|
I think the arrow going from "The fall of Shady Sands" definitely implies that there is some time between that and the bomb. I don't think the show ever says how old Lucy is, but I assume she's around 18-22. So she was probably born around 2274-2278. That means when she was taken to the surface at around 4-8, it could have been after the events of New Vegas. Then Hank goes and gets the kids back and spends some time arguing with his wife to try to get her to come back. That's young enough and the experience maybe traumatic enough that Lucy's brain could have rewritten the memory of being in the surface corn field seeing the real sun into her just thinking she had seen the real sun while in the vault corn field. It could have been a while before he just fully gave up on getting his wife back that he resorted to nuking the town. You can easily fit the events that are listed in the show into fitting in the existing canon.
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 07:28
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 25, 2024 07:08 |
|
|
Baron von der Loon posted:Here's a thing that stood out to me regarding the chalkboard that muddles up the years debate some more: A lot of caption stuff is outsource to hell and back, and usually to the lowest bidder. Much like Beth's timeline, this is probably in error.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 07:36
|
|
|
My interpretation remains that the fall of Shady Sands was a drought and famine situation resulting in a mass exodus from the city, those who remained were the ones siphoning water from the vault, and doing so allowed them to rebuild a bit and get some of the good times back. Feels kind of elegant that way, because drought and famine were the big inciting incidents in the first two games and mentioned as threats to the NCR in New Vegas.counterfeitsaint posted:Absolutely this. The blackboard scene is the big exposition dump of the show, and the way it's presented makes absolutely no sense. Of course people are confused and no it's not because they were looking at their phones or their whole identity is built around a 14 year old game or whatever the gently caress else you want to blame it on to feel like you're the cooler, smarter tv watcher who watches tv better than everyone else. Hey! It's only 13.5 years!
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 07:37
|
|
|
Cojawfee posted:I think the arrow going from "The fall of Shady Sands" definitely implies that there is some time between that and the bomb. I don't think the show ever says how old Lucy is, but I assume she's around 18-22. So she was probably born around 2274-2278. That means when she was taken to the surface at around 4-8, it could have been after the events of New Vegas. Then Hank goes and gets the kids back and spends some time arguing with his wife to try to get her to come back. That's young enough and the experience maybe traumatic enough that Lucy's brain could have rewritten the memory of being in the surface corn field seeing the real sun into her just thinking she had seen the real sun while in the vault corn field. It could have been a while before he just fully gave up on getting his wife back that he resorted to nuking the town. You can easily fit the events that are listed in the show into fitting in the existing canon. Is this like an American vs European thing or something. You have a chart where everything has a listed year except 1, with the one not listed being a catastrophe. A chart written by survivors of said catastrophe. Why would you ever assume that is some unknown date after that point. Did everyone forget the year a capital (or at least major city) of the largest government in the wasteland was blown up. Clearly someone just hosed up something when they were filming the scene or changed the script later but nobody caught that the date was on the board until it was too late. Obviously its a production error if its not supposed to erase NV. The knots people are tying themselves into to try and say actually no its super clear and the people pointing out its not clear have probably never seen a chart before!
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 07:47
|
|
|
I do think it's an error tbh, and I don't think there was ever an intent to invalidate NV. And they flat out said it's not invalidated, so it's not.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 07:56
|
|
|
Todd himself took a break from loving our mothers to confirm that it happened right after NV. The gently caress more do people loving want?
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 08:13
|
|
|
is it possible the writers just haven't decided what year Shady Sands got bombed?
