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I know that Mormons defends the idea that one can mix politics and religion, but i wonder, is there other religions that believe the same heretical idea?
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Dec 11, 2014 14:26
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| # ¿ May 16, 2024 13:51 |
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nobody? ok, i assume that people here take the standard opinion that christians can participate in politics and war. Now that the strawman is set up i can point at it and say: bad opinion strawman, bad opinion. Thank you for participating.
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Dec 11, 2014 14:38
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Vaall posted:Dwelling on the fear & concept of death with its consequences is not a healthy way to live, nor is following a fictional story saying immortality awaits you in the sky after your demise. it is fictional because it is borrowed from philosophical ideas and not in the bible?
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Dec 11, 2014 14:42
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Vaall posted:You illustrate pretty well the only reason people become religious—fear of death. if only he had read the bible more closely and seen that when we die we die, just like the animals. It is also why the apostles thought that Jesus said that Lazarus was sleeping instead of, you know, being dead. It is really annoying that the idea of an immortal soul took over and took people in slavery under the fear of death. Let us go and die together with him  11 After he had said this, he went on to tell them, “Our friend Lazarus has fallen asleep; but I am going there to wake him up.” 12 His disciples replied, “Lord, if he sleeps, he will get better.” 13 Jesus had been speaking of his death, but his disciples thought he meant natural sleep. 14 So then he told them plainly, “Lazarus is dead, 15 and for your sake I am glad I was not there, so that you may believe. But let us go to him.” 16 Then Thomas (also known as Didymus[a]) said to the rest of the disciples, “Let us also go, that we may die with him.” Big Mackson fucked around with this message at 14:55 on Dec 11, 2014 |
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Dec 11, 2014 14:53
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what is it with goons and the obsession with death and religion? speak in human talk so we can understand what positions are being taken here so we can move forward with the discussion! This is D&D so stop with the GBSing already! 
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Dec 11, 2014 15:02
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actually, people who can live forever in paradise technically dont have immortality 
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Dec 11, 2014 15:25
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Muscle Tracer posted:What possible prison could be worse than an eternal life in which the venal joys of bloodshed are denied you? actually, people are going to live on an earth free of pollution and war and disease
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Dec 11, 2014 15:30
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This thread... is unbelievable. As in, i cannot believe in it.
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Dec 11, 2014 16:01
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what we just needed. Some d20 comic book nerd crap.
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Dec 11, 2014 16:12
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but we literally do cease to exist, both from a secular and theological (christian) viewpoint. How hard is this to understand? 
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Dec 11, 2014 16:17
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CommieGIR posted:But a 2000 year old book says.... death is certain.
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Dec 11, 2014 16:21
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Dogmas are bad and should feel bad
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Dec 11, 2014 16:27
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Who What Now posted:At least Warhammer 40k is honest about what it is, you have to give it that. you sprang the trap! you sprang it!
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Dec 11, 2014 16:30
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I wish people could state their beliefs/arguments in terms that could be understood. Like, "i am an agnostic" or "i am an atheist" or "i am an protestant" or "my argument is Christian conditionalism".
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Dec 11, 2014 16:44
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Do people believe that Jesus is Son of God just like Adam was and is something created by God, or that he is God-Son eternally a part of the trinity God-Head as perpetrated by different sects throughout time?
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Dec 11, 2014 17:53
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BrandorKP posted:Yes some people (some church fathers!) believe(d) that. "Adam is fulfilled in Christ, which means that Christ is the essential man, the man Adam was essentially, and should become but did not become." We're talking Irenaeus ideas there. And then when Tertullian does the whole Trinity with a high Christology thing it's in the context of Irenaeus arguing that! yeah, already in the year 100-200 people started to incorporate and use greek philosophy so its no wonder that the idea of a soul and trinity became so widespread.
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Dec 11, 2014 18:18
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Yeah, some sects must twist grammar and stuff to make "Son of God" mean "Eternal God Son of God Consciousness".
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Dec 11, 2014 18:31
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Who What Now posted:I want to remind everyone that Brandor once argued that if you believed that the Pythagorean Theorem was correct you therefore must also believe in God. I sincerely hope he means a "universal" unknown god and not YHWH because that would be less retarded. Just a little bit.
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Dec 11, 2014 18:46
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Muscle Tracer posted:"Mysterious man-like entity who creates the entire universe from nothing, but has really a fragile ego, and therefore requires unending adulation on penalty of eternal torment? Totally plausible. This same entity puts part of itself in the Soul slot of a baby and puts that baby in a lady? Now let's not get carried away here, that would be ridiculous!!!" —BKP Haha what? YHWH didn't put a "part" of himself in a baby. However in the bible it states that a son of his went down and became human. "soul slot" lol, did you play binding of isaac?
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Dec 11, 2014 19:04
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Further proof that the belief in a "soul" is pffffffffttthhhh
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Dec 11, 2014 19:23
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BrandorKP posted:It's all the philosophical schools. All the heads of schools were soters and this concept was understood. In our western tradition, knowing is bound up with salvation. And not just in Christianity, this precedes Christianity. This is something one should be aware of. well yeah, it was well understood that one had to know what one should do to obey god among the israelites.
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Dec 11, 2014 19:35
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CommieGIR posted:Correct. Basically, its the same issue with the earlier parts of the thread where people were just using Faith as a coverall for proof of religion. Salvation is just being used as a catch all. I have faith therefore i am right? It is flawed in that billions of people have faith of different religions and there should be some other thing that should define why one believes in one thing.
