(Thread IKs:
OwlFancier, crispix)
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Jaeluni Asjil posted:
So much of Shakespeare is dependent on understanding 16th century English, 16th century culture and 16th century current events that I sometimes think it's hardly worth bothering with unless you're an expert, as otherwise most of it's flying straight over your head.
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Mar 17, 2024 20:38
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Clyde Radcliffe posted:Fall meaning autumn is one of those old English words that travelled to the colonies and remained in use while falling out of favour here.
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Mar 17, 2024 20:41
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Pistol_Pete posted:So much of Shakespeare is dependent on understanding 16th century English, 16th century culture and 16th century current events that I sometimes think it's hardly worth bothering with unless you're an expert, as otherwise most of it's flying straight over your head. That's right in the middle of The Great Vowel Shift.  No wonder everything went weird. edit: just after killing a wasp in my bedroom... it's March ffs!!! 
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Mar 17, 2024 20:43
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Noxville posted:Coming in late for the Corbyn monstering chat, but the very first one I remember was 'Jeremy Corbyn wants gender segregation on trains', and you had to read right to the end of the story to find out the actual truth, is that a campaigner had approached him with the idea of female-only carriages to reduce sexual assault on trains as some other foreign countries do, and Corbyn said that if elected Labour would consider holding a consultation on the subject. I remember reading this baffled as everyone talked about the bullshit headline rather than the actuality of what happened and realising this was just how it was gonna be. I'd forgotten that. My (very) right wing nephew then aged about 16 (son of Tory Boy) at a family gathering said "well how would you like to be in a segregated carriage - Corbyn wants to do that' - my reply "Firstly, he didn't say that' (and surprisingly my very right wing sister-in-law wife of Tory Boy) agreed that he hadn't in fact said that, and added 'I'm living in a country which has exactly that - a couple of segregated women's carriages, BUT women can sit - or stand armpit to armpit - in any carriage they wish, it's just men aren't supposed to get in the women's carriage'. (And it's funny because regular men- by which I mean average, law-abiding, if they inadvertently get in the women's carriage look absolutely mortified and get out at the next stop but there are some guys who deliberately do it - hawkers for one. But if they look set to stay, they get harangued by women in the carriage & beat a hasty retreat. Sometimes police get on and scoot all the men out. There used to be just one carriage but now it's two. One of them is permanently women only and the other is women only until about 730pm because if you're on the metro after then a woman is 'no better than she should be' (one of those inexplicable sayings grannies come out with). Jaeluni Asjil fucked around with this message at 21:16 on Mar 17, 2024 |
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Mar 17, 2024 20:46
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Pistol_Pete posted:So much of Shakespeare is dependent on understanding 16th century English, 16th century culture and 16th century current events that I sometimes think it's hardly worth bothering with unless you're an expert, as otherwise most of it's flying straight over your head. Yes - in this book about the English witch hunts in the 17th century I'm reading which I mentioned earlier ITT, witch (sic) dips back into the 16th century, it mentions Macbeth along with other plays of the time as being written in the light of James 1st witch hunts & also lifting directly from James 1st book Daemonologie. Essentially conforming to the witch hunting 'macarthyism' of the day.
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Mar 17, 2024 20:53
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Noxville posted:Coming in late for the Corbyn monstering chat, but the very first one I remember was 'Jeremy Corbyn wants gender segregation on trains', and you had to read right to the end of the story to find out the actual truth, is that a campaigner had approached him with the idea of female-only carriages to reduce sexual assault on trains as some other foreign countries do, and Corbyn said that if elected Labour would consider holding a consultation on the subject. I remember reading this baffled as everyone talked about the bullshit headline rather than the actuality of what happened and realising this was just how it was gonna be. Someone should create a browser extension for UK news sites that reverses the order paragraphs are displayed in and puts the headline last.
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Mar 17, 2024 20:58
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Some of Shakespeare's best comedies are all trash, in the gleeful John Waters "I'm the Pope of Trash" way, cross-dressing, increasingly convoluted plot confusions, and a wide variety of jokes about dicks and balls that make no sense unless you're a gay man in Baltimore. The main difference between Waters and Shakespeare being whether you mean Baltimore, Maryland or Baltimore, James I's friend.
