm a prison and cop abolitionist.)

That jail is notorious for killing people with medical conditions by withholding care, they outsourced their medical stuff starting in 2012 and everything's been hosed since then. A diabetic died because they locked him up and ignored his requests for medication and the family couldn't afford a lawyer.

Turtle Sandbox
Dec 31, 2007

by Fluffdaddy

Vox Nihili posted:

It's really funny that people have apparently accepted the idea that tropical fruits are strictly gated behind capitalism. This is a stale artifact of the particular historical circumstances of the USSR and the Cold War rather than a universal truth.

Most people can't understand why people did anything before currency existed, after all, the only reason to do something is to get paid.

Frosted Flake
Sep 13, 2011

Semper Shitpost Ubique

Did they ever explain if the apparent rise of ADHD and Autism were just the result of better monitoring or if there's actually something going on? I know both are spectrum disorders, and that it seems a lot of people would have got by fine in previous eras, mostly it would come across as a personality, but I wonder if there was a real change in the prevalence of either condition?

Turtle Sandbox posted:

Most people can't understand why people did anything before currency existed, after all, the only reason to do something is to get paid.

It's why the "Neo-feudalism" discourse is hilarious. Feudalism cannot function on the basis of currency, it's 100% social, not market, relationships. Rich people are going to get killed by their huscarls on day 1.

Xaris
Jul 25, 2006

Lucky there's a family guy
Lucky there's a man who positively can do
All the things that make us
Laugh and cry

Frosted Flake posted:

Did they ever explain if the apparent rise of ADHD and Autism were just the result of better monitoring or if there's actually something going on? I know both are spectrum disorders, and that it seems a lot of people would have got by fine in previous eras, mostly it would come across as a personality, but I wonder if there was a real change in the prevalence of either condition?

I’m phone posting at work so I can’t give a long answer right now, but quick answer: yes, rates are and have been going up a lot. I’ll post more later

the quick obvious comparison to demonstrate that it is well known, people who live next to US interstates have much higher incidence rates

why is mostly causation=correlation, but it’s pretty obvious if you stick a bunch of endocrine disrupters in fetuse, infants and even
pre pubescent, you are going to get spicy brains

Crazypoops
Jul 17, 2017



Frosted Flake posted:

It's like I have some sort of complex where she's a mother and lady on the one hand, and a whore on the other.

Thanks Tony soprano

insane clown pussy
Jun 20, 2023

Frosted Flake posted:

and that it seems a lot of people would have got by fine in previous eras

haha

lol

Bar Ran Dun
Jan 22, 2006




Frosted Flake posted:

Did they ever explain if the apparent rise of ADHD and Autism were just the result of better monitoring or if there's actually something going on? I know both are spectrum disorders, and that it seems a lot of people would have got by fine in previous eras, mostly it would come across as a personality, but I wonder if there was a real change in the prevalence of either condition?

I think it was the capture of G&T programs by the wealthy. That used to catch an awful lot of the high functioning end of the autism spectrum. but a lot of those folks are 2E and now a lot of the state eligibility criteria now filters them out along with the minorities and poor.

slave to my cravings
Mar 1, 2007

Got my mind on doritos and doritos on my mind.

Xaris posted:

I’m phone posting at work so I can’t give a long answer right now, but quick answer: yes, rates are and have been going up a lot. I’ll post more later

the quick obvious comparison to demonstrate that it is well known, people who live next to US interstates have much higher incidence rates

why is mostly causation=correlation, but it’s pretty obvious if you stick a bunch of endocrine disrupters in fetuse, infants and even
pre pubescent, you are going to get spicy brains

hearing you loud and clear on “endocrine disrupters” say no more 😉

Crazypoops
Jul 17, 2017



How spectrum kids did in previous eras

Farmer: "son I need you to plow the field with me"

Son: "here is a detailed word accurate break down of the the complete pokemon lore starting from..."

Traveling merchant: "so how is your son Farmer?"

Farmer: "witches took him"

Willa Rogers
Mar 11, 2005

In Training posted:

Yeah in 2007, bush admin passed a bill requiring the USPS budget to including 100% prefunding of all employees health & retirement benefits 75 years in advance, instantly adding like a $40 billion hole in their operational budget, instantly bankrupting the organization. Obama of course, reversed course on this in his first 100 days and the post office has been great ever since :)

lmao, both houses of congress had democrat majorities for that 2007 bill.

net work error
Feb 26, 2011

That cancer article is scary but I'm gonna still eat trash.

