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snail
Sep 25, 2008

CHEESE!
Sorry :words: It's Friday and I'm avoiding doing the budget for the next 12 months.

Z3n posted:

The point I'm trying to make here is:

I think we're discussing the same point from different angles :) I'm not trying to claim the 'busa is the world's best bike. Rather, I just didn't feel that many of the labels it was being given were fair.

After all, I still get a huge kick out of riding 50cc scooters, and the only label I give them is "fun" :)

Z3n posted:

I wasn't aware there were any tracks where the fastest GP rider lapped slower than the fastest WSBK bike...do you have a link?

I feel like a right git now I reread that statement :doh: I was thinking of Philip Island, where the WSBK bikes are quicker through some sections of the track than the Moto GP bikes. The HP advantage of the Moto GP machines means a fair bit on the straights.

Z3n posted:

Less weight to deal with, about the same HP, and an easier time through the tight stuff due to a more aggressive setup on the bike.

I'll respectfully disagree with a few of the points in this statement. A Gen 1 'busa is only 215 kg dry. A 2007 Yamaha R1 is 192 kg dry. One hour, and a few dollars in parts, I can easily strip a 'busa while keeping it road legal down to 195 kg dry simply by removing the "luxury" items. I know I'm almost defeating my own point by suggesting it, but 'busa does come with more "cushy" items than a SB or SS.

You're right on the similar HP point, however HP doesn't reflect torque delivery. As I'm sure you're aware, HP is a function of torque and revs. The ZX-14, the ZX-12, the B-King, the V-Max, the 'busa, there's a reason why they're all popular drag bikes. There's so much more torque delivered down low in the rev range resulting in a lower rev point for peak power. Lower revs usually means a more controllable throttle from the rider's perspective, and usually faster launches. And that's even ignoring the differences in gearing.

I can't argue with your point that out of the factory SBs and SSs are far more aggressive bikes. However, an aggressive setup like that is a spanner and some elbow grease away. You're very right, we won't be seeing the Hayabusa or similar bikes carving up the field at the Moto GP level, but for the riders like you and me, there's effectively nothing in it.

Z3n posted:

I see that every time I go to the track on my SV650...there's a lot of riders who I will pull down the front straight before the HP kicks in because they're not maximizing drive on exit because it's difficult and they're not comfortable lighting the rear as needed.

I hear you :) A friend of mine rides a SV650S (I also own a K4 SV650S) on the track, and while he can't possibly catch me down the straights, he's great fun to follow through the corners. I often pull in behind fast 600s, and chase them through the twisties for entertainment, doing whole sessions at 600cc speeds.

From time to time, I also enjoy the terror inducing acceleration when I do choose to show the one litre riders what "fast" actually is ;)

As the saying goes, "90% rider, 10% bike".

Z3n posted:

It goes double for the literbike riders, who need to park it and get it sliding and pointed and upright to maximize drive. Watching a real pro do that in front of you is absolutely astounding, and you typically only get to watch them for about 2 corners. :haw:

At a recent track day, one session was a tuning/practise session for the upcoming Australian Superbike series. I can only imagine what's going through their heads as they push their bikes that far into a corner, it's just amazing to watch.

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snail
Sep 25, 2008

CHEESE!

ClockworkZero posted:

Then she got all excited and looked up what I ride on the internet to show my dad who thought it was fantastic (he used to ride, back in ancient history). I don't know what the hell I was worried about.

My Mum is a bit the same, although she flip flops between every subsequent bike I get. My first one (well, the first one that was properly mine), she was all worried (650cc, so much power!). Bought the 'busa, she was busy telling everyone at her job that her son had just bought one of the world's fastest production bikes... then I bought the track bike and told her how much horsepower it has.

She asked me if I had a death wish, seems she's back to being worried.

snail
Sep 25, 2008

CHEESE!

redscare posted:

LA has a ton of scooter riders, especially during the warmer months. Most of them wear no more than a brain bucket because of the helmet law. In the summer, the scooter rider's uniform is a tank top, shorts, and sandals. I wish I was joking.