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Mar 17, 2024 21:00
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To be honest I'm not a huge fan of women-only carriages, I understand why they might be needed but it doesn't feel like the right solution, maybe adding more guards or similar would help. And trains are packed enough as is.
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Mar 17, 2024 21:11
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It does seem like it would cause particular problems in the UK because of terf brain.
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Mar 17, 2024 21:12
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OwlFancier posted:It does seem like it would cause particular problems in the UK because of terf brain. I doubt this is a UK-specific problem
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Mar 17, 2024 21:14
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Sure, but I guess I am particularly skeptical of the british public to not be extra stupid about it.
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Mar 17, 2024 21:16
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"What is a woman" only carriages, where they can all be insufferable together. I found this list of U/Non-U words with ostensibly the more common (in the author's region) highlighted:  The one that struck me the most was wireless/radio, because well no, but yes. I still call the thing in the car a radio, but if I want to listen to some music at home I'm far more likely to ask "is the wireless on?" It refers to something completely different, but using the exact same electromagnetic mechanism as Marconi and Tesla, so yeah sure why not.
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Mar 17, 2024 21:16
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I dont really remember there being any trans argument over it at the time? Like now that would be the first association people would make with it? Maybe there was at the time and I just didnt notice
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Mar 17, 2024 21:17
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NotJustANumber99 posted:I dont really remember there being any trans argument over it at the time? Like now that would be the first association people would make with it? Maybe there was at the time and I just didnt notice The culture war over trans people didn't really kick into gear until 2017 or so, it was pretty much kickstarted by Theresa May's plans to bring in self-ID
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Mar 17, 2024 21:23
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Clyde Radcliffe posted:Someone should create a browser extension for UK news sites that reverses the order paragraphs are displayed in and puts the headline last. This just reminded me of the old plugin that replaced the headline on the daily mail site with the top voted comment E: this site has some good screenshot examples https://www.wnycstudios.org/podcasts/otm/articles/if-daily-mail-readers-wrote-headlines
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Mar 17, 2024 21:54
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there was also "traingate" https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-41036937 TLDR: Corbyn posted a brief vid where he was sat on the train floor because of overcrowding, Branson released CCTV footage apparently showing empty seats, about a year later doubledown news did a subject access request on behalf of Corbyn and the actual CCTV footage shows the train rammed full
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Mar 17, 2024 22:13
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Guavanaut posted:"What is a woman" only carriages, where they can all be insufferable together.
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Mar 17, 2024 22:45
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DreddyMatt posted:This just reminded me of the old plugin that replaced the headline on the daily mail site with the top voted comment Oof. I think I need a trigger warning for child death stories. So so awful to think about. (ETA: it wouldn't have bothered me ten years ago but having kids of your own changes you it seems!) Maugrim fucked around with this message at 22:57 on Mar 17, 2024 |
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Mar 17, 2024 22:55
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AceClown posted:there was also "traingate" That was a real taster of what was to come - private companies don't usually get involved in PR wars with political figures, and certainly don't normally publically release CCTV footage of senior politicians and random members of the public. But Corbyn was always an acceptable target and wasn't to be treated with the same deference as any other LOTO. It's similar to the thing that really ramped up in the months before the 2019 election where the media was very keen to differentiate between Labour supporters and 'normal people' as a way of invalidating anything they said. Corbyn attracting spontaneous crowds on the street in Leeds? Doesn't count because they're Labour Supporters. This woman who harangued Priti Patel on the street about the hostile environment? Doesn't matter because we've trawled her socials and she's a Labour Supporter. A Labour Activist, even. "WHY IS LABOUR IGNORING THE CONCERNS OF ORDINARY PEOPLE???" Corbyn wasn't a 'normal' politician and his supporters weren't 'normal' people. Which made it OK to treat with with hostile contempt and dishonesty. Apparently.
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Mar 17, 2024 23:16
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Happy St. Patrick's day to those who observe it. The Irish pub here has stopped doing Murphy's since last March 17th apparently, they've replaced it with Kilkenny.
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Mar 17, 2024 23:26
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I don’t think my brain can accept “pardon?” as being less posh than “what?”
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Mar 17, 2024 23:30
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Aristos and paups say what, pardon is a definite aspirational lower-middle-class tell.
