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Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!

RPZip posted:

They caved to that insane damage on a miss guy.
Yeah, that was a drat shame, if only to witness his total meltdown if it had stayed in.

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Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!
A knocking sound you can hear 300 feet away isn't really a knock, it's more a pounding with a sledgehammer.

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!
So the Tarrasque is 50 feet tall, but moves as fast as... a regular human?

Now I'm picturing this enormous horror shuffling and mincing about as if its colossal ankles are tied together.

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!

LuiCypher posted:

Look at all the peasant fighters working for their wizard overlords!

I guess D&D really is a class-based system, huh guys? :wotwot:
Back in the days of GP=XP, was it possible to be wealthy but not in a class? (Ie, 0-level) Did you jump a level if your parents died and left you an inheritance?

Wealth=ability as a natural law is about as horribly libertarian as you can get.

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!

P.d0t posted:

If you like bloat, don't play 5e; it's basically the only selling point vs. other editions/PF.
Give it time.

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!
RAW, doesn't Animate Dead only allow you to create at most 13 skeletons at once, not 40+? You get two extra per level of spell slot used, not the caster's actual level. So if you cast it from your L9 spell slot that's your initial one skeleton, plus two for each of the six slot levels above 3rd. (Arcane Recovery lets you create another 13 that day, I guess, assuming you're L18 or higher.)

Still, even just 13 skeletons with shortbows should be enough for most people if they want to ruin someone's day.

Skeletons.

Fake edit: I also just noticed this in the Basic DMG: "A green dragon is recognised by the crest that begins near its eyes and continues down its spine, reaching full height just behind the skull." Not because, I dunno, it's green?

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!

Stormgale posted:

The spell dosent have to be maintained, you cast it and the skeletons exist forever (till they get undeaded by damage) every day you can recast the spell at a more efficient way to maintain control of them (base 4 +2 / level above third) so you can control 20 skeletons with 2 3rd level slots and 2 4th level (4+4+6+6)
Okay, now I'm going to try to hit Peak Skeleton.

An L20 wizard (a necromancer, obviously) gets mastery of two L3 spells, which can be cast at-will as if in L3 slots any number of times with a short rest between them. Animate Dead is an L3 spell. So let's say that Nigel Necro has just woken up after a nice long rest, which he used to make sure that every one of his spell slots of L3 or higher is filled with Animate Dead (he's been planning this for a while). So that's 15 castings (3@L3, 3@L4, 3@L5, 2@L6, 2@L7, 1@L8 and 1@L9), and his plan is to take four short rests over the course of the day. That gives him another five L3 castings thanks to Signature Spell. Shame both of those can't be the same spell, but hey.

So in terms of numbers of skeletons produced per day, that's 8@L3, 9@L4 (1+2, x3), 15@L5 (1+4, x3), 21@L6 (1+6, x3), 27@L7 (1+8, x3), 33@L8 (1+10, x3) and 39@L9 (1+12, x3). That's a grand total of 152 skeletons. Not bad for a day's work! And there's still enough time left in the 24 hour period to use part of a single action to command them to gently caress up somebody's poo poo.

Fake edit: poo poo, I forgot that he can recover ten levels-worth of spell slots once per day during a short rest, too! So that could be one L6 and one L4 slot of Animate Dead, or two L5s - either way, that's another 30 skeletons. 182 in all!

Real edit: oops, shat the bed there with the maths because I cast each level three times. It should actually be 8@L3, 9@L4 (1+2, x3), 15@L5 (1+4, x3), 14@L6 (1+6, x2), 18@L7 (1+8, x2), 11@L8 (1+10, x1) and 13@L9 (1+12, x1), for a mere 88, then only an extra 10 from the spell recovery. Only 98 skeletons. Sorry, Nigel. :smith:

Small Strange Bird fucked around with this message at 16:48 on Aug 13, 2014

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!
So how the gently caress are you supposed to kill this dragon, then?

(It's by being a wizard, isn't it?)

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!
Okay, so I think I worked out how to kill that loving dragon:

Find a huge rock or boulder - stone weighs about one ton per cubic metre, so one of around 10x5x2m will give you 100 tons to play with - somewhere in the vicinity of the dragon's lair. Scry the lair until the dragon falls asleep. True Polymorph the rock into a friendly fly. You control its actions (I'm working from the PHB alpha, so I hope the wording hasn't changed in the final version), so send it into the lair and have it fly above the dragon. End the spell (or lose concentration before the hour ends, so it's not permanent). Drop 100 tons of solid rock on the dragon's head.

Then send in fighters skeleton army to take all its treasure.

