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Grand Fromage posted:I don't know the name but there is definitely a mod to make agriculture always have demand. I think SPAM does it, if you want a whole farming overhaul thing. SPAM does do that... unless you're also running CAM, and you've applied the CAM workforce fix. This seems to override SPAM's demand change. *sigh* Oh well, at least I get really pretty farms for the 20 minutes the game wants me to build them.
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Jan 4, 2015 23:17
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Tai posted:gently caress those cheat mods or typing in codes. Here is what I use as I like making cities rather then dealing with money any more. Bored with budget management. Better solution: add the extra cheats.dll file to your plugins folder (it won't work in a subfolder, so put it right in "Documents\Simcity 4\Plugins"). Hit ctl-X, type "Moolah " followed by literally any number less than a trillion. BOOM, you now have that much money. Much easier that using weaknesspays over and over again, and doesn't require babysitting an in-game money factory.
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Jan 14, 2015 09:26
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The worst dependencies are the ones that get in your loving way after you've installed them. A semi-complete list of the garbage cluttering up my menus that I can't remove due to them being dependencies of some lot or other:
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Jan 14, 2015 18:54
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Shibawanko posted:So I take it Cities XXL will be another big disappointment? Probably. There's no mention of them fixing the original Cities XL's terrible memory leak problem (which lead to the game barfing as soon as towns got bigger than 100,000 or so), no mention that it can actually use multi-core CPUs, and no mention of it being 64-bit. If they had fixed these problems, they'd be trumpeting them from the rooftop, because loving nobody's made a 64-bit city sim and the original memory leak problem singlehandedly prevented what's actually a pretty good city sim from ever becoming popular.
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Jan 15, 2015 22:11
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I like how everybody's all "Have a defined downtown. Separate areas with trees. Use ploppables to enhance realism. Base your region off real geography." Then there's me: 
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Jan 21, 2015 23:21
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Poizen Jam posted:Ugh who made these stupid 1 tile high rises for medium density residential? They're ruining my row houses and making my downtowns look like poo poo, and they're pretty unrealistic to boot. 10-15 story 16x16m buildings? Really? Do not play the realism card unless you're prepared for what may come: Pencil Towers posted:these towers in Hong Kong are so incredibly slender that it is hard to imagine that given the space required for vertical transport, that there is any space left for anything else. A total livable space of 50 square meters or less per floor is not uncommon.  16x16 meters is 256 square meters per floor — actually bigger than real pencil towers. SC4's pencil tower mods are all made by Bixel, a weeaboo in love with Hong Kong.
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Jan 21, 2015 23:34
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New city map for my bizarre and nonsensical region:
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Jan 22, 2015 10:22
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Poizen Jam posted:I really want a version of SimCity 4 with an updated UI and most of these 'essential' mod functionalities built in in a more intuitive way (instead of the awful workarounds and the tabbing system). It's a real shame that the SC4 community never made any open source clones. It's been done before; Transport Tycoon spawned two huge communities — OpenTTD and Simutrans — based on different open source clones of the game. (And if you think the Simtropolis forums are spectacularly nerdy, they don't even approach Simutrans' level of  .) Instead, the SimCity 4 community locked itself into fractured dependency hells driven by pettiness and self-importance. The "big project" everyone speaks of is NAM, but the only earthshaking changes it makes are the improved traffic simulator and RHW. Everything else is cosmetic bullshit absorbed from various other teams. (And it *is* bullshit. The project to create single-track rail is trashbag pedantry of the lowest order, but it's still been folded into the NAM portfolio.) Tragically, the game that most needs an open-source clone doesn't have a community possessing the will, or even the vision, to make one.
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Jan 24, 2015 14:43
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Tai posted:I would of bought the game if EA had just smoothed terrain, added something similar to NAM, bigger radius of civics and had curves in like that guy is making in his indie city builder. In EA's defense, the Citybound programmer can make those curves because his game isn't a grid-based city simulator. Switching to a non-grid system is a big deal, and would require overhauling quite a lot. So much of SimCity 4's mechanics and interface revolves around a grid-based system, and changing that would be a poo poo-ton of work. Keep in mind, at the time it debuted, the Rush Hour expansion was essentially a $20 bug fix pack. Now imagine how expensive an "expansion" pack that completely overhauled many of the core game mechanics would be. It'd be a full-blown $60 sequel at that point. What you're asking for is quite a bit more than a game patch.
