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Weird Pumpkin posted:Even if you made a queue that banned all the popular strategies, people are going to optimize for how to win as fast and reliably as possible by the rules of the new theoretical queue I think that would be a lot of fun, make it cumulative over the course of each month or something and ban a lot of cards (the top 10 most popular cards each day). Make people really work to come up with new brews with whatever is left
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Mar 12, 2024 17:23
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FWIW these problems aren't unique to arena, every digital tcg I've played has them. Thinks like midweek magic or tavern brawl are the alternative queues. If you want to play off-meta you either have to durdle around at low tiers and accept that 75% of your games are just getting rolled by someone who's laddering, or hit mythic.
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Mar 12, 2024 17:29
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distortion park posted:I think that would be a lot of fun, make it cumulative over the course of each month or something and ban a lot of cards (the top 10 most popular cards each day). Make people really work to come up with new brews with whatever is left Thinking of the old forums game where people submit three card decks, they're all played against each other and the cards in the winning deck are banned in future rounds
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Mar 12, 2024 17:35
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Aphrodite posted:That would also have its own meta, which would just be assembling the 49% version of whatever is meta in Standard. I don't think there being a meta is a problem, last time I played kitchen table we had 3 decks to play with and there was a meta just among those 3. What is boring about standard (and why I don't want to play even more static formats) is seeing the same stuff all the time and in return often playing the same stuff too much. Once you learn what a deck or combo of cards are doing and how it responds to stuff, I get the picture and then anytime it's seen on either side of the board it is less amusing each time. My favourite event in arena is when they only let you play decks from cards using the last few sets. They don't stick around long enough, but if you keep playing past your wins you get to see more variety than usual. For myriad reasons they can't and won't make Standard a super fast rotating format but they already have ways to make alternate modes to dodge the consequences of Long standard. Realistically Arena doesn't want people playing whatever they want whenever they want, and they don't want you and your buddies playing a custom format just using what y'all have or god forbid share give trade decks or cards. A lobby is the dream but idk how to Arena-fy it sufficiently for them. No quest rewards of course but I guess they'd also want a little blood for dodging their ecosystem, some gem/gold fee to open or fire off lobbies.
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Mar 12, 2024 17:41
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Monthly ladder where every week the 10 most popular cards are banned until there is a 40 card banlist in the final week
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Mar 12, 2024 17:46
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Qwertycoatl posted:Thinking of the old forums game where people submit three card decks, they're all played against each other and the cards in the winning deck are banned in future rounds Wow I remember that. I think there was also a "worst deck" version (it had to beat a goldfish but lose as much as possible to everything else)
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Mar 12, 2024 17:47
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Sickening posted:I like to win with decks I put together myself. I don't like losing though. Only winning. I need a queue where I win. That's not what people are asking for when we say it'd be nice if jank had a place on Arena. There's a lot of mechanics/cards that are fun but are too low powered to bother bringing to a pool where people are playing time-tested stuff. It's one reason set drafts are so much fun - you get to actually engage with slower stuff and (generally) decks that aren't optimized. The frustration comes from trying to bring a Bear Tribal deck to a Vintage tournament, basically. It's not just that you're gonna lose, it's that neither player really gets a good game out of it. The person mentioning lobbies and chats is correct.
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Mar 12, 2024 17:52
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I wish they could bring back the off-the-wall all access formats. I can't find any article listing all the weirdo one-off things they've done for midweek magic but there have been some good ones they did "no limits" once which was no bans on cards, and you could use any number of cards. so you could do e.g. 20 mountains 40 lightning bolts. the meta strategy was swamp -> dark ritual -> dark ritual -> doom whisperer -> mill all your creeping chills. there was another format that had some interesting deck ideas: you started with a three card hand and you could cast one spell for free each turn. recently it's been feeling like the mwm rotation is pretty rote. it's like momir, pauper/artisan, phantom draft, and a random pre-existing format.
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Mar 12, 2024 18:12
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It sounds like people want chaos draft and sealed tbh Or standard league, which I'll always say was really fun
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Mar 12, 2024 18:14
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Vando posted:Monthly ladder where every week the 10 most popular cards are banned until there is a 40 card banlist in the final week I think they did this once with a group of mwms one month (or fnm arena, back when the weekly variety event took place on weekends)
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Mar 12, 2024 18:17
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They should do another omniscience draft. That's always a fun format, its a bunch of quick, momir-like games. I remember hearing that not every set lends itself well to that format, so they should just make a cube for it.
