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I’ve not read/listened to it yet, but Sea of Souls just came out and is apparently a good Imperial Navy book.
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Dec 23, 2023 11:22
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QuasiQuack posted:Can I lock myself out of stuff by progressing too fast, or will every side quest and the like still be available unitl the end of the game? Yes, at least my gf missed a bunch of stuff in the first act because she went straight for the main story and there's at least one other quest I can think of off the top of my head that can fail if you leave it in favor of other quests.
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Dec 23, 2023 11:26
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FuzzySlippers posted:I wanted some WH fiction while I played the game so I read the Rogue Trader trilogy books and they were alright. Any other recommendations for WH books in the spirit of the game so more either naval space or adventure-ish with few space marines or straight guard warfare? Anything in this sector of space? I've read all the usual suspects in 40k fiction like Horus Heresy, Eisenhorn, Gaunt's Ghosts, Caiaphas Caine, Ravenor. Priests of Mars is mechanicus focused trilogy but is about an explorator fleet with a Rogue Trader traveling to the edge of space to discover long forgotten secrets. I enjoyed it a lot because it's probably the book that most details what life is like for the ratings and underdeck workers on board a ship in the setting, and the mutiny scenes in this game might as well have been taken from it. Sharkopath fucked around with this message at 11:35 on Dec 23, 2023 |
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Dec 23, 2023 11:30
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Eifert Posting posted:Bounty hunter is good for non-mob enemies I've tried a support Bounty Hunter build on Idira, and it has turned surprisingly fun and effective. The key is the talent Savour the Kill: Idira gets an immediate turn with half MP&AP and no attacks whenever someone else kills prey. You can throw out shitloads of divination and sensory deprivation casts with this. (And Stabilising Factor means you don't actually push the veil meter into the fun zone doing this, either.) Also, Raid+KillSquad can buff your party's damage output vs big enemies by a respectable amount. The other two talents I picked are Share the Spoils and Good Hunting. Both of those I consider more optional and may be worth replacing with more psyker talents. Magni fucked around with this message at 15:22 on Dec 23, 2023 |
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Dec 23, 2023 12:19
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Those both look cool, thanks. I'm confused about the classes in this game. I checked some wikis and the 40k rpg seems to have tons of classes. I wonder why they just went with 4 base classes. It leads to weird choices like Cassia is an officer even though it seems like nothing about her character includes being a military officer just a lovely noble who likes to order servants around. Shouldn't there be some kinda psyker class? Same with Idira who doesn't really seem to be an 'operative' at all character wise and the abilities don't seem to synergize with her psyker stuff. Jae isn't much of an 'officer' either. At least Yrliet does seem like an operative though.
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Dec 23, 2023 12:37
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FuzzySlippers posted:Those both look cool, thanks. It took me a while to realize it but the "classes" are not always the important part. Specifically Cassia and Psykers can (and probably should) ignore most of the features of their class and just focus on their specific Psyker/Navigator features. It's like every character is forced to choose 2 to 3 classes to "multiclass" into, but you can ignore some of them to focus on the others. My Cassia for example never ever uses her Officer powers besides the Heroic action sometimes.
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Dec 23, 2023 12:40
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FuzzySlippers posted:Those both look cool, thanks. Officer isn’t a literal officer, it’s “person who orders other people around”. And psyker is more of an option to replace traditional advancement. You can absolutely ignore 100% of the archetype abilities and focus entirely on psyker stuff.
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Dec 23, 2023 12:41
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Calling the class officer instead of leader or something definitely implies military to me  and the abilities are like ordering people to open fire not announce her. If the important perks are all in the origin why overstuff that instead of moving more into a class that’s more relevant to the character?As it is the dynamic is a bit weird where her navigator origin is incredibly impactful but some origins are just an ability with a couple upgrade options. It’d also make the perk list less annoying if they didn’t have a bunch of semi unrelated perks thrown in to clutter it up. It isn’t terrible but all just a bit messy. I thought they were doing the best they could with someone else’s system, but it seems like this was all their call. If it’s moddable since a class is just a perk list it’d probably be easy to setup alternatives. If modding catches on and someone does a reimagining of the classes that’d make for a good replay when the DLC launches. FuzzySlippers fucked around with this message at 13:04 on Dec 23, 2023 |
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Dec 23, 2023 12:58
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FuzzySlippers posted:Calling the class officer instead of leader or something definitely implies military to me It's Owlcat, they can't help themselves. I'm just glad that the game a lot A LOT smoother to play compared to Pathfinder.
