USPOL Oct: So this is how the thread dies: with a Star Wars derail

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > USPOL Oct: So this is how the thread dies: with a Star Wars derail

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sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

Fox Ironic posted:

The shooter probably would have had a mental health intervention before they snapped? Or less economic stress would have allowed them to develop hobbies other than 4chan and killing people?

Are you Bernie Sanders?

Did you know some problems don't have an economic component as their major source?

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 01:06

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# ¿ May 13, 2024 00:21

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

LeJackal posted:

The thing is, you can make guns for a couple bucks with stuff from the hardware store. They won't be as pretty, but they will be lethal.

Yea and if you wanna get hosed up you can chug a bottle of tussin and chill, but that doesn't change the fact that heroin should probably stay illegal.

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 01:09

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

LeJackal posted:

Yeah, the War on Drugs has just been peachy keen and awesome for everyone. It's not like it's an engine of misery and a tool of racist oppression or anything.

Heroin shouldn't be legal apparently means I love all of the drug war, weird.

Anyway I love how the things shift from 'well criminals don't follow laws soooo' to 'well you can't get rid of EVERY gun sooo' to now I guess 'you can just MAKE a gun sooo'. Like, guns aren't a naturally occurring thing, man, we're not talking about regulating hurricanes, these are physical objects that exist only to put metal in things (almost always living things) from long distance, it seems most other developed nations have some level of handle on them.

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 01:15

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

Armyman25 posted:

Yeah, El Salvador's strict gun laws are working so well.

Yea I can't think of any other reason there'd be gun violence in El Salvador. It must be gun laws making it too hard for the Good Guys With Guns or something.

Do you think we're in the same position as El Salvador? Man dude I know hating america is a D&D meme but you're taking it too far.

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 01:19

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

Stereotype posted:

Also like 60% of the guns in El Salvador were illegally brought there from the US, where their purchase was legally allowed because we have so few gun laws.

Dude I don't know what you mean. Guns magically vanish when you cross state or national borders, that's why you have the smug 'hah Illinois has strong gun laws so there' thing without having to mention that its neighbors do not, or why we blame all the gun problems in Mexico on the savage aztec horde.

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 01:23

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

Hieronymous Alloy posted:

This is honestly just as well. These mass shootings are usually a kind of suicide attempt, and it is well documented that reporting on suicide attempts encourages more suicide attempts.

On the other hand thanks to the massively connected culture we have now not reporting this stuff leads to poo poo like in Boston where dudes just find a rando (spoiler: almost always some minority) and say 'oh this was it, let's hate him now' and the speculation and not knowing leads to witch hunts that almost always are used to justify bigotry. We already have people saying 'oh yea clearly this was a Muslim killing Christians' even with zero proof, the problem is that with those people doing it they're actively encouraging bigotry and sometimes even violence rather than just being nutballs now.

Like, imagine if it was super easy for the McVeigh had a muslim buddy during the OKC bombings to be spread nationally.

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 01:42

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

Armyman25 posted:

So you're still in favor of locking up poor people wholesale?

So do meth labs get a free pass then, or just zip guns?

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 01:53

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

Heh, queers, am I right fellow progressives.

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 02:04

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

Armyman25 posted:

No, not a free pass, just using it as an example. What will probably happen is the same thing that happened with meth, the local product will be supplanted by cheaper imports made in Mexico.

But...those cheap Mexican guns are often coming from us...

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 02:42

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

Gail Wynand posted:

It's a popular symbol in some punk and biker circles, doesn't automatically associate you with white supremacy.

Uh...those two circles have a lot of nazis...

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 03:01

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

Jagchosis posted:

McCarthy.

Even after he accidentally got caught telling the truth about the Benghazi stuff?

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 04:01

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

GreyjoyBastard posted:

Daniel Webster (R-FL), (the country's only) noted crusader against no-fault divorce.

I hear he has one powerful advocate

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 04:50

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

Job Truniht posted:

Wouldn't it be easier at this point to regulate ammunition instead of guns? We already have laws about stockpiling fertilizer.

