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Splicer
Oct 16, 2006

from hell's heart I cast at thee
🧙🐀🧹🌙🪄🐸

PurpleXVI posted:

Fist, Fist, Fist, Fist, Fist and Suplex.
I thought this was going to end slightly differently.

Or not, whatever you're into.

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Asterite34
May 19, 2009



Ah yes, the six character stats of Up, Down, Top, Bottom, Charm and Strange

Leraika
Jun 14, 2015

Luckily, I *did* save your old avatar. Fucked around and found out indeed.
up down left right a b start

whydirt
Apr 18, 2001


Gaz Posting Brigade :c00lbert:
The four core attributes of Blinky, Pinky, Inky, and Clyde

The Deleter
May 22, 2010
Yakko, Wakko, Dot, Pinky, Brain

goatface
Dec 5, 2007

I had a video of that when I was about 6.

I remember it being shit.


Grimey Drawer

The Deleter posted:

Yakko, Wakko, Dot, Pinky, Brain

Chicken Boo

dwarf74
Sep 2, 2012



Buglord

goatface posted:

Chicken Boo
Oh yeah, Disguise has to be based on something.

whydirt
Apr 18, 2001


Gaz Posting Brigade :c00lbert:
The four attributes: Hold ‘Em, Fold ‘Em, Walk Away, Run.

mllaneza
Apr 28, 2007

Veteran, Bermuda Triangle Expeditionary Force, 1993-1952




Nessus posted:

Management, Stealth, Violence, Hardware, Software, Wetware.

There's a sci-fi hack in that.

Runa
Feb 13, 2011

butcher, baker, candlestick maker

Xiahou Dun
Jul 16, 2009

We shall dive down through black abysses... and in that lair of the Deep Ones we shall dwell amidst wonder and glory forever.



whydirt posted:

The four attributes: Hold ‘Em, Fold ‘Em, Walk Away, Run.

O this is very evocative. A whole RPG about riding the rails and getting into hijinx popped into my head the second I read this. Very O Brother, Where Art Thou?.

DalaranJ
Apr 15, 2008

Yosuke will now die for you.
I’m trying to create/modify a class to be a tank/defender. What’s vital for that sort of role? I’m thinking access to the best defensive options, and some move to directly draw attention from enemies, but I don’t have a lot of experience with tactical combat focused games. What makes a good defender ability in comparison to a bad one?

Otherkinsey Scale
Jul 17, 2012

Just a little bit of sunshine!

Leraika posted:

up down left right a b start

Min-maxing by putting +2 in left and -1 in right, which I can avoid rolling by just rotating 270° to the left instead.

CitizenKeen
Nov 13, 2003

easygoing pedant
The recently Kickstarted Outgunned (the spiritual sequel to Broken Compass) has my favorite stat array of all time:
  • Brawn (Endure, Fight, Force, Stunt)
  • Nerves (Cool, Drive, Shoot, Survival)
  • Smooth (Flirt, Leadership, Speech, Style)
  • Focus (Detect, Fix, Heal, Know)
  • Crime (Awareness, Dexterity, Stealth, Streetwise)

Jimbozig
Sep 30, 2003

I like sharing and ice cream and animals.

DalaranJ posted:

I’m trying to create/modify a class to be a tank/defender. What’s vital for that sort of role? I’m thinking access to the best defensive options, and some move to directly draw attention from enemies, but I don’t have a lot of experience with tactical combat focused games. What makes a good defender ability in comparison to a bad one?

Defenders fundamentally need 2 things: a way to take hits and a way to respond when enemies go after your friends.

Taking hits can be: having high base HP, having damage resistance, having good recovery or self-heals, being able to block/negate some hits. (Avoiding hits is broadly similar, but crucially does not feel "tanky" - the 4e swordmage had high AC but couldn't handle it if they actually did take a bunch of hits.)

Responding to enemies attacking friends can be: taunts (force them to attack you), marking (attack enemies if they attack anyone but you), positioning (lock them down so they can't get to your friends), interposing (take hits for nearby allies), shielding (negate hits for nearby allies)

Think about ways these mechanics can be ally-focused (I get to attack any enemy who attacks this ally) or enemy-focused (I get to attack this enemy if they attack any ally), or focused on some other condition or trigger (I get to attack any enemy that deals more than X damage to any ally).

I generally don't like taunts to be common because that takes away all choice from the GM. That's fine as a rare thing.

Capfalcon
Apr 6, 2012

No Boots on the Ground,
Puny Mortals!