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 08:30
|
|
|
Rubellavator posted:is it possible the writers just haven't decided what year Shady Sands got bombed? The theory I saw, assuming that it wasn't just a poorly laid out diagram, was that they listed the wrong battle of hoover dam
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 08:34
|
|
|
Back Hack posted:A lot of caption stuff is outsource to hell and back, and usually to the lowest bidder. Much like Beth's timeline, this is probably in error.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 08:56
|
|
|
76 is fun to play. I’ve been enjoying it very much. I like the gunplay more than 4 honestly. I like this fallout world. It’s good times
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 10:17
|
|
|
zoux posted:Has Kyle MacLachlan played a bad guy before - no Paul Atreides doesn't count He was a great villain in Agents of Shield
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 10:57
|
|
|
I enjoyed most of the individual scenes of this show but the larger plot utterly falls apart if you think about it for a second. So Moldaver is implied to have been in love with Rose, Lucys mom and also wants to finish off her pre war lifes goal of cold fusion, with the latter presumably being more important than honoring the former. So, using Roses pip-boy, she breaks into Vault 32 where the populace has found out about the vault stuff I guess and killed themselves? Like the one guy has a fork stuck in a toaster and such, nobody else did that. They hid in that vault for awhile pretending everything was good to Vault 33 (while also not cleaning it up so that Norm and Chet can have their spooky discovery adventure that then gets cleaned up in a single night) and then say that they need to trade some supplies and suggest a trade for a husband for Lucy. 31 and 33 have no way of verifying this despite the whole thing being 31 are all secretly management who have a huge amount of leeway, responsibility and power, or at least think they do (this part at least works because Vault-Tec is like that). Anyway, the reveal in the end of the show is that Moldaver and presumably large amounts of her crew are NCR remnants to some degree, they and she are fine to be murdering the gently caress out of random vault dwellers who aren't management and Lucy, the daughter of someone she seems to have cared alot about being raped (since she's not in full knowledge of the facts that this guy isn't who he says he is) and probably murdered? Since his immediate response to her realising he's irradiated is to try and murder her. Moldaver is incredibly lucky but doesn't acknowledge it in retrospect that Lucy kills the guy rather than being murdered by him, then when she comes face to face with Lucy, she opts to just kidnap Hank and torture him for the code she needs I guess, and not to take Lucy at that point when that would be very good leverage, she also doesn't kill any of the other vault 31ers there either. She also decides not to pop along to the nearby town the dude carrying her entire lifes work is going to be at a few days later to provide escort for him? She then goes back to her observatory base and waits for..... something? Lucy arriving feels like it should be a huge surprise to her but she acts kinda like it was something she's expecting but that's insane. thebardyspoon fucked around with this message at 11:42 on Apr 18, 2024 |
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 11:01
|
|
|
Back Hack posted:Why do you find it such a stretch for someone to be disappointed the thing they liked coming to a very definite end, whose representation is mostly characters in the show lamenting about the thing they like coming to a very definite end? Well for one thing this isn't something you've said until now, so I didn't realize you were particularly sentimental about the NCR (or Shady Sands, which doesn't even appear in New Vegas but I'm not clear which you're referring to here) at all. Up until now you've been complaining about the ways you feel Bethesda is lazy or disrespectful to the New Vegas Canon. Tender Bender fucked around with this message at 11:44 on Apr 18, 2024 |
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 11:37
|
|
|
I almost had the complete opposite read on this show as the whiners. If I had to invent a conspiracy it's that the showrunners devised a way to move from boring ol' Bethesda Fallout to 1/2/New Vegas/Cool Fallout in the span of a single season. The showrunner played 1 and 2 back in the nineties and has more experience with the franchise than probably anyone else involved in the production, Bethesda aside. I think folks are overestimating Todd/Bethesda's input and control. Everything I can find points to them serving as consultants and not really being super involved in mapping the story out. I also didn't come away with the idea that the NCR was completely vanquished. The show communicated that they weren't very powerful anymore and in the end we see one smallish branch get wiped out. This is consistent with most (all?) New Vegas endings. And the teaser at the end? IMO this is like a one-in-a-zillion dream outcome for a massive $$$ amazon show.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 12:13
|
|
|
