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Yeah Temporum. Like, yeah. I have played 7 games at this point: four 3-player, two 4-player and one 5-player. I've played with the same 5 people, just that some of them weren't always there, and these are all people I have played Dominion regularly with. Only two of us have won 2 games, and everyone else has won one each. I have no drat idea how to judge this, if our Dominion experience factors into this, or if it is all just luck. I really want to start logging our games to see if the different playstyles we each tend to favor in Dominion have carried over into Temporum - like our "engine" guy being better at building complex combos or the "attack" guy doing better in games with attack zones or whatever. It is a blast at this point and I hope it has the legs that Dominion has. I am glad that people seem to be buying it because I really want to see the eventual expansion or 2.
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Dec 16, 2014 05:57
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McNerd posted:The bottom right zone in particular is a special case IMO. It takes two specific changes from the starting position, which is more than any other zone so I usually don't count on this being available. I think all of this is true, particularly the last part about the "first couple of games". As we have played more we have altered the timeline more for a better mix of zones. In time 3 we typically have had all 3 zones active for at least a few turns for our past several games. Time 4 as noted is extremely volatile, if your opponents see a powerful zone and you are trying to set it up, it is extremely easy to keep you away. This is especially true for the outer edges, since they can be "blocked" from any previous time (whereas, like, one of the middle zones can have two different paths to it from time 3). That is why Age of Anubis has been one of the cards to look out for in our games.
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Dec 18, 2014 17:36
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SilverMike posted:Edit: This is about the Harbor expansion, I'm not sure if there are any others coming along. There are actually 3 new landmarks, one being a 30 cost that lengthens the end game a bit, and gives more opportunities to use those high cost landmark powers (whereas in the base game once you get that 22 card the game is basically over anyway). But yeah, it definitely doesn't make the game any deeper. If anything it takes away any semblance of long term planning since the cards are randomized. So there is a tradeoff in variety versus stability. If you already like Machi Koro the expansion does help to push its strengths. If you find it too light or random, it won't help with that, it is still the same game at its core. Also, the game has been out for a few years in Japan, so I believe 2 expansions are out there (or maybe the second is coming?), but only the base game has been released in the west, with the first expansion coming eventually.
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Dec 19, 2014 18:28
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Elysium posted:Expansions which will also be cards that get strewn about wildly in the box? It is really weird. My assumption is that, after some of the backlash and demand for a storage solution for Dominion, they just decided to save the money this time and let players figure out their own storage. It would be great if they had at least put in dividers for the 4 ages and player cards, I don't really need anything for the chits.
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Dec 19, 2014 20:02
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Toshimo posted:I'm convinced that Dominion is really a 2 player game and DXV was conned by a publisher to say it could be more. DXV balanced it specifically for 3 players so that it could go down to 2 and up to 4 easily; he hesitantly was willing to go to 5 for the expansion but hates the idea of 6 player Dominion (that is where the publisher influence came in). It's easily the best at 3, but good at 2 and 4.
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Jan 3, 2015 18:02
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It sounds like the experienced players handicapped themselves with Rough Roads but the newbie didn't have to deal with that. Assuming you are pointing out the "don't use this to teach new players" line. EDIT: too slow
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Jan 5, 2015 23:52
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T-Bone posted:Here's the family collection so far, tell me what else to burn money on: Based on: 1) really likes Dominion, 2) cool themes, 3) good for 4, 5 players, 4) depth and variety (I am going to assume this means game to game; that's something important to my group in any case) I am going to recommend Temporum, which had a lot of buzz a month or so ago in this thread. It is the new DXV (Dominion guy) game that is most like Dominion with card variance at the beginning of each game and interacting rules on cards. It plays 2-5 players and scales well at any number, the theme is a lot more prevalent than Dominion, and it has interesting strategic decisions (i.e. it's not just all luck) but has simple play steps like Dom. (Also I want more people to buy it so that it gets an expansion as soon as possible.)
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Jan 6, 2015 17:50
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Echophonic posted:Well, Abu Simbel needs leaders and I think the Great Wall expects Leaders and Cities. It has a dove, at least. Manikin Pis and Stonehenge should be fine? You can still use side A of Great Wall without any issues. And honestly, while side B uses expansion symbols there is nothing that you need from the actual expansions in order to run it (except an understanding of the rules). In a pinch you can use the negative military markers in place of debt tokens for stage 3.
