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sit on my Facebook posted:Upper middle class old suburban white people. Okay new plan. We burn down the suburbs.
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Oct 12, 2016 19:04
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BarbarianElephant posted:They don't want any of these things (except maybe infrastructure.) They want jobs. The only problem with this is that for centuries, all the jobs have been moving to the city. You can't exactly teleport a Starbucks to the middle of nowhere. A 1000 seat call-center isn't going to set up in a village with 200 inhabitants. Saying you want jobs, but don't want any help in building those jobs is not exactly compelling. The means to job creation are offered to them, they just refuse it. Like I said before, you cant make jobs appear out of thin air. What you can do is invest tax dollars and make a community viable to for growth and new industry. Those things require increases in revenue and a focused plan to use that revenue to grow specific industries or communities. These stats have made their government so ineffective that they cant even implement basic policy to help the people that need it. But if a left leaning politician tries to do something and they receive literal death threats, harassment, and people don't vote. This is not a simple problem to resolve. and it's been getting worse for thirty years ,it will get much more worse before anything is done about it because rock bottom is still a ways to go. At this point even immediate change in governance wont help anyone for 5-10 years due to the massive hole most southern states are in. Also anyone who identifies as any bit left of center should not be blaming the poor or writing them off. Blame wont really help here. I don't think people should get a pass on being lovely just for being rural or poor however. The issue is organizing and turning out the not lovely poor people, who generally are not voting.
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Oct 12, 2016 19:04
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OAquinas posted:Who will have an ironclad alibi by being in front of 300 people. Who Breitbart will then call crisis actors, and the cycle begins anew. Everytime one of those 300 people died it will be front page of Drudge. "ANOTHER HILLARY 'WITNESS' BITES DUST"
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Oct 12, 2016 19:04
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Yeah, Trump's average supporter isn't actually poor, just an enormous rear end in a top hat white male 45-65 years old. Also in a lot of "deep red" counties in red states you still had like 1/3 to 2/5 of the vote going to Obama in '08 and '12. That's a lot of people NOT voting for right wing vermin to just write off.
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Oct 12, 2016 19:05
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Actually i think there's an Amazon call center in middle of nowhere, MD in like Allegheny county or something. I drive by it on the way out of town
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Oct 12, 2016 19:05
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Apraxin posted:Trump just said that ISIS are praying daily for Hillary to be elected. Also that Obama says ISIL instead of ISIS because 'he likes disturbing all of you'. What. US Election 2016: Russian hackers vs. Terrorist prayer groups
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Oct 12, 2016 19:05
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WampaLord posted:Like, this is the debate he's almost guaranteed to "win" because Wallace will go super hard on Hillary and will lob him softballs and he's going to skip this one? He's going to start demanding concession after concession about the debate staging and process, and when he gets rebuffed he can drop out while blaming it on them being unreasonable or biased.
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Oct 12, 2016 19:05
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Feldegast42 posted:Because it's the attitude of "lol, gently caress'em" that is leading to a lot of rural poverty which in turn is causing a populist uprising. Like that Cracked article noted, they are hopeless and have nothing left to lose, so they might as well vote Trump since he's the only one that's kind of sympathic to their plight, even if he is full of poo poo. It wasn't gassed
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Oct 12, 2016 19:06
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For the record, I sympathize for those caught in the cycle of rural poverty, but it's a hard complicated problem without an easy solution, on top of which, they actively hate the people who could start working on the problem. Like, even if Trump won, he wouldn't bring back jobs to them. It's not possible.
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Oct 12, 2016 19:08
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WampaLord posted:Like, this is the debate he's almost guaranteed to "win" because Wallace will go super hard on Hillary and will lob him softballs and he's going to skip this one? Trump is not going to win any debate how many times do we have to go through this? It doesn't matter that it's on Fox when he is completely incapable of composing himself and putting in anything near a respectable performance. He. Will. Not. Win. The. Debate. I also doesn't help him that the 3rd debate is by far the least important one.
