|
mind the walrus posted:I don't know if you're joking but I unironically want this. Not joking at all. She is joining the core 20 to replace whoever dies. I’m mainly just sad that it’s happening alongside the removal of alignment (and who knows, maybe it’s leading to a change in her - not alignment, but, you know what I mean here), and it means that a character had in my back pocket forever is never gonna see the light of day. (Arazni is/was an evil deity, but she allows CG worshippers, and her edicts/anathema mostly just revolve around never backing down from a fight, and being hell bent on preventing the creation of unwilling undead, which seems like a pretty incredible basis for the worlds most conflicted Liberator Champion)
|
#
?
Dec 10, 2023 00:08
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 4, 2024 03:31 |
|
|
It looks like we're going with Outlaws of Alkenstar, so I gotta prepare some character concepts.
|
|
#
?
Dec 10, 2023 01:31
|
|
|
Back alley doctor forensic medicine ivestigstor
|
|
#
?
Dec 10, 2023 01:59
|
|
|
The Slack Lagoon posted:Back alley doctor forensic medicine ivestigstor Funny you say that. That was the very first character concept I ever had, but I decided to shelve it. Maybe it's time for me to bring it back?
|
|
#
?
Dec 10, 2023 02:02
|
|
|
Human gunslinger sentinel archtype with full heavy armor escorting a goblin child.
|
|
#
?
Dec 10, 2023 02:03
|
|
|
ZZT the Fifth posted:Funny you say that. That was the very first character concept I ever had, but I decided to shelve it. Maybe it's time for me to bring it back? Throw on a gunslinger (or unexpected sharpshooter or any other firearms archetype that gives you one) for access to an efficient reload action, and become King Critfisher.
|
|
#
?
Dec 10, 2023 03:09
|
|
|
PF2e Adventure Paths I’ve run/played Extinction Curse (played). Solid adventure set across a decent range of locations. Circus theme is to a certain extent just a glaze, that fades from the game by book 4. GMs opinion was you should just have been Pathfinder Society members instead. Group was Fighter, Monk, Ranger, Druid, Sorcerer, Cleric. Our first AP, some odd difficulty spikes at point as it’s an early AP, one of the first encounters is written so poorly as to be a TPK. Abomination Vaults (played). Excellent Dungeon Crawl, lot of cool exploration stuff, but you are fighting in a single location, often in cramped quarters. Group was Wizard, Fighter, Ranger, Barbarian, Investigator. Some tough fights, cramped quarters can make certain tactics harder to pull off. Strength of Thousands (ran). Again, you aren’t in Hogwarts, you are mostly graduate students in a bit of an academically flavoured setting. Lot of magic in the setting, some cool moments. Personal opinion was that it was pretty easy as an AP. Group was Rogue, Druid, Wizard, Swashbuckler, Summoner. Agents of Alkenstar. (Played). Decent adventure, I really like that part of the setting and it’s very tech flavoured, the plot line is ok, but a bit muddled. Group went hyper thematic, Gunslinger x 2, Inventor, Alchemist, Ranger. The encounter design is all over the shop in this one, tons of opposition that are tough to fight with guns and we were lacking some of the higher power options you get from some of the classes we didn’t play. Blood Lords. (Playing). It’s sort of the Evil Undead campaign, but there is a big streak of Addams Family to it. Lots of LE style power acquisition. Party is Magus, Cleric, Champion, Thaumaturge, Barbarian, Swashbuckler. Some challenging fights, some that are totally toothless as all but one of the party are full undead. A lot of fun so far.
|
|
#
?
Dec 10, 2023 04:00
|
|
|
The Slack Lagoon posted:Back alley doctor forensic medicine ivestigstor I'm currently DMing Outlaws of Alkenstar, and a player character played exactly this. It's excellent, can highly recommend.
|
|
#
?
