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Well, also there's people who just stomp in high gear without any intention of doing hell or high roller.
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Aug 16, 2023 08:50
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Those cobalt-wearing sweatlords do in fact die to dumb luck in the goblin caves (some newb trains an ill-timed boss towards them and dumps aggro, circle/portal luck forces them into making hasty moves, random rogue gets lucky on them after they've just finished dunking on someone, whatever) and leave their loot for idiots in starter gear to fight over. AKA, Jackpot.
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Aug 16, 2023 09:27
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Franks Happy Place posted:Those cobalt-wearing sweatlords do in fact die to dumb luck in the goblin caves (some newb trains an ill-timed boss towards them and dumps aggro, circle/portal luck forces them into making hasty moves, random rogue gets lucky on them after they've just finished dunking on someone, whatever) and leave their loot for idiots in starter gear to fight over. Warlock decided chasing down a running ranger through a dark hallway was a great idea. One popped trap and 3 body shots later, jackpot! Sick blue cape, kickass rings and amulet, full blue armor and sweaty cobalt boots. I gave the weapons to a cleric who was following me around after doing the duck and pray dance. We both extracted like 200+ gold richer.
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Aug 16, 2023 12:16
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Kwolok posted:This game isn't going to be well made, its just going to be the first extraction shooter in this genre. I don't expect there to be much consideration into balance or anything beyond mindless wipes (looking at your tarkov). They've made numerous balance changes over the various playtests. It'd be pretty difficult running one of these types of games without regular seasons/wipes though there's probably some way to do it. I do agree there is a much better game to be made from this start but I'm always worried whoever comes next is going to do one part a lot better but then gently caress up something central like combat (or it'll be some cartoony horseshit that looks like Overwatch). VulgarandStupid posted:The problem right now is people who are doing hell are coming through the regular dungeon with blue and purple gear and stomping everyone else in the grey to green gear. At least if you could find a blue or purple weapon, you'd have a chance. I dunno if they need to do some sort of gear score limit or what. I think they should've gone the opposite direction they did and made better items more numerous. It's an issue with any type of loot game where there's way too much basic poo poo when you should be getting the good feeling drops early and fairly often. Even king poo poo of the genre Diablo hosed it up by giving you mostly stat sticks when the older games gave you all sorts of interesting bonuses. I mean it does feel great being in greys/whites and killing a team of blues/purps but every time we've done that in the previous playtests we never got to even loot them so as good as it felt we didn't even get out of there with our goodies. Especially with how much smaller the playerbase is than if it was on Steam the density of people who know the game like the back of their hand is pretty high. Groovelord Neato fucked around with this message at 13:20 on Aug 16, 2023 |
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Aug 16, 2023 13:16
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they have upped the drops for regular crypts and I think they are still elevated for ruins currently as well. seems like it doesn't matter, I rarely find gear upgrades and agree that even if you do, rarely have time to loot or escape with it. some kind of gear score system would be a good idea because I don't think having teams running regular dungeons in full purples is gonna make this game last with a high player base
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Aug 16, 2023 17:06
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Demon Of The Fall posted:they have upped the drops for regular crypts and I think they are still elevated for ruins currently as well. seems like it doesn't matter, I rarely find gear upgrades and agree that even if you do, rarely have time to loot or escape with it. some kind of gear score system would be a good idea because I don't think having teams running regular dungeons in full purples is gonna make this game last with a high player base Gear score limits feel like a reasonable compromise. Any other games that have executed that?
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Aug 16, 2023 18:05
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The Cycle: Frontier had gear score heavily weighted in the MMR for the starting map. It actually worked pretty well for the most part. e: that said, the gear treadmill is part of these games so eventually there's not going to be much you can do to stop basic lobbies from being mostly green+
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Aug 16, 2023 20:19
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The Cycle: Frontier actually did a handful of really good things I think other developers could learn from. Shame it's shutting down. My favorite was play compensation for cheaters. If you died to a cheater and reported them, they'd be investigated and your outfit would be returned if they found they were cheating. Granted, you didn't get your inventory returned, so nothing you looted, your meds, etc, but it was a solid step in the right direction. I think this was actually asked to the devs of DaD and they are looking into implementing a similar system.