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Jan 25, 2015 02:46
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Tusen Takk posted:Trains are loads of fun to play with I get impatient and go too fast, derailing them. The best part about cars is driving them onto tracks and watching them derail trains. The commuter train is but paper mache against my solid-rock Mayor's Mercedes.
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Jan 25, 2015 03:34
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SimCity 4 reads DAT files in order, with duplicate material "overwriting" any previous bits. This is how mods that tweak the default in-game civic buildings work; rather than having both available for use, the mod file is read after the original file and thus overwrites it. SimCity 4 reads subfolders within the plugins folder alphabetically, and in turn reads the files inside those subfolders alphabetically. If you have duplicate mods, whichever mod file is read last overwrites the previous one. The game isn't thrown off by having two of the same thing, because as far as its concerned, only the last one it read exists, and the previous, duplicate file(s) is an empty, useless file that's wasting its time. Even if duplicate mods wind up both being listed in the game menus (because SimCity 4 is still buggy as poo poo), as far as the game is concerned, it's the same item, it just happens to appear twice in a menu. You can even build "both" of them, remove one from from your mods folder, and both buildings will continue working fine. Because, again, as far as the game is concerned, they're literally the same.
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Jan 26, 2015 04:40
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Imapanda posted:If that's the case then why do some of my residential areas whine about a long commute time that's only a mile (and city-change) away? You would think that on a 10x10 large tiled region would be roughly about 20something miles in distance across, right? My sims shouldn't be complaining and I shouldn't be suffering crippling vacancies all over because of the long distances, at least realistically. I suspect there is something terribly broken with SC4's traffic simulator that even the NAM crew don't know how to fix. It's the only explanation for why I still get "commute too long" abandonment even after setting the max commute time to a full 24 hours.
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Jan 28, 2015 13:38
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Poizen Jam posted:What's up with the prohibition on collections of mods/packs on places like Simtropolis, and the ridiculous dependence hell it causes? Is it a modder ego issue? It's partly a relic of the very early days of SimCity 4 (e.g 2005 and earlier), when there was no cheap file hosting for files larger than 10MB or so. Modders had to split up their mods, and SC4's modding format encouraged separating out dependencies (as opposed to the "Download parts 1 through 7 of my mod" approach). These days it's a toxic mix of cultural inertia and pure ego. Every modder is incredibly possessive of their lovely texture/prop packs, and doesn't want "credit" being stolen from them. And that's why the CAM team refuses to support pre-packaged CAM collections :-(
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Jan 28, 2015 21:56
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Are there any good ones? The mass transit automata options are a bit overwhelming, so I've just stuck with Andreas Roth's BART bus/train/el-train/monorail set. (If nothing else, the set gives a consistent look to my city's transit.)
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Jan 29, 2015 07:49
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Holy crap, thanks! Edit: I should not be this excited to see an Amtrak automata. Curvature of Earth fucked around with this message at 09:09 on Jan 29, 2015 |
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Jan 29, 2015 08:18
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I really wish there was a central transit megastation capable of handling a quarter million people. I'm getting tired of trying to build elaborate setups connecting my commuter rail, el-rail, buses, and subways together.
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Jan 29, 2015 22:50
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Poizen Jam posted:There are plenty of lots combining multiple different forms of transportation though. Most of them are small-ish however, or part of the RTMP pack. Something like that. It's two separate lots, but I managed to approximate a central transit station:  The lower building is Yokohama Station, for commuter rail. The upper building is Shibuya Station, for el-rail and subway. Still no love for buses  Update: Both buildings are also bus stops, even though their descriptions make no mention of it.For the record, while I like the look of it, Shibuya Station is bizarre:  I don't care if it's based on a real station, four rail lines on one side (how do you even fit four el-train lines in a city dense enough to need four of them?) plus two lines and a weird perpendicular one coming out the other end is silly and hard to work with. Curvature of Earth fucked around with this message at 02:52 on Feb 4, 2015 |
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Jan 30, 2015 02:01
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kinnas posted:It has all been worth it. My screenshot painting game is perfect now. It almost looks like an oldschool isometric RPG and that's exactly how I want it. We're all going to die sad and alone.