Dec 10, 2023 04:12
|
|
|
Chevy Slyme posted:Throw on a gunslinger (or unexpected sharpshooter or any other firearms archetype that gives you one) for access to an efficient reload action, and become King Critfisher. Can heavily endorse "get a gun, delete people".  
|
|
#
?
Dec 10, 2023 04:18
|
|
|
Speaking of Abomination Vaults, I'm planning on running a kind of AV/Beginner Box/Trouble in Otari supercampaign for a group of first time Pathfinder players and I want to get some goon advice on how to weld it all together. To start off with, I've created I've created a new framing device where the PCs are being cast as rookie Pathfinder agents who are sent to staff a new guild hall in Otari. I know the Beginner's Box and the first floor of AV can be a little rough for level 1 characters so I want to run them through some other content first so the players can get their feet wet. For the first session I kind of want to run the players through a little tutorial dungeon that is supposed to be their character's graduation exam before they become full-fledged Pathfinder agents because I think it'd be cute for the characters to be becoming Pathfinders at the same time the players are learning how to play Pathfinder. Right now I'm planning on running the dungeon from the "Intro: Year of Boundless Wonder" PFS Scenario because I got it for free in the Humble Bundle a while back. For those who aren't familiar, the idea behind the scenario is that the PCs are tasked with cataloguing a vault full of dangerous items captured from one of the Society's enemies when the PCs are trapped in the vault by an evil spirit trying to revive itself. So, my current plan is to have this scenario be faked as part of their test, but I'm kind of worried that a first session where they were never in any real danger might sour them on the system. Maybe it would be better if I have the scenario be real and have the player's overcoming this real threat be taken as a substitute for their exam? But if I do that I'm worried that a bunch of rookies having to save the day in what should be a controlled environment would make the society seem incompetent and dampen the player's enthusiasm for being Pathfinder Agents. The third option is I just throw the whole Vault scenario out and repurpose the Beginner's Box as the exam, but I really like the idea I came up with where instead of the burnt down building in Otari being a former tavern, it's the building that was going to serve as new guild hall and is destroyed shortly before the players arrive in town and the basement of the ruins would also serve as the entrance to the Beginner's Box dungeon. This would also force the players to find a new HQ, leading directly into the first scenario from Troubles in Otari. So what do y'all think? Fake danger, real danger, or just throw the Vault/Exam scenario out and try something else?
|
|
#
?
Dec 10, 2023 04:50
|
|
|
Chevy Slyme posted:Not joking at all. She is joining the core 20 to replace whoever dies. quote:I’m mainly just sad that it’s happening alongside the removal of alignment (and who knows, maybe it’s leading to a change in her - not alignment, but, you know what I mean here), and it means that a character had in my back pocket forever is never gonna see the light of day. Eh I've always thought alignment was largely dogshit that let players create crutches and baby blankets for their RP and Worldbuilding shortcomings, but I understand that with a lot of them it's needed. Curious about that character in your back pocket though, which sounds good.
|
|
#
?
Dec 10, 2023 04:51
|
|
|
ZZT the Fifth posted:It looks like we're going with Outlaws of Alkenstar, so I gotta prepare some character concepts. rail ridin hobo with a bindle and an oath, crazy miner lookin for gold with a dark past, an italian
|
|
#
?
Dec 10, 2023 04:55
|
|
|
mind the walrus posted:Rad Yeah, I mostly agree about the removal of alignment, it just so happens that I had a character idea that made heavy use of it to be interesting and clever.
|
|
#
?
Dec 10, 2023 05:20
|
|
|
HidaO-Win posted:
One thing that my GM did that was a game changer for A Vaults enjoyability was to just 2x all the maps scaling. So, all the doorways are 10 feet wide, all of the rooms are bigger, etc. etc. It makes the whole place a lot more tactically interesting, even if it nerfs some bottleneck strats.
|
|
#
?