Same here in Brisbane Australia. Way back when I sold scooters for shits and giggles, it was a whole other game to get buyers to get some proper protective gear.

I'd call the mechanic in from the workshop, point to him and go "Look at Luke here, he got run over by a semi trailer (true story), he was wearing proper gear, he survived to tell you about how his back hurts occasionally". Being on a major road, often a loaded 45 tonne semi would rumble on by and they'd agree pretty quickly it was a good thing.

That would at least get them to buy a full face or a flip helmet instead of those stupid open or half face visored helmets. Then I'd suggest they get gloves, using the example of every kid coming off their pushie and would go hands first into the gravel. Finally, the jacket, most wouldn't buy because I've stretched their budget already, but there was so much mark up on the kit I'd play the protective big brother motorcyclist, mark it down with a "shh don't tell the boss" kind of routine, and they'd happily pay it thinking they were getting a ripper deal. The boss didn't care, he preferred customers were alive and came back to get their gear serviced and he was still making a profit on the marked down gear.

Unfortunately proper boots and pants were a stretch for most pretty young things, but give them a pink or baby blue jacket and they were happy little piggies. Kind of bummed me I had to play the customers to get them to buy proper gear, but they'd thank me for it the moment they had a proper accident (and one even did).

snail
Sep 25, 2008

CHEESE!

redscare posted:

I want to hear about that lucky son of a bitch that got run over by a semi and lived to tell the tale. Did it only run over his leg or something?

It wasn't loaded at the time, but yup, was run over by the trailer.

The guy had borrowed a Buell Firebolt from his brother who was a riding instructor at the local Harley dealership. Wasn't used to the insane brakes or the short wheel base, and he wasn't a small guy which gave the bike a high CoG. He rounded a corner trying to overtake the truck on the inside, and the truck pulled unexpectedly (even considering trucks swing wide) into the lane he was in. He grabbed the brakes in a panic, up on the front wheel, arse over head, and straight underneath the rear wheels, bike and all.

The unloaded trailer, 3 axles, ran over his torso him face down and then dragging him a bit as the truck driver hit the brakes, damaging his spine. The Buell was a total write off. Spent a while in hospital in traction, continually has back problems with on going therapy, but lived to tell the tale.

Where it comes into the equipment story, was that if his head wasn't protected with a full face helmet the impact of going down and being dragged would have not only taken his jaw off his skull, but probably cracked his skull in not pretty ways.

:siren: :siren: Not for the squeemish (no, really), but Google "Nothing comes between me and my Harley", click on the first article. :siren: :siren: If he wasn't wearing a full face, that's what he would have ended up like. I saw the helmet, scary poo poo.

snail
Sep 25, 2008

CHEESE!

Bob Morales posted:

Who's all riding newer liter bikes?

Mmmm, power. I love riding good bikes of all capacities (there's video of me somewhere doing a wheelie past a scooter shop, on a 50cc crapscooter) but I know what you mean about a daily rider. I get annoyed if what I'm riding doesn't have solid poop socking power delivery even if I don't use the full band of it on the road.

Then again, quite a few of the litre bikes have crap engines. All high end power, nothing down low which is where the bulk of my riding is done, fast or not.

snail
Sep 25, 2008

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Dubs posted:

This is standard fare for us 'drive on the left' country's. I've seen 3-4 bikes go down from waving, The government is currently running an anti-wave campaign to stop all the deaths.

Almost covered my desk in coffee reading that.

At least in Australia (one of them drive on the left countries), it's the nod. On the twisty bits through the mountains it can still be done, although no one has ever explained the etiquette of what happens when two large groups ride past each other.

I've seen it happen while sitting eating a bacon and egg sandwich at a roadstop, 30 riders each direction, and all 30 nodding at the other 30 as if it's a convoy of bobbleheads.

snail
Sep 25, 2008

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Nerobro posted:

The only sin of dropping a bike, is being under it. You will drop "a" bike in your career. I own bikes I have not dropped. But I have dropped bikes.

