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mobby_6kl posted:The Saudis had pretty big goals, here only the launchers used to attack shipping need to be taken out. Though if they're using mobile trucks or something it could be more difficult to track down. They are big missiles that make big flames and smoke at launch, so I think you could just deploy enough surveillance drones and satellites to keep an eye out for missile launches, follow the launchers to where they came from, and blow it all up. I don't know what the system uses for acquiring targets but presumably it uses an active radar, so looking for radio emissions might also lead somewhere? These sorts of operations always run a risk of causing civilian casualties, though. A more passive route (which doesn't exclude also hunting down the missile systems) would be to just escort merchant ships with destroyers that can shoot down the missiles. It's not without risks (willfully getting shot at), but doable, and I doubt that Houthis have an unlimited stack of ballistic antishipping missiles to just throw at protected targets.
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Dec 22, 2023 18:29
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Speaking of those principled Houthis sticking up for Palestine and fighting a just cause, they are even willing to do so despite it exacerbating famine at home. Such standup righteous guys, those Houthis. "Revenue at the Israeli port of Eilat is down 80%, and the cost of shipping goods to Israel is rising. But Eilat handles only around 5% of Israel’s seaborne trade; most of it goes through Ashdod and Haifa on the Mediterranean. The Houthis will raise costs for Israeli consumers, but they are far from placing the country under siege. The consequences could be much worse in Yemen, which imports more than 80% of its food. Most of that comes through Hodeidah, its main Red Sea port. Ships will now either avoid calling there or charge higher prices to reflect their own soaring cost of insurance. One Yemeni businessman says his freight rates have increased by more than 50% since the Houthis started their attacks" - The Economist
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Dec 22, 2023 23:49
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Edit: I wrote some sarcastic poo poo here. I'm done taking the bait from morons. Sorry ME thread.
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Dec 22, 2023 23:56
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Nenonen posted:I don't know what the system uses for acquiring targets They very well may be just launching at spots on a map as indicated by public ship tracking apps, or they may be using local surveillance equipment like drones to locate targets, but the missiles they are firing have no terminal guidance. Calling them an anti-ship ballistic missiles is technically accurate maybe since they are ballistic missiles being fired at ships but they are certainly not designed for that role.
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Dec 24, 2023 18:12
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Rent-A-Cop posted:... but the missiles they are firing have no terminal guidance. Some of them do, some of them don't. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e6PeA_Ixkz8
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Dec 24, 2023 22:01
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It seems like the IDF took out the senior IRGC commander in Syria with a missile strike https://twitter.com/AbasAslani/status/1739340048607166684?s=20
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Dec 25, 2023 21:25
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https://twitter.com/Reuters/status/1740492823353266550 France, Spain, and Italy were announced as members, and have since retracted their support; all three have their own ships performing safety & security drills in the region, so either they don't see a need to endanger themselves in support of Israel because they can protect their own, or they are unofficially participating, and openly supporting a US venture to protect Israel is distinctly radioactive. Maersk has announced that it will be returning to the Canal, but they don't stipulate when they will be doing so, if they will be handling freight sent to Israel, and stress that their plans are subject to change. Some ships are turning off their transponders (which, IMO is probably more dangerous; Yemen is going to be suspicious of these ships, and it complicates any rescue attempt). Others are doing the opposite, using their transponders to note that their destination is Not Israel:   As of now traffic to Israel remains barren; all visible ships are either to Jordan, Jordan -> Israel, or Israel ships idling at Eliat. Rent-A-Cop posted:They very well may be just launching at spots on a map as indicated by public ship tracking apps, or they may be using local surveillance equipment like drones to locate targets, but the missiles they are firing have no terminal guidance. To be fair this is 95% of all ordinance used past & present. It's a lot more expensive to glue an iphone to a rocket than to fire one rocket & course-correct for the second. Neurolimal fucked around with this message at 04:27 on Dec 29, 2023 |
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Dec 29, 2023 04:13
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Neurolimal posted:To be fair this is 95% of all ordinance used past & present. It's a lot more expensive to glue an iphone to a rocket than to fire one rocket & course-correct for the second. A great lesson for everyone else who has outsourced their entire economy to multinational corporations flying flags of convenience.