Dec 10, 2023 05:32
|
|
|
Scrap Dragon posted:Speaking of Abomination Vaults, I'm planning on running a kind of AV/Beginner Box/Trouble in Otari supercampaign for a group of first time Pathfinder players and I want to get some goon advice on how to weld it all together. To start off with, I've created I've created a new framing device where the PCs are being cast as rookie Pathfinder agents who are sent to staff a new guild hall in Otari. I know the Beginner's Box and the first floor of AV can be a little rough for level 1 characters so I want to run them through some other content first so the players can get their feet wet. The Beginner Box dungeon is literally designed as just the sort of tutorial you're describing, with gradually introduced mechanics and challenges built to slowly expand the players understanding of the rules. If you want to reflavor that as a field exam, i would just do that. In fact, if you go that route, you can do the whole "this is all an illusion, your characters will survive it and be fine" thing, and inform them that only a few students have ever managed a perfect score on the exam... they'll "pass" if they get to the final boss fight. Then you take the gloves off the dragon and maybe ignore some of the usual beginner box advice about it using bad tactics and go for the TPK, but give them the opportunity to be hotshit heroes and win it too. Chevy Slyme fucked around with this message at 05:36 on Dec 10, 2023 |
|
#
?
Dec 10, 2023 05:34
|
|
|
Chevy Slyme posted:Throw on a gunslinger (or unexpected sharpshooter or any other firearms archetype that gives you one) for access to an efficient reload action, and become King Critfisher. I was going to start with Medic Dedication as my choice of FA and lean into the "doctor" thing e: Repeating crossbows are advanced weapons, so they're out for me. ZZT the Fifth fucked around with this message at 19:41 on Dec 10, 2023 |
|
#
?
Dec 10, 2023 05:41
|
|
|
ZZT the Fifth posted:I was going to start with Medic Dedication as my choice of FA and lean into the "doctor" thing with a repeating crossbow, is getting a gun that worth it? I don't think Unexpected Sharpshooter gives firearm proficiency by itself... Firearms don’t have a special proficiency. Most of them are just regular simple or martial weapons. What Unexpected Sharpshooter (or Gunslinger, or a few other options) gives access to is a means of mitigating the action tax for reloading. Unexpected Sharpshooter does it with Risky Reload, which means you’ll essentially never have to keep your gun loaded between rounds if you’re using devise well - which is good because otherwise, using any weapon that requires reloads with devise a stratagem can get… difficult to manage, in terms of actions. If you don’t want to do a firearm, I’d forego ranged weapons entirely and just grab an interesting/flavorful melee option to be honest, and lean harder on Medic.
|
|
#
?
Dec 10, 2023 06:05
|
|
|
sugar free jazz posted:rail ridin hobo with a bindle and an oath, crazy miner lookin for gold with a dark past, an italian Wait what is italy on golarion? cheliax? Blockhouse fucked around with this message at 07:03 on Dec 10, 2023 |
|
#
?
Dec 10, 2023 06:49
|
|
|
ZZT the Fifth posted:I was going to start with Medic Dedication as my choice of FA and lean into the "doctor" thing with a repeating crossbow, is getting a gun that worth it? I don't think Unexpected Sharpshooter gives firearm proficiency by itself... Firearm proficiency isn't anything special. You get profiency in simple firearms from having profiency in simple weapons, and the same for martial weapons. The issue is access, which is a meaningful difference because you can get that just from coming from a region that has guns everywhere. Which is also the criteria for having access to Unexpected Sharpshooter, conveniently enough. Also what Chevy Slyme said.
|
|
#
?
Dec 10, 2023 07:42
|
|
|
Chevy Slyme posted:If you don’t want to do a firearm, I’d forego ranged weapons entirely and just grab an interesting/flavorful melee option to be honest, and lean harder on Medic. Wouldn't I need more STR for a melee weapon, then? I'm already leaning into INT because Investigator and WIS because Medicine and DEX because AC... I'm really not sure my Forensic Medicine Investigator is going to want to be in melee. Is Unexpected Sharpshooter that good to take before Medic? ZZT the Fifth fucked around with this message at 14:27 on Dec 10, 2023 |
|
#
?
