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Crabtree posted:It also makes Power Armor training actually seem necessary now that you are literally climbing into a human shaped tank instead of just putting on some future fully body armored suit, but it looks like both will be given to you very early on by the main story. I'm reasonably sure that getting Power Armor early is going to be like the earlier Fallouts. Assuming the Power Armor quest is early on, I wouldn't be surprised that it's trashed to hell during the fight with the Deathclaw and repairing/rebuilding it is an ongoing thing. Sort of like how in certain games you start off as Max Level All Abilities Guy to give you a taste of what you eventually will be, but then knocks you down to a Level 1 Guy. You might get a suit of Power Armor early on that becomes your endgame armor, but in the interim its either a rebuilding project and/or a temporary thing. Crabtree posted:As for lovely vaults, these are products of a private company hired by the same old world that was fine with groups of scientists conducting all sorts of experiments on the general population to cut costs or create a weapon or tech before the enemy did. F.E.V. was developed as both cure for a goddamn New Plague released by China and a hopeful shortcut to infectious evolution of America. Of course their contingency plans for saving their desired portion of the human race are going to be mostly tainted by the same shortsighted profit margins, general sadism and incompetence that led them all to nuclear war. My point is that I don't really like the "general sadism" aspect of it. There's plenty of reasons for Vaults to fail (shortsightedness in the seeking of profit, as you mentioned) without being Snidey Whiplash. Ravenfood posted:The rear end in a top hat ones are the real ones. The through-line From 1-NV is that the 'real ones' are dead ones. They won't help the world outside their own, suffer for it. The Brotherhood that realizes that they can't just steal technology from tribals anymore and become part of society (The Widwest group, the Capitol Wasteland group) survives and thrives. MisterBibs fucked around with this message at 22:32 on Jun 15, 2015 |
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Jun 15, 2015 22:29
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Walrus Pete posted:I'm with you. The worst part is that so many people do it, though. IIRC, BioWare once revealed that something crazy like 70% of all players played the default male Shepard as the soldier class (AKA the one without fun powers) in Mass Effect. It's baffling. It wasn't baffling; it was baffling (if hilarious) that goon/goon-type folks were baffled by it. It's the same reason why the Warrior in Diablo 2 is the one that defeats Diablo, whereas the Mage and Archer/Thief become bad guys: the player is the Combat Guy, the other characters are the Magic Guys and the Thief Guys.
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Jun 16, 2015 19:43
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The name thing is cool to me because I distinctly remember discovering in Black & White that if you named your character with a normal name, it'd occasionally whisper that name in the night.
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Jun 16, 2015 22:48
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SexyCommando posted:If it happens repeatedly then it's a Um, no, you simply reload until the acceptable result happens, just like in X-COM. SunAndSpring posted:Bethesda really needs to stop relying on essential NPCs as a crutch. If someone in a quest can die, write a new path around it rather than just making him invincible. I literally can't remember the game, but there was some Russian post-apoc game that had this, and it resulted in "can't turn in this mission; quest giver got into a random fight and died" nonsense.
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Jun 17, 2015 01:20
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scenario and you just gotta accept fate and live with it.
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Republican Vampire posted:New Vegas might have had a barebones story but they at least tried to make the player feel like the protagonist by not trying to force you into the oh so deep and amaze story that the developers thought so highly of. You saying that makes no sense to me, because New Vegas was way more "Here's your guy/backstory, here's the characters/factions you're supposed to feel one way or another about, now pick one of four stories to play" than previous Fallouts. They specifically flooded half the map with Deadly Monsters Of Deadly Death for the sole purpose of funneling you through a narrow worldbuilding path so that you don't just peace-out of the Mojave after delivering the Chip. New Vegas's plot lives or dies on you feeling something for the major factions of the story. I would contrast this with Fallout 3, wherein the more nebulous path of direction (sure, you're led to Megaton, but there's nothing stopping you from going in another direction) leads to a more macro-based motivation for players. In 3 it's not about which monolithic group you want to install into power, it's about all remembering those random people and their stories as you go along. This is boltered by the fact that in 3, more of its locations tell a self-contained story than NV.
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Jun 17, 2015 04:10
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Republican Vampire posted:Yeah New Vegas had so much more backstory about your guy and you're totally railroaded. That's the thing, you are. There's a reason why Obsidian took out the "And the Courier left New Vegas" ending. Not to mention, Lonesome Road is specifically about what your character did before the setting of the game. Republican Vampire posted:What with that huge set piece at the start about your childhood and your dad and how your dad turned out to be the centerpiece of the entire story and you spent the whole main quest running around asking people HAVE YOU SEEN MY DAD WHERE'S MY DAD OH WOW MY DAD DID ALL KINDS OF COOL poo poo. That's no different than New Vegas essentially forcing you to walk the long way around to the titular city: to try and get you to feel something for the character/place in question. You can get your average player invested with a familial hook because we all have families and most of us don't hate our parents or something. If anything, NV had to do it more because there's no baseline give-a-poo poo about a fictional city.