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Jan 7, 2015 18:08
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jivjov posted:How are debt tokens supposed to work anyway? I bought the companion app and have used Cupertino a couple times, which also has a broken-coin pay-the-bank symbol on it. They are pretty simple. The paying player takes debt tokens for each coin he cannot (or decides not to) pay when the broken coin comes up. So if a -3 comes up, and I only have 2 coins, I would have to take at least one debt token, but I could also decide to take up to 3 debt tokens if I want to keep my money. The debt tokens are just -1's to VP, and they can't be "paid back" at a later time. Which is why I said the military things would work as a substitute (unless there is a card that counts your military tokens, like I think one of the guilds does, although I can't remember if that is in the base game). EDIT: Beaten by dishwasherlove, but I had a little more detail so leaving this here.
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Jan 8, 2015 00:27
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SuccinctAndPunchy posted:Strategists's Guild and yes, it's in the base game. Bah! Well then for simplicity's sake I would just use the "pay down to 0" variant that Poopy Palpy mentioned, unless you want to substitute another token in.
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Jan 8, 2015 00:30
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I also want to toss this out there about Dominion - I feel like a lot of people tend to forget the perspective of a new player coming into it and judge the base set on pure hindsight. Like it is easy now to see the glaring flaws in the base set of Dominion and wish there were a few less duds and a few more interesting choices, but this completely ignores the newbie experience. For example, a new player is not going to see how little interaction there is in the base set because: 1) they will be way too busy trying to figure out how the game works anyway, and 2) they will not realize that more than half of the base set's attack/interatcion cards suck, so they will play them a lot more anyway. Like someone on the last page mentioned how "only Militia and Witch" were interactive, and an experienced player will probably look at a board with Spy and Thief on it and see no interaction because those cards are total duds, but a new player will not see it this way. Thief in particular is a big one that people try to figure out "fixes" for, but they forget what a learning experience Thief is for a new player; at first it seems really powerful and people play it a ton. Base Dominion is perfect for new players because it is incredibly simple to learn and play and still mechanically strong even compared to newer deck builders. It is also going to be a lot more exciting than experienced players will give it credit for because they are looking at it through the filter of years of experience. The fact that it is expandable into the absolute best deck builder out there is a bonus, not a drawback.
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Jan 9, 2015 18:28
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fozzy fosbourne posted:I agree, and honestly I think it's worth stating that total newbies will appreciate something like Marvel Legendary more than us and it's easy to take that for granted. Sure, and that might come down to familiarity with the characters or the excitement of the theme or whatever, and obviously I am not going to challenge anyone for personally liking a game better. But as someone who has more experience I would recommend Dominion over it because I think it is a richer game mechanically, the depth increases the longevity, and it expands wonderfully. Marvel might be great for someone going to an FLGS game night or something to try things out, but if someone is purchasing a game because they want to ease themselves into the hobby, I am going to recommend Dominion over any other deckbuilder 100% of the time. Also a lot of critiques being levied against the base set in particular are based on years of hindsight that a new player will not have, so it is going to be a more exciting experience than it is getting credit for.
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Jan 9, 2015 18:58
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PerniciousKnid posted:I agree with this. Even if new players don't realize that Spy and Thief are crap, they do realize that they're boring and make the game take longer. I think Intrigue is harder to learn, but it's not that much harder. In return, you get much more interesting interactions. I still feel like it takes awhile to get to that point, and once they do they are ready to move onto different games or expansions. When people are still in the "Village Idiot" phase, they are going to buy a lot of Spies, and Thief seems powerful at first until it doesn't. The point is people will play with them and they will be interactive until everyone realizes how weak they are, but that's a whole learning process. I do wish Spy was slightly more powerful though, and that there was a much more interesting 5th attack than Bureaucrat (which seems like it belongs in Intrigue anyway with the VP card theme). I am fine with Thief, and fine with the interactivity in the base set when it comes to beginners. Intrigue does blow it out of the water for interactivity though, attacks with choices are the most interesting type of attack.