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Aug 16, 2023 23:53
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Demon Of The Fall posted:they have upped the drops for regular crypts and I think they are still elevated for ruins currently as well. seems like it doesn't matter, I rarely find gear upgrades and agree that even if you do, rarely have time to loot or escape with it. some kind of gear score system would be a good idea because I don't think having teams running regular dungeons in full purples is gonna make this game last with a high player base I want to like ruins, but it's very thunderdome style, with only 3x1, 3x1 and 1x3 portals spawning inside the last three circles. My crew tried it skirting around the edges to buy time until portals were spawning and that didn't really work for us. And all the fun videos you see of people making friends with people around them? That never happened. Map is fun tho, interesting switch from ruins. BHB posted:e: that said, the gear treadmill is part of these games so eventually there's not going to be much you can do to stop basic lobbies from being mostly green+ I don't mind getting outskilled by similarly geared folks. The sadness comes when crew thought we played well but lost, and we check the other crews gear and it's dripping blue/purple/orange.
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Aug 17, 2023 02:37
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Would not be opposed to having purple or maybe even blue and higher items equipped restricting you to the highroller queue. Want to use your big dick loot? Take it into big dick matches. Would make actually getting blue+ items as drops in non-highroller that much more of a bonus, since it's an immediate objective power boost over what everyone else has available, unless they got similarly lucky.
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Aug 17, 2023 03:20
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It's only gonna get worse and worse with gear. The good thing is, people are switching classes, leveling them up, and with that comes a new inventory. But when they level those classes up, it will start happening again. Give it 2 more weeks and the try hards will have every classes up to 20 with completely degenerate sets. This isn't an issue with just this game btw, so it's not really a criticism of it. Every extraction looter game runs into the same issue. Gear = power and time = gear. The more time you put into a game, the more gear you get and the more power that comes from it. It's universal. So your solution to not getting streamrolled by the people in these crazy sets, that will get crazier, without a doubt, or at least they'll have more of them, is to play more. If you can't do that, you'll just continue to experience the power scale difference.
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Aug 17, 2023 04:03
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Pretty much that. No extraction looter has nailed the incentive cycle to keep all levels of players interested in the game for an entire wipe up to this point. Imo, there needs to be *something* that opens up in the mid-end game to put your kits towards that isn't "work towards more consistent and better kits" or "stomp on people with worse kits" because eventually the first one runs out.
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Aug 17, 2023 04:17
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Hi BHB
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Aug 17, 2023 04:41
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I hope you are doing well, friend. this game is v. good.
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Aug 17, 2023 07:21
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BHB posted:Pretty much that. No extraction looter has nailed the incentive cycle to keep all levels of players interested in the game for an entire wipe up to this point. The second one runs out too, when the people getting stomped decide they've had enough.
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Aug 17, 2023 07:32
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I've been watching some streams tonight and I'm starting to see some burnout. One of the streamers I was watching was doing a mode (high roller) that only had 5 people queuing, him and 4 others, all rogues. Others were just getting tired of the monotony. If you play a game 8-12hrs a day, for over a week, of course it's gonna get monotonous. But I am starting to see a declining player base and that's a little worrying. I wish we had a steamcharts kind of monitoring, but because it's on its own client now, we don't have that kind of access. I'm interested in what the playerbase is gonna look like in 3 weeks, when the game has been out for a bit and some big games have released. The new Armored Core comes out and then basically 2 weeks later, Starfield. By then I think Ironmace will have made enough money to sustain themselves, but I don't know how many people will actually be playing.
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Aug 17, 2023 08:04
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They really need to put out a new patch nerfing Din of Darkness scaling asap. It's getting really old, really fast to get AE'd through walls in seconds.
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Aug 17, 2023 09:44
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Hotfix patch #4 being deployed basically now: Patch Notes: Classes are now free. Please note that currency that was used to unlock a class will be returned in a future update. We apologize for this delay. Fixed an exploit with the Rogue's Pickpocket. Fixed an issue where crossbows could not fire properly. Fixed an issue that prevented Trading Post filters from working properly. Fixed an issue where the Giant Centipede's basic attack had too short an attack time. Fixed an issue where Rogue stealth would sometimes not actually hide. Fixed an issue where the Ghost King could sometimes get stuck. Increased the baseline score for the Good rating when a bard completes a performance. Bard's Din of Darkness attribute application factor has been changed from 50%/50%/50% to 10%/30%/50%. Bard's Piercing Shrill's attribute application factor has been changed from 50%/50%/50% to 10%/30%/50%. Bard's Accelerando changed from 5/10/15 to 5/8/11 Bard's Allegro's action speed and cast speed per second increase from 5/7/9% to 3/5/7%. Bard's Harmonic Shield Armor and Spell Resistance bonuses changed from 50 to 40. Wizard's Invisibility duration changed from 7 seconds to 5 seconds. Added a feature to set a framerate limit for the menu.