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Jun 17, 2015 05:02
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Republican Vampire posted:And what the Courier did is fetch quests. Did you just not get that DLC or what? The whole point is that the courier is a generic video game character. No, I got all the DLC. Your predefined character in NV has a concrete backstory and the game railroads you into content much more than 3 or previous Fallout games. Republican Vampire posted:It doesn't force you. It's harder to make it the other way, but there are more than enough stealth boys and magazines to go a different way. Sorry, but I reject that. If 10% of it is for e-peen, 90% of that path is to railroad the player into the path that force-feeds you poo poo To Care About. The main railroaded route in NV is an extended version of what Fallout 3 managed to do in the Baby->Toddler->Teenager stuff. The game fails on a story level if you get to Vegas without being told why the city is important, so you actively discourage any other path than one that does so. Republican Vampire posted:Finally, you're fundamentally misunderstanding my point. Fallout 3 goes over why you should care and why it's so important over and over again. No, I understand it, I think you've got 3 and NV backwards in that respect. NV does (and has to) go over how important the Big Groups in question are, because you start with zero fucks about a made up city. 3 doesn't have to do any of that because, ya know, you're told its your character's dad and "your dad left you and you want to find out where he went" is something that works for most people.
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Jun 17, 2015 06:04
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Acebuckeye13 posted:The purpose of the intro in Fallout 3 is to introduce your character's extremely rigid backstory, of which a part is "You have a dad". Quick, brief, innately effective since everyone has a family and the sudden loss of one works well in the motivation department. Acebuckeye13 posted:And if you need to be told why an intact pre-war city is important in a loving Fallout game, I don't even know what to tell you, except for the fact that you missed the entire loving point-the city's not important, it's the Dam. Given that New Vegas (as a story) is basically the Scouring Of The Shire or the Fifth Season of Babylon 5 (since the Super Mutants and Enclave were removed from the picture in F1 and F2, respectively, removing the series only two Significant Threats), and the city itself is a relatively-ruined place run by barely-above-tribals, yes, I do need to be told why these things are important. I'm not saying that there was anything wrong with them needing such a long railroading aspect to get players motivated, I'm simply pointing out how railroaded NV is. Acebuckeye13 posted:Finding your lovely dad who abandoned you is a compelling character hook, but "Find the person who shot you and took your stuff" isn't? Where are you getting "lovely dad" from? But to answer your question, "Find your dad" is much more compelling.
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Jun 17, 2015 07:10
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Bicyclops posted:Scavenger: Alright, pudgy. Only one of us is getting the material from this settlement, so let's see you draw. Deep down, Norm loved his wife and would be with her if the bombs dropped.  From a few pages back: Crabtree posted:No one wants to admit that no matter what we actually think about the game or how it turns out, Fallout 4 will sell enough to be a ridiculous success. It just doesn't matter. Even if we get the most ground breaking writing found in any form of fiction; even if we all are so over the moon by learning just how these post-apocalyptic societies function, from what they eat to how they poo poo, that our noses bleed from a week to ten days; even if Chris Avellone himself descends from Heaven above to pen every single conversation line so well that it touches our very lives and makes us all better people; even if every man, woman, dork and child came together to say that video games are cool, it just wouldn't matter because all the "important" reviewers will give Fallout 4 10/10s and Bethesda will make 10 times whatever they spent developing it from the stupid app alone. It doesn't matter if we love it or hate it. Would it be accurate to define Goon/Goon-type opinions on Fallout as, for lack of a better term, 'Second-Generation NMA'? The position hasn't changed ("The older game was better than this newer one! Stop laughing at me!"), but the older game has shifted from 1/2 to NV.
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Jun 19, 2015 16:21
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King Vidiot posted:Wouldn't really be accurate at all because New Vegas is the best Fallout, and it's not even that old. Yes, that's the point I'm making. You might think it's the best Fallout, but there's plenty of people who'll react with a  response to that now, much less after 4 comes out.It's still what NMA mentality, just attached to a different game. MisterBibs fucked around with this message at 20:58 on Jun 19, 2015 |
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Jun 19, 2015 20:49
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Generation Internet posted:I believe you'll find that it was actually aliens according to the critically acclaimed DLC Mothership Zeta Except that in Mothership Zeta, the relevant fact is that the aliens were denied the info that they would've needed to start the war.
