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Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."
Marche's whole thing is that he automatically moves towards destroying this world that seems okay and that he personally loves because he's spent his whole life pushed to put all his wants aside to Be A Good Boy. That's why he spends basically the entire time not talking about what he wants or whether it's the right thing to do, and why he just parrots "escapism is bad!" without anything to back it up or any strong counterargument, because he doesn't actually believe it. They point this part out several times.

Hence the whole scene with him yelling, "I never said I wanted anything! I gave all the "I wants" and "I don't wants" to you!" Marche isn't some moral arbiter or the author's voice, he's a messed-up kid cracking under the weight of getting everything he's ever wanted and knowing he can't keep it. But then he realizes that there's an actual reason to go home, and that he doesn't need Ivalice to be happy after all, and he ends the story in a place of relative peace.

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Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."

FirstAidKite posted:

Hi I'm still playing Stella Glow and just got through chapter 3 and wow Nonoka is just terrible and I hate that she is definitely going to be very useful in battles.

Go through her events up until Control Condition and her status effects are 100% effective, which makes her one of the best units in the game. She's pretty much a one-note joke though, yeah.

C-Euro posted:

I played the demo of that as part of my ongoing 3DS exploration, and I kind of enjoyed the gameplay despite being a big baby when it comes to tactics games like Fire Emblem. However, the point at which the demo ends (when your village is wrecked and you're conscripted into the royal army) might as well have involved a giant banner reading "it's about to go Full Waifu up in here". How waifu-y does it get beyond that point?

Man, what does this even mean? Use your words.

If you're asking "is it a harem story" or "is romance central to things," not really. There's multiple female characters and bonding events and some of those characters are interested in the main character, and you can pick one character to have an ending with at the end (anyone whose events you've finished). But romance is pretty background in the character stories. The girl who adopted the main character into her family does have a thing for him, and that's addressed in the main story, but other people don't spend a lot of time talking about it.

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."

Clarste posted:

Actually, forget FE-like and FFT-likes, we need more Mask of Truth clones.

It makes me incredibly sad that the Oshtor prequel game just seems to be a bog-standard JRPG. I mean, I'll still play Monochrome Mobius, but it's very much the same feeling I had when I first saw Suikoden Tierkreis or the non-Shining Force Shining games. (Even before they came out and I heard they were bad.)

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."

Harrow posted:

Thinking about playing the Tactics Ogre PSP version once I'm one with Triangle Strategy since I've never actually played the PSP remake.

Should I install the One Vision mod for a first playthrough? I've heard it's really good but I'm unsure if it's meant for veterans or not.

You shouldn't need experience with the original to play One Vision, there's not much in the way of newbie traps. In some ways not playing the original is even helpful, because One Vision removes a lot of little systemic annoyances. (You don't get stats for being in a class when it levels, only unique classes inherit anything but generic skills from other classes, weapon forging is much less of a thing.)

My big piece of advice would be to find a "increase experience" code for grinding up new classes, because One Vision adds many more unique classes to the game; many of them are cool and interesting, but it very much exacerbates the Tactics Ogre PSP problem of "tying levels to individual classes makes new classes useless for a while," and Tactics Ogre's catch-up EXP mechanic is pretty weak. The no-codes One Vision experience is either not using these classes, or else committing to spending the back half of the game's fights babysitting 2-3 unique characters that still haven't finished catching up. (And then they do catch up and you get more of them.) I played through it without those codes on the route with the most exclusive characters ( Law ) and it meant a lot of little annoyances, especially since One Vision takes out all the normal revival methods.

Class leveling is kind of the big messy asterisk on any recommendation of Tactics Ogre PSP in general and One Vision in particular. YMMV.

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."

Harrow posted:

Thanks! Yeah the class leveling thing is odd--I've never finished the PSP version but I did play it for a good while a few years back and that was always kind of an awkward spot. I'm hoping knowing about it going in (and possibly using a code for unique classes, I'm not too proud to cheat my way past something that's just a grind) will help me out this time.

Any character building tips? Good things to do with Denam in One Vision (before or after Lord), anything like that?

One notable thing in OV is that the Finisher attacks you unlock with weapon ranks inflict their statues 100% of the time, so many classes benefit from having a one-handed weapon and a bow or crossbow. Canopus wants a one-handed weapon and a bow, the Rogue you get early on wants a claw and a crossbow. When you use ranged weapons, make sure to pick up Trajectory: it not only shows the flight path and whether or not it'll hit, it gives you an active skill that greatly increases your ranged accuracy. Early on it's nearly required for ranged units to hit things, and later on it lets them destroy evasive enemies.