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Mar 12, 2024 18:23
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A Moose posted:They should do another omniscience draft. That's always a fun format, its a bunch of quick, momir-like games. I remember hearing that not every set lends itself well to that format, so they should just make a cube for it. you're in luck quote:MIDWEEK MAGIC
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Mar 12, 2024 19:10
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Khanstant posted:What is boring about standard (and why I don't want to play even more static formats) is seeing the same stuff all the time and in return often playing the same stuff too much. This is one of the reasons why I stopped playing competitive formats. I like variety too much. I only get to play once a week, if that, and I don't want to see the same cards over and over. But some people absolutely love it and they like knowing all the current archetypes inside and out and seeing all the possible moves. I also can't play chess and I think it's related.
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Mar 12, 2024 20:09
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I wonder if Arena somehow had a custom cube function if that'd serve. Anyone could create a cube and share it and then you could have lobbies to draft & play specific cubes with whoever.
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Mar 12, 2024 20:12
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Just do both. Play your competitive metagame decks on Arena and then your funsies decks in Paper. Become the Planeswalker Avatar and embrace all elements of Magic*. *except cEDH
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Mar 12, 2024 20:28
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CatstropheWaitress posted:That's not what people are asking for when we say it'd be nice if jank had a place on Arena. There's a lot of mechanics/cards that are fun but are too low powered to bother bringing to a pool where people are playing time-tested stuff. It's one reason set drafts are so much fun - you get to actually engage with slower stuff and (generally) decks that aren't optimized. The frustration comes from trying to bring a Bear Tribal deck to a Vintage tournament, basically. It's not just that you're gonna lose, it's that neither player really gets a good game out of it. You can get like a 40% winrate with some pretty drat bad decks, so honestly I don't see how that's NOT what people are asking for. If I just want to have fun with some jank, all I have to do is take that jank into the play queue.
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Mar 12, 2024 20:55
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I think people want to play jank vs jank and not 'lets see how my jank deck does against the 3 fotm decks repeatedly'
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Mar 12, 2024 21:39
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I think they'd just immediately start complaining about whatever the flavor of the month jank deck is in that cast
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Mar 12, 2024 21:43
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reignonyourparade posted:You can get like a 40% winrate with some pretty drat bad decks, so honestly I don't see how that's NOT what people are asking for. If I just want to have fun with some jank, all I have to do is take that jank into the play queue. Oh cool I'll try that then nevermind. A lot of it just comes down to really enjoying Arena's interface and wishing it was something it isn't built for.
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Mar 12, 2024 21:43
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if you want to theorize a system for playing jank against jank, I think you just have to throw matchmaking out the window because people will optimize it to poo poo no matter what restrictions you try to put in place. even lobbies with custom rules are not a perfect solution. even if everyone agreed to self-impose deck restrictions, I feel like you'd just run into the casual edh problem of people gradually power-creeping themselves until the jank converges to powerful meta decks—except even faster because there's a lesser economic disincentive in arena than there is in paper
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Mar 12, 2024 21:46
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I would kill a man for pauper on arena
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Mar 12, 2024 21:52
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The historic brawl queue does a fairly decent job of trying to match up similarly powered decks. Not sure if it's based on just the commander or if it looks at the whole deck. That system only really bites you if you have a silly idea for a commander not realizing it's also one of the most powerful ones out there if you build it differently. I've had that happen where I built something and just get stomped into the ground repeatedly, eventually running into someone else's "proper" build of the commander and seeing why it's in that status.
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Mar 12, 2024 21:55
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reignonyourparade posted:I think they'd just immediately start complaining about whatever the flavor of the month jank deck is in that cast Honestly now that I think about it it wouldn't even be "complain about the flavor of the month jank deck" it'd just be "complain about constantly playing against lifegain, forever"
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Mar 12, 2024 22:01
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it would be pretty simple to assign a brawl-specific W/L ratio for each card on the server side. then when you go to matchmake you take the average value for the deck and match it to somebody with a similar value. that's the most naive implementation of deck-based matching possible, but it feels like matching is based on commander only. it seems like the arena team manually groups commanders into discrete buckets that change only with each game update. that's my impression anyway
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Mar 12, 2024 22:04
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kalel posted:if you want to theorize a system for playing jank against jank, I think you just have to throw matchmaking out the window because people will optimize it to poo poo no matter what restrictions you try to put in place. It really does come back to this: Vando posted:The solution is to have friends I know Arena doesn't have the greatest friends list functionality in the world but it should be enough to get by.
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Mar 12, 2024 22:07
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I think it would be cool to have something like what the YGO client does and have a themed rotating format with its own banlist. I think it would be funny to have formats that are dumb fake block constructed or “you can only play creatures in TYOL 2024”
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Mar 12, 2024 22:32
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For the next 50 hours, you can play Artisan Brawl for MWM. All commons and uncommons for both your commander and your deck. So for everyone in the thread, get busy. I won my games with Abomination of Llanowar elfs.