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Jan 9, 2015 20:34
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rchandra posted:I like Black Market too, but it's logistically annoying. We shuffle the stack of randomizers to make the deck (potion cards included IFF we already have them), but you can't just put those in your deck thanks to the backs, and digging for odd cards is a little annoying when you buy them and really annoying when the game is done. I took a bunch of the blank cards and labelled them in pairs A, B, C, etc. Then I put one of blank card A into the deck and put the randomizer on the other copy of blank card A. It's interesting because this was something that didn't come up in playtesting, since Donald X's prototype just uses the 10th card of every deck as the randomizer. Also, he considers Tournament a "fixed" variant of Black Market, since it introduces cards from outside the game but in a less haphazard and random way.
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Jan 18, 2015 19:02
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Elysium posted:Just use the blue backs. Just think of it as another small bonus to buying a black market card. We also use the blue backs, then if someone wants to purchase the card they have to get it from the relevant box. It is not ideal but it is better than building the deck, and there are a lot of times you just want the extra $2 from black market and nothing appealing comes up in the draw. Nowadays we usually only pull 3-ish sets out at a time so that makes it even easier to just use the unused randomizers and pull from those 3 boxes.
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Jan 18, 2015 21:35
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GrandpaPants posted:Has anyone played Machi Koro with the Harbor expansion yet? Does it make the game more fun or does it just have the added "benefit" of a market row now? It depends on what you find fun about MK and what you felt was missing in the base game. Obviously it is still a game about being paid by rolling dice, so it's not going to improve on the core of the game. The key thing it adds is variety in the opening card selection. You'll still see a lot of the cards because they get replenished Ascension style (with the twist that copies of cards already out there stack up) but this makes the opening build up process a little less stale. What it trades for that is removing the static setup that let you plan ahead, and adds more of a luck element as the perfect card can flip for your opponents before you can buy it. The other thing it adds is more landmarks, which adds (a little) length to the game, but allows you to use your higher cost landmarks a little more during the end game. For me personally, I like the added variety (after being spoiled by Dominion I am huge on game to game variety), but the randomness makes it seem even more automatic and the added length pushes it just out of my range for "light filler" and into a medium length game where it just can't match up against the others we play.
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Jan 20, 2015 16:51
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BonHair posted:Dominion feels like a mechanic that someone forgot to put in a game. (I honestly feel like this, but I should probably try it again some day) The problem is that it is such a robust and time consuming "mechanic" that incredibly few games have been able to successfully integrate it as part of another game. Mage Knight is one of the few that has, and it was made by one of the best game designers on the planet, and it still doesn't explore the full depths of the mechanic to the extent that Dominion has. Lorini posted:You don't need to try it again. Seriously there are so many games out there now, don't waste time with something that doesn't have what you are looking for. Do not listen to this man! Dominion is the gold standard of deck building games and worth the effort of playing a few times to see what you can get out of it. This doesn't mean you have to go out and buy the game and a bunch of the expansions but if the opportunity arises at a game meet or something then by all means try it again. It's like if you are having difficulty with an acclaimed novel. Don't just give up on it, see what you can get out of the experience, even if that thing is a better understanding of what you do and don't like about it.
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Jan 20, 2015 18:04
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Schizoguy posted:Could you play Machi Koro with ten random stacks of cards instead of a market row? I thought about this. My guess is that this would cause gaps in numbers and make for some really lovely setups if you were constantly rolling a number that just flat out wasn't there, or where a few numbers dominated. Also it would probably throw off the balance between the single and double dice numbers, and each setup would have a clearly better path. I think a better solution would be to try to build customized setups, sort've like the pregenerated kingdoms in Dominion. You could probably start with the one from the base game and then swap in expansion cards for certain numbers, remove card, see what has synergy and whatnot. This way you could keep it somewhat balanced while still having some form of game to game variety.
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Jan 20, 2015 18:16
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BonHair posted:What man? Lorini is a woman, isn't she? OH! Maybe? If so I apologize! I need to remember to use neutral gender nouns/pronouns when I am unsure, that is my bad. My point was, if you are willing to try it again (which you stated) and don't have a lot of experience with it (which I admit I assumed), then it is worth it to at least see what you do and don't like about it. I tend to disagree with the philosophy of just moving on to something you enjoy more; I have figured out a lot more of what I like (and more importantly, why I like it) by playing and replaying things I don't like.
