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MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

Mickey Mouse copyright
Walt Gisnep

ActusRhesus posted:

It's just like this thing that it's not at all like. Got it...


objection. speculative.

What, just because I'm a lawyer, I have to have good arguments? This is just getting more and more offensive.

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MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

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Walt Gisnep

ActusRhesus posted:

they don't even have to be good. just better than:

"Remember that time someone did something racist? This is just like that, except not really, but it's kind of like something that makes my BFF sad...I think."

They're massively different in severity and in the fact that you're also a female lawyer rather than some rear end in a top hat white male baby boomer partner making the joke. But you should still be able to see that they are analogous. This person gets appointed to a judgeship and everybody goes "Ha, a blonde lawyer who went to FIT, something something Legally Blonde!" Again, I don't think it's a big deal at all and I doubt she's traumatized about this stuff, and my posts look a lot more serious than they would sound if I were saying them out loud. But anything like that can be annoying. Even really tall men get annoyed when people constantly bring up basketball to them.

MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

Mickey Mouse copyright
Walt Gisnep

ActusRhesus posted:

I'll be back to elf loving soon. Taking a mass effect detour. And who the hell is pie king?

It's a cruel throwback to when I was a child and I was fat. Soothing Vapors was my biggest bully and he followed me to this thread. Everybody is horrible and racist. Also Mass Effect 3 has no good ending.

MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

Mickey Mouse copyright
Walt Gisnep

blarzgh posted:

The worst kind of laws are the ones named after someone.

"Bill"

MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

Mickey Mouse copyright
Walt Gisnep

CaptainScraps posted:

The only problem is that you wouldn't qualify for IBR or forgiveness with a home equity loan.

Not to mention whatever loan repayment assistance program your school might have, I imagine.

MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

Mickey Mouse copyright
Walt Gisnep

Hot Dog Day #91 posted:

When you're ranked #1, nothing else matters?

Yale has switched to its own trinary ranking system: High Yale, Yale, and Fail.

MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

Mickey Mouse copyright
Walt Gisnep

The Warszawa posted:

We call it Yale Plus now after people shortened HY to "hile"

We had a similar problem at Northwestern when our school tried separating our grades into "C" and "Not-C."


Also, here's a cute comic I just saw on Reddit:

MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

Mickey Mouse copyright
Walt Gisnep

nm posted:

At UCDavis, you can get a masters in beer making. Not only is that more awesome, cheaper, but you'll actually get job and not hate life.

Not when his wife divorces him for being that rear end in a top hat who's gotten really into making beer.

MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

Mickey Mouse copyright
Walt Gisnep

nm posted:

It is different when you get paid for it. Those guys don't make it at home (also most of them work for bud.)

As though breweries are clambering up towers to grab recent beer-making masters graduates. Chocolate City Brewing here in DC just closed last month. The market is saturated. Don't get that master's!

MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

Mickey Mouse copyright
Walt Gisnep

blarzgh posted:

So this came for my client today.



I should get my firm's clients to use Judge Judy sometimes. A large portion of our cases are arbitration anyway and it's not like she's less qualified than the arbitrators we hire. (That's more a compliment to her than an insult to our arbitrators.)

MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

Mickey Mouse copyright
Walt Gisnep

BigHead posted:

Don't go. It's never a good idea to go unless you have a full ride scholarship to a T14.

You have a job lined up in a good industry. You do not want to spend $500,000 and probably more* to have an outside shot to get a low paying job in a dying industry. Job prospects are really bad for everyone.

*Remember, it's $50k plus per year for tuition, then room and board, plus you are giving up your regular salary.

Either factor in lost income or factor in cost of living, but don't factor in both unless you assume for some reason that he'd be living with his parents if he didn't go to law school.

MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

Mickey Mouse copyright
Walt Gisnep

Toona the Cat posted:

Yes, Duquesne, about $7,500 a year after a non-GPA reliant scholarship.

One thing I wasn't clear about--Are you going to work while you're at law school? Are you putting a career on hold that you can go back into, or are you leaving your career?

MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

Mickey Mouse copyright
Walt Gisnep

Toona the Cat posted:

No, my wife's income is sufficient to where I don't have to work. I haven't worked since the summer of 2012, and have been using my GI Bill stipend and grants for spending money. My last real job was as a railroad clerk I could go back to if I desperately needed to.