One version of "taunting" that I've seen that seems to be more generally acceptable is "Challenging." Think like a Knight or Paladin who challenges someone to combat, and if they refuse, they can do massive damage against the honorless dog. A key wrinkle is that the target understands the challenge's effects in the fiction, so they can ignore it or not as they would normally. It keeps the defender protecting people in a lot of situations, and when the chips are down, they can sometimes pull out massive damage to on enemies who aren't "playing by the rules."

Splicer
Oct 16, 2006

from hell's heart I cast at thee
🧙🐀🧹🌙🪄🐸

Jimbozig posted:

I generally don't like taunts to be common because that takes away all choice from the GM. That's fine as a rare thing.
Yeah, a good bread and butter defender mechanic presents a lose/lose(/lose/lose) choice and it's up to the gm/enemy to pick the least disadvantageous.

Splicer
Oct 16, 2006

from hell's heart I cast at thee
🧙🐀🧹🌙🪄🐸

Capfalcon posted:

One version of "taunting" that I've seen that seems to be more generally acceptable is "Challenging." Think like a Knight or Paladin who challenges someone to combat, and if they refuse, they can do massive damage against the honorless dog. A key wrinkle is that the target understands the challenge's effects in the fiction, so they can ignore it or not as they would normally. It keeps the defender protecting people in a lot of situations, and when the chips are down, they can sometimes pull out massive damage to on enemies who aren't "playing by the rules."
In the above vocabulary that would be a mark rather than a taunt. E: hmm scratch that, a mark wouldn't trigger if the target just kind of stood there.

Splicer fucked around with this message at 01:47 on Aug 7, 2023

Tuxedo Catfish
Mar 17, 2007

You've got guts! Come to my village, I'll buy you lunch.
imo player-facing hard taunt abilities are fine, GM cognitive load is high enough as it is and abilities the enemy can squirm out of like that don't feel as good to use as a hard "no"

by the same ticket devil's choice powers are a wonderful feature for enemies because it lets the players feel like they outsmarted you

My Lovely Horse
Aug 21, 2010

Otherkinsey Scale posted:

Min-maxing by putting +2 in left and -1 in right, which I can avoid rolling by just rotating 270° to the left instead.
Ah, the Zoolander RPG

Arivia
Mar 17, 2011

Leraika posted:

up down left right a b start

i'm not going to put any points into a, then i can speedrun the campaign with only half an a press

Gort
Aug 18, 2003

Good day what ho cup of tea

whydirt posted:

The four attributes: Hold ‘Em, Fold ‘Em, Walk Away, Run.

Don't forget Die In Your Sleep

GimpInBlack
Sep 27, 2012

That's right, kids, take lots of drugs, leave the universe behind, and pilot Enlightenment Voltron out into the cosmos to meet Alien Jesus.

whydirt posted:

The four attributes: Hold ‘Em, Fold ‘Em, Walk Away, Run.

We're talking about 6 attribute spreads though, so you need to add Count and Deal

Splicer
Oct 16, 2006

from hell's heart I cast at thee
🧙🐀🧹🌙🪄🐸

Leraika posted:

up down left right a b start

Otherkinsey Scale posted:

Min-maxing by putting +2 in left and -1 in right, which I can avoid rolling by just rotating 270° to the left instead.

My Lovely Horse posted:

Ah, the Zoolander RPG
I enjoyed this exchange.

tanglewood1420
Oct 28, 2010

The importance of this mission cannot be overemphasized
Chico, Harpo, Groucho, Gummo, Zeppo and Karl

Splicer
Oct 16, 2006

from hell's heart I cast at thee
🧙🐀🧹🌙🪄🐸

Gort posted:

Don't forget Die In Your Sleep
That's a value or motive.

whydirt
Apr 18, 2001


Gaz Posting Brigade :c00lbert:
Dare ye learn the forbidden rite of Counting Your Money At The Table?

GimpInBlack
Sep 27, 2012

That's right, kids, take lots of drugs, leave the universe behind, and pilot Enlightenment Voltron out into the cosmos to meet Alien Jesus.

Otherkinsey Scale posted:

Min-maxing by putting +2 in left and -1 in right, which I can avoid rolling by just rotating 270° to the left instead.

Funnily enough, there is real-world precedent for this and it's modeled in Flying Circus: in a plane with a rotary engine, it is actually significantly faster to do a 270° turn in the direction of the engine's torque than to turn 90° opposite it--so if you're in a biplane with a rotary engine that spins clockwise, and you're dogfighting an opponent that breaks right, you can probably outturn him by turning left through 270°.