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Jan 20, 2015 18:32
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The End posted:I think you mean Add this to the playlist as well https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3xZmlUV8muY
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Jan 23, 2015 20:49
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Countblanc posted:I can see being bummed about it in this modern age of kickstarters that regularly hit 120k+ on theme and novelty alone, but also that's scummy as gently caress. From the guy's description of "still in the 'where's-the-fun' stage", it sounded like he absolutely thought he had an original theme that he could glide to popularity on, and was disappointed that someone took the theme and actually did something completely unique with it.
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Feb 16, 2015 23:30
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JoshTheStampede posted:The pages long dogpile whenever anyone says they don't would seem to imply otherwise. The bigger issue is that most people don't say "I don't like this game just due to personal preference of what I look for in a game" they usually say "game X sucks because of Y". So of course fans of game X will argue the point if it's nonsense. It's okay to not like good games or to like bad games but you should try not to confuse personal preference for an actual reflection of design quality. This goes for stuff like movies, music, and literature and is basically the source of 90%+ of internet arguments about stuff like this.
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Mar 9, 2015 02:33
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I actually think the learning experience in base Dominion is incredibly valuable. Intrigue always seems like a better version of the base set with the luxury of hindsight but at the time I still thought Dominion was incredibly fresh and exciting. I guess it depends on whether you have played the game with any other people, or even read any of the theory (or I guess at this point played any other deck builders). If you are going in totally fresh to the game and genre, get the base game, if you have some experience, get Intrigue.
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Mar 13, 2015 21:42
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AMooseDoesStuff posted:Honestly I'm just kinda amazed that DVX and Sirlin get into slapfights on an internet forum. Ehhh it wasn't really a slapfight between them, kind of disappointing really. Sirlin posted Tuesday night whining about how picked on he is then the next day DXV responded to a Sirlin supporter to give his side of an encounter he and Sirlin had at a conference years back. Neither of them has posted since and aside from DXV just recounting the same story he has said before, there weren't any barbs flung in either direction. EDIT: Going back through the thread it's pretty obnoxious to begin with: "why is this designer I like not as highly rated as one of the most prolific and well respected designers in the industry??" Guy A. Person fucked around with this message at 18:07 on Mar 19, 2015 |
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Mar 19, 2015 18:04
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Crackbone posted:Stop the presses somebody is iterating on good ideas, guess we should just go back to Catan since it was first. Lol dude at the very least he blatantly ripped off the graphic design. As if the only way to have titles on a chip is on a banner in one of those specific shades. Or the only way to represent "+ action" or "+ cards" is with an arrow or chip icon like the first guy used. Like gently caress it is supposed to be fighting game right? Couldn't the action icon be like a fist or something? I came up with this alternate design in 40 seconds. Also iterating on good ideas is cool but at the very least contact the dude ahead of time and say "hey this looks cool mind if I turn this into another game?" or pay him for the design or something StashAugustine posted:How different is the game from Dominion in terms of actual rules? The core "deck building" rules are remarkably similar although with the whole chip pool (or whatever the hell the stack of chips is called I haven't played it in a long rear end time) and the circular attacking it plays drastically differently. Like I think he actually is one of the few who took Dominion and made it into something pretty significantly different, especially in relation to other games that came out in a similar time frame. I don't have any beef with him "copying" Dominion, it's a much different game
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Mar 20, 2015 00:53
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Jimbozig posted:"Also, my creation is a wonderful gift to game designers. Sad that none of them are good enough to deserve such a great gift." DXV has a super weird way of speaking but he is actually pretty humble about Dominion. One thing he repeatedly says is "two guys thought of calculus", and that just because he happened to think of deck building first doesn't mean it wouldn't have been created eventually. He also almost without fail will mention a deckbuilding game that he would like to try along with that line (usually Mage Knight but he has also mentioned a Few Acres of Snow and maybe others). He is mostly ragging on poo poo like Tanto Cuore and clones with that line, the stuff that is just a blatant ripoff.