Frosted Flake
Sep 13, 2011

Semper Shitpost Ubique

Crazypoops posted:

How spectrum kids did in previous eras

Farmer: "son I need you to plow the field with me"

Son: "here is a detailed word accurate break down of the the complete pokemon lore starting from..."

Traveling merchant: "so how is your son Farmer?"

Farmer: "witches took him"

lol I figured, you know how there's a type of Victorian imperial adventurer or artist that breaks down to "repressed homosexual"? Well, surely autistic people were the people who translated Sanskrit or got really into Egyptology or whatever? The lower class autistic people might have just been really good at plowing?

Pittsburgh Fentanyl Cloud
Apr 7, 2003


net work error posted:

That cancer article is scary but I'm gonna still eat trash.

A lot of that poo poo is just genetic and the die was cast before you could have done anything about it. The oldest person to ever live smoked a cigarette and drank booze every day into her 100s.

RadiRoot
Feb 3, 2007
the cell towers are the cause of the cancer.

skooma512
Feb 8, 2012

You couldn't grok my race car, but you dug the roadside blur.

mawarannahr posted:

you can do this? I should look into it. I will Never do it.

I would say he probably gets to have real diagnostics done on him regularly and not just fobbed off as a hypochondriac or hysterical woman because he's in the biz and knows people and can afford it.

One of us in our 30s asking for this would get "lol no I'm not ordering that get off google, $400 dollars please"

Crazypoops posted:

How spectrum kids did in previous eras

Farmer: "son I need you to plow the field with me"

Son: "here is a detailed word accurate break down of the the complete pokemon lore starting from..."

Traveling merchant: "so how is your son Farmer?"

Farmer: "witches took him"

Died of a disease while young like many many kids. No need to get elaborate.

Xaris posted:

I’m phone posting at work so I can’t give a long answer right now, but quick answer: yes, rates are and have been going up a lot. I’ll post more later

the quick obvious comparison to demonstrate that it is well known, people who live next to US interstates have much higher incidence rates

why is mostly causation=correlation, but it’s pretty obvious if you stick a bunch of endocrine disrupters in fetuse, infants and even
pre pubescent, you are going to get spicy brains

Maybe it's all the microplastics from tires :thunk:

It really messes with coho salmon, but hey, humans are way more complex and break in far more subtle and insidious ways, which is to say no all these boutique disorders and cancers are not related to all these novel forms of pollution invented within living memory and then made a cornerstone of society.



Frosted Flake posted:

Did they ever explain if the apparent rise of ADHD and Autism were just the result of better monitoring or if there's actually something going on? I know both are spectrum disorders, and that it seems a lot of people would have got by fine in previous eras, mostly it would come across as a personality, but I wonder if there was a real change in the prevalence of either condition?

My ADHD would probably be less noticeable and debilitating if I didn't have so many little objects that have to travel with me 30 miles round trip with me every day on an exacting schedule and have to juggle all kinds of disparate tasks and appointments that occur entirely out of the physical realm.


Inventory of guy in 1850: Some pocket change and a house key maybe

Inventory of me in 2023: Car key, house key, work phone, personal phone, wallet (with ID and credit card that must all be accounted for).

Whoa the guy that habitually loses stuff because of wigglebrains loses so much stuff and is constantly having to track it all down.

Shageletic
Jul 25, 2007

WrasslorMonkey posted:

lol, if you're lucky your bank has an app, and if you're lucky it supports Zelle, and if you're lucky the person you need to send money to has a bank with an app that supports Zelle and they have set it up.

Even Zelle is a massively inferior version of what the rest of the world uses. A hold of 3 business days is a specifically US phenomenon built by a driftwood of bureaucratic nonsense meant to hold up monopolies.

net work error
Feb 26, 2011

Pittsburgh Fentanyl Cloud posted:

A lot of that poo poo is just genetic and the die was cast before you could have done anything about it. The oldest person to ever live smoked a cigarette and drank booze every day into her 100s.

The article said genetics can't account for the entirety of the sharp increase

croup coughfield
Apr 8, 2020
Probation
Can't post for 73 days!

net work error posted:

The article said genetics can't account for the entirety of the sharp increase

lol at pfc reading

Thoguh
Nov 8, 2002

College Slice
The best part about the US system is that if someone knows your account and routing numbers they can just initiate a transfer and empty your account and it's up to you to deal with the damage because even if you get your money back it's still gonna be a huge headache and time commitment.

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FlapYoJacks
Feb 12, 2009

croup coughfield posted:

lol at pfc reading

Landlords can't read lol.

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