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Oct 12, 2016 19:08
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lozzle posted:Okay new plan. I'd be okay with this. Strip malls and subdevelopments are a blight on the land.
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Oct 12, 2016 19:08
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I seriously think trump isnt ignorant or insane, but is actively trying to lose the election as dramatically as possible because he doesnt want to be president.
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Oct 12, 2016 19:09
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WampaLord posted:For the record, I sympathize for those caught in the cycle of urban poverty, but it's a hard complicated problem without an easy solution, on top of which, they actively hate the people who could start working on the problem. Ftfy
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Oct 12, 2016 19:09
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sean10mm posted:Yeah, Trump's average supporter isn't actually poor, just an enormous rear end in a top hat white male 45-65 years old. also people are forgetting suburban and exurban communities, which also lean conservative, and were a key factor in a lot of republican victories like as reagan and gingrich.
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Oct 12, 2016 19:09
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Pick posted:Yes, when you consider rural people, and you blame them for not understanding the policies they may or may not be voting for, think about your high school education. Now imagine something about half as good. That is what they were given for making decisions about their future. These are people who have been systematically failed. Education tends to be a magic bullet, but I went to a very nice high school and people who were in my classes and did well still put up shitheaded support for Trump. So better education won't help everyone. Trump himself went to a great prep school, for example. But yeah, who would blame the poor for anything? The poor don't vote. I wish they could. They're too busy working or don't have a car to get to the polling place or don't even know how to register to vote.
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Oct 12, 2016 19:09
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Heck Yes! Loam! posted:Saying you want jobs, but don't want any help in building those jobs is not exactly compelling. The means to job creation are offered to them, they just refuse it. Like I said before, you cant make jobs appear out of thin air. What you can do is invest tax dollars and make a community viable to for growth and new industry. Those things require increases in revenue and a focused plan to use that revenue to grow specific industries or communities. These stats have made their government so ineffective that they cant even implement basic policy to help the people that need it. But if a left leaning politician tries to do something and they receive literal death threats, harassment, and people don't vote. The idea that people see a project and say "this could help me but gently caress you I don't want it" is baseless. The recurring theme has been people thinking something doesn't benefit them, and not just that but costs them money while benefiting someone who is not struggling. This is also, incidentally, what fuels a lot of progressive populist rhetoric. computer parts fucked around with this message at 19:12 on Oct 12, 2016 |
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Oct 12, 2016 19:09
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Basically, I think you have to look at these things in a bigger picture kind of way. I mean, you can make a lot of the same statements about men and why they vote the way they do. It's not fair to blame rural people for being rural, or men for being men. There are a lot of really good rural folk Who vote in the interests of others, and there are a lot of good men who vote in the interests of others. We like to look at things like Nate Silver's map, and be like drat. But there's a lot going on there. By and large, people are who we have trained them to be.
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Oct 12, 2016 19:10
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:Trump is not going to win any debate how many times do we have to go through this? It doesn't matter that it's on Fox when he is completely incapable of composing himself and putting in anything near a respectable performance. He. Will. Not. Win. The. Debate. Notice the quotes around win? I think it's the one where the media would be more likely to say he did the best because Wallace will go super hard on Hillary and she'll probably stumble at one or two points.
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Oct 12, 2016 19:10
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greatn posted:What if Trump really is doing cocaine to get ready for a debate? What if he ODs on stage? Regardless of wherever he OD's, Trump supporters will be convinced he was given bad cocaine by Clinton operatives. Also I think the 'I'm done' with Trump was in reference to answering questions about it.
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Oct 12, 2016 19:10
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WampaLord posted:Notice the quotes around win? I think it's the one where the media would be more likely to say he did the best because Wallace will go super hard on Hillary and she'll probably stumble at one or two points. The media is done with the horse race narrative.
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Oct 12, 2016 19:11
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https://twitter.com/candacesmith_/status/786262723323715584
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Oct 12, 2016 19:11
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https://twitter.com/woodruffbets/status/786266991694753792 In before a  post.