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Aug 17, 2023 11:19
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I've been watching streamers all night and it's basically devolving into rogues and rangers versus all. People are trying to do the typical thing of like, fighter, cleric, wizard, but when you can just go in with minimal gear on a rogue or ranger, whats the point of doing something different? You can see some success with that make up, but the issue is that you can spend 0g-50g on a rogue or ranger loadout and while you might, and probably will, die, you can also walk out with 10x that value in loot with such a small commitment. I think thats why so many people are running rogue. It's just such a small commitment to potentially make so much. Lobbies are basically half or more rogues right now. That's 1 class representing half the lobby while all of the other classes represent the other half.
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Aug 17, 2023 11:26
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ShowTime posted:I've been watching some streams tonight and I'm starting to see some burnout. One of the streamers I was watching was doing a mode (high roller) that only had 5 people queuing, him and 4 others, all rogues. Others were just getting tired of the monotony. If you play a game 8-12hrs a day, for over a week, of course it's gonna get monotonous. But I am starting to see a declining player base and that's a little worrying. I wish we had a steamcharts kind of monitoring, but because it's on its own client now, we don't have that kind of access. I'm interested in what the playerbase is gonna look like in 3 weeks, when the game has been out for a bit and some big games have released. The new Armored Core comes out and then basically 2 weeks later, Starfield. By then I think Ironmace will have made enough money to sustain themselves, but I don't know how many people will actually be playing. It's done pretty well considering it came out while everyone and their mother is playing Baldur's Gate 3 but it certainly doesn't surprise me that streamers are burning out pretty quickly. The size of the maps and player count per raid is both a positive and negative - it's perfect for a single round (or many rounds) but for the long term for a hardcore player likely becomes very repetitive. Compare to say DMZ with a larger map and longer rounds but also missions to keep you focused on something or moving towards the next tier. I think I said early on that my ideal form of this game would be a meld of the two (I'm envisioning a bit more of an "overworld" with a town or towns and smaller crypts/dungeons/ruins dotted about) so I'm hoping someone copying Ironmace doesn't just do the exact same thing and expands upon the concept.
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Aug 17, 2023 13:42
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I dunno how people are playing a rogue but its real tough. I've tried doing pure sneaky/ratting and a damage build and it just sucks, or I suck, probably the latter. its super hard to kill mobs without taking damage (especially the 2hand ones) and I can never not have players just wait out the stealth and chase me down and push my poo poo in. edit: also I don't think Starfield is going to be any threat to dakka dakka, didn't it have like 5k people playing it at the height? yawn. or i'm thinking of starsiege? who knows Demon Of The Fall fucked around with this message at 14:52 on Aug 17, 2023 |
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Aug 17, 2023 14:12
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In the beta I liked to combine invis with darkness- turning out every single torch I can as I go through the map, and retreating back into it if I run into a bad spot with players
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Aug 17, 2023 14:21
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Demon Of The Fall posted:I dunno how people are playing a rogue but its real tough. I've tried doing pure sneaky/ratting and a damage build and it just sucks, or I suck, probably the latter. its super hard to kill mobs without taking damage (especially the 2hand ones) and I can never not have players just wait out the stealth and chase me down and push my poo poo in. Starfield is Bethesda's next game so even if it's dog poo poo it's gonna sell like hotcakes. It's not that it'll replace Dark and Darker just that everyone will be playing it instead of Dark and Darker.