Gaspy Conana posted:I almost had the complete opposite read on this show as the whiners. If I had to invent a conspiracy it's that the showrunners devised a way to move from boring ol' Bethesda Fallout to 1/2/New Vegas/Cool Fallout in the span of a single season. According to Nolan AND Howard it was the showrunners/ writers idea to blow up Shady Sands and weaken the NCR, one that took some convincing to let them do. so yeah people are really being wierd about Beth's supposed hate-boner of NV/ old games. They also confirmed the rest of the NCR still exists, they lost Shady Sands but they are still a big territory. I think the NCR is currently under the threat of invasion by an emboldened Brotherhood, and they have lost control law wise of the Shady area though. Hell I thought this theory was wierd when Kellog's memories in F4 actively reference events out west in F2 and NV. People are real wierd about this. TulliusCicero fucked around with this message at 12:27 on Apr 18, 2024 |
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 12:18
|
|
|
One thing that's bugging me that hasn't really been mentioned: What's the deal with The Enclave? They just get unceremoniously plopped into the story with absolutely no explanation or exposition and immediately they are completely forgotten. Why do they have that cold fusion seed thing but not the means to use it? Why does the scientist guy get free access to it and why's no one from The Enclave looking for him? I wonder what people who never played Fallout made of that whole thing.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 13:13
|
|
|
I think there are a number of very loud nerds out there that when a franchise has one entry that's head and shoulders above the others, that's not only the best entry, but all other entries are poo poo from a butt. Andor is the only good star wars; deep space 9 is the only good stae trek; winter soldier is the only good marvel movie; Mass Effect 2 is the only good mass effect game; and so on. Everything must be the best or its garbage and not worth it.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 13:55
|
|
|
I mean that's debatable for Mass Effect 2 when ME1 exists.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 14:04
|
|
|
twistedmentat posted:I think there are a number of very loud nerds out there that when a franchise has one entry that's head and shoulders above the others, that's not only the best entry, but all other entries are poo poo from a butt. Yup. And these are the same people that bend logic into knots just to fit their narrative that anything else is either poo poo, or intentionally and specifically making GBS threads on that one "best" iteration.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 14:05
|
|
|
I mean, there was a lot of bad Star Wars before anyone had heard the word "Andor." I'm still mystified at this whole flowchart misread thing. Folks are looking at the water cycle and saying that clouds can't exist because they saw a lake once.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 14:13
|
|
|
It started to dawn on me half way through the show that they were building towards being a New Vegas-centric story. Mostly vibes, like the camera lingering on the Sunset Sarsaparilla sign, it's a distinctly New Vegas thing as is Mr House. Open question: what other major characters from the games have been depicted in the show, if any?
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 14:28
|
|
|
SCheeseman posted:Open question: what other major characters from the games have been depicted in the show, if any? Sinclair (the guy that built the Sierra Madre) was in the same room as House talking with the group at the table, representing Big MT.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 14:38
|
|
|
I still need to play that DLC... underlines my point though! This is a Fallout: New Vegas show.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 14:42
|
|
|
Capilarean posted:One thing that's bugging me that hasn't really been mentioned: What's the deal with The Enclave? The Enclave has to be included because it's a brand feature  Presumably they got or stole the cold fusion mcguffin from Vault-Tec, which is why it needed Vault-Tec authorization to use at the end. Unless I missed it they also don't explain how The Brotherhood knows about it, prob a spy or something. I think someone with no Fallout knowledge would just see the common TV trope of bad science guys.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 14:43
|
|
|
So, when Coop and Lucy come across Roger, the ghoul who's in the middle of going feral, he says something to the effect of "I made it 24 years, 24 years is good right". Now was he saying he'd only been a ghoul for 24 years or that he'd been fighting off the ghoul feralization for 24 years? Is Coop unique in that he's a prewar person, or do you come across some in the games? Also lol. TBH the empty nose effect was hard to look at (I'm generally a pretty squeamish person) but the cyclops effect they did was even more unsettling, if less grotesque. "Lots of people have one eye" lol.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 15:01
|
|
|
There are both in the games, pre-war people who are ghoulies and post war peeps who were ghoulified from a variety of sources.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 15:03
|
|
|