I can't recall the exact name but it's a merit scholarship that's renewable as long as I maintain good academic standing which is defined as a 2.0 GPA.

In your earlier post you said the scholarship was "non-GPA-reliant," and then you mentioned in another post that it requires a 2.0 GPA. This will sound nitpicky at first, but you need to be less careless than this for such a major investment of time and money. At UCLA or Georgetown, it's extremely rare for students to have GPAs under 2.0. At low-tier schools, it's normal for dozens of students to flush out every year because their GPAs are lower than the minimum required to be in "good standing," or because their seemingly-safe scholarships were revoked. Presumably most of those people did not think they would end up with a GPA below that threshold.

The school you're thinking about attending is Duquesne, which publishes no formal mandatory curve for professors to follow. This is what the Duquesne website says:

"For each first-year course and all upper-level courses of 15 or more students, the Faculty suggests that 20-25% of the grades be A- or above, 50-60% of the grades be B- to B+, and 20-25% of the grades be C+ or below."

You should assume that any low-ranked law school is run by scammers who, in order to keep their jobs, have to try every deplorable trick they can get away with in order to maximize revenue for the school. For all you know, faculty are privately encouraged or even required to make a certain percent of their letter grades F's.

With that said, I think you're probably fine.


Soothing Vapors posted:

there was a great 10-8 post a few years ago that convinced me to stop trying to save them. there's plenty of evidence out there that would have let them save themselves, so why bother? it's way funnier to just passively watch as they do whatever then drink their sweet, briny tears when they fail

I thought we sort of came to an unspoken consensus that this kind of schadenfreude is pretty hosed up. If you believe in a world where only people you consider to be smart deserve not to suffer, then you are a terrible person. I know you play a character in this thread and were probably joking, but a lot of people, especially lawyers, actually think like this.

Also, same thing to the lawyers who get a lot of pleasure out of watching people with deteriorating mental states file pro se "sovereign citizen" suits. I understand that it can be funny in a gallows humor sort of way, but you can bet that their parents and other loved ones find the ceaseless decline of these people's lives and sanity to be horrifying, not funny.

MoFauxHawk fucked around with this message at 22:07 on Feb 22, 2015

MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

Mickey Mouse copyright
Walt Gisnep

ActusRhesus posted:

Somewhere there is an inadequately monitored pie eating contest that needs refereeing. Suggest you get on that and leave the rest of us assholes to our petty vices.

I have that trophy proudly displayed in my home. The law diploma itself, however, I never bothered to get a copy of.

MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

Mickey Mouse copyright
Walt Gisnep
I graduated from law school in 2014. I found out this week that :

1. My friend at Latham & Watkins in NYC broke up with his girlfriend recently because he found out that she had been cheating on him while he was at work. From what I've heard, it was a horrible breakup. The endless demand for billable hours at his job has helped distract him from it.

2. My friend at Jones Day in suburban SoCal cancelled her wedding scheduled for April, and her ex-fiance moved out.


And then there's still that 2013-graduate friend of mine who was engaged and worked at Kirkland & Ellis in San Francisco until he committed suicide a few months ago. In law school he was primarily known for being really friendly and perpetually in a good mood.


By the way, anybody else going to be in Albany this coming week to get interviewed and sworn in for the NY bar? The January swearing-in was past capacity so March 12 is my date.

MoFauxHawk fucked around with this message at 20:25 on Mar 7, 2015

MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

Mickey Mouse copyright
Walt Gisnep

Zo posted:

Lol how many of y'all firms have a full blown liquor room for on the job drinking because I'm in the states visiting locals firms now and it's been 2 for 2 so far.

My two biggest clients for my solo practice are a whiskey distillery and a restaurant/bar entrepreneur so I just try to have as many client meetings as possible. Including tonight

MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

Mickey Mouse copyright
Walt Gisnep

Vox Nihili posted:

What's your practice now, MoFaux?

I had been working for the federal government (as a contractor) for about a year and building a little solo practice here in DC on the side during that time. I wasn't really happy with the government contracting job, so when I sold ClintonKaine.com a month ago for $15,000, I decided to use this new cushion to go whole hog with my solo practice, and didn't seek a new government contract when my term ended in August.

