Wii U Discussion - Yes, it has nice water - The Something Awful Forums

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Are you getting the Wii U? This poll is closed.
Yes	9031	65.25%
No	1191	8.60%
Maybe	808	5.84%
I'm an idiot	460	3.32%
Waluigi	1603	11.58%
Waa	748	5.40%
Total:	13841 votes

[Edit Poll (moderators only)]

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

Bland posted:

The complaining was sparked by claims from a developer that a "good portion" of the single player campaign of Rayman Legends would be controlling Murphy (pushing platforms and other rather mundane activities) whilst watching an AI Rayman do the platforming.

And it wasn't just a random developer, it was the lead game designer.

I'm relatively convinced that it is more than half of the game and not less than half of the game. Ubisoft revealed back at E3 that their reason for developing for Wii U was to have the ability to develop for smartphones/iPhone as well:

Yves Guillemot posted:

"The new content you can't port on the other machines but what you can do is port it to mobile phones and to tablets. So it's a way to create content that you will be able to port on the generations of tablets or phones that work well,�

Recently Ubisoft released a Rayman endless runner on the apple app store. I think Rayman Legends follows this design philosophy, of designing a game specifically around the tablet, so that it can be ported easily to other tablets and smartphones.

I'm not saying that this is a glorified mobile game, but it is designed so that a mobile version is easy to make. And if that's the case, then there's no way that the majority of the game is platforming. The majority of the game will be Murphy, I'm sure of it.

I could live with that if the co-op version of the game was online, but I'm pretty sure that Rayman Legends has no online co-op; only leaderboards for 'skill challenges'. Either way it's a legitimate let-down and no one is whining for what amounts to being tricked.

# ¿ Sep 16, 2012 17:40

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# ¿ May 13, 2024 22:01

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

2012 posted:

I don't have any data to back this up other than Square Enix's tech demo, FOX Engine, Watchdogs, and (hopefully) not needing to subsample games down to 1024 resolution to run at decent FPS, but, at this stage in graphics, the small details are EVERYTHING(volumetrics, physics, lighting/shadows). Wii-U will get eclipsed in those departments. BF3 is the tip of the iceberg.

Wii-U is cool on its own. You don't need to justify it.

I still don't get what's next gen about Watchdogs other than people assuming it was because of it being the One More Thing of Ubisoft's press conference. The game itself doesn't look next gen to me. Just prettier on PC, is all. Which is.. par for the course.

# ¿ Sep 16, 2012 21:59

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

My only concern with wii u specs is the lack of info on the CPU.

My other concern is that Microsoft will switch to a subsidy model which will let them put space age tech in their box if they wanted to. I still think such a model would prove ultimately unpopular with gamers, though.

# ¿ Sep 17, 2012 02:26

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

al-azad posted:

Crytek said they would like to see 8gb next console cycle. I definitely believe RAM is the most crippling factor in consoles but that's pretty overkill for a dedicated system.

No way. Most you'll see is maybe 3GB, but that's because Sony isnt afraid to sell a console at $600 with a smug look on their face.

But no matter how much GB there is, at least 1 is gonna end up dedicated to the OS for all of the consoles, if they plan on having completely integrated operating systems in everything you do. So the gap won't be large there.

# ¿ Sep 17, 2012 03:44

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

I wouldn't be surprised if you could switch from whatever game you're playing to a different game the same way you can on 3DS, as long as the current game is closed. Although with the amount of memory dedicated to the OS, you might be able to store the session iOS-style. I'll be interested to see just how deep their OS is.

The problem I have with Nintendo's digital strategy is that they've somehow strongarmed Gamestop into never discounting their digital codes, and I expect that to continue. I remember some people thought "oh we'll still be able to get this game cheap digitally because it'll be cheap at third-party retailers" but that doesn't seem to be the case.

# ¿ Sep 17, 2012 04:44

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

Louisgod posted:

I suppose my point is if you're looking at newer generation games running on UE4 and on Square's Fox Engine and similar engines, then you will see gimped ports on the WiiU

I don't know about that. Epic is scaling down UE4 to run on smartphones. Their posturing with Wii U is no different than when they said the next Xbox/PS weren't capable of running their engine -- of course that's not going to be true, but they're trying to make a play and convince Microsoft/Sony/Nintendo to increase the power of their boxes.