Or thrown over it. I've seen plenty of that on race tracks. I always get a little bit of :smug: when it's that first time MotoGP wannabe that has been talking trash about the pro testers and semi-pro racers.

But yeah, never dropped my first bike. Never dropped my second bike, came mighty close though.

Third bike, well, it's been over both sides, both while totally stationary. First time I stupidly forgot to put the kick stand down and walked away. Second time, was evading a courier who'd cut across my path as I was exiting a steep driveway with a high gutter. Feet didn't touch the ground, couldn't stop the bike going over.

As for my track bike, it's been down plenty of times.

snail
Sep 25, 2008

CHEESE!

Olde Weird Tip posted:

EDIT: My worst fear with kids is them grabbing the exhaust or the top end of the engine, or tipping the bike onto themselves.

My kidlets are pretty drat good about that. Know not to stand behind the exhaust, touch anything unless I ask them to or fiddle. But that's training and one or two examples of what not to touch (after them seeing what an V-22 Osprey model did to my hand, they know not to stand anywhere near the moving parts of a RC model)

Speaking of which, I've been contemplating picking up a small trial bike for the kids (girl 6 - boy 5) to ride around the backyard and maybe elsewhere. Thinking an Oset electric trial bike. Silent, easy to ride, top speed adjustable, and cheap. Anyone have any useful tips on what to get, what not to do, or suggestions on a suitable bike? The only real requirement is being in suburbia, noise will be a problem.

snail
Sep 25, 2008

CHEESE!

Sir Cornelius posted:

Just checked and got 21 MPG from my slightly modified GT750. Lower is more fun. Your bike is 21/39=54% less fun than my bike.

Not really relevant to the conversation but you had me curious. My 'busa gets 49 mpg with 185 ponies at the wheel, and only weighs 187 kg (412 lb for you Burmese). Then again, it's running a PCV with an autotune and bits replaced and removed, so it's cheating.

Heck, my CBR954 track bike somehow manages 6 litres per 100km (39 mpg) running flat out. I probably spend as much time off the throttle braking as accelerating.

Nidhg00670000 posted:

Riding without a helmet to me is like going outside without pants, it just seems so wrong.

I like to ask fans of open face and no helmets, would they run down the road and then take a flying leap onto the road? "Of course not", the answer is. To which I reply "So why do you think a motorcycle is any different?". I get blank stares at that one.

snail
Sep 25, 2008

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MotoMind posted:

3D CT scan of someone who face planted:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/roentgenator/2450912496/in/set-72157601198404570/


Crap, that made me sick looking at it.

"Nothing ever comes between me and my Harley" into Google, and the image that comes up on the first few links. I'm ugly, but I'm not that.

snail
Sep 25, 2008

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KARMA! posted:

They are wide as gently caress and I've only seen fat people ride on it. Does that answer your question?

As a result, it makes them more likely to wheelie. They're already wheelie monsters, add a fat person that can't hug the tank to keep the front down, and it's a non-stop hoon machine.

snail
Sep 25, 2008

CHEESE!

Z3n posted:

You did ok there. Sucks that she merged over, and not great to be in her blindspot, but you were far enough back that you didn't have to do much when she merged over...and there's a point where you have to sort of mitigate the risks of the guy behind you not paying attention and the person next to you not paying attention. Might have been better to accelerate a little slower and try and get some more space between you and them.

^ This, and also you probably should have been in a ready position to go until the car comes to a stop behind you around 20 to 30 seconds in. In gear, feet on ground, ready to go, until that car behind you has come to a safe stop. You had space to roll forward if needed (which you did), and two escape alleys down the side of the car in front.

Been witness to too many idiots running into the back of others at lights for no good reason to trust people to stop properly.

snail
Sep 25, 2008

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Ziploc posted:

I've also adopted the act of staying in gear and being ready to move until the person behind me is stationary.

One last thing, I leave more than a car length between me and the car in front while waiting. When the car behind me is almost about to stop, I'll edge forward.

snail
Sep 25, 2008

CHEESE!

28_days posted:

After 150 miles (first week) I'm starting to feel pretty confident.

Ruh oh...