For like five bucks you can get enough bullets to reasonably take out a lot of people and hide them in your pocket. Fertilizer costs a little more (the kind that makes things go boom at least) and is a bit harder to hide.

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 18:52

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

His Purple Majesty posted:

I'll repeat this question since you nanny state authortorians glossed over it,
Can no one answer this simple question?

Can you give us an actual year range for this instead of a vague and subjective legal era?

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 18:55

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

Also not naming these people leads to witch hunts and won't actually stop people from finding out with the tools we have these days. Voldemorting them is called that because the entire point of that bit in the books was not saying his name did literally nothing to stop him because that was never a factor in his deal.

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 18:57

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

Job Truniht posted:

Yeah, you can definitely go through rounds quick. I have no doubts about that, but nobody is going to start a mass shooting at a gun range.

Let me use some better wording: you can buy as much ammo as you want at a dealer and even take it with you, but you're in trouble if you leave it all sitting there within a month. I'd really like to. See what kind of people are keeping 1000+ rounds sitting around their house.

Depending on the time limit, what you're basically doing is forcing a mass shooter to:

a. Get lucky and have all the ammo he needs
b. Have to go to dealer just before he goes shooting

Both are really hard to do if done right, even if you legally own that weapon you use.

This is all way more arcane and stupid than just limiting what kinds of guns civilians get and increasing the scrutiny.

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 18:58

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

Nintendo Kid posted:

It means that random people stop getting named as the shooter by places like Reddit, which means reduced harassment of innocent people. Christ.

Unless you actually enact ongoing government cover-ups of all mass shootings, the dude who sot up 50 people or whatever will still be famous without having his name at least. It'll still get news coverage.

Just to be clear this literally happened already.

http://libertynews.com/2015/10/breaking-is-this-the-oregon-shooter-4chan-forum-says-his-name-is-toby-reynolds/

http://littlegreenfootballs.com/art..._Oregon_Shooter

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 18:59

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

fool_of_sound posted:

Except it totes was because he NSAed anyone who said his name.

It helped him find people but the 'saying his name gives him power' bit wasn't how it worked, his weird fetus bath was all he needed. I guess if shooters start killing everyone who knows their name then we can call it voldemorting them.

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 19:00

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

His Purple Majesty posted:

Hmm lets go with 1945-1980

You mean the era when most states had literal bans on concealed carry entirely?

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 19:04

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

Lemming posted:

The news value of repeating his name all the time for weeks, which is...?

This shooter also literally wrote "If you kill a bunch of people, they pay a lot of attention to you! Whoopee!" Seems to me pretty likely that this was part of his motivation.

Yea cool, he was loving insane. The news shooter also wrote that he wanted to start a race war, should we stop talking about racial issues?

The news value is, again, they literally had people claiming the wrong guy did it.

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 19:05

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

His Purple Majesty posted:

Im talking regulations on firearms in general.

No concealed carry, a severe lack of proper 'gun industry' that we know it as today, and a massive surplus of WW2 weapons. This is what made the 'golden age' for gun owners (you're not the first dude to invoke this weirdly broad time period, that includes a lot of different standards for gun ownership depending where you are, prices, and local availability), not regulations.

Lemming posted:

Are you kidding me? We're still hearing about the dingus that shot up the theater. He lived, which generally doesn't seem to be the case, but these shootings are absolutely huge news for long periods of time, and they spend tons of time discussing the shooter and everything about them.

Unless your point is that what I said is hyperbole, in which case, congratulations, you identified a hyperbole.

Dude you're 'still hearing about him' because he was just on loving trial. Should they have put a black bag with a big ? over his head or something?

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 19:10

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

Also wait wasn't your point 'less gun regulations more mental health stuff'? 1950's-80's weren't exactly a bastion of mental healthcare...

Doccers posted:

It was a little more complex than that, You just had to know how to operate.

Up until about 85 or so, what you did was get a "Courtesy Card" from the local police: "please treat this person as if they were an officer", and that was how you CCW'd (This is not to be confused with the Fraternal Order of Police courtesy cards, which mean dick-all). When I get home I can upload a few of them from various states that my grandfather had.