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Dec 29, 2023 20:15
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None of the ships attacked in the past were going to/from Israel, or really had any connection to Israel. The charitable interpretation of the attacks is that they're like a protest shutting down a random freeway (by taking potshots at passing cars with a rifle). The less charitable version is that they're like robbing a convenience store then saying "This was in solidarity with the Palestinian people". One ship was successfully hijacked and its crew (mostly from the Philippines or eastern Europe) are being held hostage, others had hijackers fought off, and the missile attacks were generally preeceded by "dock at our port or we will shoot you" threats
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Dec 29, 2023 23:36
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Foxfire_ posted:None of the ships attacked in the past were going to/from Israel, or really had any connection to Israel. Either way they're going to earn a bunch of cruise missiles for their trouble next time Raytheon needs a stock bump. And it's still a good lesson for any country that thinks relying on shipping they don't control for necessary goods is smart. Edit: I don't for a second actually believe they give a poo poo about Palestine, but even their obvious bullshit has apparently been effective. Rent-A-Cop fucked around with this message at 00:10 on Dec 30, 2023 |
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Dec 30, 2023 00:08
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why would the houthis not care about palestine? it seems clear from the sheer size of pro-palestinian demonstrations in yemen that public sentiment is quite fervent on the matter, and the palestinian issue is obviously one which seems to harmonise quite well with their general ideological outlook. with these things being true and also them repeatedly insisting that about palestine i don't see that it's reasonable to discount the idea of this being somewhat connected to what's going on in palestine
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Dec 30, 2023 00:49
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V. Illych L. posted:why would the houthis not care about palestine?
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Dec 30, 2023 00:54
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they're openly provoking the global hegemon by lobbing bombs at passing ships in possibly the most crucial sea lane in the world, this is hardly a simple smash-and-grab. there have got to be easier ways to make a quick profit if that's their agenda
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Dec 30, 2023 01:03
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V. Illych L. posted:why would the houthis not care about palestine? it seems clear from the sheer size of pro-palestinian demonstrations in yemen that public sentiment is quite fervent on the matter, and the palestinian issue is obviously one which seems to harmonise quite well with their general ideological outlook. with these things being true and also them repeatedly insisting that about palestine i don't see that it's reasonable to discount the idea of this being somewhat connected to what's going on in palestine Shouldn't material interests determine their geopolitical stance, rather than protests and general ideological outlooks? If the Houthis feel that it is in their interest to fire missiles at civilians, they will do so, regardless of whether they care in any way about Palestine or not. The war gives them a great excuse to so, but it's not like they were deeply in love with Israel prior to the war. Pointing to protests feels quite weak to me, I'm not sure the Houthi leadership would be very keen to be submit to protests on matters where they don't already agree with the protestors.
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Dec 30, 2023 01:26
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V. Illych L. posted:they're openly provoking the global hegemon The US is an empire in decline with no appetite for finishing the genocide its client kingdom started. Nobody else really gives a poo poo. Rent-A-Cop fucked around with this message at 02:04 on Dec 30, 2023 |
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Dec 30, 2023 02:02
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Rent-A-Cop posted:Por que no los dos? It’s hard to believe that others have beliefs when you have none yourself.
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Dec 30, 2023 04:04
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Yeah on the risk-reward scale for the Houthis I'd say this makes sense. It's a way to build up a lot of support both within Yemen and across the Muslim world, which can potentially work towards breaking the deadlock in their civil war. They're effectively already fighting the same people anyway, inasmuch that the US is supporting the Saudis.
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Dec 30, 2023 04:55
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poor waif posted:Shouldn't material interests determine their geopolitical stance, rather than protests and general ideological outlooks? If the Houthis feel that it is in their interest to fire missiles at civilians, they will do so, regardless of whether they care in any way about Palestine or not. The war gives them a great excuse to so, but it's not like they were deeply in love with Israel prior to the war. how do you imagine that political movements "mean" things? the houthis have an opportunity to position themselves as the foremost champions of palestine abroad, which is enormously popular among their constituency and in accordance with their official ideology which presumably at least some people in the movement sincerely believe. they were not doing this stuff before the present escalation in palestine, and are explicitly drawing the connection to that escalation to justify their actions. there's also a plausible connection between placing pressure on the suez and placing pressure on israel, since it's an enormously important shipping route both globally and especially locally. i have no deep insight into the psychology of the houthi political bureau, but it doesn't feel terribly relevant to me - it seems most straightforward to read this as indeed being meaningfully connected to what's going on in palestine and thus that they for all intents and purposes "care" about palestine
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Dec 30, 2023 14:43
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V. Illych L. posted:how do you imagine that political movements "mean" things? the houthis have an opportunity to position themselves as the foremost champions of palestine abroad, which is enormously popular among their constituency and in accordance with their official ideology which presumably at least some people in the movement sincerely believe. they were not doing this stuff before the present escalation in palestine, and are explicitly drawing the connection to that escalation to justify their actions. there's also a plausible connection between placing pressure on the suez and placing pressure on israel, since it's an enormously important shipping route both globally and especially locally. Not sure where I said anything about political movement meaning anything, are you quoting the right post? It can sometimes be informative to look at political movements as expressions of the interests and economic relationships of the class they represent, more than being guided entirely by ideas. Their material interests result in a set of ideas (an ideology) used to excuse or possibly explain why they do these things, but assuming that ideology guides their actions is often putting the cart before the horse. If your argument is that the Houthis uniquely are a group that is guided entirely by morals and ideology, it's a bit surprising that this haven of morality ends up firing missiles at civilians for the crime of going to work that day. That's why America for instance can be appalled at bombing civilians in Ukraine, but actively support bombing civilians in Palestine, or any other million examples. There's rarely a single ideology that guides an organization of millions of people, they have interests that result in these positions. It's entirely possible that the Houthi have interests that align with Hamas, or with Palestine as a whole, but purely humanitarian reasons and their love for civilians is probably not dominant. There are a lot of other conflicts in their immediate area where they could care just as much if they're worried about civilian deaths, but don't. They could blockade the Suez canal for Sudan, Eritrea, Somalia or wherever people are suffering at the moment. In this case they determined that it is in their interests to fire missiles at various ships, so they did so.