As far as my practice areas go, I'm willing to do pretty much anything people ask me to do, but I mostly work for startups and local businesses (my ongoing clients include several bars, a distillery, a property management company, and a few small IT companies). I clear and file a lot of trademarks, I draft and review a lot of documents and contracts, and I'm hoping to do more litigation over time. I'm also trying to grow my weed law practice, as weed is becoming more and more legal here in DC. I also do pro bono work here for tenants, sex workers, and low-wage workers.

MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

Mickey Mouse copyright
Walt Gisnep

Zo posted:

I'm in the DC area for two weeks now, can i get free booze at your distilleries?

More than anything though I'm looking forward to watching the first debate, in America, with lots of beers. I wonder if there's a good bar for that in Alexandria.

The bars give me free booze sometimes, but not the distillery, unfortunately.

I can't imagine anything less fun and more annoying than watching presidential debates with a bunch of drunk, center-left, semi-nerdy DC yuppies. It'd be like being in a real life Trump meme.

MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

Mickey Mouse copyright
Walt Gisnep

Phil Moscowitz posted:

LOL did you seriously squat on Clintonkaine.com and then sell it to Trump?

You bet! Clinton's digital director didn't want it so I put it up on Flippa and handed it off to a broker. The person he ended up selling it to turned out to be Trump's digital director. Now I'm living very happily on Trump money. The website was only getting about 50 visits a day by the time Trump's campaign got it, after most of the media coverage had died down.

Here's my Morning Edition interview about it. Great start to my legal career here in DC: http://www.npr.org/2016/08/17/490314006/clintonkaine-com-pays-off-for-domain-squatter

MoFauxHawk fucked around with this message at 23:09 on Sep 23, 2016

MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

Mickey Mouse copyright
Walt Gisnep

Vox Nihili posted:

Article even manages to include literal basement dwelling.

To be fair, it's a pretty charming 2Bd1Ba English basement apartment in an old rowhouse. My basement co-dweller is actually a goon too though (Zikan).

Thank you for the kind words, everybody!

MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

Mickey Mouse copyright
Walt Gisnep

evilweasel posted:

my secretary notarizes things

i did discover the other day that being a lawyer makes me automatically licenced to be a real estate broker, for some reason

Wait, really? Can you link to a source?

MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

Mickey Mouse copyright
Walt Gisnep

blarzgh posted:

same in Texas:

Texas Occupations Code Section 1101 basically says, "the restrictions on listing, selling, and taking a commission on a real estate sale do not apply to licensed Texas attorneys."

Dang, DC does not seem to have that exemption, at least not except in specific situations like trusts and estates. Lawyers here definitely can't try their hand at real estate without a license as far as I can tell.

MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

Mickey Mouse copyright
Walt Gisnep

evilweasel posted:

https://www.liebschool.com/content/material/publication/Publication_RealEstateAttorneysAsRealEstateBrokers_TheSuffolkLawyer_June2015.pdf

i actually looked up all the details but that happens to summarize it, a ny lawyer doesnt need a real estate brokers licence but can get one if they want the card without any education requirements etc

I guess it's nice to know that with my NY license, if I ever move to NY (I live in DC), I have one more possible side hustle.

MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

Mickey Mouse copyright
Walt Gisnep
To be fair, practicing lawyers still have plenty of nightmares about law school, even middle-aged ones I've talked to. But that's true of college and high school too.

MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

Mickey Mouse copyright
Walt Gisnep

evilweasel posted:

law school: pay vague attention in class, take four hours of class, goof off all semester because the finals are open book so who the gently caress cares as long as you remember that your book has a table of contents and an index

I'm not saying law school was particularly hard (though if you're in a curved class, it's as easy or hard as the other students), but that doesn't mean I don't have the standard school nightmares where I realize there's a final exam and I haven't gone to class all semester, or I never did a paper I was supposed to do and I'm not going to graduate on time, or something like that.

MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

Mickey Mouse copyright
Walt Gisnep

Konstantin posted:

I'd do some more specific research. Do people who have the specifc positions you want typically have a JD? If so, do they typically follow your career path, or do they have experience as a practicing lawyer? Is school prestige a factor in getting those jobs? It's rarely a good idea to get a JD if you don't want to be a lawyer, I'd consider something like a MLS with a focus in law librarianship.

I think they know the answers to these questions already and it is a major factor in their desire for a JD.

I've also always been under the impression that law librarians usually have JDs, and usually do not practice law for a while first (or don't have to, at least).

MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

Mickey Mouse copyright
Walt Gisnep
Lawyers should be able to take custody of the children in the event of nonpayment

MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

Mickey Mouse copyright
Walt Gisnep
Edit: Nvm

MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

Mickey Mouse copyright
Walt Gisnep

Gobbeldygook posted:

Patent trolls are the lowest form of legal life. At least the guys that make a living suing small businesses for ADA violations are making the world more accessible to the handicapped.

Lower than health insurance company, management-side employment, corporate-side environmental, etc. attorneys?

MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

Mickey Mouse copyright
Walt Gisnep

Gobbeldygook posted:

I put most patent trolls below most of those. In most cases, patent trolls are a pure protection racket that do nothing but subtract value from the world, but e.g. health insurance company attorneys fight to prevent payments for useless treatments, against the company being defrauded, against those who simply don't like the contract they agreed to, etc.

That is some serious capitalism-loving rationalization there. We're not talking about public defenders protecting poor people's rights here, we're talking about people who make a lot of money finding creative ways to deny healthcare to children and other people. There's no real (moral) currency in saying "I would rather see a thousand impoverished, sick children go untreated than let one non-sick child receive treatment!" I really don't give a poo poo about small businesses and their awkward patent conflicts in comparison to this.

At least patent trolls are finding holes in some very hosed up systems (patents, capitalism, and the legal industry/system) and tearing them wide open for everybody to see.

MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

Mickey Mouse copyright
Walt Gisnep

Gobbeldygook posted:

Even if Barack Hussein Obama nationalized all of the doctors and hospitals in America in the name of glorious communism and rededicated them to providing the best treatment possible for as many people as possible, there would still be government-side healthcare attorneys arguing against sick people getting uneconomical, inappropriate, and ineffective treatments that they really wanted.

related
https://twitter.com/daveweigel/status/793116547648724993

However, there won't be the same profit motive. There will be motivation to save money, but it's not the same. At my old union-side labor and benefits firm, I did some work for the determination board of a coal miner union healthcare fund, and while it still felt sickening to sometimes be involved in denying dental surgery to children or nitpicking the transportation costs of people who had to drive 800 miles to get brain surgery, there was at least the sense that all of these decisions were being done for the good of the community, and you tried to determine whether somebody really was supposed to receive treatment or reimbursement based on the wording of the plan and their actual needs.

The patients about whom you were making these decisions were part of the same group of people you were being employed by to make these decisions, and denying somebody coverage for iffy reasons was not considered desirable. If you work for a private insurance company, however, every denial of coverage is a victory.

MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

Mickey Mouse copyright
Walt Gisnep

SlyFrog posted:

They do have state jobs, but not so many as I think. And the issue that does not resolve for me is that I'm very afraid I could end up in that state job wanting to blow my brains out because it's the same paperwork, same job, just less ability to leave (because you're not a law firm partner). My problem is not really being overworked. I'm not sure I could forget I have a job.

I have thought about the greatly reduced pay route for something with "less stress." My fear is that I would still hate it, but just be more captive to the job when I'm there (harder to keep people off your back when you're literally in the building and captive to your client, and when it does not cost them anything extra to bug you, because you're not billing them by the hour).

I think a new job might help a lot. There's something specific about the billable hour system that's especially anxiety-inducing, I think. And I think you might be surprised how much freedom you have to get up and take long breaks at state and corporate jobs.

MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

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Walt Gisnep

mastershakeman posted:

People are really mad at the doc review facility that they can't work dec 24-26th

As a Jew, I would be mad too. Great opportunity to work long days without social FOMO.

MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

Mickey Mouse copyright
Walt Gisnep

bub spank posted:

For Christmas, I quit my regional "biglaw" job to take a position at a 2-person firm. I have no idea what to expect, but maybe 2017 will be less stressful? :unsmith:

By that, do you mean you're the second person or the third person? And are we using "person" to mean "lawyer"?

MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

Mickey Mouse copyright
Walt Gisnep
Did something change recently at the USPTO? In the last week, multiple different trademark examining attorneys have been calling and emailing me about my applications to ask if they can quickly amend them for disclaimers and other things that I'm used to getting office actions about. Is there a new procedural policy there or something? I've never been proactively contacted by examiners before.

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MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

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Walt Gisnep
I think you might be underestimating how miserable the billable hour system is for a lot of people. There may be nothing wrong with you except your firm job.

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