So, yeah, it was "Banned", but people still legit CCW'd pretty often using this method. Of course, these cards were almost never, ever, ever issued to anyone who failed the paper-bag test, as the whole thing was pretty much "How do we prevent darkies from having guns while letting the good old boys have theirs".

So basically the golden age of guns involved toothless laws that were easily circumvented by racist organizations. Yea ya know what, I take it back, that is the ideal for a lot of these people I guess.

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 19:13

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

Raerlynn posted:

For someone with a reputation for being so picky about his words you're certainly implying an awful lot about mine. FFS all I said was there are communities that don't trust their police. That's it. Nowhere did I advocate vigilantes. I get you don't like gun laws in this country. Guess what? I think they're pretty dumb too. How about we work on a solution that addresses the mass shooting, the number of fun violence issues in the country, and mental health issues? One that permits the people who live in rural areas that use them responsibly for defense against wild animals, who use them safely for sport, who use them safely to hunt, to continue to do so?

So LOL JUST KIDDING. Man the gently caress up and admit you were wrong shitstain.

Yes police reform should also happen, literally no one is arguing this. It doesn't change the fact that regardless of that, 'some people don't trust cops' isn't a counter to 'you're not actually an action movie hero and have better odds of making things worse than better if you start shooting too'.

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 19:43

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

Lemming posted:

Taken just now from google news in an incognito window, so shouldn't be any garbage stuffing up the results.

The shooter is obviously a major focus of this story. Claiming he isn't is completely dishonest. Let me reiterate again that I don't think there should be a total blackout of the guy or his name, but it shouldn't be repeatedly plastered everywhere along with pictures of him the way it is now.

So have you moved on to 'we must never say his name' to we literally can't say 'the shooter' at all? Like, yea, the shooter had racist poo poo and a lot of guns, that's a fair thing to report.

You tell us what the news should be saying?

"Some people got shot today, very sad, shooter's dead though"?

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 19:44

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

I heard if you look in the mirror with the lights off and whisper "Chris Mercer" three times another mass shooting happens in America.

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 19:47

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

Literally The Worst posted:

thats really just more of a timing and statistical thing than magic, though

A whole different kind of spooky

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 19:49

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

Dan Didio posted:

Multiple survivors of Columbine claimed the 'Are you a Christian?' exchange took place as well.

The dude apparently went on about organized religion, it's fair to say this may be genuine, dude.

duz posted:

How is that different from any other law not written by an industry lobbying group?

I've always wondered, Rent-A-Cop and all, I assume you at least agree we should have SOME gun laws. If you have beef with non-experts writing them, who should? Wouldn't the 'experts' in this case all be in the pro-gun industry lobby? Isn't that like saying 'big pharma' should write our healthcare laws?

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 19:57

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

Raerlynn posted:

Which. I also. Did not. Say.

This is what I said. That many Americans don't trust their local police to shoot the right people. As a refutation of this point specifically:

It's not paranoia if they have demonstrated a desire to be out to get you. Which Ferguson demonstrated remarkably well. But somehow pointing out that in many communities fear of the police is well founded makes me the paranoid gun rights activist that advocates for vigilantism... despite owning no guns, agreeing that our gun culture is hosed up, and depressingly resigned that nothing is likely to change.

Then what ARE you saying? Tell us the point instead of just going 'you know...cops are bad...' as if that contributes literally anything.

The conversation is 'the idea that a gun owner can be the hero in poo poo like this is almost always wrong and the examples people show are the exceptions rather than the rule, and that's a major argument they use for needing loose gun laws'. You then interjected with 'oh so we're supposed to wait for THE COPS' and started this. So what are you trying to say other than dropping your balls on the conversation?

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 20:04

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

Lemming posted:

It seems really important to you to never address people's main point, and instead try to harp on semantics.

Dude what is your main point? You shifted from 'don't say his name' to 'don't talk about the shooter at all'. How should this story be reported, walk us through Lemming News Network's handling of this.