I think it's disingenuous to say that the Wii U is similar to current-gen tech; current-gen tech is six years old and the tech in the Wii U is not. The memory is not, the GPU is not, the CPU is not. Whether it can run with the other next-gen systems, we'll only know when the other systems are opened up.

95% of developers are still going to be using Unreal Engine and aren't going to have a COD budget, so the Wii U shouldn't present any real barrier. Wii U is also much friendlier to Japanese developers than the next Xbox will be, so Square-Enix will certainly scale their new engine to it.

# ¿ Sep 17, 2012 18:49

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

Marc Rein has already said UE4 can run on Wii U, like I said they are posturing and trying to squeeze these companies. They are going to try to put it on everything. Get those sweet royalties.

# ¿ Sep 17, 2012 18:57

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

It's a leverage thing. They also 'have no intention' of bringing UE4 to the other systems either, because there's no rush and maybe they can get what they want if they continue to sit on their hands. The official stance, in that same article is "beyond the PC, we haven't confirmed any other platforms for Unreal Engine 4."

# ¿ Sep 17, 2012 19:03

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

Louisgod posted:

This is the big point: The engine can run on the WiiU and other platforms, but at what sacrifice, and will developers choose it over UE3 even if it means they'll have to spend more on development costs? It's good to see that Epic was just blowing smoke up people's asses.

Well to be honest I still don't see what the big deal about UE4 is; some of the new stuff they showed in the tech demo looked like it had no practical application to gaming.

Typically new engines are more about helping developers work smarter and faster, so developers may still want to use it. I have no idea what the license cost will be for UE4 vs UE3.

But of course Epic will put UE4 on Wii U because of the royalties/license fees they collect. Seems to me like the kind of money you can make on engine licensing is fuckin' nuts.

e: on second thought that unintentional pun looked too intentional, I'm takin it out

# ¿ Sep 17, 2012 19:39

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

Astro7x posted:

What's with all the clamoring for 4K resolution consoles when we're barely getting 1080p games as it is?

We're not even getting that either on consoles. Aren't Xbox 360 games upscaled from 540p?

# ¿ Sep 19, 2012 18:34

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

Nintendo hasn't said that any of their games will have anything more than Miiverse integration, but maybe they'll surprise us with a Nintendo Direct to tell us about online support.

# ¿ Sep 20, 2012 00:39

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

The Wii U has the ability to do that, but it is opt-in rather than opt-out, according to Reggie Fils-Aime in a Kotaku interview. So not everyone will do it, but some developers WILL simply because it will meet the criteria of "game must use the gamepad somehow" and developers are lazy.

# ¿ Sep 20, 2012 00:45

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

Unity on Wii U means more eShop titles, so it can only be a good thing.

# ¿ Sep 20, 2012 01:38

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

Shelf Adventure posted:

I think it's really too early to say that retailers aren't discounting them. They probably won't, as first party Nintendo stuff usually doesn't get discounted anyway, but the first full retail game on the 3DS only appeared a month ago.

Gamestop carried vouchers for Kid Icarus, Excitebike, Pushmo, SML2, and some other 3DS eShop titles, for months.

They were never discounted.

# ¿ Sep 24, 2012 18:57

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

PaletteSwappedNinja posted:

Hmm...

+endorsed by war criminal
-local MP only

I can see the dilemma!

Where did you read that there would be local multi only?

# ¿ Sep 30, 2012 17:20

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

StepDadJeff posted:

Speaking of controllers, here's a great clip showing the gamepad going through a lag test:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gxIhZYjyBxc

It's a great clip except it reminds me that Rayman Origins is all AI-Rayman bullshit aaaggghhhhhhh why did I pre-order it. Gotta switch to NSMBU instead.

# ¿ Oct 3, 2012 06:11

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

I just wish the Murphy thing was an option. Why not a toggle to let the AI handle Murphy instead of Rayman?