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Nov 6, 2015 09:42
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Fintilgin posted:An enjoyable shoot'em/loot'em set in a fanfiction version of the Fallout universe. It's not the fanfiction version of the Fallout universe if its the dudes who own the thing are making it, though? It's just the Fallout universe.
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Nov 6, 2015 19:06
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Related to needing power cores to run power armor, one thing I'm kinda worried about is needing to find poo poo for upgrades. I can see the idea of "Ok I need to find a toothbrush, a piece of duct tape, and a can of red paint, hope I find them in the random loot" thing becoming wearing after a while. Like, repair kits in New Vegas were so good that you started stockpiling all the otherwise-vendor-trash stuff in advance, because if you didn't (and sometimes, even if you did). you had to go on a Hunt For Some Goddamned Wonderglue.
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Nov 6, 2015 20:15
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Generation Internet posted:I think it'll actually be much better, because instead of needing the exact wonderglue/paint-gun/whatever that always meant I never made anything in the last game, you just need resources that you can scrap from junk. Wonderglue and duct-tape give you adhesive, tin cans give you metal, stuff like that. Yeah, I recall reading about how you break down poo poo into resources, I'm just worried that finding enough resources will be a minor pain-in-the-rear end. I guess it'll come down to how much variation there is in Junk -> Specific Resource. Like, if four things produce Item X, it'll be a lot less annoying than having to seek out just one or two things.
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Nov 6, 2015 20:26
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Hell, don't most of the BoS-centric endings in NV have them trundling off into irrelevancy or death?
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Nov 7, 2015 06:05
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TG-Chrono posted:It's like Bethesda fans haven't seen Obsidian's latest effort, God's own Pillars of Eternity Mainstream gamers not knowing about the spiritual sequel of a game that nobody played? I'm shocked.
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Nov 9, 2015 23:59
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The character planner has revealed to me that I should've, on at least some level, conceptualized what I want to do before hours pre-release.
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Nov 10, 2015 04:12
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At last we know what really started the War. Both sides collectively having a "  killitkillitkillit" moment, focused on you.
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Nov 10, 2015 04:25
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JoshTheStampede posted:I think they create the atmosphere they want to create, it just doesn't make sense logically that stuff would still be that bad 200 years later. They are more than happy to handwave timeline stuff like that in order to make stuff the correct amount of apocalyptic. Fallout is post-apocalyptic, not post-post-apocalyptic. The whole setting is "humanity survives and rebuilds, but doesn't rebuild that much." Logic about everything being hunky-dory 200 years later isn't true in this setting. When stuff gets too well preserved or 'normal', you get New "PLEASE PLEASE care about this random city that doesn't have the Enclave or Super Mutants to threaten it" Vegas.
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Nov 10, 2015 04:42
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New Vegas will likely be ignored, story-wise, because nothing of import happened, if you look at things from the perspective of anywhere else in the setting. Some folks fought over some landmark for some reason, but who cares cuz there's a Super Mutant/Enclave remnant /Something Significant attack right here.
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Nov 10, 2015 05:17
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How do you tell Dogmeat to stop following you? Just tell him to stay at a certain point and he will? I heard talk of being able to build a doghouse for him, but I don't see the option. I can't wait for a mod that keeps a targeting reticle up when you hold right click to zoom in. Why Iron Sights is a thing in games now, I'll never know. Few hours in, and I'm already having more fun than NV.
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Nov 10, 2015 17:13
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Starhawk64 posted:So what's the goon hivemind consensus of this game? Is it a buggy piece of poo poo that I should wait on buying so it can get patched? It's a Bethesda game: it's got minor problems, but it's fun as hell and most of the annoyances would've been ignored if the Favored Developer had done them.
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Nov 10, 2015 17:28
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Zaphod42 posted:The only thing I haven't liked so far was Hey here's your wife, whoops, now she's dead. That's purely character motivation, not player motivation. I as the player have no idea who my wife is as a person and have no real reason to give a poo poo about her other than you telling me that my character does. That's really weak storytelling. I'm not sure if this is a bit or not. It's your character's wife and baby we're talking about. Everyone in the world has a family. Every Fallout with proper motivation had a family-based motivation. In 1, your extended family would die without a Water Chip. In 2, your extended family will die without a GECK. In 3, your father escapes. In 4, someone shoots your wife and steals your infant son.