The starting magic class you get is for magic damage and only magic damage, with only weak statuses and support; most other magic classes get statuses and support but weaker magic. OV makes bulky units bulkier and balances them by making them weak to status magic, so you want at least one caster with those spells. Be aware that enemy Knights can't heal in this version but have all the status removal spells, so they'll prioritize curing their allies.

Healing magic is pretty rare in this game, so you'll want Priests or Sybils for basically the entire game. You're given three during the game (one near the start, one a little after that, one in chapter 4), and it's not a bad idea to use all three in maps that have high unit caps. You can't revive characters during fights except by trading another alive character for them, and enemies can't be revived at all, so the game favors defensive play. (Kind of like Triangle Strategy, but unit durability is more symmetrical in OV.)

The Necromancer class deserves special mention, in that it's the easiest to mess up: if you want a good Necromancer, you need someone to train up Crossbow levels before changing over. It's a hybrid class between Crossbows and magic, but if you don't get the levels first then it ends up just being a weaker Warlock. If you get at least Crossbow level 3, though, then changing an Archer over to that class is fun.

I personally built Denam to dual-wield swords. Berserker can learn dual-wield early on and he can use both the Ranger and Lord special classes to do the same, but better. If you go Law, you get free Ranger class marks for Denam; if you don't go Law, you can craft them later. There's a chapter 4 choice between the Lord class or a special character in chapter 4, but you can craft Lord class marks later as well. (Or just hack it in after that branch, the class is fun but it won't break the game in half.)

Law is even more favored route-wise in OV compared to vanilla TO PSP, since Ravness is now a Paladin (after Chapter 1) and Denam gets Ranger access early. The third exclusive recruit (Ozma) is fun as well, due to getting a two-radius Charm AOE finisher. Yes, that Charm is still 100% accuracy! ...and that finisher has friendly fire, so if you use it wrong you'll charm half your team. It's hilarious.

Einander fucked around with this message at 01:41 on May 27, 2022

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."

Harrow posted:

Thank you for all the advice! This sounds great. I didn't know Denam could be a Ranger in OV, that's cool. Making him a dual-wield striker seems good, too, especially if he's going to have to carry some solo battles. I've read that weapon types are much better balanced in OV so I'm guessing I can't really go wrong with like swords or spears or anything like that.

My last questions are just about the World system, which probably all apply to vanilla as well. I've heard that you want to Law and get Princess on the timeline you do CODA stuff on. If I do Law first, is that going to mean I'll have to replay all of Law later to set up for CODA, or is there some way to finesse it so it works out more neatly than that? Knowing Law is that favored for recruits makes me want do to that first so I can play with those units for as much of the game as possible.

(Note that I haven't actually done Coda in OV myself, since the patch-maker still needs to adjust some of the post-game content for the patch, but I'm going off my memory of vanilla here.)

The bigger obstacle is that if you want to go through Coda, you need to clear the Palace of the Dead down to the 100th floor in chapter 4. Beating the final boss and then beating it does not count. (Not ALL 100 floors, there's routing, but it's still 50+ maps.) I would not recommend you do this before you've done all the traveling you want to between routes before doing the Palace, because if you mess something up and somehow lose that clear flag, then I can't imagine doing that all again.

Then, after clearing the Palace, you need to do the final set of levels again to enter the post-game with the "Palace cleared" flag.

So I don't think your initial route choice matters unless you're doing Law and then immediately going through Coda, because you'll be going back to chapter 4 for the Palace of the Dead anyway.

Also, should post this: it's a listing from the patch creator that has what class have what magic and abilities. Normal classes tend to only be able to use what they can learn, but special classes generally get 3-5 things scattered across other classes.

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."

ImpAtom posted:

Live a Live is just Saga Frontier but better.

I do love Live A Live, but, no, the "you must play all these characters" aspects makes it feel pretty different. I don't have to play as Lute if I don't like Lute, but I'm already reluctantly buckling up for my fourth time through Cube's chapter. That's the one part of the game that suffers on a replay.

And, also,

Snooze Cruise posted:

saga rules

quote if you agree

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."

Heithinn Grasida posted:

How is the build customization/ combat in crystal project? I like the concept but if the main draw is exploration and the combat is bland (I think menu based jrpg combat tends to be bland, though it can sometimes be very good), I’ll probably pass.