Dec 10, 2023 13:16
|
|
|
Scrap Dragon posted:Speaking of Abomination Vaults, I'm planning on running a kind of AV/Beginner Box/Trouble in Otari supercampaign for a group of first time Pathfinder players and I want to get some goon advice on how to weld it all together. To start off with, I've created I've created a new framing device where the PCs are being cast as rookie Pathfinder agents who are sent to staff a new guild hall in Otari. I know the Beginner's Box and the first floor of AV can be a little rough for level 1 characters so I want to run them through some other content first so the players can get their feet wet. Having run Beginner Box/Av/Troubles myself, my recommendation would be to keep it as is. Beginner Box fills the niche of a tutorial dungeon just fine, and retooling that to be the exam so you can have a character to chain into the next adventure (if you decide to continue from abom vaults) would probably work better than doing the intro scenario in addition to the beginner box.
|
|
#
?
Dec 10, 2023 14:11
|
|
|
Piell posted:Abomination Vaults is the best of those and is a dungeon crawl.  I'm playing in a Blood Lords campaign rn (level 13 atm) and the only thing that I will add is that it kind of needs some work to function as an undead-focused campaign, which seems a little antithetical to its purpose. They seem to have designed encounters with the assumption that players would be living characters, which is a little weird when my skeleton just ends up being immune to a lot of the damage being thrown around. It honestly probably would have been better if (BLOOD LORDS VILLAIN SPOILERS)Chancellor Khemnebi didn't rely so much on undead to get the job done, and instead was like, manipulating crusaders of Pharasma or some other fanatical anti-undead god like Anubis so people still get the satisfaction of taking down someone who was ultimately evil while at the same time undead parties get to worry about radiant/good damage and provide more leeway for negotiation/manipulation/machinations. For the most part in this campaign we have been fighting undead, with the occasional straggler encounter of "living people". I'm sure that would also have its own set of issues with it, but I feel like it would be more appropriate/fun for an undead-focused party. That said, it's still a pretty good campaign. Book 3 was probably the most fun I had as a player with Convincing the different crusader factions to fight each other and surprising them both with a celebrant ghoul invasion.
|
|
#
?
Dec 10, 2023 14:29
|
|
|
A while ago this was posted in the thread https://zenithgames.blogspot.com/2019/09/pathfinder-2nd-edition-guide-to-guides.html?m=1 Is there a more up to date version as a lot of what's on there now is from 2021! If not, does anyone have a decent guide to ranger animal companions/archetypes that's from more recently?
|
|
#
?
Dec 10, 2023 14:38
|
|
|
Taear posted:A while ago this was posted in the thread I think it would help if we know what your goal is. Are you looking for "optimization" for combat? Are you looking for RP options? Are you looking to see what weird things you can do? We don't really know what you're trying to do so advice could be all over the map.
|
|
#
?
Dec 10, 2023 15:09
|
|
|
ZZT the Fifth posted:Wouldn't I need more STR for a melee weapon, then? I'm already leaning into INT because Investigator and WIS because Medicine and DEX because AC... I'm really not sure my Forensic Medicine Investigator is going to want to be in melee. Is Unexpected Sharpshooter that good to take before Medic? With finesse, and you need an agile or finesse weapon anyway, strength is only a +1 damage per point which is good but you don't really rely on it. You can use finesse if you want to have Dex on your attack rolls that aren't already powered by devise. I don't know when investigators get access to critical specialization options but having weapons that you can know you are going to apply a good crit spec effect with is the approach I would take to investigator besides trying to work spell strike in somehow. Like I know I'm going to crit so I switch to my hammer and knock his rear end down Harold Fjord fucked around with this message at 15:23 on Dec 10, 2023 |
|
#
?
Dec 10, 2023 15:18
|
|
|
Harold Fjord posted:
They do not get access to critical specialization, as far as I can tell. How often will I be able to get out of melee if I engage, is the question? Investigator is not exactly the tankiest class. ZZT the Fifth fucked around with this message at 15:37 on Dec 10, 2023 |
|
#
?