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Dec 23, 2023 13:04
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I'm honestly finding it a little dry mechanically compared to WotR. It's easier to understand, but the combat feels far more samey and it absolutely feels like there's a lot fewer viable player options.
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Dec 23, 2023 13:25
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Xun posted:Yes, at least my gf missed a bunch of stuff in the first act because she went straight for the main story and there's at least one other quest I can think of off the top of my head that can fail if you leave it in favor of other quests. I thought so. Will it be really obvious when I'm approaching a new chapter? I'm only in chapter 2, but I have a feeling I have gotten the quest that leads to 3. I like to sprinkle side content and main story inbetween eachother, so it would be a bummer to suddenly get locked out of whatever I haven't gotten around to.
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Dec 23, 2023 13:32
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QuasiQuack posted:I thought so. Will it be really obvious when I'm approaching a new chapter? I'm only in chapter 2, but I have a feeling I have gotten the quest that leads to 3. The furthest I've gotten is Act 3 and there's always been a "the act is clearly about to end" moment. For act 2 it's when you start the ceremony after getting your four colony planets.
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Dec 23, 2023 13:44
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Dry is a good description. I am a degenerate reroller and respecer. There are plenty of crpgs I have tons of hours in that I’ve never finished from constantly restarting. I’ve probably gone through Privateers Hold in DF over a hundred times. I’ve taken innumerable parties to New City in wiz7. By this point with Wrath I had restarted at least half a dozen times and respeced endlessly. I am still on my first character in RT and haven’t respeced once. I’m interested in another run to see the story aspects of being a religious nut, but nothing mechanically sounds exciting. The most interesting mechanical origins are npcs so changing my pc origin isn’t that exciting and I feel I’ve explored the classes pretty thoroughly on one run
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Dec 23, 2023 13:53
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Aramoro posted:The fact it sounds like Monkey is just part of the joke. Also equally coincidentally the tau word for human sounds like gorilla.
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Dec 23, 2023 14:33
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FuzzySlippers posted:I wanted some WH fiction while I played the game so I read the Rogue Trader trilogy books and they were alright. Any other recommendations for WH books in the spirit of the game so more either naval space or adventure-ish with few space marines or straight guard warfare? Anything in this sector of space? I've read all the usual suspects in 40k fiction like Horus Heresy, Eisenhorn, Gaunt's Ghosts, Caiaphas Caine, Ravenor. Those are some old books. Have you read any of the new 40k stuff? Vaults of Terra, Watchers of the Throne, etc..? Definitely do if not, those novels in particular are quality while also introducing the Great Rift, Fall of Cadia, Indomitus Crusade, return of Guilliman, and so on. These aren't specifically Rogue Trader/space related but they setup the setting as of 2017. The Dawn of Fire series is more of a mixed bag but the novel Sea of Souls takes place pretty much entirely on an Imperial Navy battlecruiser. CottonWolf posted:I’ve not read/listened to it yet, but Sea of Souls just came out and is apparently a good Imperial Navy book. I finished it a few days ago. It's a good Imperial Navy focused book, yeah. It's only really tangential to the Indomitus Crusade/Dawn of Fire series in general, but it's a solid read. Some nice Chaos/body horror stuff as well. Lassitude fucked around with this message at 14:46 on Dec 23, 2023 |
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Dec 23, 2023 14:41
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Kanos posted:I was mostly replying to the idea that someone shooting a daemon summoner in the head immediately was part of a genre-savvy metagaming approach, rather than whether or not one choice or the other provided more interesting content. If anything going "maybe i'll let the person who summoned a daemon in the middle of my ship that could have blown it up and killed everyone off with a slap on the wrist to see what interesting content results" is probably a bit weirder. Me kill demons easy, they're no problem.
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Dec 23, 2023 14:49
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SHISHKABOB posted:Me kill demons easy, they're no problem. It took a bit to get enough Navigator points to turn my whole network yellow so yeah, no longer afraid of demons because I could fill my ships underdecks with their carcasses, if they left any. First time you see a bloodthirster is an intense moment of panic, immediately dispelled when they try to charge a heavy bolter and get transformed into a fine and angry mist.