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Jan 31, 2015 23:25
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 Congrats for caring about 9/11 with your imaginary train station? 
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Feb 2, 2015 10:15
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kinnas posted:I'm not sure. They use HD assets which might mean hardware only? Maybe someone who knows the engine quirks better can confirm or deny. HD mods requires hardware mode unless you want graphical glitches when the game tries to display them. That's why some modders provide an "SD" version of their work so software mode people can still use them.
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Feb 2, 2015 18:22
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Crosscontaminant posted:I'm trying to be minimalistic with my choice of mods and stick to things which fix bugs, but NAM is thwarting that. The compulsory texture mods which I don't really want are bad enough, but they can't even just provide one simulator - instead there's five or six with fussy distinctions between them. Fun fact: you can use a zip file extractor to open NAM's .exe installation file. In there you will find a file called "TSCT_Setup.exe". That's the traffic simulator installer, which is the only truly necessary part of NAM. Everything else is cosmetic changes and endlessly frustrating alternative transit networks. Pick "Ultra" settings for the traffic simulator, which are generous enough that you shouldn't have to worry about saturating your roads or rail. You can also use this method to change what NAM stuff you have, because the alternative is reinstalling the whole thing each time you want to opt out/in of a particular add-on. I mention this because the NAM team's advice for if you want to change something is to go through the entire reinstallation process again. This is because the NAM team HATES their users and I want to strangle every one of them.
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Feb 2, 2015 21:41
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Nition posted:Pick "Ultra" if you're a dirty cheater. Pick Medium or Low if you want a realistic traffic simulation. Ultra drastically underestimates the real-world capacity of transit networks. I was unhappy with how quickly rail lines were saturated in-game, and did a lot of research. Feel free to skip if you don't care for transit nerdery: The New York City Subway's R160 car has a standing passenger capacity of 202 people. Assume trains are 8 cars long (typical for New York City, though San Francisco manages 10 per train), meaning each train can carry a maximum of 1616 people. If trains maintain two-minute headways (some Japanese trains manage only 1.5 minute headways, but that's considered exceptional), and stay at each stop for three minutes, that means each tile will have had 12 trains pass through it per hour. Multiply out for the whole 24-hour day, then double it because SC4 subway tiles have two rail lines, not one, and a subway tile has a capacity of over 930,000 per day. I applied these same numbers to other rail networks. I actually raised it Of course, station capacities need to be increased as well. Assuming a small-but-consistently-busy station has only 30 people get on/off for each train that passes through, that's a 8,640-person daily capacity. That's like rock bottom. A substantially busy typical three-tile wide station should be able to handle north of 25,000 per day. Yet, I still see train stations with 6,000-person capacities... And that doesn't even touch multi-line stations huge enough to handle entire trains of people getting off at once. They should have capacities of over 1 million, easily. Highways, on the other hand, are comparatively pitiful. I'll spare you the numbers, but my source is this research. In America, passengers per private car during work commutes averages out to 1.2 people per car. So, multiplying it out, we get 60,480 passengers per tile of highway. (Please note: per tile, not per chunk. The highway builds in two-tile-wide chunks, but the traffic simulator only calculates on the basis of per tile.) For the record: Ultra settings may not go high enough, but you still can change the traffic simulator properties to match using iLive Reader. You can also change network speeds, which I did, because the monorail/high-speed rail's speed was pitiful and even commuter rail can hit speeds of 200 km/hr before being classified as high-speed. Curvature of Earth fucked around with this message at 11:14 on Feb 3, 2015 |
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Feb 3, 2015 04:50