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Oct 12, 2016 19:11
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WampaLord posted:For the record, I sympathize for those caught in the cycle of rural poverty, but it's a hard complicated problem without an easy solution, on top of which, they actively hate the people who could start working on the problem. Yeah I'm not trying to be overly hostile or anything, I feel ya. It's just that after spending my entire adult life in Oklahoma I've really come to hate this persistent meme of "poor white people in the sticks are ruining politics" because if you actually know anything about red state politics, you'd know that the idea that impoverished rural communities wield any kind of meaningful power in the system is ludicrous.
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Oct 12, 2016 19:12
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:The media is done with the horse race narrative. Well, the have one, but it's for congress  And Fox isn't done with it, but Fox is going to be so  worthy come the 8th.
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Oct 12, 2016 19:12
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OAquinas posted:Crossposting from the CSPAM/BoneZone: This article is pretty well written and a worthy read, I think. The guy doesn't really pose any solutions (are there any?), but he paints a picture of deploreable America and makes the point that it's not just that these people are racists, their way of life IS in fact actually being crushed out of existence, etc. Weird that Cracked used to be the idiot little brother of Mad Magazine when I was growing up and now it sometimes produces some pretty decent political articles.
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Oct 12, 2016 19:12
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iospace posted:More scales falling off, from back in August:
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Oct 12, 2016 19:12
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Pick posted:No lie, it's going to be an incredible resource in the future. Historians kill for poo poo like this. And when everyone's talking in future-Zalgo, nerds are going to be trying to explain ye olde zingers from the country's rich cultural past. Maybe I'm missing something, but what exactly is so useful about our dick jokes? Is it just because it provides context for the kind of things we talked about, or because it makes us seem less abstract like when when we found bathroom graffiti in Ancient Rome?
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Oct 12, 2016 19:12
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Goatman Sacks posted:Reminds me of the primaries when Clinton said "where was Bernie when I tried to do healthcare reform in the 90s?" Yes this is what came to mind for me. It's really just indicative of the fact that people have bad loving memories - myself included.
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Oct 12, 2016 19:13
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computer parts posted:The idea that people see a project and say "this could help me but gently caress you I don't want it" is baseless. This is a much better wa of putting it. thank you. The race to the bottom is real , and it is destroying red states first because it has been grafted into the ideology of the alt-right. Anything that helps someone else and not me is bad. therefore the only things that get done are things that help those in power, while everyone else is continually left out. How do you change that culture, or more importantly, how do you minimize it while promoting a culture of helping others without any benefit to yourself?
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Oct 12, 2016 19:15
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Also, I do think that the cracked article made a good point that city culture is incredibly fast and weird to most folks in rural areas. And it has very little patience for the time it takes for rural communities to catch up culturally. One of the reasons that you see folk get so pissed about LGBT, LGBTQ, Latin@, and etc is that they legitimately can't keep up with lingo and they get mad when they're shut down for making a mistake when they really were trying. It is humiliating to them. So they feel like they are forced to be the bad guys, so they just own it. It doesn't describe everyone, but it is definitely a running thread.
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Oct 12, 2016 19:15
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I haven't seen anything like this in my lifetime (paying varying degrees of attention to elections since the Reagan years, I'm old), a major party nominee flinging poo in all directions 4 weeks before the election, and the people in his party not even unendorsing, or running back and forth with their hair on fire and reversing their unendorsements just because the guy didn't become a literal corncob in the second debate. It's historic, hilarious but sickening and dreadful all at the same time.