There's been some praise for Crystal Project's variety of options, so the one caveat: if you're on Hard, you're going to become very, very familiar with Rogue and Shaman. Rogue's Blind is incredibly powerful against physical bosses, especially with the game's perfect information, and you need some source of Sleep to cut random encounters down to something more manageable. Sleep shows up elsewhere, but Rogue is one of two classes with Blind, and Rogue is the only one that can do it more than once a fight. (And the other class is basically an endgame thing, because the Summoner fights are not easy.)

Meanwhile, Shaman is the only source of attack debuffing and one of two sources of magic debuffing for a long time. Even later on, Assassin is the only other class with both damage debuffs, and it's one of the easier ones to miss. (Or you could put Protect and Shell up on everyone all the time, but that's not very practical in a game where they wear off. The Warlock's Doublecast only goes so far, especially now that the cost of that got increased in a patch.)

Since Hard expects you to make use of disabling and debuffing effects, the relative rarity of those effects is a weird blind spot in the balance. It's basically my one complaint with the fights.

FirstAidKite posted:

Just finished Stella Glow ng+ and got the good ending.

2 thoughts come to mind:

1. well this new twist came out of absolutely nowhere
2. I accidentally cheesed the final boss. I think it was trying to charge up some kind of move that I assume would have either killed me or at least done a lot of damage but the final boss wasn't immune to delay status effects so I was able to just repeatedly and infinitely delay the final boss's turn until they were dead.

Yep, that's what makes Nonoka one of the strongest characters: Control Condition makes delay 100% effective and nothing's immune to it. She can utterly destroy bosses.

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."

Clarste posted:

I noticed that the description of Hard says it expects you to grind, which immediately put me off. Can you confirm/deny that?

Like, I enjoy a challenge but my idea of a challenge does not include walking back and forth fighting the same enemies for an hour.

The only time I actually sat down and did any grinding was mastering some classes at the very end of the game, and that was mostly because I wanted to see what the ultimate class armors do. I fought monsters that were near platforming I had to do, but I got through the game comfortably without fighting everything. The one time I felt like I fell behind was random encounters in the desert area, and that's more the game raising its expectations. (Use Sleep.)

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."

DACK FAYDEN posted:

Crystal Project: I'm in the volcano - just got the second mount - and getting my rear end kicked by every random encounter with more than one enemy, even with Sleep. What's a reasonable mitigation solution for multi-targets?

Current party is a magic dps, a thief/scholar (mostly thief lol), a hunter for dps, and a reaper acting as tank with warrior skills. There doesn't seem to be good multitarget healing (Sun Bath is lovely and slow) so that's not the solution and I'm getting ground down by multi-target abilities from enemies + the damge from being on fire in the volcano.

e: also I'm supposed to come back for this Ancient Sword, right, because same problem (lol it just multislashes me and I get Bleed on everyone and I loving die instantly)

I believe the volcano is completely optional (there's a class crystal for a good tank class but actual forward progress once you have the goat is in the ice area), so ducking out and going somewhere else is an option. If you're in the Volcano, did you get Assassin and Samurai from Shoudu Province? One of those two is available from the Sky Arena's rewards, the other is in the undercity area. Assassin will be particularly useful for you, since the attack and magic attack debuffs are on the class's bow branch.

I do remember avoiding most encounters in the Volcano when I could, because it's a pain. Even in locked rooms, you can usually juke them into lava (Quintar mount's speed helps), and then they count as dead for the purposes of unlocking rooms. That sword boss is completely optional too, since it just blocks a chest with a good sword. I'm pretty sure I pulled it off when I first got to the Volcano: it's doable if you're very, very on top of using Blind and debuffing. Hard, though, especially with the Rogue's aggro management requirements.

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."

DACK FAYDEN posted:

lmao I did not get either of those, I set one foot in that area and turned back, addin that to the list (hell I haven't even seen the ice area yet, I beelined back to the volcano as soon as I got the goat)

the goat is my boy, cute as hell and my quintar can eat poo poo beause I like cute slow goat better

also, the actual answer may have been just that you can loving dispel the Burn from being in the volcano, I assumed you could not because, you know, volcano hot.

Yeah, most people do that with that area for some reason. (Probably because you can get there before you even really start exploring the desert in earnest, and then the goat distracts you.) Just make sure to climb to the top-left of that area first when you backtrack to it, because there's a shrine up there and the area is very vertical. Being able to warp back to the top at any time helps.

Now that you mentioned it, yes, that helps a lot. (Doubly so if you have two people with double-cast, since that means you can eliminate it in a single turn. Plus /Warlock is just generally great for random encounters.) Usually games like this would reapply it as a global effect on turn end or something, but nope.

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."