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Mar 17, 2024 23:33
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It's like calling the big soft chair in your living room a settee instead of a sofa. e: oh right I see that's on the list as well.
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Mar 17, 2024 23:34
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big scary monsters posted:Happy St. Patrick's day to those who observe it. and also to those who don't 
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Mar 17, 2024 23:34
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He was a definite troll, putting his day so that it would always be somewhere right in the middle of Lent like that. Giving up alcohol? Not now you aren't.
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Mar 17, 2024 23:36
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friggin day off tomorra isn't it 
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Mar 17, 2024 23:40
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crispix posted:friggin day off tomorra isn't it Only in NI, annoyingly. Good argument for home rule (of the rest of the UK from NI)
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Mar 18, 2024 00:01
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None of this would have happened if everyone voted for chaos with Ed Miliband like I did
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Mar 18, 2024 00:01
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Guavanaut posted:He was a definite troll, putting his day so that it would always be somewhere right in the middle of Lent like that. Giving up alcohol? Not now you aren't. Look at this guy, not knowing that the Irish are experts at coming up with reasons why you can drink during Lent but still have it count. (Paddy's Day being a counter to Lent is the most obvious one. But depending on who you talk to, Mother's Day, your Birthday and the day when Ireland win the Grand Slam at Rugby are all days when you can drink and still be fine for Lent.) Brought to you by the country that classified Geese as a type of barnacle, so they were okay to eat.
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Mar 18, 2024 00:18
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The Question IRL posted:Look at this guy, not knowing that the Irish are experts at coming up with reasons why you can drink during Lent but still have it count. But they are... The barnacle goose and the similar brant goose were previously considered one species, and were formerly believed to spawn from the goose barnacle.[3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barnacle_goose  Much as a Terry's chocolate orange counts as 1 of your 5 a day. Ahem. Jaeluni Asjil fucked around with this message at 00:26 on Mar 18, 2024 |
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Mar 18, 2024 00:24
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Supposedly part of the "U" vs "Non-U" thing is to do with using French root words or not. Using Frenchy words is apparently a thing that the proles do/did to try to seem posh. So that's why "Lavatory" and "Pardon" and "Preserve" etc. are non-U.
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Mar 18, 2024 01:00
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I think you'll find that "lavatory" started as a policy recommendation and eventually they mistakenly removed the space
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Mar 18, 2024 01:23
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WhatEvil posted:Supposedly part of the "U" vs "Non-U" thing is to do with using French root words or not. Using Frenchy words is apparently a thing that the proles do/did to try to seem posh. Didn't Kate's parents get looked down on by Brenda & Keith for either saying lavatory instead of toilet (or vice versa) - just say "bog" and cover all bases.
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Mar 18, 2024 01:24
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Just say shitter
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Mar 18, 2024 01:29
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Crapper, in honour of the man famous for slightly improving it.
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Mar 18, 2024 01:46
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It should be renamed the seaside log flume
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Mar 18, 2024 01:48
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Pistol_Pete posted:So much of Shakespeare is dependent on understanding 16th century English, 16th century culture and 16th century current events that I sometimes think it's hardly worth bothering with unless you're an expert, as otherwise most of it's flying straight over your head. Reminds me of the quote from A Comedy of Errors that is unambiguously a fart joke "A man may break a word with you, sir, and words are but wind. Ay, and break it in your face, so break it not behind"
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Mar 18, 2024 05:58
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logger posted:Reminds me of the quote from A Comedy of Errors that is unambiguously a fart joke "A man may break a word with you, sir, and words are but wind. Ay, and break it in your face, so break it not behind" And that reminds me of being told 'Falstaff is the comedic relief of the scene' when all he does is mention ale.
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Mar 18, 2024 06:32
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logger posted:Reminds me of the quote from A Comedy of Errors that is unambiguously a fart joke "A man may break a word with you, sir, and words are but wind. Ay, and break it in your face, so break it not behind" Oh so this was Shakespeare https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rlpg_rbjxRA
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Mar 18, 2024 07:01
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NotJustANumber99 posted:It probably shouldn't but yards in my head are like paved or concrete or whatever. That has always been my way of thinking too - if it's got more slabs or concrete than grass and flower beds, then it's a yard.
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Mar 18, 2024 07:34
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