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Mar 12, 2024 23:21
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WOTC says they plan to fix stickers in Legacy because Mind Goblin causes some problems, and it's currently much weaker on MTGO than in paper because the paper version lets you know how much mana it's going to create ahead of time. 1) A Goblins player needs to know how much mana to expect from their Mind Goblin. 2) A Mind Goblin needs to produce mana after getting put on the battlefield by Muxus, Goblin Grandee. 3) Legacy decks that can steal an opponent's spell get a competitive advantage from bringing their own sticker deck, on the off-chance that they steal a Mind Goblin. To make it equivalent to how it works with stickers, they would need some rules text like:quote:Reveal _____ Goblin from your hand: If you don't control a Sticker emblem, roll a D6. You create a Sticker emblem with "When a card named _____ Goblin enters under your control, if it's on the battlefield, add X red mana, then sacrifice this emblem. 
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Mar 12, 2024 23:54
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Qwertycoatl posted:Thinking of the old forums game where people submit three card decks, they're all played against each other and the cards in the winning deck are banned in future rounds 3 Card Blind is still a thing!
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Mar 13, 2024 00:08
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ilmucche posted:It sounds like people want chaos draft and sealed tbh Naw, limited is its own experience. Bigger time and attention commitment, highly dependent on drafting specific skills and knowledge. Limited is the only good thing to come out of the gambling in this game, but it's still the kinda vibe I'm happy to play once a week tops. Especially in Arena where I can do the one draft throughout the week rather than marathon it on one go like at LGS. Making janky decks with what you have or for a wild hare silly idea, or for the fantasy world where a sets most interesting/thematic synergies actually make for a good 60 card deck, without play to win pressure, is distinct from wilder drafts. Those are fun too but compound drafting inability.
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Mar 13, 2024 00:31
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Chamale posted:WOTC says they plan to fix stickers in Legacy because Mind Goblin causes some problems, and it's currently much weaker on MTGO than in paper because the paper version lets you know how much mana it's going to create ahead of time. 1) A Goblins player needs to know how much mana to expect from their Mind Goblin. 2) A Mind Goblin needs to produce mana after getting put on the battlefield by Muxus, Goblin Grandee. 3) Legacy decks that can steal an opponent's spell get a competitive advantage from bringing their own sticker deck, on the off-chance that they steal a Mind Goblin. To make it equivalent to how it works with stickers, they would need some rules text like: I believe this isn't true for the traditional definition of "steal" because you can only put stickers on cards you OWN, not cards you control. It is true for "can create a token copy of mind goblin" though.
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Mar 13, 2024 00:33
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Just ban everything from Unfinity in vintage and legacy and admit that it was a stupid mistake let me keep saw in half in edh for gyruda though
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Mar 13, 2024 01:08
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Unban every unset and playtest card, what's the point of every card format if you got all these cards excluded. Cowards scared of Nearby Land and a few clown tokens.
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Mar 13, 2024 01:35
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A Thunder Junction... side-story, I think, not a main one? It's not numbered. But it does give us something very important: Trans MtG Character number 2, 3 or 4, depending on how you count alt arts and Secret Lairs... but no matter what, the first trans man in Magic! I hope his card is green or black, to get us one step closer to the best color cycle in the game.
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Mar 13, 2024 02:12
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one of the bears on the best secret lair alt art has had top surgery but I don't know if he counts as a character
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Mar 13, 2024 02:19
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Cleretic posted:A Thunder Junction... side-story, I think, not a main one? It's not numbered. But it does give us something very important: He's the face card in the Naya lands commander precon for Thunder Junction.
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Mar 13, 2024 02:29
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1024x768 posted:I would kill a man for pauper on arena This would be cool as hell tbh.
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Mar 13, 2024 02:35
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Kids and Guns posted:He's the face card in the Naya lands commander precon for Thunder Junction. Oh, drat. ...Wizards really wants me playing red all the time, don't they? Well, at least that color identity does mean that he can run Bearscape and Alesha for a decent t4t deck. Cleretic fucked around with this message at 02:49 on Mar 13, 2024 |
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Mar 13, 2024 02:43
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Cleretic posted:A Thunder Junction... side-story, I think, not a main one? It's not numbered. But it does give us something very important: dudes rock
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Mar 13, 2024 02:46
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Cleretic posted:Oh, drat. ...Wizards really wants me playing red all the time, don't they? Alesha's got a Mardu color identity, doesn't she? Unfortunately.
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Mar 13, 2024 02:50
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