But actually I don't like Murphy in general. For me the whole fun of Rayman Origins was that it was a precision platformer based on timing. If they're designing the game around intentional roadblocks, I can't imagine it's going to be anywhere near as tight or as fluid. Platforming with intentional roadblocks, for me, is bad design. It's 3D Sonic Game design.

# ¿ Oct 8, 2012 18:00

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

Like I said before, Ubisoft is in a cycle right now where they are all about making their games adaptable to tablets and mobile devices, so I always assumed the majority of the game would be Murphy dumbshit.

I'm just gonna get myself some of that Mario gaming comfort food instead.

# ¿ Oct 8, 2012 19:02

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

Almost Smart posted:

The Murphy levels sound like they're the only things that take advantage of the Wii U controller, so taking them out... would actually be pretty smart on Ubisoft's part. Then they could release the game on PS3, 360, PC and your microwave and make a hell of a lot more money than they would ever see with a Wii U exclusive.

They could port it now if they wanted to, 360's got that SmartGlass poo poo and PS3 plans to use the Vita for that.

# ¿ Oct 9, 2012 23:58

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

PaletteSwappedNinja posted:

Wii games support all the standard Wii controllers - Wii Remote/Nunchuk, Classic Controller, MotionPlus, Balnace Board, etc - but will not support the Wii U Gamepad or Wii U Pro controller.

The Wii Classic Controller needs to be plugged into a Wiimote to work, so you'll need both if you don't have them already.

Can this be sourced? We don't even know a single thing about the Wii U's OS yet. If what you said was true, Nintendo would have to make two separate Virtual Console stores so that future releases would work on the gamepad.

# ¿ Oct 12, 2012 05:04

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

thefncrow posted:

Nintendo's said outright that Wii games, WiiWare, and Wii VC stuff runs inside "Wii Mode", which doesn't allow for things like transferring the TV feed to the gamepad.

So are they discontinuing Virtual Console then? Or are they literally going to have two separate Virtual Console stores (one for Wii one for Wii U)?

Not that it would shock me that Nintendo would want people to rebuy everything. But Nintendo of America considers that kind of effort poisonous to them. If the way the eShop has been updated is any indication, the Wii U VC will end up only having 20 titles by the time the next Wii is released. They're loving lazy as poo poo.

The 7th Guest fucked around with this message at 22:01 on Oct 12, 2012

# ¿ Oct 12, 2012 21:58

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

All I'm saying is they'd better uh do a better job with Wii U VC than they've done with 3DS VC, because. Yikes.

# ¿ Oct 12, 2012 22:55

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

Supercar Gautier posted:

I won't kick up too much of a fuss over separate setups for Wii and Wii-U VC games as long as you automatically get the Wii-U version of a game once they release it.

We're talking about Nintendo, you're rebuying that poo poo.

# ¿ Oct 12, 2012 23:19

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

Of course you can transfer your Wii stuff. I'm just saying you won't get a Wii and Wii U version of the same VC title. They'll make you rebuy it if you want to play it on the Gamepad. Nintendo's gonna Nintendo.

# ¿ Oct 12, 2012 23:29

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

microwave casserole posted:

Are you basing this on stuff like Star Wars 1313, Unreal Engine 4, and the Final Fantasy demo? Or do you know ~secrets?~ This isn't supposed to be a trap or something dumb, I'm genuinely curious.

Man I don't know why I'm so picky but none of those demos made me think "this would be totally compromised if it had to be ported to current gen systems." They're certainly beautiful looking but you could turn the graphical settings down to get them on current gen systems and they would probably be identical from a gameplay standpoint. It's not like Dead Rising Wii, where it -never- had a chance because the Wii couldn't render that much poo poo onscreen at once and it was a dumb game to try and port. I think that the Wii U would be fine when the next systems come out. And if the Wii U is the clear sales leader when the other systems arrive then you'd think it would make sense for developers to port their games.

Maybe the Square tech demo does things that would be impossible to replicate, but... I wouldn't have a lot of confidence in a Square JRPG that had to be made at that fidelity... FF13 was already dogshit at HD fidelity, a next-gen FF would probably end up just being battles linked by cutscenes like Infinity Blade.