Feel sure footed, but certainly don't start getting cocky.

28_days posted:

I keep my left foot under my gearshift, and my right foot pinned to the side of the rear brake pedal (not under or over, but not sticking out super far either). Is this correct?

The other replies were on the money, but it's important to stress symmetry. Don't sit twisted on the bike, and even a small difference in foot placing will result in that.

I personally (and have been taught in race and general riding instruction) to put the balls of my feet on both pegs, moving the feet as I need them. I don't touch my toes on the ground when cornering, and I don't jump on the brake lever by mistake.

28_days posted:

I've found that I can scoot my Ninja 250 around by shifting my weight slightly, and recognize in sharper corners that I lean the bike and "counterlean" so to speak. It sounds good, and feels appropriate, but I'm not sure if it's what I should be doing.

The bike doesn't steer with your weight, always remember that. It leans and steers because you change the angle of the front wheel with respect to the bike's present motion. Many less capable riders assume that their weight is what's steering it, when in reality they're twisting the front bars as they go to move on the seat.

The weight shift on the other hand can help settle the bike particularly when giving it a bit with the right hand, or over rough terrain.

I usually share a technique that involves rocking onto the butt cheek that will be on the inside of the corner before you start braking for the corner, and hook the heel of your outside boot on the peg. You'll find your upper body will be in the right position, your feet will be in the right position to not scrape them on the ground, and it'll keep the bike more upright with a better contact patch on the ground. Most people once taught this are able to safely hustle along a wet patch of road at the speed limit through corners without worry.

And the motion leads into a more advanced weight shift used on the track.

28_days posted:

Are there any recommended, preferably free, online resources that I can use to hone my skills? Maybe YouTube instructional videos, etc.?

Keith Code's Twist of the Wrist books are good for getting the right ideas into your head. Understanding why it works is usually irrelevant.

snail
Sep 25, 2008

CHEESE!

clutchpuck posted:

Sure is... which is how many bikes, especially 2012-EPA-compliant EFI models, are tuned from the factory.

And it's usually not excessively lean in the cylinders, just the exhaust. A common fix for popping on Suzukis is to block the PAIR valve. Before the fix on my Hayabusa with its 4-into-1 Yoshi, it was often shooting flames out the back despite the in cylinder air-fuel being spot on. It usually means it won't pass an emissions test, but arguably it's cheating by adding clean air into the exhaust.

snail
Sep 25, 2008

CHEESE!

Jim Silly-Balls posted:

"My inexperienced, short, light friend bought a hayabusa as a first bike"

It's not that we're mean, we're just realists.

"Realists" making a boatload of assumptions. If she bought the 'busa with the intention of it being a beautiful bike to cruise around on, she's probably a heck of a lot less likely to total herself and the bike than some fuckwit who just bought himself a Ninja 250R because it had a fool sik carbon pipe, bro. If she keeps her right hand casual, a 'busa is an absolute pleasure to ride. As a long term 'busa owner, I'm far more concerned about the weighting of the bike and her experience, than even the total weight or the power.

Attitude on the bike leads to as many crashes as anything else, IMVHO.

snail
Sep 25, 2008

CHEESE!

Rev. Dr. Moses P. Lester posted:

It's heavy and powerful even for a big guy, with very strong brakes. So it introduces more things to worry about in a situation already overloaded with things to worry about, the situation of learning to ride.

I agree with that, never said there weren't better first bikes.

I'd prefer someone learn on a good bike that cover some mistakes and provide some forgiveness, rather than some of the 20 year old shitheaps people seem to trot out as "perfect learners." I'm going through this now looking for a good learner for my five-foot-nothing sister, and the market really is thin down at the Australian LAMS (150kw/tonne p/w ratio) end. Even older bikes that are were decent in their day often end up being totally clapped out now.

snail
Sep 25, 2008

CHEESE!

2ndclasscitizen posted:

A 'Busa is going to neither cover any mistakes, nor provide any forgiveness.

I'm never going to convince you otherwise, so I won't try. Don't worry, I raised my eyebrows too at the original story, and can think of more suitable bikes. I can just think of a great many more terrible bikes too.