Dec 10, 2023 15:34
|
|
|
ZZT the Fifth posted:They do not get access to critical specialization, as far as I can tell. quote:How often will I be able to get out of melee if I engage, is the question? Investigator is not exactly the tankiest class. The rest is both using multiple Move actions-- I find a lot of players really hate to "waste" a round without "doing something" but that's not always good in PF2e-- as well as cover on the map and of course, have your allies back you up. If an Investigator is standing alone in combat against wizard or large monsters and the Champion/Fighter/Witch isn't thinking about how to watch your back at least a little then you have poo poo teammates.
|
|
#
?
Dec 10, 2023 15:41
|
|
|
Blockhouse posted:Wait what is italy on golarion? cheliax? I was gonna say Pitax but maybe that’s more new jersey italian american than anything cheliax probably works best
|
|
#
?
Dec 10, 2023 15:52
|
|
|
mind the walrus posted:I wonder if there's a Feat like "you've spent enough time with this weapon that your nerdy Investigative rear end now knows how to use it and only it's crit specialization." That would make sense for an Investigator I think. The problem I have here is action economy. Devising a Stratagem, moving in, Striking, and moving out is four actions if the enemy isn't the subject of a Lead.
|
|
#
?
Dec 10, 2023 15:57
|
|
|
mind the walrus posted:I think it would help if we know what your goal is. Are you looking for "optimization" for combat? Are you looking for RP options? Are you looking to see what weird things you can do? We don't really know what you're trying to do so advice could be all over the map. Oh sorry, optimisation like the guides in the link are. Not "This is the best, do this exactly" but more "the bird pet provides you with the most options and is generally the 'best' choice, but these two are also close"
|
|
#
?
Dec 10, 2023 16:07
|
|
|
Taear posted:Oh sorry, optimisation like the guides in the link are. Keep in mind that the dates on that list are when they were originally posted, but many of those guides authors do keep them up to date - unfortunately, you’ve gotta click the links to figure out which are and aren’t. (And remaster updates are going to be few and far between for a little while yet, so, in the absence of that, most animal companion options are largely going to be unchanged since 2021/2 - they’ve added a few but it doesn’t dramatically change what’s out there.) Edit: sadly, it looks like the ranger guides included are just kind of dated. I imagine a remaster Ranger guide will show up soon enough. Zenith’s guide list is still being kept up to date last I checked and is probably the best single place to find an index short of lurking the Paizo forums/reddit endlessly. Chevy Slyme fucked around with this message at 16:25 on Dec 10, 2023 |
|
#
?
Dec 10, 2023 16:19
|
|
|
ZZT the Fifth posted:Wouldn't I need more STR for a melee weapon, then? I'm already leaning into INT because Investigator and WIS because Medicine and DEX because AC... I'm really not sure my Forensic Medicine Investigator is going to want to be in melee. Is Unexpected Sharpshooter that good to take before Medic? I ran a ranged investigator with a melee weapon as backup. I spent 90% of my time using the melee weapon instead of the ranged one because devise a stratagem kept saying "if you move to flank you could upgrade your hit to a crit" or "the only way to hit right now is to make the target off-guard. I'd recommend focusing on melee from the start. It is more dynamic, easier to get bonuses, and generally more powerful. Also, repeating crossbows suck. Plus, you want to be near the front line so you can actually heal them. And since you can only heal each target once per combat, you want that damage spread out. You being a target is a good thing. The 4th level medic feat, doctor's visitation, is amazing for melee characters. You'll want some strength (12 or 14) anyway since you need it to max your AC and carry stuff. I used a war razor. It was pretty good due to being deadly, but there might be better options. Medium armor might also be worth picking up. Edit: they made weapon swapping less of an action tax in the revision, so I might have been able to do more ranged with the new rules, but there still wouldn't be much of an advantage to doing so. KPC_Mammon fucked around with this message at 19:14 on Dec 10, 2023 |
|
#
?