zoux posted:Is Coop unique in that he's a prewar person, or do you come across some in the games? There are a bunch of pre-war ghouls in the games, Desmond Lockheart being one that immediately comes to mind.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 15:04
|
|
|
Yeah, plenty of pre-war ghouls, and the game never really give a definite cause of why some ghoul go feral.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 15:09
|
|
|
Accipiter posted:There are a bunch of pre-war ghouls in the games, Desmond Lockheart being one that immediately comes to mind. There's at least another in the Underworld in Fallout 3. Her story of what it was like when the bombs fell is honestly kinda affecting.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 15:20
|
|
|
Dawgstar posted:There's at least another in the Underworld in Fallout 3. Her story of what it was like when the bombs fell is honestly kinda affecting. Raul is definitely pre-war So is the first Ghoul in Fallout 1 Unlike other factions, the NCR and Followers of the Apocalpse recruit/ accept ghouls, because they know they are typically incredibly experienced and make excellent scientists/ soldiers/ rangers because they have survived and learned a lot of things. TulliusCicero fucked around with this message at 15:31 on Apr 18, 2024 |
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 15:28
|
|
|
And ghoulification is just another potential consequence of radiation poisoning (in the FO universe)? I know there are other ways to become a ghoul, like the FEV (and whatever the suicidal podiatrist had), but is it just random whether you die of radiation poisoning or become an immortal ghoul
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 15:31
|
|
|
Fallout 4 has at least the guy who door knocks you to sign up for the vault, the fridge kid, and I think his two parents.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 15:31
|
|
|
zoux posted:And ghoulification is just another potential consequence of radiation poisoning (in the FO universe)? I know there are other ways to become a ghoul, like the FEV (and whatever the suicidal podiatrist had), but is it just random whether you die of radiation poisoning or become an immortal ghoul I think the official answer to that is  I know when your player character gets a poo poo load of rads they just die. It might have to do with over how long your exposed to the radiation? I can't remember do any of the children of atom turn ghoul? They're around radiation all the time. dr_rat fucked around with this message at 15:34 on Apr 18, 2024 |
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 15:32
|
|
|
I liked Maximus confusing his bombing experience as a kid with the original bombs
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 15:33
|
|
|
The NCR's elite troops/ rangers they bring into NV in the build-up of troops towards the end include a bunch of ghoul rangers from Baja. They are like an elite unit by all accounts
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 15:36
|
|
|
zoux posted:and whatever the suicidal podiatrist had It occurs to me now that he was probably testing if his head would grow back.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 15:37
|
|
|
moths posted:It occurs to me now that he was probably testing if his head would grow back. I think he was sick of being persecuted for his scientific curiosities. e: oh, what was your guys' favorite joke in the series? zoux fucked around with this message at 15:47 on Apr 18, 2024 |
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 15:42
|
|
|
Nancy posted:The Enclave has to be included because it's a brand feature That's the other thing, I don't remember any of the games even suggesting that Vault-Tec has any post-war presence in the US. It feels like this show is replacing the Enclave's place in the overall plot with Vault -Tec, but then why have the Enclave at all? Would IMO work a lot better to have some hapless scavengers stumble upon some Vault-Tec property and discover the mcguffin there. The Brotherhood hears about some fancy new tech being found and investigates, Flame Mother lady hears the name of the company she worked for and investigates, bada bing bada boom.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 15:45
|
|
|
TontoCorazon posted:I liked Maximus confusing his bombing experience as a kid with the original bombs If he didn't have an actual education, he might not know much about the original bomb dropping or that they even happened.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 15:51
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 25, 2024 07:08 |
|
|
zoux posted:And ghoulification is just another potential consequence of radiation poisoning (in the FO universe)? I know there are other ways to become a ghoul, like the FEV (and whatever the suicidal podiatrist had), but is it just random whether you die of radiation poisoning or become an immortal ghoul Most people affected by radiation poisoning still die from it. In New Vegas you can come across a shack next to a nuclear waste disposal site. Inside you can read the diary of a woman who wanted to become a ghoul and decided radiation exposure was the way to go. When you get there she is very much dead.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2024 16:00
|
|