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Serf
May 5, 2011


what if, and stay with me here because this is crazy, some people played D&D in worlds that had more advanced technology

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Serf
May 5, 2011


also game mechanics do not have to reflect reality because you are, in fact, playing a fantasy game. just have a gun use the same stats as a bow

Serf
May 5, 2011


8one6 posted:

As an aside, leave it to Baen to come up with the shittiest possible cover for an omnibus collection. I mean, the original cover for The Sleeping Dragon wasn't exactly mind blowing, but come the gently caress on with this floating head least effort bullshit.

As for the topic: I've run SpellJammer and Expedition to the Barrier Peaks. Guns, space lasers, knights, brain eating aliens from the future, magic, psionics, muscle wizards dragging the sun back over the horizon by flexing really hard, elves, and any other gonzo poo poo you can think of always have had and always will have a place in Dungeons and motherfucking Dragons.

I dug up my old 3.0 DMG because I could've sworn I remembered something in there about firearms and this is what I found:

Serf
May 5, 2011


8one6 posted:

gently caress yes, I remember that. This entire debate reminded me of an article from the last print issue of Dragon magazine. I present Meepo's pump-action Mossburg


I still own all of the d20 Modern books, and that kobold showed up in Urban Arcana, and he still rules.

Serf
May 5, 2011


How to Gun

1) Find the stats for the bow
2) Copy those down
3) Go back and erase "bow"
4) Replace with "gun"

Serf
May 5, 2011


admanb posted:

5E is a perfectly good version of D&D. It's just that D&D has pretty much always been an incoherent mess of a system except for 4E which was coherent, but not D&D.

Simply incredible.

Serf
May 5, 2011


gently caress that. Seize the means of reanimation.

Serf
May 5, 2011


Polo-Rican posted:

I was DMing a game recently and had the players enter a vampire's lair.

One of the PCs should know all about vampires, so I read off some basic info about vampires, including this little gem I didn't know about :

"If a piercing weapon made of wood is driven into the vampire's heart while the vampire is Incapacitated in its Resting place, the vampire is Paralyzed until the stake is removed."

The players opened the casket and then the player with the stake rolled a natural 20 dex check for plunging the stake into the heart accurately. So, the players were able to kill a monster normally worth 10,000 XP without breaking a sweat — literally the easiest kill in the entire adventure so far. I'm fine with this since the players did carefully prepare for the battle... and, luckily this particular vampire wasn't integral to the story, just something that had been terrorizing a village of nearby NPCs. Still, it doesn't feel right and I'm curious about how other people handle wooden stakes and vampires.

That actually sounds pretty cool.

Vampires are usually portrayed as very intelligent and well-prepared enemies, so maybe the next one isn't some scrub-tier vampire like that one. Give other vampires proper lairs with traps and guardians and have contingency plans in place in case they get attacked during the day time. Killing a vampire by staking it in the heart is a really thematic and neat way to do things, but make sure that getting there isn't easy for their enemies.

Serf
May 5, 2011


Dragonborn are big lizards, what is there even to show? :confused:

Serf
May 5, 2011


Remember, just because your bones are broken doesn't mean they won't stop a bullet from hitting me.

Serf
May 5, 2011


Enola Gay-For-Pay posted:

You can buy the rules for individual spells for 2 bucks a pop.

Hahahaha gently caress this.

Serf
May 5, 2011


Intellectual property is theft.

Serf
May 5, 2011


Trebuchet King posted:

I missed 4e completely but I'd heard it characterized as kind of MMO-ified? Like in terms of mechanics and such.

In that it introduced balance and mechanical definition that ensured that every party member had an equal contribution, sure.

Serf
May 5, 2011


MonsterEnvy posted:

Well you are not giving him money you are giving the charity extra life money. Funny enough one of the first tweets about that is if they could have Crawford do it instead and he just straight up says sure I will ask him.

I agree that it's pretty funny how loving stupid Mearls is.

Serf
May 5, 2011


dont even fink about it posted:

"Roll to advance plot" is not a roll people should make. Among other reasons, never make people roll for something if nothing interesting would happen on a failure.