Dec 10, 2023 19:09
|
|
|
KPC_Mammon posted:melee talk Again, the problem I have with being a melee investigator is that the action tax from DaS if my target isn't a Pursued Lead means that I have to spend 1 action to DaS, 1 action to move in, and 1 to strike - and that still leaves me right in melee where an enemy can take 3 swings at me if they want. My investigator is likely to be kinda squishy and have ok, but not incredible AC.
|
|
#
?
Dec 10, 2023 19:43
|
|
|
You should have 1 less ac than the fighter at level 3. The same before that.
|
|
#
?
Dec 10, 2023 21:13
|
|
|
And that's also assuming the fighter is going heavy armour. Even after that, you'll still have the same AC as any other martial.
|
|
#
?
Dec 11, 2023 01:00
|
|
|
Okay, so here's where I'm at. With the standardized boosts and Back-Alley Doctor I'm at +0 Strength, +2 Dex, +1 Con, +4 Int, +2 Wis, +0 Cha, with a Forensic Medicine Investigator . I obviously need the Int, need some Dex for AC, want the Wis for Medicine, and need the Con so I'm not stuck with 0 Con and minimal HP. That doesn't exactly leave me with any points for Strength at level 1. And with all that said, my concerns about action economy and getting out of melee still haven't been addressed. I don't want to take 3 attacks from an enemy, even with -5 and -10 on the second and third - or worse, a 3-action special activity. ZZT the Fifth fucked around with this message at 01:58 on Dec 11, 2023 |
|
#
?
Dec 11, 2023 01:27
|
|
|
Chevy Slyme posted:Keep in mind that the dates on that list are when they were originally posted, but many of those guides authors do keep them up to date - unfortunately, you’ve gotta click the links to figure out which are and aren’t. (And remaster updates are going to be few and far between for a little while yet, so, in the absence of that, most animal companion options are largely going to be unchanged since 2021/2 - they’ve added a few but it doesn’t dramatically change what’s out there.) yea the ranger ones are clearly quite old. Like I know what I'm doing sorta but I really love those big lists of "okay, here's roughly how things work" I can sit and make a nice ranger, I know I can. But I would also like to know "this is how the community feels about these choices" I think
|
|
#
?
Dec 11, 2023 01:56
|
|
|
ZZT the Fifth posted:The problem I have here is action economy. Devising a Stratagem, moving in, Striking, and moving out is four actions if the enemy isn't the subject of a Lead. I notice this fucks with a lot of 5e and other player's heads because they have to be "doing something useful" each round, and I empathize with the desire but like... the thing you resist is actually the thing that will make you what you want to be you know? Taear posted:yea the ranger ones are clearly quite old. As for optimization? It looks like it really depends on your style-- the Ape, Badger, and Bear all have the same damage for their main attack (1d8) while Bear and Badger get claw attacks for 1d6, so is there really that big a difference? I know that's just one part, but looking at all the blocks it really looks like they're all in that general range of "more similar than different" outside of size and special abilities. I'm sure there are synergies that really take advantage of certain abilities depending on if you want support, mobility, raw damage output, or some balance, but what those are would require building up various Ranger builds and testing them with various types of companions... which I don't think anyone has bothered to do in a good long while given the stupid range of options, no pun intended.
|
|
#
?
Dec 11, 2023 03:07
|
|
|
Taear posted:yea the ranger ones are clearly quite old. "the community" likes to measure things against full attack haste fighters. I've had people insist that things are bad because they don't match up in damage potential to a fighter with agile grace and alchemist dedication for feral mutagen and monk dedication for flurry of blows, standing there attacking 5 times.
|
|
#
?
Dec 11, 2023 03:27
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 4, 2024 03:31 |
|
|
Yeah, I guess y'all are right. Thanks for the advice you two.
|
|
#
?
Dec 11, 2023 04:51
|
|