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Tusen Takk posted:I only felt like I was cheating when I made a city with 1.6mil people in it and it was skyscrapers everywhere, but then I looked into it and apparently there are around that many people in whatever amount of kms a large city tile takes up in NYC so I don't worry too much about realism. I nerded out over the transit networks because I enjoy it, but I don't value realism for it's own sake. The scale of the game is just too out of whack. For example, my old high school is the equivalent of 11 SC4 tiles across. And it only held 1200 students! The middle school next door was a similar size. My tiny community college is the equivalent of 34 x 34 tiles! Imagine if every school in the game was that big. And light rail stations have a typical size range (PDF alert, only worth it if you're a transit nerd) of up to 400ft — that's 8 tiles long! Every station I've seen from modders tops out at 6 tiles. Heavy rail stations are even longer. And do not talk to me about the hospital system. I've noticed that SC4 cities can have up to 10% of their population in hospitals at a time. Think about that in real life. My home town has about 50,000 people, all served by one general hospital. If 5,000 people showed up at the hospital tomorrow, it would mean that the worst public health disaster in my town's history had just happened. There's no way it could handle that volume of people. My point is that you shouldn't prize realism for its own sake. If you want to painstakingly recreate the exact look and feel of a certain kind of neighborhood, do so. Games are for having fun, so have fun however you want. But the game mechanics are broken and don't reflect realism in the slightest. All SimCity 4 realists are forced to make arbitrary compromises by the game, so I've learned not to focus on realism much. (By the way, @Tusen Takk, I am working on instructions for editing the traffic simulator.)
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Feb 3, 2015 09:28
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Tusen Takk posted:Also, how did you edit the train speeds? I want my Shinkansen to go 300km/h dammit Alright, let's learn how to edit the NAM traffic simulator!  First, open iLive Reader. (It's Windows-only, but it's the only editor I know of that can open the simulator file properly. If you're running Mac or Linux and still want a customized simulator, I'm willing to either share my own edited simulator file or make one customized to your tastes. Either should work fine if you have NAM installed.) If this is your first time opening iLive Reader, you have my pity because it's a real pain.  Click the open file button at the top left:  Navigate to the Network Addon Mod folder in your SimCity 4 Plugins directory. Select the file that starts with "NetworkAddonMod_Traffic_Plugin_Z_":  The last two words in the file name are different depending on your existing traffic simulator settings, but it doesn't matter. You should get something like this (emphasis on "something" because I don't remember how lovely iLive Reader's default settings are):  Select the first item listed in the left sidebar:  Now double-click on the variable you want to change. For this example, we're going to change the max speed of the monorail:   Now, the "Max speed" settings, "Network Traffic Capacity" settings, and "Monthly cost for network tile" settings all contain a list of 13 variables. They represent, in this order: 1. roads 2. rail 3. elevated highways 4. streets 5. [placeholder for nonexistent network] 6. [placeholder for nonexistent network] 7. avenue 8. subway 9. elevated rail & light rail 10. monorail & high-speed rail 11. one-way roads 12. dirt roads (the Real Highway mod piggybacks off this network, so set it to match the highway variables) 13. ground highways The description at the bottom of iLive Reader's window is incorrect for some of these settings, so ignore it. The above list is their actual order. Because monorail trains obviously only run on the monorail network, we leave the other variables at zero and select the 10th. All speed values are in kilometers per hour, so if you're used to thinking in miles per hour, find an online metric converter. Select the relevant variable:  And type in the value you want:  Now that it has the number we want, click the "Apply" button twice (once to remove the cursor from the text box, the second to actually apply your changes). And we're finished!  Now CLICK THE SAVE BUTTON OR ALL YOUR CHANGES WILL BE LOST.  Changing the other networks' speeds isn't any harder. Again, always in km/hr. Because cars, buses, and trucks are capable of running on all road-based networks, enter values for them in variables #1, 3, 4, 7, 11, 12, and 13 based on whatever speed you think is appropriate for those respective networks. (I don't know what happens if you accidentally tell a bus to run at 100km/hr on subways. It could crash the game, or you could've discovered an amusing hack.) IMPORTANT NOTES: Once you've edited the simulator using an external editor like iLive Reader, trying to change settings using NAM's provided Traffic Simulation Configuration Tool will undo ALL your changes. The NAM Configuration Tool hates you — it won't even report the correct numbers if you set them really high. The in-game Traffic Volume Data View doesn't like capacity values above 65,535 and will automatically highlight networks with a capacity above that in bright "over-capacity" red. That's a quirk of the user interface, but the game itself doesn't care and your city will