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!

slydingdoor posted:

Actually, you'd spend 2 days getting 4 skeletons, then 2 days asserting control over the old ones and raising one more. Then on the fifth day you wake up, realize this is a pain in the rear end, write them all off and raise 2 more for 7 total, which will all turn on you in the next 24 hours. It's okay though because you're going to get them all destroyed anyway and never do this again.
So use True Polymorph to create your skeletons instead. It takes longer, as you only get one casting per day (unless there's some way to recharge high-level spells faster that I can't look up because I don't have the PDF on my iPad), but anything you create is A: automatically friendly to you and your party, so you don't have to keep reasserting control, and B: you control their moves and actions without any range limits RAW, so none of that "within 60'" crap.

Or alternatively, keep using True Polymorph to create an army of adult red dragons. Or Balors. Or Tarrasques. Or skeleton Tarrasques. Just go somewhere with a lot of large boulders to use for raw materials, and the world will be yours!

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!

Jack the Lad posted:

Note that making Object to Creature permanent means the creature is no longer loyal/friendly to you.
Was that changed from the PHB alpha to the final version? Because if so, that's a dick move on the part of Mearls and co.

Still, if you find a large enough boulder you can have a Balor on your side for an hour. And at the end of it, you tell him to teleport directly above anything you want to squash.

Incidentally, if necromancers are constantly having to recast Animate Dead to keep those members of their skeleton army within 60' under control, that doesn't make them much of a threat as NPC supervillains. It'd be like spinning plates, running around trying to remember which of their undead horde are about to turn on them every hour or so.

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!

Babylon Astronaut posted:

Yea, homeboy who based his fantasy homebrew system on the "there's always a way" rule from basic really helped with letting everyone be useful. At the worst, a character with balanced stats has a 55% percent shot at doing anything because you just under or equal your stat. So ideally, you'd have the high dex do the fine motor skills challenge, but no one was up poo poo creek unless they were specifically gimped.
Yay, I helped with something! :toot: (Here's the link if anyone wants to check it out.)

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!

Babylon Astronaut posted:

Why is the commoner +2 to hit? If the lovely commoner is +2 to hit, what does that make the level 1 fighter? He's even shittier with the same stats? I don't even know.
I picked up on that the first time I created characters in the playtest and found that Tom Shitfarmer, Level 0 Commoner, had a better chance of hitting an enemy than most of the party. Don't remember that being part of the precious tummyfeels of previous editions.

I also remember in that packet that kobolds had +4 to hit despite their crap stats, with absolutely no explanation why. That resulted in a TPK in the very first area of the Caves of Chaos (and I wasn't even using the Pack Tactics bonuses). I guess the math team hadn't fired up their mangle wringer at that point.

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!
The whole thing with Dancey and the OGL/SRD is mind-boggling to me; I can't believe that Wizards could have missed the glaringly obvious downside. "So this allows anybody, even our own competitors, to copy our system, make whatever modifications they like and put it out as their own product in perpetuity and royalty-free as long as they don't include our tiny handful of trademarked monsters like Beholders and Mind Flayers? What a great idea, nothing could possibly go wrong!" I guess they assumed they'd sell PHBs to everyone using a d20 product and all would be rosy.

(It's also mind-boggling that it worked, because d20 is a horrible, over-crunchy system that tries and fails dismally to be a physics engine, but that's by the by.)

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!

gradenko_2000 posted:

At level 6, Thunderbolt Strike can push a target away 10 feet whenever the Cleric hits a target with lightning damage. That's just 5 feet less than the Battle Master's Pushing Attack, and in exchange the Cleric can do it all day with Divine Strike at level 8 to deal lightning damage on any successful weapon attack and the target can't save against it.
So if the cleric successfully attacks the floor at his feet with Divine Strike, would the resulting pushback be like rocket-jumping in Quake?

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!
Half the stuff from the DMG so far could have been presented as a PDF errata to the 1e DMG, with only the ACs and damage changed. Gygax has probably written as much of it as Mearls.

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!

AlphaDog posted:

I ran Mentzer's Basic after getting all inspired during the Next playtest, and dungeon crawling with Basic was still as fun as it was in the 80s.

It also kind of started me re-reading all my old BECMI/AD&D stuff, which slowly brought me to the realisation that what I really wanted out of 5e was an updated BECMI (even just the basic and expert books) not an updated AD&D.
Same here (which was why I created TAAC, a B/X clone with unified mechanics). I own B/X, RC, 1e, 3.5e and 4e, as well as the playtests and Basic PDF of 5e, and of all of them the one I would most want to actually play is B/X. (I know RC is much the same thing, but I prefer B/X, partly out of nostalgia and partly because I have the actual physical books rather than a PDF.) Simpler is better, and I'd much rather take five minutes to roll up a character and then get on with exploring than endure character creation as a session in its own right.