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Nov 10, 2015 17:47
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Fish Fry Andy posted:It's destiny, if you talk to the psychic crackhead old lady and pass a speech check she'll tell you that it's like your first trial or some dumb poo poo like that. That "dumb poo poo" she says is "There's something out there that is hearing the fighting we've been doing and the noise is literally attracting it to us." Zaphod42 posted:I'm fine with the motivation in the game being "family". But that family needs to feel like the player's family, not the player's character's family. See the difference? Not at all. You're shown you were in a stable, loving relationship with a wife/husband and a child, and both are taken from you. MisterBibs fucked around with this message at 18:23 on Nov 10, 2015 |
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Nov 10, 2015 18:19
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Anime Schoolgirl posted:Reminder that MisterBibs tried for eight hours in vain to get past Cazador And Deathclaw Alley because the thought of going the other direction or sneaking never occurred to him I don't know where you're getting this from. I never tried in vain to get there. I corrected the flaw preventing open world access with a mod that had Cazador and Deathclaw Alley much more lifeless. Zaphod42 posted:Right, you're shown. That's it. And in videogames you can do so much more. Given how some people couldn't grasp/accept the basic motivation of "my father escaped the Vault and I'm going to find him" from 3, I doubt any developer can fix Beep Boop Why Is Family Important in some people. (paradoxically, I imagine this is the point where you claim NV made you care about the titular city, heh) MisterBibs fucked around with this message at 18:30 on Nov 10, 2015 |
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Nov 10, 2015 18:27
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Anime Schoolgirl posted:they're given all of two minutes of characterization compared to the hour or so better-suited-to-this-sort-of-thing games would let you play through before killing them, it's pretty hard for the player to care about someone they know for all of two minutes Player rushes through game section where you learn about your characters family (there's like, a dozen things you can Activate in the house) , complains about not having enough to care about the character's family. Harrow posted:I didn't have to care about the city on a macro level. That wasn't the point. So, yes, you're paradoxically saying that the fate of random towns, for a dude whose job keeps him from putting down roots, is somehow stronger than "My literal father left me" and "My child was stolen from me and my spouse was killed".
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Nov 10, 2015 18:42
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Zaphod42 posted:I'm sure my character cares a whole lot, but I'm not my character. It's not a distinction because it doesn't exist. Never in Fallout has your character been a shell to pour your own motivations into. You're always playing a defined character with plot-dictated motivations. The particulars on how you accomplish those motivations are different (and utterly immaterial since 'How you did it' never gets brought up) but you're still playing someone. There is no way to play Fallout 1 that doesn't lead to V13 surviving, Arroyo being founded. No way to play F2 that doesn't save Arroyo to some degree. The only outlier is New Vegas, whose developers removed the "And so the Courier hosed off after doing his job because that's all he was here for" ending. Which is a shame, since it's the only NV that makes sense for the defined character you're playing. The Walrus posted:Mister Bibbs heres a story for you about a man I call the Player Character 8/10. Game has done it's job, motivating me. MisterBibs fucked around with this message at 19:09 on Nov 10, 2015 |
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Nov 10, 2015 19:04
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that distinction is loving important dude.
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MAKE WAY NEW STARS posted:I liked VATS better when it stopped time. Same. I think the mouse lag has something to do with it, since by the time I've figured out the precise place to put the cursor to target X, the dude has moved enough that I'm now targeting Y.
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Nov 10, 2015 20:02
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Some questions that lot lost in the shuffle: how specifically do I tell Dogmeat to leave me alone? I told him to wait in a location, but fast travel brought him back to me. Is it related to building him a dog house? Because I don't know where that is in the crafting menu.
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Nov 10, 2015 21:35
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Fintilgin posted:So far, it feels like a willful rejection of the soul of Fallout that New Vegas tried to recapture. New Vegas represented Obsidian's attempt to argue that, in the modern age of gaming, they still know what Fallout is, or what's best for it. It's a statement that the West Coast of Fallout still matters, that there's still interesting threats to be had after Super Mutants and the Enclave are gone. Unfortunately, it was made after a company that had just brought back from the pit of unacceptability/obscurity by a mainstream developer. And it worked. They made a Fallout better than its original developers could hope to do. The only reason Obsidian was allowed to make NV was because Bethesda did the heavy lifting of creating an acceptable Fallout 3. Obsidian tried that (iirc) and the result was Van Buren. New Vegas, not 3 or 4, is a rejection of the soul of Fallout. MisterBibs fucked around with this message at 02:46 on Nov 11, 2015 |
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Nov 11, 2015 02:43
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Vanderdeath posted:No, seriously, how can anyone objectively say that Fallout 3 is a better game and story than New Vegas. Simple: Bethesda took a series abandoned/forgotten that I dug, and used their talents to make a better game out of it than the original ones. When the folks whose talents were responsible for the abandonment/forgetting made a game in the series after that, it was a step back. Can't fathom it? The NV thread is dotted with posters shocked that their friend/brother/mom/boyfriend/etc told them they like 3 over New Vegas. It's similar to Star Trek fans realizing that their friend couldn't stand DS9, or that Trek Show They Hate won yet another online contest... ImpAtom posted:Liberty Prime was apparently one of the most popular parts of FO3. I'm not big on him myself but they don't think that out of nowhere. We're talking about a scene where you follow a giant anti-communist robot defeating the remnants of the United States Government through a series of lasers, knocking down forcefields, and throwing nuclear bombs like footballs. How could it not be?