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 20:20

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

Warcabbit posted:

Yo. Three people who enjoy shotgun sports, and a Wal-Mart way the hell upstate. Hundred rounds a go, two or three gos on a weekend, we tend to have well over 5000 rounds hanging about just because we don't enjoy driving to North Fuckistan.

Remember, ammo lasts FOREVER. We are still shooting ammo made for WWII. It's good and it's accurate. It's pretty much the perfect thing to buy in bulk, load into the car, and store in a dry place till you need it.

And that's with three people who have guns that share the same ammo. When you factor in multiple types of guns, or even just different loads for different sports, you can, reasonably, have tens of thousands of rounds around.

For people who don't understand why you'd have different loads - think of it as golf. They have different flight characteristics and do different things.

Yea, aside from the habit of guns killing people, think of it like golf, just a fun time with the bros. Anyway I got a trunk full of bullets that I probably will literally never go through but I needed them for a rainy day.

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 20:32

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

I like to think of my old heroin habit as being a chocoholic. I mean I KNEW it was bad for me but it was just so good!

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 20:33

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

mcmagic posted:

I hate to post a link to Tucker Carlson's lovely site here but Marco Rubio is very good. Could he possibly be the best bet to win the nomination as of now?

http://dailycaller.com/2015/10/01/here-is-marco-rubios-brilliant-response-to-black-lives-matter/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

Marco is a dumb motherfucker in a lot of ways (he also said that women will sell their fetus to PP for money thanks to the baby harvesting they do, and so getting pregnant will be an income source somehow) but he's probably the least dumb motherfucker they have, and is young and very cute, so yea he's probably the smart one to rally around if they want a fight.

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 20:36

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

mcmagic posted:

The only thing that gives me pause is that he was a member of the Gang of Eight for comprehensive immigration reform and the base HATES that...

Yea he's been on record occasionally saying not insane things, but if anything that's probably best for him because that'll make him the establishment golden boy rather than the teabagger one.

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 20:38

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

mcmagic posted:

Right but that isn't enough to win the nomination. Remember that batshit insane candidates Donald "Our planet is freezing" Trump+Carson+Fiorina are over 55%

So were guys like Cain and Bachmann in some places. The establishment has the money, the establishment picks the nominee, if they can be shown a promising, less insane, option in a cute young Cuban dude they'll probably rally for him and it won't matter of Trump has idiots on his side.

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 20:41

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

It will literally never be Jeb!, he's pissed any chance he had away.

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 20:45

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

Also yea I've lived in the south my whole life, have many friends who own guns, have been shooting with them, have seen them take their family shooting, all that gun culture stuff. There is no way 5k is 'a month for a small family'

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 20:48

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

Warcabbit posted:

Trap shooting. Hundred rounds a go. Two rounds each. (200) Two days in a weekend (400). Three family members (1200). Four weeks in a month. (4800).

I hope I've been informative, because I really wouldn't mind dropping the topic.

You're right, I didn't account for the possibility you spend literally every weekend trap shooting.

You...got me?

# ¿ Oct 2, 2015 21:03

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

dogs named Charlie posted:

http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/gun-control-advocates-dont-say-nothings-changed

Obama's not shutting up, not taking bullshit arguments, wants us to be single issue voters for years if needed to change this.

Senioritis Obama is my favorite Obama

# ¿ Oct 3, 2015 17:10

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

DeusExMachinima posted:

Congrats, you're why pro-gunners will never agree to middle ground controls.

Yea you caught us, we were juuuuust about to get some reasonable gun control passed but then we let Random Retard Online say a thing and it just blew it all up.

Alternative joke: so you're saying gun owners are so thin skinned and prone to overreaction that an unrelated internet post from a nobody queers the whole deal?

# ¿ Oct 3, 2015 18:31

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# ¿ May 13, 2024 00:21

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

Rincewinds posted:

So option 3 is the most plausible one?

You're not good at doing things

# ¿ Oct 4, 2015 16:23

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > USPOL Oct: So this is how the thread dies: with a Star Wars derail

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