5e is better than 3.x in that respect, but there's still way too much cruft slowing things down.

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!

Ryuujin posted:

I do want to try TAAC, or try it again but likely use some of the optional classes, but man looking at the Warlock and those invocations are expensive. 2 con for Eldritch Blast, with each higher level invocation getting progressively more expensive, and you only restore 1 con after a Turn. So it takes awhile to recover. Still might be a bit more spammable than normal spellcasting classes, kind of.
Turns are only 10 minutes in TAAC, like B/X, though. So the equivalent of a Next "short" rest will get you back 6 CON!

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!
Having finally read the PHB, I'm just happy that my idea to abuse the poo poo out of True Polymorph and turn it into a one-hit-kill weapon against any opponent (True Polymorph a massive boulder into a friendly and obedient fly, command it to hover directly above the target, end concentration) still works. (Hmm. Does a lake of acid count as "an object"?)

Granted, anyone capable of casting True Polymorph should probably be able to kill any target anyway.

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!
D&D Adenturer's Handbook Dungeons & Dragons.

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!

SmellOfPetroleum posted:

Didn't one of the playtest packets include a segment of the Keep on the Borderlands / Caves of Chaos? Considering the number of times Temple of Elemental Evil gets repurposed for current editions, it would be nice if good old B/X era stuff ever came around again.
Yes, and when I tested it (by creating four level 1 characters and sending them into the kobold caves), I had a TPK at the pit right inside the entrance when the Wizard flubbed his DEX roll and fell in, alerting the kobolds on guard (who took out two of the other characters in one round) and the 30 rats from the next room, who demolished the survivors 1HP at a time.

Thinking back I suspect I forgot to include the characters' proficiency bonuses in their rolls, but since I didn't use the kobolds' Pack Tactics either it probably balanced out.

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!
A character's highest ability score doesn't have to be the one most associated with their class, does it? I created a Tempest Cleric last night to test how the process works, with STR and DEX as her highest scores and WIS third simply because I like the idea of someone with a pissed-off thunder god on their side whose approach to dealing with evildoers isn't through spells but by smacking them really hard in the face with a big fuckoff hammer. (Basically my Skyrim character.)

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!

ProfessorCirno posted:

Isn't a cleric who doesn't use magic literally just a fighter though
Spells as backup, big fuckoff hammer as first resort. The character concept came first and I picked the nearest class.

Besides, how can I win at D&D if I don't play a caster? :v:

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!
What's the DC for catching a small object attached to your wrist by a cord? Got to be like, DC 40, right?

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!

AlphaDog posted:

I can see some benefits in pushing for this, but I'm not sure it's worth it since as soon as centipedes are currency you can't just pull them out of your component pouch any more.
Centipedes? In my component pouch? It's more common than you think.

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!

mastershakeman posted:

To add to this, wouldn't low level swarming enemies (goblins, etc) be flanking against adventurers almost all the time since it's pretty much automatic?
Kobolds automatically get +5 to hit because reasons, and on top of that they're pretty much guaranteed to get Advantage thanks to Pack Tactics (ie, flanking). So you end up with a low-level trash monster that effectively gets +9 to hit if there's more than one attacking.

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!
Couple of British comic book characters: Torquemada from Nemesis The Warlock ("Be pure! Be vigilant! BEHAVE!"), and Blackblood from ABC Warriors. And Judge Dredd, maybe, although he's more Lawful Bastard.

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!

quote:

edition 3.75

Dungeons & Dragons, Asymptote Edition.

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!

Grimpond posted:

I can't put my finger on exactly why, but I feel like this could have been worded better?
dndnext.txt

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!

ActusRhesus posted:

How do you "passively investigate?"
I now want to create a 5e detective who just sits around and waits for the clues to fall into his lap. Kind of a fantasy Jason King.

Actually, Fantasy Jason King is such a brilliant concept I might create him anyway. What class would be best for a louche alcoholic playboy who always wins fights despite being hopeless at fighting?

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!
Roll or assign your stats. When you want to Do A Thing, the appropriate stat becomes the target number. If you have advantage, add 4 to the TN. If you have disadvantage, subtract 4 from the TN. Roll the TN or under on a d20 to succeed at Thing.

Game design is easy! :haw:

Small Strange Bird fucked around with this message at 11:53 on Feb 4, 2015

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!

Laphroaig posted:

It makes a skeleton as per the Monster Manual and it works on a pile of medium humanoid bones. It doesn't do anything more than that. You'd need to get the DM to agree to let you make a new spell. And then you get to go down the rabbit hole of turning <X> into a skeleton, and what level spell is that, etc, considering that Create Undead exists as a 6th level spell and lets you make ghouls/ghasts/wights/mummies.
Can you make a horse-mummy?