Tonfa posted:

It's extremely easy if you run a Cleric set. Blackout ruins so many fights in the game.

I think that's good design, actually, because the fights are still winnable otherwise. (Though the jungle temple random battles would definitely be much more annoying without Blackout.) FF5 is basically the standout example of a game people love in part because it's full of things like Level 5 Death without letting those invalidate all the other ways of playing.

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."

DACK FAYDEN posted:

yeah holy poo poo Valkyrie is really, really good

just got water transportation and now the world's my oyster, and also this Weaver class which appears to be literally nothing but Haste and Quick? which I mean I guess that's good

Haste and Quick and Slow, and a knife. It's surprisingly good as a primary class for a Rogue, giving them more support utility and a use for their MP, and it means you can start every random battle with a target-all Sleep Bomb, which is nice.

(Plus there's an optional endgame dungeon where you can only use magic. That was kind of a nasty surprise.)

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."
Wait, Symphony of War had a demo, right? Did they remove it now that the game's out? That sucks.

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."

Prism posted:

As I understand it, it was using some older gameplay rules that have changed since it was made in beta, so they're making a new one.

Oh, that's cool of them, if unfortunately timed. Hopefully they get it up sometime before a week or so, because I'm curious about the game but my memory is not great.

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."
Crystal Project:

One thing to mention with the Owlbear, since it keeps coming up as a problem in the thread. I'm pretty sure you can still get on your Quintar and get it to charge after you into the spikes; I don't think I saw anything about that getting patched out. So long as you hit the spikes before it actually touches you, you'll respawn up there and it'll be out of the way. Then you can go up, get the warp stone and the mount, and come back later to actually kill it.

Beatsmith isn't usually a very useful class, but there's one edge case use for it: one of the optional endgame dungeons is magic-only, and the Beatsmith healing and MP healing spells count. (So do the Valkyrie ones, I think? And unlike FF6's equivalent, Scholar blue magic is fine.) You can do worse than having your fighter characters learn those two Beatsmith spells and having them play healer/MP mule there.

On the topic of that dungeon: mentioning FF6 made me realize why the boss casts Meteor on death. That's cute.

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."

Kingtheninja posted:

Well I am all in on crystal project. Does anyone know the trick to the spot behind the nan's house? Those trees look like they lead to an area west of the house but I can't figure how to get on them.

I checked, and even if you can't get on the trees you can get to the other side of that high dark brown outcropping without them, and there's nothing on that outcropping itself with your starting mobility. If you want more hints on that, go left across the bridge and climb up the waterfall.

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."
Got the Live A Live demo to play during my lunch break and was disappointed; the Imperial China chapter isn't especially long, but they cut it pretty early in the demo. Instead of having three short fragments, they should have just put out the entire martial artist chapter by itself as the demo, especially since it's the only one with multiple endings. It's longer than the short chapters and shorter than the long chapters, so it'd have been the perfect slice of the game for demo purposes.

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."

Ibram Gaunt posted:

For Caligula Effect 2, is there any particular party comp that's outright better? Shota seemed kind of useless so I benched him almost immediately, but as the game keeps throwing more party members at me I'm left unsure who's worth using overall.

Shota and Ryuto are the only party members that I'd say are bad. In Shota's case it's more that his starting moves are bad, but he at least climbs back up to mediocre later. Ryuto's just bad, because evasion does not work with any reliability and that's very central to his kit, so he just has some debuffs and bad attacks. Sasara is a tank in a game where you can move around, interrupt or perfect block almost everything, but otherwise has pretty good attack properties. Niko has healing you similarly don't need, but also gets full party buffs, so she's good (once she gets those buffs, and also some better attacks). Kobato's attacks can be awkward to land, but he hits hard. Gin, Kiriko and Marie are all good.

Due to how the character bond mechanics work, though, you have to use all of them pretty evenly for most of the game if you want to max that out. If you don't want to, though, then I don't think the game really forces party compositions, so you should be fine sticking to the characters you like.

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."

Ibram Gaunt posted:

Alright, that clears things up. Thank you!


Am I free to skip sidequests? It was too tedious with all the back and forth that I've just stopped. I don't care about missing out on like best equipment or something like that but if there's something I gotta do to get a true ending or w/e I'd suffer through it.

They don't matter, no. The biggest effect is that some of them raise your protagonist stats, but even in the hardest difficulty, you don't need that.

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."

Ibram Gaunt posted:

Decided to jump back into DQXI while waiting for XBC3. I just recently got Slyvando so I'm pretty early.

I'm not sure how you're supposed to build him though. What weapon type is best for him etc..Any pointers?