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Dec 11, 2014 19:57
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BrandorKP posted:Maybe for the reasons there, the Christian concept "Son of God", is different from the Pagan concept "son of God"? Perhaps we assert those fundamental differences when we say "only-begetton" and when we don't affirm 'There was a time when he was not' This isnt really an argument because Adam was recognized as Son of God, legitimately. And the bible definition of only begotten is that Jesus is the first and only thing created directly by God as the beginning of everything that is created. This is bible 101.
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Dec 11, 2014 20:00
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Kyrie eleison posted:The Creed says he is "begotten, not made". Jesus was not created. Jesus is God. This is lol because "The Creed" is not the bible. edit: just noticed it was Kyrie eleison so that explains it Big Mackson fucked around with this message at 20:15 on Dec 11, 2014 |
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Dec 11, 2014 20:07
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BrandorKP posted:I'm taking that argument from directly transcribed class notes of "The History of Christian Thought: Lectures in Church History (108)" taught in 53 by Tillich. It's the same place the usage of soter is coming from. oh, i misunderstood. I thought you thought that this was what it meant in the bible, instead it was what christians thought they thought about how they could square philosophy with what was written in the bible.
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Dec 11, 2014 20:11
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Really, there is a lot that could be said about the various sects and groups (gnosticism) etc. that all used various philosophies and beliefs to understand the bible.
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Dec 11, 2014 20:12
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BrandorKP posted:Soter is the word in the bible that is translated to savior? No argument here. I dont know what you think i argued and i am not sure either anymore.
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Dec 11, 2014 20:16
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I think the discussion is that people have a different view of what kind of savior jesus was. Some thinks politically or socially or religiously. It is an opinion.
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Dec 11, 2014 20:20
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The op read literally the entire bible (as i also have) and his first argument with me and his proof is quoting The Creed. This thread IS AMAZING.
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Dec 11, 2014 20:23
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Mr. Wiggles posted:Creed is pretty important. Yes, the first thing one should use before the bible.
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Dec 11, 2014 20:26
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Kyrie eleison posted:The Creed is authoritative... 15 The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. I think the discussion is if one think that God created Jesus first before all creation and then created everything else with him or that he have existed eternally. Kyrie eleison posted:I know a thing or two about other religions. I've studied. That I am critical of Judaism and Buddhism is mainly because those two religions are held to be almost unacceptable to criticize, which is ridiculous. Christianity, on the other hand, not only deserves criticism, but is afforded no defense! I can see what's going on, and I reject it. There are a lot of things people have done in Gods name. Catholics/Protestant/Baptist/Etc/Etc have had a big share in causing real harm throughout history and teaching people heretical things borrowed from Greek philosophy. One thing the catholic church have done especially is deliberately not using the personal name of God. http://www.catholicnews.com/data/stories/cns/0804119.htm "As an expression of the infinite greatness and majesty of God, it was held to be unpronounceable and hence was replaced during the reading of sacred Scripture by means of the use of an alternate name: 'Adonai,' which means 'Lord,'" the Vatican letter said. Similarly, Greek translations of the Bible used the word "Kyrios" and Latin scholars translated it to "Dominus"; both also mean Lord. "Avoiding pronouncing the Tetragrammaton of the name of God on the part of the church has therefore its own grounds," the letter said. "Apart from a motive of a purely philological order, there is also that of remaining faithful to the church's tradition, from the beginning, that the sacred Tetragrammaton was never pronounced in the Christian context nor translated into any of the languages into which the Bible was translated." It is almost as if they retroactively change history so that nobody have never used God's name. It is also strange it wasnt unpronounceable before overzelous pharisees like people was afraid of even saying his name, as if he never wanted us to know it in the first place.
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Dec 18, 2014 14:11
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The belief that God send people to hell have done more than enough to make people believe that God is cruel. If people knew that it is actually not true then it would be more nuanced opinions itt imo.
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Dec 18, 2014 15:24
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steinrokkan posted:He's trolling at this point because the thread itself has fallen apart, but I think he's not embellishing his beliefs. He is actually not trolling because he masterfully refuted and defended the belief in the catholic dogma of the trinity and an immortal soul. Greek philosophy was the libertarian belief of their time after all.
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Dec 22, 2014 13:47
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rudatron posted:There's nothing wrong with greek philosophy, but it does matter which greeks you're talking about...gently caress plato " Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ." What is the Catholic church but a miserable little pile of traditions? obligatory Perhaps the same could be said of all religions...
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Dec 22, 2014 13:58
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SedanChair posted:Oh come on Kyrie, nobody baits Jews like you do. The eternal student
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Dec 22, 2014 16:58
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CommieGIR posted:Wasn't Plato also one of the ones that held knowledge was for the elite, not for the working/lower classes? That explains why the catholic church didn't want people to read the bible.
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Dec 22, 2014 17:59
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Exclamation mark! Baseless arguments! ! ! !
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Dec 22, 2014 19:23
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yes aristotle great man good church man
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Dec 22, 2014 19:41
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formula
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Dec 22, 2014 21:54
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| # ¿ May 16, 2024 13:51 |
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People cry all the time. Also in the bible. It being percieved as weak is a leftover from satanic catholic patriarchy brainwashing i guess.
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Dec 22, 2014 22:11
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