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High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."
I'm 6'5". I commute to an office job in an F-150 and happily burn fuel at 14mpg. Sometimes it's less about "bad with money" and more about "good with legroom."

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High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."

Not a Children posted:

Kids are being sold the "do whatever you want and everything will work out" dream at probably the most important crossroads of their life to date. It was tenable when college cost under $1000 a semester, but at $20,000 a year or more, there should be more thought involved. There's a lot of blame to go around, from myopic students to greedy banks, but at the end of the day it's just the old capitalist story of some people chasing dreams and others chasing money.

Oh let's not just blame the capitalists. Well-intended politicians did plenty to cause this mess by not understanding the basic economics of what happens when you make an unlimited pool of money available to pay for something via federal guarantees and regulations.

Colleges can hardy be blamed for jacking up tuition to get their slice of that juicy pie, nor can banks for doing what banks exist to do. And why offer a quality education relevant to tomorrow's needed skills when you can lure chumps in to take courses that cost almost nothing to teach (women's studies, Klingon, cinema) and charge anything you want?

The moral: Always be wary when politicians try to make something affordable for everyone. The laws of economics can only be avoided for a short time before, like gravity, they bring everything crashing back down.

See also: housing bubble.

Coming soon: healthcare!

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."

Radbot posted:

How about more Bad With Money and less My Ideological Take on Macroeconomics?

Understanding how policy can have an enormous impact on your life and being good with money go hand in hand.

So do blaming greedy banks while driving a shitbox Corolla your whole life because you made ill-informed decisions.

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."
College football really ought to be NFL minor leagues instead.

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."
I'll probably be skewered here for this, but my church does an incredible amount of good with its budget. We fund shelters, a place for disadvantaged children in the city, and other very good things. Yes, those who are helped know who's providing it, but we're not beating them over the head with bibles.

The overhead for the building and modest salaries for the few employees are a small portion of where the money goes. I'm certainly happy to fork over a few hundred a month. I'm under no illusion that doing so will save my soul, but I know it makes me a better person than I would otherwise be.

Of course, my cars are paid off and I max out my 401k first.

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."
Government isn't just bad with money, it's bad with other people's money, a far worse sin.

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."
[quote="Cockmaster" post="444792226"]
And letting the SNAP peak budget become the new normal still would've left us pretty far behind the curve in terms of how well we take care of the less fortunate.
[/]

There is a tremendous economic cost to incentivizing people to not work. Stop pretending welfare payments flourish in a vacuum. When we spend tax dollars, we really spend the value generated by productive people.

That opportunity cost is rarely discussed in the left-wing bowels of the Internet, but a compelling case can be made that entitlement spending is wasteful beyond just corruption, rent-seeking, and bureaucratic waste. It can also be a crippling counter-incentive that can prevent otherwise productive value creators from reaching their potential and contributing instead of suckling the government teat,

Now here comes the part where the rabid leftists insinuate that my suggestion that excessive entitlement spending can be counterproductive means I want to throw the poors in a wood chipper on HBO Live.

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."

Ornamented Death posted:

Verizon just trumped every story that has or ever will be posted in this thread. They are buying AOL for $4.4 billion.

This is excellent with money. They just bought access to a bunch of Pepsi-drinking, QVC-shopping Luddites who pay a goodly sum of money to check their email once a week.

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."
People who loudly avoid Wal-Mart do so mostly to feel superior to others.

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."
Not squatting in an abandoned foreclosure is bad with money.

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."

Sephiroth_IRA posted:

Yeah, a lot of different people are gonna eventually lose their jobs but I think drivers will probably be t
It's gonna be funny as hell watching "Americas backbone" slowly turn leftist.

By "turn leftist," I take it you mean "inadvertently drive up costs and render businesses uncompetitive by fighting to inflate wages and preserve jobs that technology and globalization have rendered economically unviable."

Can't wait. Should be exciting television when the whole country consists of walled islands of affluence patrolled by terminator robots protecting the Good with Money crowd from uneducated, obsolete meatbags.

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."

BarbarianElephant posted:

I heard a theory once that the UK had so many great rock bands in the '60s and '70s because the welfare state was so generous you could basically start up a band and get the dole until it took off (if it ever took off.) Most bands were no-hopers but some made it huge, which continued paying off for the country for years. This is also one of the reason why Scandinavia is punching above its weight in business and the creative industries; people aren't afraid to take risks, because a generous government will pick up the pieces if they fail.

It's a hard sell to taxpayers, though. "Let's fund a load of idiots pissing around pretending to be authors/musicians/entrepreneurs/actors with your cash earned as a wage slave, because one day a small percentage of them will make it big."

Any time someone talks about "free" anything, I immediately dismiss them as bad with economics.

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."
Well, just like diets, it's common sense that almost no one follows. Some of the best advice I've ever received was "pay yourself first," meaning save a portion of your income before you buy anything. Then only spend what's left. Never had a budget, have a seven figure net worth anyway.