2ndclasscitizen posted:

As for LAMS bikes, CBR125, CBR250R (either the old 4cyl or new single), Ninja 250 and 300, Aprilia RS125 (2T or 4T), CFMoto V-Night or Leader 150s, YZF125 and R15, and so on. There are shitloads of choices.

I'll give you the Ninjas and the CBR250R. I can't speak on the CFMotos and Leaders never haven ridden one. The others, meh, for a variety of reasons (having ridden them).

Slavvy posted:

Also the LAMS legal hyosung gt650 or sv650 or er6-n. All of which are (even the hyosung, now) very reliable, moderately fun bikes. The two V-twins have the option of unlocking full power down the line, too.

The quality of the Hyosung is questionable (they tend to rust and corrode here in the humid air), and I'm providing a suggestion to a family member for something she'll keep for a longer time. Both the ER6-N and SV650, no way to legally derestrict them here when she's capable.

snail
Sep 25, 2008

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nsaP posted:

Stick with me here for a second. What if you just removed the throttle? Then it could be a beginner bike. You do all of your accelerating with the clutch. Really it's just removing a dangerous hassle that a new rider shouldn't have to deal with. With the right gearing and the idle raised slightly I'm sure you could get up to 50 or so. Perfect.

Plenty of "automatic" bikes in the higher end of the market and we keep being told by marketing it's the future. Makes me wonder actually why they're not brought to the smaller bikes (ignoring scooters).

snail
Sep 25, 2008

CHEESE!

2ndclasscitizen posted:

You just replace the ECU with a full powered one. Perfectly legal to do once she's off her restrictions.

...and reregister it as a new vehicle if you live in Queensland. It's a little more complicated than just a straight part swap and the TMR are arseholes about it.

The last bit of info I had regarding the SV was that nobody bothered (in Queensland) as it wasn't cost effective once all was taken into account. You're better off to sell the LAMS bike, and buy a new one that's not restricted. It was the same for the ER6-N as of last year. The only one that was apparently sensible to derestrict was the Hyosung. Of course it may have changed, that info is 18 months old.

All the more reason to take a day off work and go test riding bikes.

snail
Sep 25, 2008

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Here4DaGangBang posted:

What about a VTR250?

It's on the list, I know of many riders with good experiences of them. I dunno about you guys though, but recommending a bikini faired or naked bike to a newbie can be insanely hard.

Fairings are everything apparently.

snail
Sep 25, 2008

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Z3n posted:

I try to roughly sort out suspension setup for the new rider bikes I sell because there's nothing less fun than losing traction over a bump because the bike is bottomed out.

I refer them to my tame suspension mechanic, and he doesn't mind a few easy dollars. I have to admit I'm terrible at adjusting someone else's suspension, but at least a good mechanic can fish through the garble of a rider to figure out where the problem lies.

Z3n posted:

Some bikes came with seriously absurd suspension setups, like rear shocks sprung for 220 pound riders and front forks for 120 pound riders.
...
A big part of the confidence that people talk about when they get on a non-budget bike is just because the spring rates are slightly more sane. I have no idea why all the stock budget bikes come with such insanely soft front springs.

As a casual aside, I wonder how much of a role poor suspension plays to the over-representation of newbies in crash statistics? Even after decades of riding, if I know there's something quirky about my setup, I tend to be far more tentative about riding certain ways. Newbies don't have this knowledge about what's good and bad, so believe nothing is wrong, that riding is supposed to be "hard".

snail
Sep 25, 2008

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Slavvy posted:

I'd like to ride a gladius to see if they fixed the problems with the SV. I doubt it.

I have ridden the loaner Gladius from a workshop I use. I don't actually remember about it much beyond it felt like an anaemic SV. It did the job, but strictly speaking so did the jumping castles you could borrow (GS500s).

snail
Sep 25, 2008

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goddamnedtwisto posted:

An acquaintance of mine would tour Europe on his 916SPS with not so much as a rucksack, just a credit card and a list of hotels.