The fact that this is not obvious to the lead designer of the RPG with the most name recognition in the world is hilarious.

Serf
May 5, 2011


Magil Zeal posted:

I can't wait to be a dragonborn from the Grrrmmballhyst clan.

Personally I think Chumbyxirinnish is for me.

Could this thing be any more :effort:

Serf
May 5, 2011


Arivia posted:

I ended up looking at the lizardfolk name tables from Volo's Guide to Monsters and it turns out they were all taken from 3e. Wouldn't surprise me if these are similar. Good job Mearls!

Too lazy to even use a random name generator. Then again, the D&D team is now what, three people working out of a supply closet in the back of the MTG offices?

Serf
May 5, 2011


If the fighter is the class for idiots, what does that make barbarians?

Serf
May 5, 2011


mastershakeman posted:

I kind of get the logic about bad rules leading to better DMing - it's stupid at first glance, but everything about high level play I've ever seen breaks down pretty badly and it seems the solution to fixing that was just to tell the DM to git gud via having to pull rulings out of his rear end from the get go

I'm not saying it's a good idea, but I understand why they did it

We purposely trained him wrong, as a joke.

Serf
May 5, 2011


Who doesn't, at some point, just want to be dollar store Gimli for a little while?

Serf
May 5, 2011


In my fantasy games when I voice dwarf NPCs I like to give them redneck accents.

Serf
May 5, 2011


Dungeons and Dragons stays true to its roots

Serf
May 5, 2011


quote:

“The land that they live in is a savage land. That’s just part of what Chult is. It’s a place of monsters."

they're still echoing centuries of racist fantasies about darkest africa despite the sword coast or whatever being eat the gently caress up with zombies, owlbears and whatever the gently caress else

lmao

Serf
May 5, 2011




Nanny Pu'Pu

:thunk:

Serf
May 5, 2011


MonsterEnvy posted:

Just to inform you That is much less racist then you would think. Nanny Pu'pu there is actually a Green hag. Which is a literal baby eating monster.

Even in Human forms they like to make themselves look ugly and creepy.

Just to inform you That is just as racist as I think.

I know your gimmick is to eat WotC rear end 24/7 but you don’t have to do this. Don’t go to bat for racism.

Serf
May 5, 2011


MonsterEnvy posted:

This is the same thing as this



Neither of those things are real. They were made up by people. One of them is a racist caricature summoned up from centuries of colonialism. The other appears to be a bog-standard fantasy being. Maybe its racist against the villain of True Detective?

Serf
May 5, 2011


MonsterEnvy posted:

Yeah. I agree there. Vegepygmies are legacy monsters from that Alien Spaceship adventure so they kept their name from that.

I know that neither are real. But at this point I just feel like you guys are just going to refuse to understand were I am coming from.

The place you are coming from is...?

"I'm okay with racist imagery that comes from Wizards of the Coast"

or

"Drawn pictures cannot possibly use influences from the real world and therefore the bone-wearing 'monster' woman was completely created from a person's imagination"

Serf
May 5, 2011


Haggins posted:

Don't like it, don't buy it. Why does any art have to go through some PC filter to ensure it doesn't offend anyone?

I mean, I sure ain't buying it. But I ain't gotta buy it to know that poo poo stinks.

Serf
May 5, 2011


Haggins posted:

This poo poo just seems like a witch hunt akin to what the Christians in the 80's did. Instead of indoctrinating kids to worship Satan now it's making them Klan members.

lmao sure, this is the new satanic panic

Serf
May 5, 2011


christians in the 80s: your books make kids worship satan
black bloggers in 2017: hey maybe do better when creating your fantasy africa

same thing

Serf
May 5, 2011


maybe don’t create entire cultures or species of sapient beings who exist to be cannon fodder for guilt-free murdering.

Serf
May 5, 2011


Conspiratiorist posted:

I approve of this but good luck getting people to give up their goblinoids and kobolds and trolls and ogres and giants and evil elves.

In every game I've run since I started, the "monster" species were never monsters. They were just regular people trying to get by like everybody else. It takes a little getting used to, but its way more interesting than the standard ethnic cleansing fever dream that most games endorse.