(That's not a humblebrag, I look down upon you Corolla-driving peasants with no humility whatsoever.)

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."
Why the gently caress do you want to hurry up and get on the plane? Your seat is reserved, and you're going to be trapped in it. I run down the jetway when I hear the door closing.

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."

Subjunctive posted:

Room for carry-on, sitting down and reading my Kindle vs standing in line. Plus the sense of superiority.

Under the seat in front of you, the airport lounge until final boarding, and if sitting in a slightly larger seat makes you feel superior, you aren't.

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."
Fidelity Amex is the best I've found. 2% unlimited cash back on everything. No fees.

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."
We have both a Fidelity Amex and Visa, both set to deposit 100%of the rebates into my children's 529 accounts. Amex gives 2% and Visa gives 1.5%, so we only use the Visa at places that don't take Amex. We put absolutely everything we can on the credit cards and pay them off in full each month, with autopay drawing from checking on the due date. It's free money for my kids and a month of float for me, not that that matters at current interest rates. I also like having everything I buy on 1-2 electronic statements that I can compile in Excel.

And whoever said they cut the rebate to 1% if you pull it out of Fidelity accounts is full of poo poo. Yes, you need a brokerage account, but once it hits, it's cash like any other.

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."
I'm mixed on 529's. My kids are under 4, and I doubt education in 15 years will look like it does today. I think we're on the edge of a bubble where people will soon realize that there are vastly more efficient ways to educate than to park 50 bored teenagers in a classroom in front of a live instructor, then bill them $40k and build a new fitness center.

But I don't want money to be a barrier either, so my goal is $250k per 529 when they turn 18. If they don't need it all, no biggie, I guess.

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."

BarbarianElephant posted:

Are the child-free allowed to opt out of the tax entirely?

That's a great idea if I can opt out of subsidizing Obamacare for smokers and obese people.

You can't have it both ways, see?

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."
If only we had a strong education system instead of simply an expensive one...

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."

Jack2142 posted:

Hunt the rich the revolution will not be civilized.

Nor will the aftermath, when the economic illiterates suckered by envy-based politics realize that rich people got rich by building the safe, comfortable civilization they took for granted out of an overinflated sense of entitlement.

You'll be cold, starved, and bored, but everyone else will be too. I guess that's "fair."

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."
Frothing leftist goons: Bad with accepting anything that conflicts with what their crazy freshman sociology professors told them.

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."
I'm not sure what's worse, that some idiot's best attempt to rebut a post they disagreed with was to dig through my previous posts and find one where I said I own a truck, or the fact that you're all still talking about how dumb tall people are for owning trucks instead of shitbox Corollas two days later.

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."
If Mint could ever manage to log into all my accounts without making GBS threads the bed, stop randomly making my transfers seem like income one month, then payments the next, and generally just work right, I would love it. As it is, it's just the place where I keep all my info so hackers can steal my whole identity in one convenient place.

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."
Automation will undoubtedly eliminate tons of jobs, but they're the jobs that are barely worthy of a human brain. At some point, humanoid machines will have enough battery capacity and processing power to run all day and interact with the world around them.

At that point, the only real question is: What will we do with all the useless people? Once I can buy a machine that can mow my lawn, wash my dishes, and grill a steak, and once food production, manufacturing, and transportation are mostly automated, people who aren't capable of doing things robots can't (practical application of abstract thought, judgement, and creativity) will be economically obsolete.

One optimistic theory is that the robots produce enough value to keep them fat, dumb, and happy in their meatbag ghettos.

Another theory is that the ignorant masses will grow discontent with the inevitable income disparity, and we'll have to activate the hunter-killer AI modules.

Reality will likely be somewhere in between. Either way, I support anyone who wants to make birth control mandatory with a $1000 license before you reproduce. The future is coming, and there are too many people for it.

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."

Nail Rat posted:

(why the gently caress do they cost so much anyway?).

The real answer, i.e. the one frothing liberal goons hate, is that well-intended politicians tried to make college more affordable by providing an endless well of taxpayer-backed money. Colleges, not being as stupid as politicians, realized that this was a massive windfall waiting to happen. They raised their tuition as fast as they could to get the biggest possible slice of government cheese. And the most profitable way to do that is to push a bunch of starry-eyed idiots who have been told to "follow your dreams" through liberal arts programs that cost the school very little beyond a classroom and a failed writer to teach in it.

Enroll as many people as possible, and gently caress the outcomes because our endowment will be huge!

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."

Dawncloack posted:

I want the massive gains in productivity from automatization to go towards everyone having their basic needs covered and everyone needing to work 10h weeks. Instead of, you know, them going towards the 11th golden hull yatch for the Koch brothers.

Without technology, you'd be taking the slow stagecoach to Crazytown instead of a fast train.