My wife and I tour almost this way. Get to the end of the driveway, flip a coin as to which direction we head and it's that way for a week or so. Minimal clothing in a tank bag on each of our bikes and leathers. We usually decide to find a hotel or somewhere to stay at about 3 or 4 in the afternoon, be it a hostel or a 5 star hotel.

Makes for great fun when we decide to rock up to a premium hotel at a glitzy tourist destination and rent the best room available for the night. The Valet's give us "complementary free self parking", the receptionists generally either are really interested or turn their noses up at our bug covered leathers and many other guests are much the same.

On the other hand, the staff at the cheaper places are often interested in the trip and don't care we're leaving a trail of dead insects through their lobby.

snail
Sep 25, 2008

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Sagebrush posted:

Ewan is definitely more likeable, cause Charley is a giant tool, but he's certainly nothing on the road compared to, say, one of the guys on ADV-riders.

Oh I dunno... I was pretty amused with Charley's abuse of a Honda Cub on Greatest Ever. I just can't see Obi-wan being that much of an amusing tool on a bike.

snail
Sep 25, 2008

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Slavvy posted:

I'm pretty sure I've just hosed the fluid, by the time I was riding home the lever wouldn't bite immediately and coming to a complete stop from 100km/h required more brake pressure than normal. I can't vouch for whatever pads are in the bike so it could very well be poo poo brakes.

It's really not hard to overheat the braking system on many bikes out of the factory. A bit of heat soak from repeated use even though the rider isn't being a loon, and they start to get soggy and non-responsive. I've had my brakes fade to the point of deciding to stop by the side to let them cool more than once.

A few bucks for better front pads (don't bother with HH or similar on the rear, stay soft, you'll just eat the rotor otherwise), braided lines, better fluid, and sometimes a rotor replacement. A bit of change in your braking style and gear selection can also make a world of difference.

Slavvy posted:

I went from an 02 hornet 919 to an 03 sv650n, mileages similar. The suspension on the hornet was MILES ahead, as were the brakes and the whole bike in general. I've been riding for 3 years and the SV is the first bike I've ridden that feels like it's holding me back, all the others have felt like I could go faster if I were a better rider. The SV feels like the engine power is disproportionate compared to the suspension and brakes.

I've seen all sorts of modifications on SVs to get them handling better. Ultimately I think the best solution is to buy a new bike, despite how much fun the SV engine can be.

snail
Sep 25, 2008

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Nerobro posted:

The SV is a great platform to learn on, as it uses suxuki parts bin bits, and you can easily take it from damper rod cheapbike specs to 12,000 bike bits with only a few hundred dollars and some dirty fingers. You will have something that will handle better than anything you can get off the shelf.

Don't get me wrong, I loved my SV. That said, everyone I know that has owned one and invested time into the suspension ended up either accepting what they could get, or just buying another bike to start with as a baseline. They ride well enough, but if I want to circlejerk about how incredible the SV is I'll do it on a SV forum.

Everything from GSXR front ends, to replaced internals, to custom built cartridges. No matter what was done, another quirk in handling appeared. It's a solid first bigger bike, just don't expect to ever reach the levels of many other bikes.

snail
Sep 25, 2008

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Xovaan posted:

I was planning on taking my bike in to get a dyno and rejet because it seemed kind of anemic, but I had an inkling that it had more to do with the fact that it's been really loving cold lately. Took the bike out yesterday at 65F and was surprised at how smooth the bike was at all RPM. Pulled all the way to 130 without hesitation nor vibration. I can't wait for spring. Poor bike's got it rough lately. :smith:

Cold air usually results in a leaner mixture (kinda matches what you describe) due to more oxygen for volume finding its way in. Warmer air, less dense, richer, and is probably running smoothly.

While on the topic, I'm actually after a decent display for my PC5/Autotune setup so I can keep an eye on AFR and injector duty/throttle setting. Anyone know of anything other than the official Powercommander stuff? The official LCD is too big to tuck in under all the bits, at least anywhere I can see it.

snail
Sep 25, 2008

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Jim Silly-Balls posted:

A guy I used to ride with had some sort of flamethrower map on his GSXR. Every single time he would roll off the throttle it would barf out this huge flameball. Every time.