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Dec 30, 2023 15:29
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poor waif posted:Not sure where I said anything about political movement meaning anything, are you quoting the right post? you responded to my post, which was originally responding to the idea that the houthis don't care about palestine and that entertaining that idea was something to scoff at. i then follow up on the response by elaborating a bit on why i don't think that's a reasonable thing to say, in this case because the interests and official positions of the interest groups to which they're beholden and their own public rhetoric on the matter seem to support the idea that there is a level of real investment in the palestinian cause from the houthi movement and it's not just an excuse to do some piracy or whatever. i have never suggested or attempted to suggest that the houthis were "purely humanitarian" or anything of the sort and tbh i think that that interpretation requires a rather strained reading of my posting in general and in particular the quoted post
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Dec 30, 2023 19:03
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https://twitter.com/Moh_Alhouthi/status/1740805094260564359Google Translate posted:As stated, Websites specialized in maritime navigation indicate that several ships are using the ship identification system in a new way. By adding and announcing the phrase “We have no relationship with Israel” when crossing the Red Sea. that Yemeni Armed Forces Which confirms that any ships that are not Israeli and do not head towards occupied Palestinian ports will not be a military target will encourage Houthi seems to endorse the move to write NO CONTACT ISRAEL in their transponders.
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Dec 30, 2023 20:54
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V. Illych L. posted:you responded to my post, which was originally responding to the idea that the houthis don't care about palestine and that entertaining that idea was something to scoff at. i then follow up on the response by elaborating a bit on why i don't think that's a reasonable thing to say, in this case because the interests and official positions of the interest groups to which they're beholden and their own public rhetoric on the matter seem to support the idea that there is a level of real investment in the palestinian cause from the houthi movement and it's not just an excuse to do some piracy or whatever. Why would I know the first thing about your posting in general, I don't keep an excel sheet of posters and I have no idea who you are. I replied to a post asking a question, and I thought the question was odd. Your question was "why would the houthis not care about palestine?". I'm saying organizations don't act because they care or because of ideology, they act because they determine that doing so advances their interests, and the moment their interests stop being aligned, they stop "caring". "Caring" is the result of aligned interests, it's not the root cause for their actions. A state does not have emotions or feelings in that sense, and attributing feelings to a state is likely to lead to some incorrect conclusions. If caring just means that Hamas and the Houthis have aligned interests, sure, but that's not how I normally use the word. Public rhetoric, allowing protests and ideology are derived from the interests of the ruling class. I'm sure individual members of the Houthi movement can care about Palestine, but attributing that same feeling to the entire state is not a useful way to think about geopolitics. The Houthi state cares about the plight of the Palestinians in the same way as the US government cared about Afghanistan in the 80s, or the Soviet Union in 1943. If tomorrow Gaza becomes the liberal light of the Middle East and applies to join NATO, I think the Houthis would end up "caring" a lot less, as suddenly their interests would no longer be very well-aligned.