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!
Was "PCs and monsters must play by exactly the same rules!" an outcome of the 3.x-as-physics-simulator thing? Because they didn't in grog touchstone 1e, where monsters had a ton of special options that players not only didn't, but never would.

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!

Kitchner posted:

Which is like criticising it for the lack of laser guns and space ships.
1e had laser guns and spaceships. :v: And rules for cowboys and atomic mutants right there in the DMG too!

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!
"IM your DM."

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!

kingcom posted:

Well you can have that same attack roll be used for lots and lots of different things. Special events that happen, cool tricks that are pulled off, plot advancements/shift/changes all as part of that same dice roll mechanic.
I'm working on a retroclone where one of the options in melee combat is a 'blitz attack' where you're guaranteed to hit, but still have to roll - to see if your target hits you in the process. Not sure how that would go down with the "b-b-but you can't damage on a miss!" crowd (though I can guess), but I absolutely loathe the "Roll to hit!"/"You miss, that's your turn over" treadmill, especially at low level.

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!

PurpleXVI posted:

While it does speed things up, the less things you roll during combat, the less purpose there is to combat. If everything was just static values, you could basically sit down at the start of the fight, look over all the sheets, and go: "Okay, you start fighting the ogre, you all take... twenty HP worth of damage, distribute it among yourselves, you win the fight and pick up fifty gold pieces and the ogre's club." At the very least, if you applied it to D&D as-is.
Ha, that's exactly what I asked about in the Elf Simulation thread a few days ago. No-combat combat, basically, where each encounter delivers a set amount of damage, which can be mitigated by character defences and burning limited resources like spells, potions and the equivalent of Dailies. (Or you can try to come up with another way to deal with the enemies that doesn't involve fighting them.)

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!

PurpleXVI posted:

I think it could actually, potentially work. It'd need an entirely new system, though, from the ground up, and having no random factors at all it would really, really take an experienced and capable GM to keep it fresh, interesting and challenging yet not bullshit. Normally the dice soak up a lot of that responsibility by being arbitrary and unaligned factors. If you've got literally nothing on the board that's not placed there by the GM, though... puts a bit more responsibility on him, and I'm not sure I'd trust myself to be able to manage it, as cool as the idea sounds. I also feel it risks making combat a bit more adversarial by, again, putting EVERYTHING directly in the GM's hands, if a PC bites it, it can never just be put down to the dice, and... I don't know, I'm repeating myself, but I think it would take a really mature group and competent GM to make it work.
A random element could be added by having a "damage die" or something for each character which they roll to add to their total damage mitigation, representing how quickly they take down the opposition before they're killed themselves. Essentially, Murderhobo Level + Damage Die + Armour/Defence/Whatever + Burned Resources are totalled and subtracted from the encounter damage, which is then divided up amongst the party. Having a die involved also allows for crit bonuses and the like.

As you said, it would involve completely rewriting chunks of the system. But maybe that would count as one of Mike Mearls' mythical modules? :haw:

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!

PurpleXVI posted:

The problem is, though, if you make the random element large enough to unburden the GM in some sense, and large enough that players feel a bit endangered, like a given encounter isn't completely predictable, then you're already heading back towards what we had in the first place. But if you don't make it large enough for that, it remains as kind of a vestigial mechanic and still leaves us with hard, but not insurmountable, problems. So I think I'd just scrap the random element completely, if I was really going to work on it, just go all-in towards a non-random system and see what the end result was.
If the players have the option to spend (or not spend) resources of different strengths to reduce the damage they take, though, there's always going to be a "random" element - at least from the GM's point of view. If someone decides to blow their most powerful Daily by nova-ing the first group of kobolds the party encounters, that'll throw off the GM's maths for the rest of the game as the encounters get harder.

If each monster had a set damage rating (or whatever) that were totalled to produce the encounter's danger level, rather than just saying "this encounter will cause X damage", then that gives the GM the option to add or subtract enemies to balance things, as they know how much punishment the party can still take. (Or again, the party could just not fight and instead come up with clever alternatives to save on resources.)

Anyway, Gygax is probably spinning in his grave at this talk of an RPG where combat isn't played out segment by laborious segment, so, er, Next content: hey, how about them Intellect Devourers, huh?

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Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!
I stole the idea from whichever edition introduced Cleave, but extended it so that you kept chopping up fools until you used up all your damage roll. (I hadn't seen it anywhere else in that form; it came about after the Next playtest where my fighter was bitten to death by the 30 rats at the entrance to the Caves of Chaos while swinging at them one at a time and often missing.) I do like the thought that Next stole it right back, though!

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