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Oct 12, 2016 19:16
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Heck Yes! Loam! posted:Saying you want jobs, but don't want any help in building those jobs is not exactly compelling. The means to job creation are offered to them, they just refuse it. Like I said before, you cant make jobs appear out of thin air. What you can do is invest tax dollars and make a community viable to for growth and new industry. Those things require increases in revenue and a focused plan to use that revenue to grow specific industries or communities. These stats have made their government so ineffective that they cant even implement basic policy to help the people that need it. But if a left leaning politician tries to do something and they receive literal death threats, harassment, and people don't vote. Trabisnikof posted:Ftfy This sniveling bullshit is hands-down the worst thing about this site. Engage with someone's opinions or shut up. And you know what? As an "urban youth" I'm sick of you useless white pricks using my community as a political football to score points on each other with. Tiny Brontosaurus fucked around with this message at 19:20 on Oct 12, 2016 |
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Oct 12, 2016 19:16
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Zwabu posted:This article is pretty well written and a worthy read, I think. The guy doesn't really pose any solutions (are there any?), but he paints a picture of deploreable America and makes the point that it's not just that these people are racists, their way of life IS in fact actually being crushed out of existence, etc. Buzzfeed started crowding Cracked out (and to be fair, Buzzfeed doesn't do the multi-page list poo poo that Cracked does), so I think Cracked adapted. And then Buzzfeed decided to do some journalism and well, here we are.
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Oct 12, 2016 19:17
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iospace posted:https://twitter.com/woodruffbets/status/786266991694753792 Well, his notion of locker room talk probably does involve discussions of cheating.
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Oct 12, 2016 19:18
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In my experience, a lot of the folks living out here are coming from a place of myopia and ignorance, rather than hate. I live in the rural north-east, mind, so this isn't at all universal. Sure, there are some genuine bigots and assholes out here, but for the most part folks just aren't too concerned with what's happening with the world outside their sphere. Hence, the appeal of conservatism and libertarianism. Keep things the way they are, keep your laws off my property, don't tax me for services I don't use, etc. etc. The newspaper comes out once a week, and is mostly filled with the mugshots of who got arrested in the county, and a few puff pieces about flower festivals and old people with interesting toy train collections. People watch Fox news sometimes, but more often than not, they'd rather watch whatever sports are on, or whatever reality show is interesting. They just aren't too concerned with the outside world, except when they feel threatened by it. There just aren't than many black people living here (and yeah, it's a huge shock going from a city that's about 40% black to a village that's 3%), so they fall back to what they see on TV. Hence, all the Republican threat based propositions: "The liberals are coming to make your daughters get gay aborted by Obama's tax funded ISIS Muslims!" Taking the time to think things through, or consider how and why things might go in a couple years just doesn't really come into play. They're worried about the next season's harvest, or getting chores done, or how they're going to scrape together enough money to pay rent. They have different priorities, and so a big successful rich guy who makes them feel good about themselves and is running for "their team" sounds better than the wife of that adulterer who ruined the country. There's not much more thought or analysis than that. Why overthink? And it's not everyone. Driving along the state routes, I see about as many Clinton/Kaine signs as I do Trump/Pence ones.
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Oct 12, 2016 19:18
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Tiny Brontosaurus posted:This sniveling bullshit is hands-down the worst thing about this site. Engage with someone's opinions or shut up. Fully agree. Keep the drive by shitposting out of the forum designed to be all about long winded arguments unless it's really funny
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Oct 12, 2016 19:18
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Heck Yes! Loam! posted:How do you change that culture, or more importantly, how do you minimize it while promoting a culture of helping others without any benefit to yourself? Well, a good starting point might be convincing likeminded people to adopt that culture before working on your opponents. Remember: there is benefit to aiding (e.g.) minorities as a Democratic voter, because they help enact your policies. That's not exactly selfless sacrifice.
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Oct 12, 2016 19:18
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By the way, early voting in both Obio and Arizona began today. We're already gonna be running up the score while Trump is floundering like a fish out of water
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Oct 12, 2016 19:19
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OddObserver posted:Well, his notion of locker room talk probably does involve discussions of cheating.  Also: An interesting take from back in May (part of a thread) https://twitter.com/LPDonovan/status/727312102252273664
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Oct 12, 2016 19:19
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iospace posted:Well, the have one, but it's for congress Fox News at 8 PM PST when they have to call it for hillary is going to be amazing to watch. reminder: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9TwuR0jCavk
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Oct 12, 2016 19:19
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