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Dec 23, 2023 14:53
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Can't go wrong with ADB. Spears is really good.
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Dec 23, 2023 14:53
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So when I was seeing the "there's not enough variety in the classes" posts, I did have kneejerk "ah it's fine" reaction but thinking on it, yeah, I can see it. I think the abstraction of Cassia and Jae being "officers" is fine personally for example, but the issue for me is, I'm only in act 2 and looking ahead I know I'm only going to get at a push, one or two more active abilities on my characters who aren't psykers and they're all fitting pretty solidly into their combat grooves so to speak that I expect won't change massively over the course of the rest of the game. Then if I replay it, even I'm using different characters in my party they'll still largely be fitting into those same grooves just in a different configuration. Hopefully the DLC companions each have a new base archetype and that becomes available for your main character as well at least. Maybe new secondary ones that then become available for everyone too.
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Dec 23, 2023 15:01
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I think they were gonna add more classes with DLC? 5 more IIRC. IMO the current class variety is fine but for my second playthrough some more options will definitely not go amiss.
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Dec 23, 2023 15:04
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I'll do a second playthough as a psyker eventually but I'm not very interested in the other classes except officer, which I'm doing for my first.
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Dec 23, 2023 15:13
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Carcer posted:I'll do a second playthough as a psyker eventually but I'm not very interested in the other classes except officer, which I'm doing for my first. Really depends what you pick for psyker school. Pyromancer officer will be a bit weird till you get to master tactician at least
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Dec 23, 2023 15:16
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Jack Trades posted:I think they were gonna add more classes with DLC? 5 more IIRC. Someone in this thread did say that, I'd like to hope but that'd seem like a lot to me, the DLC store page says for the second one that it adds "new archetypes" but doesn't specify a number. Unless they've gone into more specifics in the discord or something I'm gonna keep my expectations lower than 5. It would make sense imo if the new companions were new archetypes just from a "they give you cool new poo poo" perspective but then the first dlc companion is a death cult assassin, who are traditionally your stabby dashy agile fighter types and there is a class already called assassin that does a lot of that. The one in the second one sounds like it'd be a lot more different than most of the base game companions as a space cop (in 40k the squad can have a "leashmaster" who has a robot dog and the captain has a weird loudspeaker thing he can use to shout "I am the law" so hard it hurts people so they'd have some options there) but that one won't be out for a year at least as well so quite a wait.
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Dec 23, 2023 15:17
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My plan is to beat the game once now, and then again when all the DLC comes out.
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Dec 23, 2023 15:22
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Kanos posted:I'm honestly finding it a little dry mechanically compared to WotR. It's easier to understand, but the combat feels far more samey and it absolutely feels like there's a lot fewer viable player options. In their Pathfinder games it's the same problem but there were dozens of different class options, so 1/4 of them being sub-optimal isn't as noticeable as here. There's a industrial design test call the oil test, where for a consumer good the person will oil up their non-dominant hand to see if the item can still be used effectively in a safe manner. Owlcat has the sort of reverse philosophy where hard specialization in a narrow window of flexibility is required.
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Dec 23, 2023 15:52
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I just had the silliest example of pointless friendly fire in this. My ally ran up to an enemy and used an AoE melee attack, killing one of my party members and two other allies. There was just one enemy, why did you do that?
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Dec 23, 2023 15:59
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So I'm a little behind the crowd, plugging my way through act 2 and I just learned about the word 'Mon'kie'. I was greatly amused by how stupidly blunt it is. As far as classes go? In a way I'm grateful because unlike Pathfinder I have absolutely no background in Rogue Trader so I was afraid I'd be hopelessly overwhelmed. On the other, I made Idira an Assassin because I already had a Master Tactician and a Grand Strategist (or whatever her other two options were). It's working out very poorly. ChrisBTY fucked around with this message at 16:45 on Dec 23, 2023 |
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Dec 23, 2023 16:37
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Carcer posted:I'll do a second playthough as a psyker eventually but I'm not very interested in the other classes except officer, which I'm doing for my first. If you want a non support psyker officer is the worst archetype you can pick. Soldier's Run and Gun lets you make a second attack of any type, including psyker powers, while operative will passively much more than double your damage.