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Mar 20, 2015 01:19
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Bubble-T posted:The action arrow makes perfect sense from a fighting game standpoint, it's the one used to signify movement inputs required before you hit punch/kick/whatever to do a move. Fists are a symbol on the 'aggressive' chips that do something to your opponent's stuff. That's actually a good point, the arrows do remind me of the old SF instruction manuals showing moves. quote:The issue isn't that Sirlin used these design choices because, let's be honest, most of them a super-loving-obvious (a banner like on dominion cards, a circle to represent a chip, genius ideas!). Sirlin's right that changing things for the sake of it would be silly. He should just give proper credit to the guy who made the Dominion chips, that's all. The banners in particular irritate the hell out of me because they're pointless design for PS outside of Sirlin just being too lazy to change them. They make perfect sense for Dominion because they look like the borders of actual cards which are reminiscent of medieval heraldry. If Sirlin had changed these to something more generic like just a solid bar across the top, and maybe even changed the color scheme to anything but an exact copy of the Dom chips, he would get so much less poo poo about these. They really don't have to look exactly the same, they only do out of laziness.
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Mar 20, 2015 14:38
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Elysium posted:DXV said an expansion would depend on base game sales, which judging by the the lack of hype and activity on BGG (if that's any measure) I would say are not that great. He actually made a post about that in the past week and it sounds more optimistic: DXV posted:I won't know for sure it will happen until the printer has the files and there's a date for it. It's tentatively happening though. Alayna has agreed to do the art and it's waiting on her finishing another project. The design/playtesting has been done for a while.
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Mar 20, 2015 16:12
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Poopy Palpy posted:Chips make shuffling easier, but shuffling is really loving easy. Chips make the following essential manipulations harder: You also need supplemental accessories to simulate basic properties of a deck of cards. I.E. you need a bag or some other container to simulate a randomly shuffled deck, and a screen to have a hidden hand of cards. This is a lot of extra cost to save like 5 seconds per shuffle.
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Mar 20, 2015 19:23
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McNerd posted:I am a huge fan of Dominion and it may well be the better game, but I can list a lot of things Temporum does better: Yeah comparing Dominion in its current state to Temporum in its current state is probably unfair. I think base Temporum is much more solid than base Dominion, and it's obviously due to DXV's growth as a designer. I don't think it has the depth to reach Dominion levels even with expansions, because I don't think new zone cards/player cards will have the impact that new kingdom cards do with every Dominion expansion.
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Mar 20, 2015 22:33
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jivjov posted:I've gone whole hog on Dominion...Was gonna pick up Seaside today, ended up adding Alchemy (and some other misc. stuff) to a Cool Stuff order to get to $100 for free shipping, and I went ahead and picked up all the promo cards off the BGG store too. In order for the central mechanic (cards with a potion in the cost) to be worthwhile, the designer needed to make all of the cards both powerful and chainable so they would be worth buying in games with only one of them. They're not terrible but they lead to some one note strategies, some large action chains which slow down the game, and they increase the luck factor (if you get your potion with 3 estates while someone buys their first potion cost it can be frustrating) which is why it isn't super popular. You should still have fun, just don't follow the rulebook's advice about making sure there are at least 3 Alchemy cards in any game, one or two work fine. And dilute the pool with the other expansions ASAP (since it sounds like you are getting hooked you will probably want to anyway).
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Mar 28, 2015 01:30
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Yeah but once you have all of the expansions you have more than enough blank cards to proxy the good cards. That's what we did with Apprentice, never did with Herbalist although we have the extras for it.
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Mar 28, 2015 04:54
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taser rates posted:First of the Dominion Adventures previews is up, holy poo poo. There was also a bonus post for another card, Storyteller: http://dominionstrategy.com/2015/03/30/adventures-preview-1-storyteller/ Apparently in addition to the 3 they are previewing each morning they are having a Dominion Strategy poster preview another one in the afternoon. Storyteller initially looks extremely powerful then kinda weak then potentially powerful but situational. People on their forums have mentioned a few combos with the specialty treasures but I would have to play with it to get a better feel for what would work.
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Mar 30, 2015 19:46
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Lorini posted:Also while the IPad has historically been the platform of choice for board game conversions, Android tablets are making some inroads, specifically because Google only takes a 10% cut vs Apple's 30% cut. I could do a lot of things with $500, that doesn't mean I can't also buy an IPad with it. I guarantee in the next few years we are going to be seeing more html 5/js libraries that allow games on both devices. It sucks losing a large percentage of your audience even if you do like the features when programming natively.