One thing to keep in mind with Sylvando in particular: since you reset skills by category, you can use individual categories as bridges. So the quickest way to get Hustle Dance is to go down-right through Litheness to Fuddle Dance, buy it, and then reset Litheness and put those refunded points straight into Hustle Dance. Then you can immediately focus on Knives to support Erik's damage with statuses or Whips for Wyrm Whip.

(I'd advise the Whips, Erik's only okay until he gets his skill tree expansion.)

Outside of Sylvando, the other use for this trick is that you can also use it to get the locked Sword Dance skill from the Luminary's Swordmastery tree much, much earlier than usual, making it available as soon as you have 72 total SP. Outside of those two big uses, it's mostly optimization trivia.

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."

Clarste posted:

The Ruby Weapon is vulnerable to paralyze, so you can just summon Hades over and over again to stunlock it indefinitely. Still takes a while I guess.

I remember visiting a cousin with the game, back before I'd played any non-SMRPG RPGs. He was talking about not beating able to beat Ruby. I saw, and said, "Hey, if this inflicts all those statuses, why not use it on the boss?" And then he very patiently explained to me that that wouldn't work, because bosses are immune to them, and he even booted up the boss fight to show me that it wouldn't work.

There was just kind of a moment of silence when the boss was paralyzed. I think that was the funniest possible time for me not to know the Old JRPG Rules yet.

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."

BabyRyoga posted:

Waiting for Xenoblade 3, I powered through Crystal Project in a few days.

I really liked the idea of just exploring the game, even if the platforming was frustrating at times. Finding out secret ways to get into areas way higher level than your party and getting all kinds of broken weapons, armors, etc. Is satisfying.

Try as much as you will, you won't break the game, however, because the big negative here is a total lack of balance in the combat. I was playing on hard, and essentially found it impossible to fight stuff (even regular battles) without basically blowing it up instantly with a fuckton of magic, then spamming ethers and potions between battles and reviving the people that inevitably died in one or two hits. There is no item command (locked to a job, isn't REALLY an item command as much as a class that uses items to produce similar effects in battle) , and MP/HP values are low on characters and REALLY high on bosses, thus it is hard to sustain any fight for more than a couple of rounds before dying to attrition. Hit rates for non-magic seems to be rather low as well, which is frustrating. Since most of the bosses are merely guarding a crystal that unlocks more jobs, I found myself finding ways to despawn or get around them (sometimes taking dozens of tries) rather than fighting them, and coming back at a later time. Until the end game when I actually discovered I should just have 4 wizards, I would routinely not be strong enough to beat even bosses I had "skipped" from 5-10 hours earlier in the game. There is no flee command, so you are forced to just avoid enemies most of the time. There are ways to escape from combat that are inconvenient to use later on in the game.

Also, the game just caps you at level 60 rather than 99, when it is clear the endgame bosses and enemies continue to get stronger into what would be the equivalent of the 70s, 80s, and even 90s. There is an option to remove the cap that is locked in way that tries to make you feel like you are cheating if you use it I guess? I'm not sure how much it would even help based on the way characters progress from level-ups; you wouldn't gain enough from it that it would change the cheese everything in 1-2 rounds strategies. I thought that was a rather weird design choice.

Still a recommend from me, it's one of those games where you'll probably never find everything hidden in every little nook and cranny of the huge interconnected world. If you just like loving around and trying to 'problem solve'/find weird tech to get past areas/enemies/etc, you'll love this game.

This isn't really the case even on Hard. Random encounters do expect you to use Sleep to whittle down enemy actions per round (Rogue has sleep bomb), but attrition is perfectly possible on bosses so long as you a) have a tank, b) use stat debuffs (adding buffs is nice but not necessary), and c) have some way of stopping enemy actions (Blind before physicals and interrupt casting-time spells, Rogue can do both and Daze helps time the second). Using a Warlock for cheap attack spells and Refresh access is also very helpful.

(Also, Rogue can flee battles, it's a relatively easy skill to learn. Did you just never use that class?)

I'd say that some classes are too necessary on Hard (Rogue, Warlock and Shaman, for example), but even if you don't want to use them, you're apparently proof that there are other strategies.

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."
I enjoy timed hits in Thousand Year Door and basically nowhere else, because 1) they're easy and 2) there's the Stylish inputs. Everywhere else, I either dislike them or don't really care. I don't want to fail a hard boss five minutes into the fight because I pressed A slightly too late to attack or dodge, but I do want to hit an enemy with a hammer, backflip four times, and then mug for the camera as confetti falls. Most importantly, Stylish inputs don't get you anything very useful, even if you're making the game hard for yourself.