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Aug 17, 2023 16:38
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i dunno about streamer burnout, all the ones I watch still think this is the greatest game and are playing all the time. https://twitch.tv/thespudhunter prob my favorite, he is so funny and entertaining
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Aug 17, 2023 17:44
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rumors in the discord that the legal case against Ironmace in the US has been dismissed edit: confirmed! obviously the case in SK is still active, but this appears to be a real good sign for the game's future  eat poo poo haters! Demon Of The Fall fucked around with this message at 18:10 on Aug 17, 2023 |
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Aug 17, 2023 18:04
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Big deal if true since that would allow it to relist on Steam. Edit: Without prejudice means nexon can try again though, if they want to be dicks about it. Groovelord Neato posted:Did Ironmace know this was coming? It makes the release make a lot more sense. As one point of anecdata, in my immediate friend group, aside from me only one other person bought it direct. The other half-dozen decided to wait for it to go back on Steam. This is a group who probably put ~20 hours of actual playtime each into the last test. sushibandit fucked around with this message at 19:53 on Aug 17, 2023 |
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Aug 17, 2023 18:07
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It doesn't seem to be dismissed based on evidence but the facts that there is already a case going on in korea and the us court feels it is better done over there instead of translating everything from korean to english
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Aug 17, 2023 18:11
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Demon Of The Fall posted:i dunno about streamer burnout, all the ones I watch still think this is the greatest game and are playing all the time. Spud Hunter is great it's too bad he plays such a scum class. Demon Of The Fall posted:eat poo poo haters! We true believers can't stop winning. Did Ironmace know this was coming? It makes the release make a lot more sense. Groovelord Neato fucked around with this message at 19:12 on Aug 17, 2023 |
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Aug 17, 2023 18:31
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Third World Reagan posted:It doesn't seem to be dismissed based on evidence but the facts that there is already a case going on in korea and the us court feels it is better done over there instead of translating everything from korean to english Yeah before claiming victory over evil nexon people should probably chill or wait for more details to come out. Dismissing without prejudice doesn’t mean it’s gone for good, Nexon still has the right to bring it to US courts again. Lotta reasons that could happen. If the case doesn't get brought again I'd be surprised. Usually big corporations just bleed people out in courts, and opening lawsuits in multiple countries will take a lot of resources away from defendants. LITERALLY MY FETISH fucked around with this message at 20:14 on Aug 17, 2023 |
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Aug 17, 2023 20:10
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Demon Of The Fall posted:eat poo poo haters! Franks Happy Place posted:If you are a Dark and Darker fan and you have shown a lack of faith in this thread, wallahi you will not see the Heaven of a playtest Franks Happy Place fucked around with this message at 20:19 on Aug 17, 2023 |
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Aug 17, 2023 20:15
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It's nuts to me that DaDa is still doing 40k+ on twitch while competing with the tarkov wipe and BG 3. Sustaining those numbers for any length of time is for AAA multiplayer games mostly, and that's without the direct competition for eyeballs.
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Aug 17, 2023 20:21
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Rogues always struck me as the protagonists of Dark and Darker. Stealthin aroun, grabbin the loot, extremely high burst damage...
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Aug 18, 2023 01:03
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BHB posted:I hope you are doing well, friend. this game is v. good. I am and it is
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Aug 18, 2023 03:29
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LITERALLY MY FETISH posted:Yeah before claiming victory over evil nexon people should probably chill or wait for more details to come out. Dismissing without prejudice doesn’t mean it’s gone for good, Nexon still has the right to bring it to US courts again. Lotta reasons that could happen. Watched a video from a lawyer who thought this dismissal had a very low chance of happening where he said while Nexon is almost certainly going to appeal that appeal has a low chance of being successful and that this grants Ironmace leverage in possible negotiations for a settlement. I don't know how right he is due to not being a lawyer but I would think even for Nexon there comes a point where it isn't worth it to keep doing this and to settle. Groovelord Neato fucked around with this message at 13:18 on Aug 18, 2023 |
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Aug 18, 2023 13:00
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I just picked this back up after the last steam playtest. I hope all the legal issues fall to the wayside and it gets relisted soon. My friends and brothers are waiting for that so I currently am playing solo barb. I'll happily repurchase it on steam as well. I got more than $60 out of the playtests alone. Draven fucked around with this message at 14:19 on Aug 18, 2023 |
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Aug 18, 2023 14:15
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I'm generally a person who doesn't know a PC even exists until it hits Steam (I legit didn't know Darkest Dungeon 2 was in EA for about year since it was on EGS) but if you put a ton of time into the playtests waiting until this gets on Steam is so bizarre to me. sushibandit's friends played WAY more than I did during the last playtest (I maybe got four-five hours in) and I bought it immediately.
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Aug 18, 2023 15:03
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the coffee promos are back baby
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Aug 18, 2023 15:18
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Groovelord Neato posted:I'm generally a person who doesn't know a PC even exists until it hits Steam (I legit didn't know Darkest Dungeon 2 was in EA for about year since it was on EGS) but if you put a ton of time into the playtests waiting until this gets on Steam is so bizarre to me. My younger brother at least mentioned that he didn't want to buy the game just for it to be taken down completely due to losing the lawsuit. Everyone else just doesn't want to use anything other than steam.  I'm having fun with it solo, but it was definitely more fun with others. I just need to get used to how it plays again. I've been away too long. I did get a successful extraction out of the 5 rounds I've played.
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Aug 18, 2023 15:39
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the zoomers only know steam, all of the young kids were so confused on the discord when they had to figure out a torrent for the 5th PT. I'm not surprised they won't bother until its avail on steam
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Aug 18, 2023 15:42
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My Steam account is 2 weeks younger than the oldest one I found out. Makes me feel ancient. 
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Aug 18, 2023 15:46
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