Serf
May 5, 2011


Conspiratiorist posted:

That was humans until we discovered agriculture, though.

You sure about that?

Serf
May 5, 2011


Conspiratiorist posted:

Ask the megafauna.

I don't have access to an elephant at the moment.


gradenko_2000 posted:

There is no reason why goblins, kobolds, trolls, and ogres can't have material reasons for coming into conflict with the player.

Like, "uh oh we can't have primitivist depictions of monster societies anymore!" is absolutely spot-on because the native societies that this conflates them with weren't "primitive" either!

It's not hard to come up with reasons why people would fight each other, and I don't know why people need to come up with bullshit like "always chaotic evil" or whatever.

Of course if you follow the line of material justifications for conflict, you always arrive back at the root cause and only 100% guilt-free acceptable cannon fodder: the bourgeoisie.

Serf
May 5, 2011


AlphaDog posted:

Countdown to "why did you have to make this discussion all political?" and/or "now you're talking about people like me being the bad guys this is not ok".

Considering that we started this conversation talking about the new racist D&D book, that would be silly.

Which virtually guarantees it will happen.


Goffer posted:

Been doing a bit of looking at evolutionary psych and life history strategies https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Life_history_theory and depending on the lifecycle of the Orc, there might be some great explanations. According to the evolutionary psych, organisms that live faster lifes:
- mature rapidly and have an early age of first reproduction
- have a relatively short lifespan
- have a large number of offspring at a time, and few reproductive events, or are semelparous
- have a high mortality rate and a low offspring survival rate
- have minimal parental care/investment

This isn't directed at you, but just an observation. It's interesting that you can look at this list of traits and pretty much see how almost all of them are arguments made by white supremacists.

Serf
May 5, 2011


The Racism Defender has logged on.

Serf
May 5, 2011


like

quote:

“I’m gonna ignore for a moment the fact that they described [Chult] as a wild, untamed land—how much of Africa was thought of for a long time,” Dace, who runs the Black Role-Players Organization, told me. He had bigger fish to fry: “Their speaking patterns are described right down to having clicks. This creates a problem if white gamers were wanting to do an accent and do serious clicks and clucks based on what they’ve seen on TV about African languages.” Dace noted that Africa has upwards of 2,000 languages and only three language groups use clicks. It is one of the most stereotyped aspects of Africa.” Dace suggested using Swahili as another point of inspiration.

Another eyebrow-raising feature for Dace was the narrative arc of Chult’s escape from foreign rule, which he says “smacks of colonialism. It borrows from this rich African tradition of kings and queens and then reduces it down to them now being tradesmen, a path they learned not from their own but from their neighbors. This mirrors the historic way in which Africa’s empires were broken by European powers and then colonized.”

He was unimpressed by “mad monkey fever,” especially, he said, considering the long history of “likening blacks to monkeys.”

read the article

Serf
May 5, 2011


MonsterEnvy posted:

I am just posting stuff from the adventure. (Which no matter how you may feel about this topic is very solid. Probably the best one they have come out with.)

I would hope that it would be better than Drums on Fire Mountain. I love a good, well-designed racist adventure.

Serf
May 5, 2011


MonsterEnvy posted:

I did. I don't care much for the article.

I know. I blame Reene for posting that stupid article and starting us down this path.

:qq: :qq: :qq:

MonsterEnvy posted:

I am talking about the 5e adventures you rear end.

Right, Tomb of Annihilation is the best racist adventure they've put out yet.

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Serf
May 5, 2011


MonsterEnvy posted:

You have not read the adventure so judging something as racist just because of an article rubs me the wrong way.

That article itself mainly was talking about chult stuff before Tomb of Annihilation. While at the same time it's somehow tricked people into thinking that hostile Jungles, lost cities, and witches are racist.

I was a little skeptical at first. After all, WotC is staffed by some real nincompoops at the moment, but surely all that progressivism they'd been into recently would have helped them create a better product right?

Nope. The Nanny Pu'Pu picture was a pretty big indicator that the article was right, and on further inspection, they really do know what's up.

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