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Dec 23, 2023 16:46
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One way Owlcat dropped the ball, 100 percent, is in lack of reactivity to you being a psyker. Like I think the only time it ever even comes up aside from that starting conversation is a throwaway line when you get to the Warrant of Trade. There's at least three times off the top of my head I can think of that could and should involve those powers but it just never gets mentioned. I guess Baldur's Gate's reactivity spoiled me a bit.
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Dec 23, 2023 17:03
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As a less mechanically inclined player the thing I dislike most about the character progression is how cluttered it is. I had to respec Cassia because I'd been spending all this time not realizing how far down the list I needed to scroll past all this generic stuff to find her actually good talents. It's clear that there's some interesting synergies if you are smart enough to read and remember through all these formula-heavy talents and abilities to generate lots of stacks of this or that but there are so many different action currencies that I kind of glaze over trying to decipher the bonuses which are expressed in terms of mathematical formulas of other bonuses that are in turn changed by yet other bonuses. I've watched a couple build guides and the gap between middlingly built party and a super tuned party is massive as far as how much damage and how many actions you get in the first turn. In some ways. it's appropriate to the universe that combat is so lethal. "Rebels attacked the Rogue Trader, her entourage responded with horrendous fury and shouting. They annihilated the heretics where they stood before any of the wretches could act," is the kind of thing you'd read in a sidebar in a 40k book. I think I prefer BG3's system which gives you lots of abilities with relatively few stacking bonuses. It's easier to understand how to use that in a fight, where RT's very stingy ability roll out enhanced by lots of passive bonuses and modifications means that the interesting decisions get made in the clumsy character leveling interface, while the combat is about executing your plan.
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Dec 23, 2023 17:53
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thebardyspoon posted:Someone in this thread did say that, I'd like to hope but that'd seem like a lot to me, the DLC store page says for the second one that it adds "new archetypes" but doesn't specify a number. Unless they've gone into more specifics in the discord or something I'm gonna keep my expectations lower than 5. The Rogue Trader Reddit seems sure there are 5 coming in DLC2, one new base and the 4 new advanced combinations. That’s where I got it from, but digging into it, I can’t find an original source for that.
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Dec 23, 2023 18:22
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Yeah Ive never seen confirmation either :/
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Dec 23, 2023 18:22
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Well it totally makes sense as a thing to tempt people to buy it so I wouldn't be surprised, just makes sense to not get overhyped before they confirm it. I'll also not be buying DLC for it until the base game is pretty thoroughly patched anyway, which from the sounds of it might take awhile.
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Dec 23, 2023 18:33
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doingitwrong posted:As a less mechanically inclined player the thing I dislike most about the character progression is how cluttered it is. Half the time you should be able to filter the talents. The other half it makes you pick a "common" talent, whatever that means, and I think that includes the navigator talents she gets, but they dont let us filter those...
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Dec 23, 2023 18:48
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A quick search on Reddit brought up this: https://www.reddit.com/r/RogueTraderCRPG/comments/189qe2p/starrok_posted_this_on_discord_dlc_plan_for_rogue/
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Dec 23, 2023 18:58
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Getting a weird bug after the patch...all my information and dialogue windows are transparent, effectively making the game unplayable because I can't read anything.
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Dec 23, 2023 19:25
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Aramoro posted:The fact it sounds like Monkey is just part of the joke. It's a long standing 40k joke. Eldar call humans "mon-keigh". Tau call humans "gue-la".
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Dec 23, 2023 19:26
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Devorum posted:Getting a weird bug after the patch...all my information and dialogue windows are transparent, effectively making the game unplayable because I can't read anything. Roll a dice for every conversation option.
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Dec 23, 2023 19:26
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Hubbert posted:It's a long standing 40k joke. I like to imagine that in the decade or so between the 2 the writers learnt that humans are apes and not monkeys and fixed it for tau.
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Dec 23, 2023 19:28
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Aramoro posted:I like to imagine that in the decade or so between the 2 the writers learnt that humans are apes and not monkeys and fixed it for tau. I thought the Eldar "mon-keigh" was a relatively modern lore development. It certainly wasn't present in the Dawn of War games, for example, in the times you encountered or played as Eldar. Meanwhile I'm pretty sure gue-la was some OG Codex Tau stuff.
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