continue functioning normally. Interestingly, the Traffic Congestion view will accurately account for any number you put in the simulator and you can continue relying on it. Do not change the "Max speed by Network for walking" settings. Yes, 15km/hr is bicycling speed and definitely not walking speed by any metric. However, if you reduce it, your citizens will refuse to do basic poo poo like walk to a bus stop 8 tiles away, and your city will die. Finally, if you don't want to research "realistic" traffic capacities yourself, here are my settings, based off my own research into real-world highway and rail capacities. I treat lower-tier networks like roads and avenues as appropriately reduced versions of full-blown highways. My Network Traffic Capacity settings (people per tile per day) 1. roads: 30240 2. rail: 936000 3. highways: 60480 4. streets: 15120 5. [placeholder for nonexistent network]: 0 6. [placeholder for nonexistent network]: 0 7. avenue: 40320 8. subway: 1152000 9. elevated rail & light rail: 432000 10. monorail & high-speed rail: 432000 11. one-way roads: 45360 12. dirt roads: 60480 13. ground highway: 60480 Curvature of Earth fucked around with this message at 11:59 on Feb 27, 2015 |
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Feb 3, 2015 14:17
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Baby Cakes posted:Sorry I've been lurking in this thread and as a resident of NYC, this made me chuckle. Oh, I know. The real world ain't perfect. Like, the maximum speeds I set trains in the traffic simulator to would never be achieved in real life — constant station stops means they don't even have time to hit that speed. The NYC subways manage 25-45mph in practice, even though some of their cars were theoretically capable of almost 90mph. But anyways, that's why it's maximum capacity. It's the highest possible daily throughput an in-game tile of subway is capable of handling. Edit: poo poo. I've become the Simtropolis people.
Curvature of Earth fucked around with this message at 20:20 on Feb 3, 2015 |
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Feb 3, 2015 20:17
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Poizen Jam posted:I installed the CDK pack manually a little over a year ago, and prop-pox related to that set dates back to 2009/2010. So either PEG never bothered to update them, never bothered to take them down, or just never bothered to put up a warning. Pegasus is a true SimCity modder, in that he belittles others and denies any problem: "Pegasus in denial" posted:This individual also claims that the PEG BDK (Beach Development Kit) is the source of the pox... We here, however, are not inclined to change anything unless actual players come forth and report that they are indeed having issues with the identified lots and dependencies.
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Feb 3, 2015 21:30
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Poizen Jam posted:Here's hoping Cities XXL is more passable than it's predecessors, else I'm waiting for Citybound.
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Feb 3, 2015 22:28
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Tusen Takk posted:Speaking of Simtropolis, did anyone see this?
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Feb 4, 2015 12:40
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So to be helpful, I thought I'd try editing a DAT file to force agricultural demand even in big, developed cities, so I could share how to do it here. I figured it couldn't be that hard — just edit an existing lot so it raises the agricultural cap and creates demand for that agriculture, right? loving nope. Agricultural demand stays negative. There's a deeper problem here, and I don't know how to fix it. Opening up SPAM's core DAT files isn't helpful, because there's a poo poo ton of settings and properties spread over a dozen exemplars, and I have no idea which one actually determines agricultural demand. (I thought SPAM was already supposed to scale agricultural demand with education and presumably population just fine. I also assumed that, like most mods, if you can get it to load last it'll overwrite other mods, like CAM. Apparently not. Once I merged CAM with the main SimCity DAT so the jobs bug went away, SPAM's improved demand settings stopped working. Now agricultural demand drops to zero after a city gets too big and too educated.) On a side note, I did discover that if you add a property to a lot that a normal in-game building isn't supposed to have (e.g., anything more complicated than "raise cap and create jobs"), SC4 takes one look at it, decides it's no longer really a building, and removes it from all in-game menus. It's weird, and I freaked out the first time it happened (I was just trying to use this building to fix agricultural demand why the hell can't I find it in it's usual menu?!). On the other hand, I may have accidentally figured out a way to stop dependencies from cluttering up your menus. (It wouldn't be practical, because I'd have to add a token non-building property to every bothersome lot, but it may be possible.)