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."
By all means, raise the minimum wage (a totally arbitrary representation of the cost of unskilled labor).

I feel slightly bad for all the minimum wagers who will lose their jobs in the short term when the cost of employing them exceeds the value they generate, but as a Gen-X with a real job and a mortgage, I'm all for the cascading inflation that will devalue the balance on my fixed-rate jumbo loan and make my house payment the equivalent of a large pizza*.

Remember, kiddos: Raising the minimum wage is t about helping the poor. It's about pandering to the stupid to buy their votes.

* which will be made and delivered by robots

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."

Top Bunk Wanker posted:

You ever heard of a rich guy living on a houseboat?

I've never heard of anyone living I. A houseboat except down-on-their luck private investigators on TV.

But those bastards are smart enough to do it somewhere like San Diego where women in bikinis need regular assistance solving murders and busting their wealthy husbands banging the maid.

You'd be better off living in your car.

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."

Devian666 posted:

The porn needs to be added to your "go bag".

You mean his come bag, right?

Zing!

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."
Back to the "under 100k horse crowd," a lot of those people live in places like Wyoming and Texas where you can buy a few hundred acres with a decent 3br/2ba for almost nothing. With the cost of living so cheap and abundant land, having a few horses to roam the range is really satisfying and not as bad as stabling them in some fancy Northeastern suburb.

So yes, they're expensive but in certain parts of the country you don't have to be rich to do it.

Source: Grew up with horses, did not starve.

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."

spwrozek posted:

It poo poo land Texas it is still around $2000 an acre... A few hundred (300?) Is still $600k. No wonder you didn't starve.

It was about $100 an acre when/where I grew up. Absolutely worthless for most purposes and a long way from anything except grazing big animals.

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."

The Mandingo posted:

I have customers at work that are veterinarians and they flip their poo poo if there's a weather delay that makes their shipment of horse semen deliver late. After reading this thread I realize they're probably jerks because the horse owners that pay for horse jizz are jerks to them and poo poo rolls downhill.

Or because you gotta get the jizz in the mare while she's in season or wait even longer to create more horses.

Making new horses and selling them can marginally defray the foolhardiness.

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."
What do Realdolls cost? I think it's that.

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."

potatoducks posted:

Is this thread full of rich people hating on poor people for spending money they don't have and inevitably relying on social systems? Or is it full of poor people hating on rich people for spending money on frivolous things? Both?

This thread is mostly poor single men who flunked out of college due to a WoW addiction and now work retail, trying to convince themselves that ramen for food, WoW as the sole source of entertainment, and a rusted out Civic are good with money instead of bad with life.

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."

B33rChiller posted:

While this may all be true, and there's kids that need a stable,

Keeping kids in a stable is GWM.

Keeping horses there is BWM.

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."
Wow that guy makes the idiotic Everest tourists seem sane. I can confirm that running over people in Kenya and fleeing the scene is The Thing to Do, though.

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."
Has he posted lately? I hear it's hard to type after the local warlord lops off your hands because you were foolish enough to stop at the barricade of burning tires instead of flooring it.

High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."
I'm sure those people are idiots, but let me give you a comparison:

I just put the last six months of transactions in my pivot table and it turns out that in that time, my family of four spent $12472 on food (grocery and restaurants), not including alcohol bought to take home (I categorize that as entertainment).

Holy poo poo, that's $2078 a month!

Holy poo poo, that's $69 a day!

Holy poo poo, that's $5.77 per meal per person!

Oh wait, that actually sounds pretty reasonable. Families with growing children don't survive on Ramen and frozen pizza.

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High Lord Elbow
Jun 21, 2013

"You can sit next to Elvira."
Great input - I checked the USDA budget tables for feeding a family of four and even by the most liberal standards, we are nearly doubling it. That surprised me.

I already gave this data to my wife (who does 100% of the shopping) and she agrees she can do better. To her credit, planning meals and shopping accordingly takes time, when she's doing what she does (no job but cares for a special needs child and another kid to boot). If it comes to it, I'd rather she spend the time on the kids and the money on the food. We're still maxing 401k and putting lots in 529s and saving more on top of that, so it's not like we're eating ourselves into bankruptcy.

Hard to break down restaurant vs grocery because our grocery store has one of those cafe things inside where they sell you 35 cents worth of beans for eight bucks. We do that maybe once a week.

My wife and I both eat at restaurants (mine is a company cafeteria) almost daily for lunch. Dinner 1-2 times a week.

And of course, she buys bullshit like pre-sliced melon and deli meat. Again, time vs money. We have less time than money and we put it towards our children's needs.

Still, we can do better, obviously. At the end of the day I'd rather save several hundred dollars than pay someone three bucks to slice a cantaloupe.

High Lord Elbow fucked around with this message at 21:22 on Jun 20, 2016

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