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Mar 31, 2015 19:52
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PerniciousKnid posted:Intrigue is my favorite Dominion expansion, I guess because I'm a boring person. I enjoy the simplicity of it compared to how crazy some of the later sets get. I almost always play kingdoms with at least 50% base or Intrigue cards. This is why Hinterlands is still my favorite set. It is as polished as the later sets but still simple and the "on gain" mechanic isn't as crazy while still being a super versatile idea. Also it has a ton of cool interactive stuff. It makes sense because at one point it was going to be a standalone
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Apr 2, 2015 06:12
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fozzy fosbourne posted:Yeah, at a glance, Trade seems like it would be degenerate in a lot of kingdoms. These events can be used in addition to a terminal action, right? Since they trigger off of a buy? Yeah events are something you straight up buy during your buy phase, so they don't cost any actions or whatever, they are just an effect that happens immediately. So Trade does not seem all that overpowered because remember you have to spend $5 during your buy phase and then trash from your hand, meaning at minimum you would need 2 silvers and a copper to trash the other 2 cards in your hand. So it's not something that is going to enable heavy trashing from the get-go.
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Apr 2, 2015 16:18
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Jabor posted:Note that this is literally a joke card from a joke set that isn't legal for tournament play because every card in it is a joke. Honestly having not played Magic in like 10 years I a) figured out it was a joke and 2) still pretty much got the jist of what it is supposed to do (it's intentionally stupidly worded but you just have to keep track of one of two events and then their outcomes). Magic is actually pretty solid for having new cards come out all the loving time. If it wasn't so hilariously obviously trying to steal all of my money from me I might be interested in following it.
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Apr 10, 2015 16:44
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The last time I played Galaxy Trucker our AP guy was first in line for rounds 2 and 3, so made all decisions for those rounds. You wouldn't think it would take long to decide if you want to lose 2 flight days to get some cargo from an abandoned space station when you are already 6 days ahead, but welp.
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Apr 10, 2015 20:53
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Lorini posted:No, they can't change the past, you're right about that. The plaintext passwords however, were changed years ago. They were also done by a completely different company. Goko no longer exists, Making Fun is now handling Dominion Online. EDIT: to add more to this, this is pretty exciting news. I had written off Dominion Online after Goko made a giant cluster gently caress mess out of it. I knew that Making Fun has taken over a little while back, but they didn't seem to be fixing things. Reading this guy's posts, it sounds like Making Fun has to keep the Goko version up and running while creating a completely new version it from scratch to correct all the mistakes. But at the same time it sounds like they have a much better plan and a better idea on how to do things overall. Tentatively looking forward to this now. Guy A. Person fucked around with this message at 19:04 on Apr 22, 2015 |
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Apr 22, 2015 18:59
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fozzy fosbourne posted:I'd argue it's an official variant rather than house rule. Gotta agree as well. It's true even to the extent that there have been in depth discussions with Donald X on dominion strategy and other forums about the best way to deal with banning/vetoing cards in the next iteration of Dominion Online, with Donald strongly in favor of integrating a multi-tiered solution that works for everyone. It's also why you have things like the suggested sets and the kingdom design challenges on dominion strategy; the nature of the game means there will be one-note setups, so advanced players are going to want more control over kingdoms to create something interesting and unique. I also believe they use pre-built/pre-approved sets in competitive Dominion so you don't get a championship game that's like "oh welp Rebuild is in this kingdom, guess everyone will just spam that and we'll see who gets luckiest". There's not really a great solution for sitting down with strangers, but you can try to discuss with them if they do vetoing or whatever, it's something a lot of groups do. I get the argument that it is a non-ideal workaround, but I also feel like it's been a part of the game since day one. In the base game you have the randomizers but also the suggested sets which are contradictory ideas, and the original rulebook states "players can choose the 10 Kingdom cards using any method they agree on". I also don't really see a better solution outside of just drastically limiting the amount of cards and ideas, which seems boring and can still lead to something like an "all village" game regardless of how well the cards are balanced.
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Apr 27, 2015 17:41
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