The 7th Guest fucked around with this message at 04:47 on Oct 13, 2012

# ¿ Oct 13, 2012 04:44

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

Atomicated posted:

While sure this is possible I really hope people aren't pre ordering the Wii U and expecting this outcome. When was the last time Nintendo pulled that off? The snes? The Wii U will be good but I fully expect to own it and at least one more console to be able to play third party games on.

I'm not convinced the next Xbox or Playstation will be here until sometime in 2014 so I think it's very plausible. We're talking a possible 16-20 month head start for the successor to one of the most financially successful consoles ever.

# ¿ Oct 13, 2012 16:33

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

Blackbelt Bobman posted:

What are you talking about? Did you play the ps3 version of it? It looked fantastic. And I don't know what that final bit about Infinity Blade has to do with anything

The amount of work involved in making a JRPG at that fidelity made FF13 ultimately terrible, limited, and super linear. Maybe another company would do a better job of it, but I don't trust Square. If they had to actually make a game that looked like their tech demo it would probably just end up being a string of battles connected by cutscenes like Infinity Blade. I'm not saying that's the case for every company, I'm saying that's the case for Square.

quote:

Regardless of how you feel about Final Fantasy XIII, you have to admit that it is a well made game with high production values.

No. I don't.

The 7th Guest fucked around with this message at 19:30 on Oct 13, 2012

# ¿ Oct 13, 2012 19:27

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

That's all sound. Ultimately, I was only trying to say that it's not a situation like Dead Rising which literally couldn't work on the original Wii. There should be plenty of multi-platform including the Wii U in this next generation, and the sales of Wii U ports will basically come down to whether the average console gamer notices the difference in presentation as much as us super nerds and PC gamers do, and whether that's a make or break factor in their purchase of the game.

I know that there used to be, years ago, the whole "HOW DOES (X) LOOK ON 360 VS. PS3" fad, but I don't know if that's still a thing or if that really matters to anyone other than people who like to post patriotic comments on a gaming website.

If I were to predict which system was going to struggle due to the other systems passing it by, I would not say Wii U-- rather, it would be one of Microsoft or Sony, because if they release within a small window of each other, people aren't going to buy both. So I think Wii U, if there aren't many obstacles to making a port to it, and it's got a step up over at least one of the other systems in sales, it should be okay, library-wise, for a couple of years at least.

The 7th Guest fucked around with this message at 19:48 on Oct 13, 2012

# ¿ Oct 13, 2012 19:43

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

I own a Vita and everything but I realize that Sony products at this point are trending towards the back of the line in sales.

It's possible that Wii U will get a small price cut around the time the other systems come out (if they come out in 2014), so you'd have Wii U Deluxe at $249, Microsoft maybe trying out their subsidized model and selling for $199 with a multi-year Xbox Live plan, and then what's Sony gonna do? Sell at $499-599 again? I wouldn't be surprised. But who's going to want to pay that this time around?

# ¿ Oct 13, 2012 19:51

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

Didn't Nintendo's in-house developers beg for the Wii U not to have achievements? I question whether exclusion of online play is a business decision or a "Nintendo has really stuck up eccentric people making their games" decision.

# ¿ Oct 18, 2012 16:10

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

The 3DS Mii software has "accomplishments" but retail 3DS software doesn't have any sort of unified achievement system. The Wii U will probably have something similar. No unified achievement system and entirely up to the developers.

Some quotes from Nintendo:

quote:

"When they create their games, [Nintendo's designers] don't tell you how to play their game in order to achieve some kind of mythical reward," Trinen said, explaining his view of why Nintendo's top creators have stayed off the Achievement bandwagon.

"Basically, the way the games are designed is they're designed for you to explore the game yourself and have this sense of discovery," he said. "To that end, I think that when you look specifically at games from EAD [the group long led by Mario and Donkey Kong creator Shigeru Miyamoto] and a lot of other games that Nintendo has developed a well, there are things you can do in the game that will result in some sort of reward or unexpected surprise. In my mind, that really encourages the sense of exploration rather than the sense of 'If I do that, I'm going to get some sort of artificial point or score that's going to make me feel better that I got this.' And that, to me, is I think more compelling."