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Nov 11, 2015 03:14
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I never spent eight hours walking through Cazadore alley. Didn't have to, I modded half the preventing-sandbox-play Cazadores away. Course, Anime won't remember it that way... conversation piece posted:if this is true it is damning evidence that misterbibs is in fact incredibly stupid and should be ignored The feelies for Terror of the Deep made no sense to me. X-COM veterans talking about their buddies dying from the aliens? 8 soldiers deployed, 8 come back. MisterBibs fucked around with this message at 03:24 on Nov 11, 2015 |
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Nov 11, 2015 03:20
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Sigma-X posted:Having said that, Van Buren was made by Black Isle. Obsidian had people who worked on earlier Fallouts but they never made their own FO project until NV. Yeah, that's why I specifically used the phrase 'iirc' on that because I wasn't precisely sure about who specifically made Van Buren (I get Black Isle/Troika/etc mixed up given their shared fates). The point was that it took a comparitively outside company, Bethesda, to do Fallout properly in the modern era. Not surprisingly, an atavistic throwback wasn't as good to me. I'm sorry if I wasn't clear. MisterBibs fucked around with this message at 03:39 on Nov 11, 2015 |
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Nov 11, 2015 03:30
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Unrelated to the current discussion, do Feral Ghouls respawn (or just spawn depending where the player goes) in the Super Duper Mart or whatever it's called? Because holy poo poo there's a lot of them.
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Nov 11, 2015 04:05
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Dan Didio posted:They objectively didn't prevent a single thing You're right, Cazadore pruning allowing the player to go any direction is more accurately described as a bug fix. (pun not intended, although I wish it was.)
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Nov 11, 2015 04:24
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Boogaleeboo posted:It has like twice as many concurrent players as Skyrim peaked at. http://www.gamespot.com/articles/fallout-4-has-more-players-than-any-other-game-on-/1100-6432146/
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Nov 11, 2015 04:33
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Phrasing posted:The old woman that can see the future crawled under a workshop bench then teleported to the top of a house in Sanctuary Hills. There goes my soothsayer. I think that's a Thing because she did that to me. Eventually she came down. Then she requested I build her a chair.
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Nov 11, 2015 05:02
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Is there any way to schlep people from other settlements to another? I'd rather have Sanctuary be the only one I deal with, but my sperginess prevents me from not defending even the little ones with turrets and poo poo. Related, does the (super early quest) quest telling you to build a radio tower at the cleared out theater have to be done there, or can I build it in Sanctuary instead?
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Nov 11, 2015 05:41
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Dick Fagballzson posted:What's with all the 0's on metacritic? This is going to end up with a worse user review score than Big Rigs at the rate things are going. Fresh NMAers can't prevent a Bethesda Fallout from getting high critical scores or great commercial numbers that they feel it doesn't deserve, so they go for the moral victory of user scores to make themselves feel better. Before I restart, I'm having a bit of trouble wrapping my head around certain perks. The ones with bonuses to 1h/2h weapons work for ballistic and energy weapons, but the crafting perks for weapons is differentiated between low tech and high tech, right? Or are there low-tech upgrades that require the high-tech perks?
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Nov 11, 2015 08:41
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Zaphod42 posted:Save constantly. That's all. Just run around and have fun and explore and try new things, but SAVE CONSTANTLY. Why this isn't SOP for computer game players, regardless of game, I'll never figure out. Always be saving.  "I failed a speech check with my love interest!" Why don't you have a save before that convo, even if you're blind to what's coming up?  "I got stuck in a chair after using a terminal!" Load the save before you used it, you do have one, right? "Because of this, I had to load a save six hours of progress ago!" Why don't you have saves since then? If your X-COM facility needs to spend money on ink to write names on its memorial wall, you're doing it wrong. Always be saving. MisterBibs fucked around with this message at 17:50 on Nov 11, 2015 |
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Nov 11, 2015 17:47
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