The measure for any mechanic shouldn't be "Is this fun the first time," it should be, "If I get stuck here due to other reasons, then will this mechanic want me to fire the developer responsible into the sun?" Timed Hits usually fail the sun cannon test.

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."
Okay, correction to an earlier statement: Utawarerumono 2 and 3 also have a pretty cool Timed Hits mechanic, in part because if you screw up you can just immediately try again. It also has its own version of Thousand Year Door's Stylish mechanic, in that a lot of combos have extra beats you can hit for a minor boost. One character is defined in part by getting a ton of these hidden add-on strikes, and learning his combos is actually pretty fun.

Those two games just have great difficulty in general, too. The end of game 2 and its post-game falls more into rocket tag territory than I'd like (especially since there's no revival, even if there's no added consequences for losing characters in a map), but even then the Overzeal mechanic keeps that interesting and fun. Game 3 brings offense and defense back into proper balance, though, and then it gives you some really crazy tools.

In particular, I want to shout out Nekone as the most fun I've ever had using a support character in anything. Stance of Attack and Defense letting her have one offensive and one supportive action every round lets you do some really crazy things, especially with Overzeal.

cheetah7071 posted:

maybe today is the day I play them, I just finished what I was playing

given I played uta 1 like, a million years ago and vaguely remember a twist or two but not much else, would it be better to just go "that's good enough, skip to the better sequels" or should I replay it. Fwiw, I remember liking it but not being blown away by it.

If you vaguely remember Utawarerumono 1, then you remember enough to play the much better sequels.

I think most of the benefit of going into the Mask games having played the first is that it makes the beginning more interesting, because there's some obvious legacy elements that serve as an immediate hook while the game is otherwise taking its time. There's also some pretty good dramatic irony, especially in the first game. Otherwise, the Mask games are pretty good about explaining returning elements.

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."

Endorph posted:

oh yeah stance of attack and defend is great, when i unlocked it i was like 'hold on is this happening right now' 'wait is this actually how this works' 'lmfao'

never found any good use for nekone's shikigami buddy tho

It's great in the rocket tag part of game 2. Sure, it's dying to one hit from anything, but bosses will shred the rest of your party about as bad. Plus, if the boss kills it in one hit, then they're less likely to use the rest of their chain and get the rest of the Zeal from that, so wasting a boss turn on it can buy you an extra turn before their Overzeal. (Shame it's also so slow.)

Still a shame that they didn't add anything extra to it in game 3, though. Both of the other spellcaster characters have great familiars.

(Shumari, Shumari...)

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."

FirstAidKite posted:

Lookin at the wild arms successor



"Temple means shrine. It's also the upper part of the face."

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."

Ragequit posted:

Hell yeah, those songs definitely have the Wild Arms touch.

The Kickstarter is taking off. It launched today and is over $500,000 already. I really hope it turns out well.

Someone bought the "voice an NPC" tier in Penny Blood, so I'm afraid that the Kickstarter is already officially a disaster.

In all seriousness: even $7 million would be pretty unlikely to pay three years of salaries and expenses for two teams each making their own games. Reading the "Why Crowdfund?" section, I guess the Kickstarter is paying for the tech demos ("proof of concept") they'll be sending to publishers? Nothing seems to suggest that there's any actual deal in place. I understand why they're not saying that directly when Kickstarters are all about PR and building excitement, but... If that's the case, then there's a pretty good chance one or both of them doesn't get off the ground.

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."

Booky posted:

i just hacked my new 3ds last night (finally!! and i even put the screen protector and did a system transfer) and now that i've loaded it up with some cool games:

is 3ds radiant historia good? i already put the og ds game on the sd card and all but i was kind of curious about the rerelease, since i recalled reading some posts a while back in another thread from someone who was kind of down on the new stuff

I like Radiant Historia quite a bit and played through the original several times, and the new content was just... there. It didn't detract from things (I'm looking at you, Chrono Trigger 3DS), but it didn't really add anything from a gameplay or story perspective. There's voice acting now, if you like voice acting. They also changed Eruca's portrait and sprite to something more generically princess-like, which is the only thing I had any real opinion on.

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."

Booky posted:

ah i see..... personally i think her new design is Fail

tho also all i know about the new stuff is that its apparently mandatory to get the true ending?? i always had the feeling that it was really only that atlus game that did that but thinking on it idk if the true ending in this is just a expanded ver of the og best ending or if its just flat out a new thing like in the megaten rereleases
i shall await more info before grabbing 3ds RH too cause man pq2 eats up a lot of GB

Yeah, agreed on the new design. Like I said, it's just much more of a "generic princess" design.