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Dec 30, 2023 21:20
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poor waif posted:Why would I know the first thing about your posting in general, I don't keep an excel sheet of posters and I have no idea who you are. I replied to a post asking a question, and I thought the question was odd. my question was a response to an ongoing concern, as i just specifically pointed out. we are then back to the point where you seem to think that no political organisation can be said to "care" about any agenda at all, since priorities are naturally transient - either that or you insist on attributing to me a position which is indeed asinine and which i have specifically disavowed
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Dec 31, 2023 00:27
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Wow they have extracted the concession of changing a couple bits on a transponder. Truly we are seeing the decline of the US hegemony. The end is nigh for the side that is indiscriminately killing tens of thousands of Palestinians. Members of NATO said they would operate under a NATO command structure, that absent that they weren't interested in participating. I can certainly understand why they wouldn't want to be seen as supporting Israel at this time. I don't see what this really accomplishes other than providing some cope on the internet, but I guess if that's what you want it's what you want. Hopefully these Houthi freedom fighters release all of the non-israeli hostages they've attacked as a part of this process. Grip it and rip it fucked around with this message at 04:15 on Jan 3, 2024 |
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Jan 3, 2024 04:12
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https://x.com/washingtonpost/status/1742540348465852891 Huge terror attack in Iran. Do attacks like this happen in Iran from internal forces? I don't recall any in recent history, but I don't follow it that closely.
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Jan 3, 2024 15:12
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It’s pretty rare
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Jan 3, 2024 15:15
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ummel posted:https://x.com/washingtonpost/status/1742540348465852891 Israel did it OP
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Jan 3, 2024 15:22
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Iran doesn't seem to be blaming Israel for it as of yet.
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Jan 3, 2024 15:51
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With only glancing at the headline I'll say the MEK is a revolutionary group which occasionally gets blamed for this sort of thing. I can't think of an attack on this scale though, ever. Iran's enemy list is a mile long, and the conspiracy oriented might say it was a false flag, which I wouldn't give much credence to.
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Jan 3, 2024 16:05
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The last time there was a big terror attack in Iran, it was ISIS. No idea who conducted this current attack, but remember that Iran and the US, without working together directly, were both fighting against ISIS at the same time, with the IRGC and Soleimani himself working a lot of counter-ISIS operations in Iraq and Syria. Or, for maximum "goddammit" maybe it was Israel who knows.
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Jan 3, 2024 16:06
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I know everyone is going to jump to blame Israel, and it's certainly a possibility but it's not the only possibility. I'm sure the timing isn't a coincidence though.
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Jan 3, 2024 16:14
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You can’t rule out Israel but i think it’s more likely to be another group
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Jan 3, 2024 16:40
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ISIS, or a franchise of ISIS would be my tentative bet.
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Jan 3, 2024 16:43
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Well, surely by now nobody still thinks Israel would be opposed on moral grounds to this kind of action. But a direct attack like this would be escalatory enough (at a time when they are vulnerable due to having stuck their dick into a Gazan woodchipper) that I'd need to see more direct proof than just 'Israel bad' Hopefully things become clearer as more evidence comes out - though things look pretty grim in terms of numbers of people killed/injured. BBC claiming they were bombs planted in a two bag remotely detonated. So not a suicide attack.
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Jan 3, 2024 16:47
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if it was israel, the only plausible motive would be they want to escalate the current regional poo poo storm, but i can't really see to what end. force the us into a more direct role in the fighting? unify public sentiment in the face of netanyahu's bad polling and the supreme court setting back the judicial overhaul effort? i won't pretend i can get into the headspace of ethnonationalist rightwingers (see my guesses on the intentions of putin in late 2021), but the risks seem to outweigh the likely benefits
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Jan 3, 2024 20:36
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GhostofJohnMuir posted:if it was israel, the only plausible motive would be they want to escalate the current regional poo poo storm, but i can't really see to what end. force the us into a more direct role in the fighting? unify public sentiment in the face of netanyahu's bad polling and the supreme court setting back the judicial overhaul effort? The war in Gaza has not gone well and their initial goal of "destroying Hamas" will not be achieved. Now they are flailing and have launched airstrikes in Lebanon, Jordan, Yemen, Syria, and just recently assassinated a Hamas leader in Beirut proper. A regional war would ensure US involvement and direct military support. Nasrallah referenced their attempts to goad others into a direct confrontation today in his speech. The risks involved in this entire debacle have outweighed the benefits. I wont post anymore here since I mistakenly posted ITT anyway.
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Jan 3, 2024 20:49
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Caro just got awarded $50 million, like a real life Spawny Get https://x.com/MansourOmari/status/1742634380437188712
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Jan 3, 2024 20:55
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lasted i heard he was not doing particularly well, so i hope it's being paid in some way that maintains a support system for him i feel kind of conflicted on such a big payout going to an american while we steadily approach year 15 of syrain refugee crisis
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Jan 3, 2024 21:07
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as well as someone who went to war by choice and lied about medical skills
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Jan 3, 2024 21:38
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Brown Moses posted:Caro just got awarded $50 million, like a real life Spawny Get
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Jan 3, 2024 21:46
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