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LifeSunDeath posted:also crazy is you can see the spray of gunfire as they're trying to hit the drone. like that's a little jetski type thing they're shooting at but can't even hit that. what modern warships can't even hit a small craft that's trying to get near them? russia's navy being a joke is an old joke, but also LOL. What puzzles me is how few splashes there are. Most American warships have at least a couple token .50s for exactly this kind of bullshit. Edit: Orthanc6 posted:Sinking the entire Black Sea fleet is a strategic goal, including the ships that are not being much use right now (ie: most of them) cause they can still mess with Ukraine's shipping. And losing the fleet is a political hit that is extremely difficult to sweep under the rug even in Putin's world. It's also a long-term problem for Russia. Warships are expensive and take time to build [citation needed], so every ship lost has implications for their future planning. Blue Footed Booby fucked around with this message at 20:36 on Feb 1, 2024 |
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Feb 1, 2024 20:34
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mlmp08 posted:Most of them. Thank you! 20% still seems like a crazy amount
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Feb 1, 2024 20:34
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You sunk my BlyatlshipDirt5o8 posted:Thank you! 20% still seems like a crazy amount I'm sure they lost them against a fierce opponent with their own substantial navy. *checks notes* Oh. Oh dear. Nervous fucked around with this message at 20:37 on Feb 1, 2024 |
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Feb 1, 2024 20:34
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It's the kind of loss rate where they desperately need to protect their assets to remain operational, but to defend Crimea and to continue missile attacks from south they can't just pull completely to eastern Black Sea either.
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Feb 1, 2024 20:49
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Fidelitious posted:I assume none of those defensive guns can even decline low enough once a drone boat gets within a certain range. So they still haven’t fixed that problem in the last almost 225 years?
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Feb 1, 2024 20:57
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CNN's published an opinion piece by Zaluzhnyi. Among other things he stresses Russia's advantage in human resources and how only through unpopular measures like mobilisation Ukraine can hope to catch up on that front. He also goes through some military innovations and lessons learned from the war. https://edition.cnn.com/2024/02/01/opinions/ukraine-army-chief-war-strategy-russia-valerii-zaluzhnyi/index.html It doesn't necessarily give credence to the rumours of his resignation, but the timing is probably not a coincidence.
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Feb 1, 2024 21:00
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Tigey posted:This is not funny - boats only do this when they are in extreme distress Counterpoint: This is very funny.
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Feb 1, 2024 21:01
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Paladinus posted:CNN's published an opinion piece by Zaluzhnyi. Among other things he stresses Russia's advantage in human resources and how only through unpopular measures like mobilisation Ukraine can hope to catch up on that front. He also goes through some military innovations and lessons learned from the war. Considering UA parliament didn't even let a bill get to the floor before being thrown out in regards to harsh punishments to draft dodgers, I'm doubtful of that in the short term being allowed to happen. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-67949900 Ukraine's parliament has refused to consider a conscription bill that proposes a crackdown on draft dodgers.
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Feb 1, 2024 21:06
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Blue Footed Booby posted:What puzzles me is how few splashes there are. Most American warships have at least a couple token .50s for exactly this kind of bullshit. To everyone implying or saying that Russia could "just shoot these little ski jets!", it's actually pretty hard. Imagine you're on a boat moving 20 knots through choppy water. You have to hit something moving 60 knots through the same choppy water and its a few hundred meters away. Also it's dark out. Also the boat is dark, against dark water. I sure hope you have thermal sights, a stabilized gun, a laser range finder that only returns results from hard targets, and ideally a radar which can spot and track a 60-knot ski jet at sea level (instead of the 600-knot 15-ton F-15 at 2,000m elevation it was probably designed to detect). You might as well ask infantry why they're not just shooting these little drones out of the sky. Hitting a moving target is hard, particularly when it's small and rapidly changing acceleration and velocity. Nervous posted:You sunk my Blyatlship The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > War in Ukraine CE: You sunk my Blyatlship
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Feb 1, 2024 21:26
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OddObserver posted:Mc is way too "Anglo-Saxon". As is face. Should be something like Blyaty Blyatmordov. Blyaty blyatovich
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Feb 1, 2024 21:27
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Zopotantor posted:So they still haven’t fixed that problem in the last almost 225 years? Even if you want to fix the problem, the fix will change the number of low-angle options from 0 to like 3 or whatever. You still are going to want most guns set up for higher-angle fire or anti-air - losing occasional ships to this kind of attack definitely sucks for them, but dying to aerial attacks could lose the whole fleet pretty quickly
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Feb 1, 2024 21:42
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Yeah, to be clear, if it's moderately dark outside and there are a few waves, you ain't hitting poo poo with a DShK mount on a boat unless the target is big and static.