The thing with the new ending is that it doesn't really resolve any loose ends or improve any part of the ending, because the original true ending already resolves everything in a very satisfying way. It's just there because an "improved rerelease" needs a new ending, the same way the rerelease's new character in the new content is just there because the new content needs a new character.

If you really want voice acting, Perfect Chronology has voice acting. If you already have the DS version, though, no reason to bother.

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."

Anno posted:

How hyped are people for DioField Chronicle? Some reviews came out today that were generally quite positive. Also sounds like it might be shorter than I expected - 30-40ish hours. Which sounds great to me.

Heard "strategy RPG," was interested, heard "real-time," was no longer interested, was reminded of Growlanser, was interested again, saw gameplay wasn't actually that much like Growlanser, was no longer interested. Make your magic able to hit any target on the map from any position, you cowards!

In all seriousness, I think that the way magic is handled is a large part of what makes the Growlanser games work: enemy mages create time pressure, ally mages let you soften up enemy positions or kill stragglers, but you don't have enough MP or magic damage to kill everything from safety. In general, Growlanser's magic works to increase the game tempo, and anything that makes you less likely to turtle up or to waste time in an SPRG is good.

I should play one of those games again.

Back on Diofield: I don't think I've heard anything very complimentary about the story from reviews, either.

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."
Can't recommend SMTV as a post-surgery game, the platforming isn't that intensive but there's points where messing it up means a lot of walking back around, plus there's avoiding enemies and areas where the map is not very helpful. If you're going to be in bed for a couple of weeks, then I assume you're going to spend a fair amount of that time drugged up and/or in pain, and either way your motor skills won't be the best.

DQ7 would be good. Heavily episodic, pretty easy on the difficulty (outside a spike or two, and if you're 30 hours in you're probably past Dharma), and party talk should point you in the right direction if you get distracted for a bit and forget where you're going.

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."

Walla posted:

I just now learned about Rondo of Swords, and even got spoiled on a mild twist. I think I'm going to try that.

A few things that are good to know:

Characters can talk to each other on the maps, but there's no in-game indication of who and when. Consider looking up on GameFAQs to see who and when, because some of them are pretty important for characterization.

The starting tank is mostly the only character to get ZOC (plus the MC in one route and a character who gets it as a joke and/or point of characterization), which stops enemy attacks from continuing past them. He's basically an auto-include in most parties as a result, though he becomes worse and worse at actually doing damage as you go.

Enemy archers work like mages, in that they can't move and attack. Your archers can, though. There is unfortunately no way to display enemy arrow or spell ranges, which can make some maps tricky.

There's what's known as card quests (they mention one of the Major Tarot in the description) when you start being able to send people out on quests, which give character-dependent bonuses. Most of them aren't important, but the characters Ansom and Alhambra have their attack damage doubled if you send them on six of these card quests, turning them into absolute wrecking balls. There's also no in-game sign of how many card quests a character has done or whether they have their bonuses, so you'll have to keep track.

I hope you try the game and enjoy it! It's a strange game, but I'm very fond of it.

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."

cheetah7071 posted:

finished yggdra union

overall, very mid, unfortunately. It had just enough I liked to string me along to the end, mostly in the strong aesthetics (both in the spritework and in the kinds of characters who appear in the game; mermaids, griffins, and princesses with magic swords is a strong showing)

The game was still kind of annoyingly slow even with speedup, but was fairly bearable. The real problem was that most of the maps kind of sucked. They tried to tell their story inside the maps themselves, which is a commendable idea, but what it ended up meaning is gating progress by waiting around for cutscenes to pop, with no actual indication that there's even an event you're waiting for. I lost track of how often it happened that I struggled through a difficult foe only to find out that they can't be reduced below 1 hp, and two turns later a cutscene shows up to "save" me from them, meaning that the optimal strategy is to just mash end turn and completely not engage with the game, because progress other than cutscene triggers doesn't matter. It wasn't every map, but it was enough of them to be a recognizable pattern.

The hidden item system also encourages you to tediously step on every single tile of the map but I decided pretty early on that I was not going to subject myself to that, which ended up meaning that a lot of the cool item nonsense just didn't exist for me

The map that always comes to mind when I think of Yggdra Union and its unclear event triggers:

IIRC there's a part just after Yggdra's promotion where you end up at a fortress with enemies where the last character of each unit will completely refuse to go down, so you'll lose every fight. But this is just after the point where you got the card for Yggdra's special attack, which immediately wins any fight. Including ones where the enemy is invincible! So naturally, you're going to think, "oh! I see, that's what's going on here! I'm supposed to use this special attack to break through!"