Reggie Fils-Aime posted:

"Once you start getting into game-specific [Achievements] that's developer driven." Microsoft may require every game to have Achievements, but, Fils-Aime said, "That is not our philosophy."

I wouldn't be surprised if the Nintendo developers still don't see the point of online play and refuse to put it in their games because they just don't want to.

Nintendo sees what they're doing as giving the developers 'freedom' but I wonder if the developers are all that happy to have to handle online play, achievements, etc, completely on their own rather than having an existing infrastructure to plug into.

The 7th Guest fucked around with this message at 16:57 on Oct 18, 2012

# ¿ Oct 18, 2012 16:53

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

I feel they should have created a unified online infrastructure and achievement system, even if they themselves didn't want to partake in it. Make life easier for everyone instead of telling developers to bootstrap it. We keep talking this cycle where third parties and Nintendo can't seem to get along in each generation. Well at some point Nintendo has to actually work with them if they want to actually foster growth.

Also you'd be surprised about casual people and achievements, achievements are all over iPhone games now, and if a game doesn't have Game Center support it's generally considered a Bad Thing.

The 7th Guest fucked around with this message at 18:02 on Oct 18, 2012

# ¿ Oct 18, 2012 18:00

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

There must be some confusion with the voice chat thing. Would you need a headset for video chat???? Does anyone remember that goofy generic action figure trailer Nintendo did for Nintendo Direct where the guy was talking to his grandpa without a headset, both video chat and while he was playing the game?

Was that trailer just bullshit?

# ¿ Oct 18, 2012 22:20

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

I wish they'd talk about the Nintendo Network in general and not just Miiverse, but the way things are going it really sounds like there is no unified network infrastructure of any kind and all we're getting is a universal friends list and eShop.

# ¿ Oct 27, 2012 23:07

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

Be more specific. Nintendo of Japan put a shitload of content on VC for Wii. It's Nintendo of America who has utter contempt for their customers in terms of digital offerings.

# ¿ Oct 28, 2012 00:59

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

I played Rayman Legends. The game is beautiful, but I hope that the demo level is just an intentional bait-and-switch to show off all the features. If I have to switch from Rayman to Murphy in the middle of levels it's gonna fuckin irritate the poo poo out of me.

It seems like the game is mostly designed to be a co-op experience... except that there's been no indication that the co-op campaign is supported online. why do you do this game companies, why

:negative:

(for the record the only confirmed online content in Rayman Legends is "Players can connect online with friends for a variety of challenges that test their skill and speed, and can see where they rank on the worldwide leaderboards." which sounds like side content or minigames)

e: Also I got a look at NSMBU and the game looks pretty darn crisp and colorful in HD. No playable demo though :I

The 7th Guest fucked around with this message at 17:19 on Oct 28, 2012

# ¿ Oct 28, 2012 17:01

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

horriblePencilist posted:

Didn't they say way back when they announced the Wii U that there'd be cross-game voicechat?
I'd assume that if they'd did that anywhere, it'd be in Miiverse.

Ehhh but aren't there Wii U games that don't support voice-chat? I think they left it, like everything else, up to the developers (who don't WANT everything left up to them).

# ¿ Oct 28, 2012 23:33

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

CrushedB posted:

Behold the first console F-Zero game since GX:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SvdxIL3HfXo

A cross between F-Zero and Sonic 2006.

# ¿ Oct 29, 2012 18:58

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

That sounds like a day 1 nightmare. People stuck without being able to update their console because the servers are getting hammered.

# ¿ Nov 7, 2012 07:36

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# ¿ May 13, 2024 22:01

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

It does seem like this game is much more focused on a high-quality single player campaign.

I mean Rayman Legends is beautiful and all but it seems designed around co-op and AFAIK it doesn't have online co-op. NSMBU doesn't seem to have it either but at least it's not designed around it?

I gotta imagine we would have heard today that NSMBU DID have online play if it had any. I think it's safe to assume that it doesn't.

# ¿ Nov 7, 2012 18:00

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