LashLightning
Feb 20, 2010

You know you didn't have to go post that, right?
But it's fine, I guess...

You just keep being you!

Asterite34 posted:

Ah yes, the six character stats of Up, Down, Top, Bottom, Charm and Strange

Ah, yes, Farflung.

A little :nws:.

90s Cringe Rock
Nov 29, 2006
:gay:
Strength, Speed, Stamina, Sharp, Soul, Social Standing

tanglewood1420
Oct 28, 2010

The importance of this mission cannot be overemphasized

GimpInBlack posted:

Funnily enough, there is real-world precedent for this and it's modeled in Flying Circus: in a plane with a rotary engine, it is actually significantly faster to do a 270° turn in the direction of the engine's torque than to turn 90° opposite it--so if you're in a biplane with a rotary engine that spins clockwise, and you're dogfighting an opponent that breaks right, you can probably outturn him by turning left through 270°.

That's an exaggeration for effect. In a prop plane you generally turn about 5-10% faster in the direction of when rolling with the torque versus against it.

The myth of turning faster 270° vs 90° originated with the Sopwith Camel. It's been proven empirically incorrect with existing ones that still fly with the original engine (there are a couple still around amazingly). The Camel was not affected by the torque any more significantly than any other WWI era aircraft was.

Now the Camel was a notoriously unstable plane in many other respects. The centre of gravity was way back in the fuselage, it was extremely light but also had a very small wing area. The pilot was always fighting against it just to fly level in a straight line. Many British pilots actually liked this as they felt it gave them a sense of unpredictability in dogfighting. It has been likened to driving a car that is always understeering or oversteering - skilled pilots played towards this strength and would basically do aerial powerslides when in combat.

SimonChris
Apr 24, 2008

The Baron's daughter is missing, and you are the man to find her. No problem. With your inexhaustible arsenal of hard-boiled similes, there is nothing you can't handle.
Grimey Drawer

GimpInBlack posted:

Funnily enough, there is real-world precedent for this and it's modeled in Flying Circus: in a plane with a rotary engine, it is actually significantly faster to do a 270° turn in the direction of the engine's torque than to turn 90° opposite it--so if you're in a biplane with a rotary engine that spins clockwise, and you're dogfighting an opponent that breaks right, you can probably outturn him by turning left through 270°.

The same thing can be true about cars as well. I used to make logistics software, and in many cities making three right turns is often faster than a single left turn, so a route with little loops in it can be quicker than the shortest one.

Leperflesh
May 17, 2007

Does Flying Circus also model the total loss oil system of the Sopwith Camel, which constantly sprayed the pilot with an aerosol of castor oil that - allegedly - gave them such bad diarrhea that pilots would drink gin before flying as a countermeasure?

Bar Crow
Oct 10, 2012
Str, Str2, Dex, Dex2, Int, Int2

whydirt
Apr 18, 2001


Gaz Posting Brigade :c00lbert:
Strength
Might
Beef
Muscle
Physique

LatwPIAT
Jun 6, 2011

My system uses only one Attribute, but it tracks a variable that maps to a six-dimensional space...

Arivia
Mar 17, 2011

LatwPIAT posted:

My system uses only one Attribute, but it tracks a variable that maps to a six-dimensional space...

gender?

GimpInBlack
Sep 27, 2012

That's right, kids, take lots of drugs, leave the universe behind, and pilot Enlightenment Voltron out into the cosmos to meet Alien Jesus.

Leperflesh posted:

Does Flying Circus also model the total loss oil system of the Sopwith Camel, which constantly sprayed the pilot with an aerosol of castor oil that - allegedly - gave them such bad diarrhea that pilots would drink gin before flying as a countermeasure?

"Spray something into their cockpit" is literally one of the GM moves.

HOMOEROTIC JESUS
Apr 19, 2018

Verily I say unto thee, That this night, before the cock crow, thou shalt deny me thrice.

LatwPIAT posted:

My system uses only one Attribute, but it tracks a variable that maps to a six-dimensional space...

Ah yes, one of the infamous parametric attribute systems. Is it fully continuous and differentiable? I want to algorithmically optimize my character based on a homebrew utility function

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Drakyn
Dec 26, 2012

Leperflesh posted:

Does Flying Circus also model the total loss oil system of the Sopwith Camel, which constantly sprayed the pilot with an aerosol of castor oil that - allegedly - gave them such bad diarrhea that pilots would drink gin before flying as a countermeasure?
See this is exactly the kind of poo poo that Peanuts kept from us about historically accurate ww1 air combat.

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