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Feb 1, 2024 21:47
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I'm slightly surprised several people here are still treating the reports of Zelenskyy asking Zaluzhny to resign as "rumours". It was confirmed by the Economist, the Financial Times, Ryan Evans (War on the Rocks), Dmitri Alperovitch, and Michael Kofman. To quote the FT, "Zelenskyy on Monday offered Valeriy Zaluzhny, commander-in-chief of the armed forces, a new role but the general refused." The Economist says that new role was to be the "secretary of the national security council". The relationship between the two has apparently been fraught for some time (years). It is true that there are very few publications (if any) that can be trusted when it comes to reporting on unnamed sources. However there are specific people that have shown they can be trusted.
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Feb 1, 2024 22:17
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Not great if true for a general to say "no" to the civilian chain of command.
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Feb 1, 2024 22:25
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Zopotantor posted:So they still haven’t fixed that problem in the last almost 225 years? loving lmbo quote:Finding that he had been beaten by such an inferior foe, the Spanish second-in-command asked Cochrane for a certificate assuring him that he had done all he could to defend his ship.[8] Cochrane obliged, with the equivocal wording that he had 'conducted himself like a true Spaniard'.[8] Anyway, Antigravitas posted:Yeah, to be clear, if it's moderately dark outside and there are a few waves, you ain't hitting poo poo with a DShK mount on a boat unless the target is big and static. Turns out I'm so stupid I hadn't thought through the implications of the video being through thermal vision. Yeah, you ain't hitting that. Blue Footed Booby fucked around with this message at 23:20 on Feb 1, 2024 |
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Feb 1, 2024 23:17
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Ynglaur posted:The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > War in Ukraine CE: You sunk my Blyatlship Many people are proposing this
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Feb 1, 2024 23:26
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While it is a good one. I feel almost certain that we've already had some variation of it.
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Feb 1, 2024 23:31
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Some more news from the logistics front: Chancellor Scholz visits my home state on February 12th, to lay first cut for a new ammunition factory. Unterlüß in Lower Saxony has been the place where Rheinmetall put a new factory line for Gepard-ammunition, and since that worked out very well and the EU only managed to deliver maybe half of the promised "1 million shells" of 155mm ammunition, Germany decided to upgrade their ammunition production. Similar theme to my last post about this: In this case, Rheinmetall will create a completely new factory here in my state, which will is supposed to add 200k more shells to the yearly production of the EU in a couple years. Together with the other 200k shells from the other new factory, we're getting there. The other deal is mentioned here, another German and a French company promised another 200k shells. It's kind of darkly comedic that our production of artillery shells was so hosed, two more factories are all that is needed to nearly double current production. It's also kind of funny that 2/3rds of the new production will be German-only, with the French adding maybe the last third with their company. I mean, if I add the numbers up, most of the current 155mm artillery shell production in the EU seems also to be mostly French and German. Surely there must be some other EU-nations producing them, at least? I know Norway is making more 30mm shells, and I'm guessing the eastern states are doing something, but I confess I don't remember. 
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Feb 2, 2024 20:15
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Slovakia and Bulgaria.
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Feb 2, 2024 20:41
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Finland is producing 155mm ammo via Nammo Lapua, existing production went to full three shifts already and in December government made the decision to double production. But that won't be ready until years from now.
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Feb 2, 2024 20:58
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Ikasuhito posted:While it is a good one. I feel almost certain that we've already had some variation of it. Indeed!
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Feb 2, 2024 23:26
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Bulgaria is producing 152mm ammunition, I believe, though I haven't seen any sources claiming to know how much. The US is on track to hit 80,000 shells/month by the end of 2024. That's only 2,500 shells a day, though. It's not enough. I think the US and Europe should be targeting something like 4 million shells a year at this point, just for 155mm (never mind mortars, air defense, barrels for all of these guns, etc.). We have stockpiles to replenish, and at the same time can *easily* consume that much ammunition on an ongoing basis.
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Feb 3, 2024 02:27
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There's been a report today that the Czechs are pushing for the EU to purchase 450k 155mm ammo from outside Europe. https://www.politico.eu/article/czech-republic-artillery-weapons-ukraine-european-union/
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Feb 3, 2024 02:43
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Hasn't South Korea really been rising as an arms dealer this last few years? Couldn't they ramp up 155 production fast?
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Feb 3, 2024 02:53
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https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2024/02/02/zaluzhny-zelensky-white-house/ New reporting that Zaluzhny soon to be relieved. quote:The government of Ukraine has informed the White House that President Volodymyr Zelensky has decided to fire his top military commander, Gen. Valery Zaluzhny, in what would be the most consequential personnel shake-up of the war, said two people familiar with the discussion.
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Feb 3, 2024 03:55
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The guy did the job of saving the country in the initial invasion, but if you don't make much progress for a year it's time to get someone else. Ukraine doesn't have the luxury or manpower of an empire to wait 4 years for General Haig to learn how to win a war. Keep firing Generals until you find one that works.
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Feb 3, 2024 04:54
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Charlz Guybon posted:Hasn't South Korea really been rising as an arms dealer this last few years? It would be very darkly funny if both side were using artillery shells from respective Koreas.