No. If you win anyway, they can't be reduced below 1 HP. You're actually supposed to lose a certain number of fights to move forward.

Yggdra Union is a game with some really cool ideas, but the execution of those ideas is often so, so dumb.

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."
I have an admittedly very dumb complaint that keeps me from playing Troubleshooter: no control over saves. I tried a mission, did something dumb, restarted, looked at Albus, and realized he still had EXP from the aborted attempt. Then I uninstalled the game.

Like, I see what they're doing, I appreciate the thought, but also, "NO THANK YOU" in giant ten foot tall letters made of fire. Having no control over when a game does and does not save feels very icky to me and I want no part of it. I have at least one other friend who echoes the complaint, so there's dozens of us! Dozens!

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."

nrook posted:

Is confusion any good in SaGa: Scarlet Grace? Every time I’ve landed it, it hasn’t been effective in stopping the enemy from attacking me. Indeed, it seems much worse than Sleep or Paralyze. Am I just getting unlucky?

IIRC (and it's been a while!), against enemies Confusion mostly turns off their AI, so they just kind of do things arbitrarily. So it has its uses against enemies focusing on support or enemies that focus fire, but it's not going to outright shut anyone down like other statuses can.

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."

GreenBuckanneer posted:

I got to the first combat in utawarumono, grinded the level a bit, started the next section and got bored, though I bought the entire collection. I'll come back to it one of these days

also I started up SRW30 and the confirm button is backwards on the steam deck, so I put out a layout within steam, hopefully that helps someone.

My suggestion every time Utawarerumono comes up is to skip the first game/Prelude and move straight on to the Mask games. More interesting plot-wise, more interesting character-wise, more interesting mechanically, nothing in the first game is necessary for the Mask games. The original Utawarerumono is a 6/10 or 7/10, and it's more likely to make you drop the series than to enhance your experience of the much better sequels.

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."
Remembering those "Denam plus AI" boss fights is a big part of why I went Rune Fencer with him immediately. Projectile spells made the one in 2L much, much easier.

I'm in chapter 3L, just before Almorica Again Again. The 3L Ganpp fight was the hardest boss fight so far by a lot, because there's no real option but assassinating him pronto and he's reluctant to come forward and get murdered unless he can hit someone. Did manage to take him down without an incap, but mostly by virtue of having two dragons to walk into the middle of the enemies to distract them long enough to gang up on him... And the Wildwood isn't accessible again until after that fight, and I only recruited them on a whim in the fight immediately before. ("Oh, hey, I need a Hydra for Deneb, right? There's one in this story fight! And I might as well grab another one while I'm here.") Those two dragons still got hit for about 2600 HP total before Ganpp went down, so anyone humanoid would have been very, very dead.

I haven't been too adventurous with my team, but everyone's at weapon level 19, so one more until my Familiar can start spamming the second Bow finisher with Meditate. This isn't One Vision and the status ailment won't be 100%, but even if it's only 25% that should be very useful.

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."

FirstAidKite posted:

I am trying to think of rpgs where there are legit good reasons for why characters don't tell each other stuff that might resolve conflicts faster.

Planescape Torment comes to mind. Phantom Brave as well.

I mean, you mentioned Stella Glow earlier, but I think it counts. :v: The main person not explaining things thinks the world is doomed for hundreds of years because the plan to save the person who can save it failed, then she discovers she was wrong right in time to make that person her enemy forever, so the world is extra doomed now. Also, she's hooked up to a magical despair rock, that person was her therapist, all her friends are dead, and the whole world hates her because of her desperate plan to keep the doomed world going a little longer.

I feel like every "not explaining things conflict" plot comes down to the potential explainer being in a really, really bad mental place, or else being somehow coerced by an evil person to not explain things. It's hard to make the second one interesting.

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Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."
Almost all of my favorite RPGs are SRPGs, because most conventional RPGs don't quite nail the gameplay-story balance. I am then immediately going to be a hypocrite and say my favorite RPG is Utawarerumono: Mask of Truth, which is at least 80% story by volume. Complete consistency is for cowards.

I've played like the first half hour of Monochrome Moebius, but I'm trying very hard to save it for the point where I'll start getting bogged down in the post-game of Tactics Ogre, because that always happens. Maybe this time I'll actually get through more than Coda 1.

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