I know a guy who put an Akrapovic 4 into 1 on a Hayabusa, but didn't close off the PAIR valve, and the tuning adjustement makes it so that whenever he's in overrun, flames are popping out of the back of the can by his pillion's feet.

Looks pretty awesome at night, but I wouldn't want to be repacking the muffler that often.

snail
Sep 25, 2008

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Rev. Dr. Moses P. Lester posted:

It's nice if you live in a place with no sharp turns and no deer or coyotes or dogs.

Or a kangaroo. Nearly 100kg, 2 metres tall(long) and often travel at 50km/h through forest, popping out of a tree line on the road edge straight across the path of a vehicle.

A housemate got collected by one a few years back. He was lucky to be thrown clear, but the bike didn't look like a bike as such afterwards. They can be a problem during the day too.

snail
Sep 25, 2008

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hayden. posted:

Any recommended brushes for cleaning a chain other than the grunge brush? $20 seems a little steep to me for the convenience of having three sides.

I use cotton rags, bought in bulk from the local auto store. Costs me about $2 for a huge bag of rags that lasts me months, and can be used for all sorts of things. Hand wipe the links, doesn't take any longer than a brush and I ended up with better results IMHO.

snail
Sep 25, 2008

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Z3n posted:

You left out "replace chain every 3 times you do this!". :D

I haven't clean a chain in years but they're all spotless. Stop using sticky poo poo to lube your chain and all of the sudden you don't need to clean them anymore.

I've tried the lube-less sprocket thing, and while it stayed "clean", it really felt like crap. A dirty or unlubed sprocket (which is why you're really lubing a chain) feels like poo poo on a gear change, and there's always a certain kind of rough feel from the chain while coasting or cruising. Do some riding in the rain, and the usual road grime will end up coating the chain and sprockets with poo poo anyway. Environments like Brisbane in Australia where it rains rarely, but heavily when it does, means road grime is a special kind of ick.

Like many things on a bike, they don't "need" to be done, but cleaning the sprockets and chain takes 10 minutes at most with practice and done every few weeks. Throw on a 2 cent pair of latex gloves and you won't get dirty at all during the process.

snail
Sep 25, 2008

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Z3n posted:

I still lube them, I just use gear oil. One drizzle down each row of o-rings, wipe off all excess. If you want to actually lube your sprockets, a bit of grease on a few links will sort that out nicely.

That's not quite how I read your post, but I see we both agree from different perspectives. Keeping the running gear maintained means I've never had to clean a chain in the way being described by others before it has worn out. 45,000 km out of my current Hayabusa chain and sprocket set, and they're still in great condition even after deciding the Hayabusa made an awesome adventure bike. It doesn't really, but kind of fun overtaking 4wds while riding up a muddy hill

snail
Sep 25, 2008

CHEESE!

Nerobro posted:

You oil an unsealed chain to lubricate the pins

Fixed. Otherwise I don't disagree with the rest of what you wrote. But that wasn't quite the point of me saying the sprockets are what we're interested in anyway.

JP Money posted:

I doubt a sprocket face cares if there is a miniscule amount of grease between it and the roller before it gets squeezed out from contact.

Zool posted:

The sprocket and rollers do wear, and lube is going to do gently caress all to prevent it.

It does matter actually. Asperity (roughness of a surface) has an effect, and boundary lubrication occurs on chains and sprockets. Good material and lubricant selection can greatly reduce the wear.

Every chain, sprocket, and lube vendor, along with all chain lubing guides I looked up said to lube the rollers themselves. Coating the sprocket won't get all the rollers of the chain. Coating all the chain rollers, will protect all the roller and sprocket contact points.

snail
Sep 25, 2008

CHEESE!

Tamir Lenk posted:

I always check that chain before I ride. No telling what might happen if that snapped free with me straddled on top.