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Feb 5, 2015 14:44
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I apologize. I was apparently very wrong with my previous posts about agriculture. SPAM works fine under CAM, even with the CAM jobs fix applied. I ran a test city to confirm this. It has a current population of ~334,000 with an EQ of 190 and life expectancy of 75ish years. In short, it's big, educated, and healthy. Agricultural demand is holding steady at ~13,000. There is one slight glitch. My current I-R cap is over 120,000, but the census repository reports I'm at 100% of my cap, despite my city only containing ~68,000 farming jobs. Despite supposedly being at 100% of my farming cap, if I zone for new farms, my city grows new farms. It appears the key to keeping farm demand up in a big city is to actually build farms. If you jump straight to medium-density industrial, farm demand soon drops to zero and never comes back. But if you actually build farms, you can grow your city as much as you want and keep farms growing. (As far as I can tell, other industry doesn't counteract this. My test city has a couple dozen tiles of hi-tech industry, so farming demand doesn't appear to be affected by more advanced industry.) I still have no idea which lot properties actually raise the I-R cap. I edited the census vault before starting my city, boosting its I-R cap release from 30,000 to 100,000. But, the game refuses to acknowledge this and only gives me the original 30,000 cap boost with each vault I lay down. 
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Feb 7, 2015 13:58
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Do any of these city journals actually feature viable cities? Because my experience with even the biggest swathes of suburbia is that they barely break even — and that's after I set the equivalent of a $30 gas tax on road usage (it's in the NAM settings). If you remove that, then even providing only power and water, and letting your citizens stay stupid and die young, there's no way in hell any of the more rural cities are actually making money. (Unless of course, I'm the fool for thinking this is SimCity 4 and not ScreenCapture 4?)
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Feb 10, 2015 22:41
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I'm getting this weird problem where taxis are replacing most of my automata. My bus stations spawn the ugly default Maxis blue taxis. My waste-to-energy plant has taxis driving up to it instead of garbage trucks. There are still a few buses and garbage trucks appearing, but for the most part they've been replaced somehow. It's driving me nuts and I have no idea how to fix it.
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Feb 13, 2015 14:57
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Tusen Takk posted:I installed the JRJ Streetmod with the JRJ sidewalk mod and it looks really, really good in my small town You: Look at my adorable town. Me:  Pack em' in like sardines I'm almost at 4 million! 
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Feb 15, 2015 23:21
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Tusen Takk posted:
I cheat: I edited the Air Purifier into a cap buster. It boosts all residential, commercial, and industrial caps (except agricultural, due to some complicated SC4 nonsense I could never work out) by 1 million for each one I plop. I don't like RTMT either. They're a pain in the rear end to bulldoze; they don't show up in the zone view, so I have to destroy every building surrounding them just to get to them. I prefer regular rail because it means my commuter transit and rapid transit are one giant network. I briefly tried splitting commuter/rapid transit between regular rail and elevated rail, but I got real tired of having two separate transit networks that couldn't directly interact with each other. I could use subways for everything, but I like seeing the automata, plus subways can't tunnel up steep slopes like regular rail can. My rail layout:  There are still avenues criss-crossing the city:  The rail network divides the city into small "cells", ensuring that sims actually use them and don't complain about long commute times. (Ignore the over-capacity red. I've mentioned this before, but SC4's data views can't display traffic capacity values over 65,535 properly. Each line you see can actually carry 900,000+ people.)
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Feb 16, 2015 00:06
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kinnas posted:People seem to be under the misconception that it's a game about making numbes go bigger and not a picture painting application Other truths: cheetah speed at all times is the only way to play the game.
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Feb 26, 2015 12:58
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Brotato Broth posted:pedestrians didn't seem to be too hot on getting to the station on foot unless it was right next to a road. Isn't that how all transit stations work?
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Feb 27, 2015 23:44
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It's been pretty quiet on this thread. I assume everyone is busy playing Cities: Skylines.
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Mar 14, 2015 13:13
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