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Feb 3, 2024 05:33
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Xiahou Dun posted:It would be very darkly funny if both side were using artillery shells from respective Koreas. Well, the war is being fought on former Hwanguk territory.
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Feb 3, 2024 05:50
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Xiahou Dun posted:It would be very darkly funny if both side were using artillery shells from respective Koreas. Korea playing the long-con as payback from decades ago huh?
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Feb 3, 2024 10:48
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Charlz Guybon posted:Hasn't South Korea really been rising as an arms dealer this last few years? Reminder that ramping up production as in building new production capacity is not fast, it takes years to build that. If existing factories are not working 24/7 then you can increase capacity there, but only up to a point.
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Feb 3, 2024 11:12
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You can ramp up production at one factory by increasing shifts or whatever, but you need to ramp up the entire supply chain. It doesn't do much good to have shells filled when the factory producing the fuzes can't keep up
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Feb 3, 2024 11:22
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Comstar posted:The guy did the job of saving the country in the initial invasion, but if you don't make much progress for a year it's time to get someone else. Ukraine doesn't have the luxury or manpower of an empire to wait 4 years for General Haig to learn how to win a war. Firing generals in major wars is nothing new and it's discouraging when the media makes a big deal out of it. The general who performed well in the past but is not delivering results currently absolutely needs to be relieved. It shouldn't even be a career ender. In WW2, the u.s. alone relieved something like 20 generals. Some of them, after a period of performing at a lower level, we're elevated back into command. Sorry, my dislike of u.s. army leadership for the last 70 years is slipping out.
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Feb 3, 2024 11:43
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Korea is an arms dealer but not as big as the US, France, Germany, UK, Italy, Sweden, Spain, Czechia… not exactly expecting a windfall from them either. Although ofc it depends on what you’re exporting too, ie Spain mainly does boats iirc which Ukraine clearly doesn’t need (lol)
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Feb 3, 2024 12:17
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Some decommissioned munitions which were planned to be scrapped, seem to be headed to Ukraine. https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/crv7-rockets-ukraine-canada-1.7103798 More countries should do this. I’m sure there are tons of perfectly fine weapons all ready written off, and waiting for destruction in western countries. Even if like in this case some warheads are missing, I’m sure Ukraine can make use of it. They’ve certainly shown to be extremely innovative and creative.
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Feb 3, 2024 14:02
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Koffman and Evan in Monday’s War on the Rocks episode were having a much different opinion on Zaluzhny saying he had wide support in the armed force. Ryan Evan thought it was an unnecessary and politically motivated decision. We can at least appreciate the fact that Ukraine is more flexible in its choice of generals than Russia. Gerasimov and co are going to be weight hanging around Russia’s neck for the rest of the war.
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Feb 3, 2024 14:26
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Comstar posted:The guy did the job of saving the country in the initial invasion, but if you don't make much progress for a year it's time to get someone else. Ukraine doesn't have the luxury or manpower of an empire to wait 4 years for General Haig to learn how to win a war. This approach assumes the problem is the general in charge. Can Ukraine achieve its political objectives at all while having a 5-to-1 deficit in artillery ammunition? I don't know, but it's not like Zaluzhny had no successes in 2023: the Ukrainian military re-opened grain shipping in November 2023 by defeating the Russian Black Sea Fleet. Yes, absolutely fire bad generals (and officers), but I'm unconvinced Zaluzhny is a bad general. He pivoted very quickly during the offensive when it became apparent that the concept of operations wasn't going to work. Let's keep in mind some constraints any Ukrainian commander will work under:
I don't think that Eisenhower or Manstein or Zhukov could do much better with those constraints, to be honest. Now, of course my analysis presumes that the decision is driven by Zaluzhny's impact or competence using military means to achieve political ends. There are other valid reasons to fire otherwise competent generals (see: Truman firing MacArthur).
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Feb 3, 2024 15:22
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Ynglaur posted:I don't think that Eisenhower or Manstein or Zhukov could do much better with those constraints, to be honest. I believe Admiral Yi can pull this out! 
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Feb 3, 2024 16:35
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Both Lincoln and Roosevelt rotated their generals around many times throughout their wars. It’s a normal thing - you need a leadership team that works well together. Maybe it’s a good idea, or a bad idea, but if the current dynamic isn’t healthy then something needs to change. Hopefully both of them see that.
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Feb 3, 2024 17:07
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Dirt5o8 posted:Firing generals in major wars is nothing new and it's discouraging when the media makes a big deal out of it. The general who performed well in the past but is not delivering results currently absolutely needs to be relieved. It shouldn't even be a career ender. Drones can do a lot but there doesn't seem to be any way to gain back significant territory without boots on the ground. Where there was an opportunity for easy gains around Kharkiv, Zaluzhny exploited it.
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Feb 3, 2024 17:14
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Ynglaur posted:I don't think that Eisenhower or Manstein or Zhukov could do much better with those constraints, to be honest. Fighting a protracted war at a deficit of equipment against an imperialist enemy? You need Võ Nguyên Giáp.
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Feb 3, 2024 19:04
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