I had a link on the chain on my brother's bike seize on me years ago. The kinked link managed to hit the chain guard cast on the engine case hard enough it broke it clean off. The chain held together. I suspect it may have only held because of the slow speed.

snail
Sep 25, 2008

CHEESE!

Slavvy posted:

-mraaaaaaaWOOOOOAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHTWAAAAAAAAAAAAHTWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHT-*is doing 60km/h. One of them tried to race me on an empty stretch of motorway when I had a 919; he changed gear three times while I rolled half throttle in fourth. Sounded awesome with a hollowed out can though.

My first bike was a CBR250RR MC22, and yeah, it was rev happy. Needed 6k to ride around town at all, and would buzz at 11 or so on the highway. An hour of that and my hand was totally numb.

Using high octane fuel also doubled the range out of the tank.

snail
Sep 25, 2008

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Sagebrush posted:

It has a compression ratio of 11.5:1 and spins 20,000 RPM. The bike was probably just designed exclusively for high-octane fuel, which also explains why it was running like poo poo whenever he filled it up with regular.

The manual claims normal unleaded was fine, but who knows, it could have been a grey import tuning thing. Given the price difference for a tank of fuel was a dollar or two, it was going to cost more to figure out why my MC22 and those of my friends all got significantly more range on premium, than it cost in fuel. The bike still ran fine on normal unleaded meaning my cheap brother would buy it. I'd have to switch to reserve at 110km/h on the highway as it started spluttering as the tank ran dry.

A quick Googling says people get 180km - 200km on a tank of normal unleaded. Putting premium in, I'd get 270 or so. Around 130-150 on a tank of normal unleaded.

In hindsight, I may have been more of a hamfisted squid than I recall

snail
Sep 25, 2008

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hayden. posted:

I noticed over the past couple days that the ZX14 I bought about a month ago has mirror extenders and footpeg lowering brackets, which is awesome. Loving the bike, but accelerating super fast from a legal limit to like 110 is getting less fun.

Learn how to ride it on the track. It's rather amusing being the arsehole who passes all the fooly sik go-fast guys, because you know they won't ever be able to corner faster than you on the ZX-14 anyway. Down the straights, not too much keeps up with the ZX-14 and Hayabusa once out of first.

If you're getting wobbles at speed and sore shoulders from longer rides, you may need to have your suspension or steering damper looked at. The ZX should be getting smoother and more bedded at speed, not getting more cagey.

snail
Sep 25, 2008

CHEESE!

hayden. posted:

To clarify, it's squirrely because it's going 100MPH in the powerband and there's basically no weight on the front wheel. I don't think it's unusual behavior (it's only when hitting bumps in the road) and I'm probably just not used to it. Bar risers would be nice but I'm not sure I want to throw that much money into the bike right now.

Neither my race bike or my street bike get squirrely at those speeds with the power on (you should see how rough my two local race tracks have been/are). Both have their damper turned to the minimum setting. I don't own a ZX-14, but the last one I rode certainly didn't get twitchy at speed with power.

You could be holding the bar too tight, trying to force the steering. It would also explain the soreness. If you're feeling confident to do so, next time you're out remind yourself to lighten your grip somewhat and see just how it goes over the rough stuff.

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snail
Sep 25, 2008

CHEESE!

Ponies ate my Bagel posted:

I don't want to be an rear end, but I'm not sure I want to ride with him again. I'd really hate to be the one calling 911 to come scrape what's left of him off the road after a 120+mph wreck. It also encourages me to ride faster, which I don't want to do. I've got a family to support and I shouldn't be riding like a total dong.

So CA should I be "busy" when he asks me to ride, or should I give him another chance?

Ride the way you want to ride, and tell your buddy that. The terms of riding as a group are that you're out for some casual enjoyment, and you have no intention of scraping anyone off the road. If you think he won't honour that, then just decline.

I've been in groups that have elected to sit by the side of the road for an hour so the moron who turned up will go away. "God decides if I live or die" had no place in that group's riding culture, and we weren't going to let anyone impose that on us. It's not fair for him to impose his behaviour (risks and consequences too) on you.

Faux-edit: What many others have said.

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