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Cemetry Gator posted:The libertarian would day that those people did have their property rights violated because their bodies are their property. I'm trying to remember the quote from Rothbard about this. Something about how in An-cap land slavery would ~technically~ be legal but if you were a slave there would be nothing stopping you from just running for the hills at the earliest opportunity. Which makes me wonder what exactly is stopping your owner from just shooting you in the back when you run but I assume my faith in the Nonaggression principle is just lacking.
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Oct 11, 2015 00:45
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Sephyr posted:And I love it when Hong Kong is brought out as a gambit. That' when you know they have nothing. Yeah, a historically strategic port, stolen (guess the Chinese lost the deed somewhere, or we'd surely have given it back) by the world's top imperialist power as its crown jewel in the region and protected/developed, it's just the same as any dust-farming village west of Tibet. What really works about this logic is watching Libertarians explain how Hong Kong is proof that unfettered capitalism is the way to go but the Irish Potato famine is the result of all that filthy statism in the air
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Oct 11, 2015 18:02
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Alhazred posted:Really? That seems kinda harsh. I also didn't expect to see jrodefeld, a strong defender of property rights, defend squatting. Depending on where you live this could decrease property values and cost your neighbors money so a fine makes sense. It's still kinda messed up how real estate values get decided by a bunch of arbitrary rules that often heavily contribute to pollution and resource scarcity (While also being racist as hell) but that's an issue for another time.
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Oct 11, 2015 20:26
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QuarkJets posted:Conservatism is nothing if not hypocritical. I wonder if we could get a bunch of would-be conservatives on-board with a bunch of liberal policies and taxation if we just had people sign something before graduating high school or somesuch. "If I choose to join society then I agree to be bound by its rules, otherwise I'm free to leave and go live somewhere else" or something like that But if I don't sign the contract  MEN WITH GUNS will force me out of the country. No don't ask how this would be the same if it was a DRO
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Oct 12, 2015 01:48
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Caros posted:Well yeah, utility monsters don't actually exist. The post was tongue in cheek. Jrod is what happens when you tell the utility monster to maximize "Freedom". A couple hundred people getting 50 billion freedom points is better than 7 billion people getting the bare minimum amount of freedom points to survive 
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Oct 13, 2015 01:34
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jrodefeld posted:Let's talk about something else for a bit. There is a reason why I keep coming back here and posting. Most political internet forums are populated by people who don't know anything. They frankly aren't any fun to participate in. But on the other hand, this is not a way to have a debate. I'd be happy to debate just one of you or a small number of those who are serious, but taking on thirty at once is unwieldy at best. Hiking, TV, paddleboarding, video games, huge tea snob, environmental activism. I was working on a marine bio degree ages ago but dropped out and plan to come back to that, more on that later. jrodefeld posted:Contrary to what many of you have insinuated, I was not born of privilege. My parents were working class. I was raised in a 1200 square foot 1960s-era house in a not particularly great neighborhood. Luckily my parents valued my education, so I was fortunate enough to attend a private school for most of my formal education. My parents went into debt to send me there and I was on a scholarship that helped pay for my education. Ok so here's the thing. I'm not going to mince words here I was too crazy for university. Had a series of breakdowns under pressure and a couple suicide attempts and I've spent the past 9 years working on my mental health and keeping myself sustained with poo poo jobs. If my family wasn't as rich as they are I would not have the luxury of living like this to deal with my issues. If there was significant debt attached to my education I would have kept on regardless and cracked for good, either killing myself or showing up to class with a rifle or something like that. So my hat's off to you Jrod, my time preference is poo poo compared to yours. That said, this is also why I'm so diametrically opposed to your vision of a perfect society, I know there are millions out there dealing with what I have to deal with without the support network I got, and I'd like to fix that.
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Oct 16, 2015 04:43
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Caros posted:Marine biology and a tea fetish? You're a worse loving person than Jro- Yeah something I picked up from my current job. It makes me annoying as gently caress And yeah thanks
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Oct 16, 2015 04:50
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Nevvy Z posted:Missionaries do better when they integrate themselves into the local population and prove useful and interesting. No one likes annoying preachy people. I want to be sure he's not a robot. Until he tells me what his favorite TV show is I'm having trouble seeing him as a person and not some kind of markov-chain algorithm designed by one of Hans-Hermann Hoppe's interns to most efficiently preach ancapism to the masses.
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Oct 16, 2015 05:31
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Andorra posted:Yo OP, I'm Choctaw. Does this mean I should be able to go to Average Neighborhood, Mississippi, tell the people there whose families have lived there 100+ years to hit the road so I can live communally with some of my friends and family? That's how they lived way back in the olden days. The Libertarian go-to answer to this is that European settlers ~mixed their labor with the land~ which makes their right to it more special because factories got built on it or some poo poo. It is an effectively meaningless distinction that only serves to benefit those currently sitting on the land.
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Oct 16, 2015 21:44
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Nolanar posted:That's a pretty good article, and it links to another good article about Thomas Paine. Paine was a Marxist before there was even a Marx and it cracks me up to no end knowing that he's part of the mythologized "Founding Fathers" conservatives talk about 
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Oct 19, 2015 20:13
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OwlFancier posted:Is there a libertarian argument for why we need to replace the fuzzy but largely functional system we have now for human interaction with some kind of weird honour-driven barter system? By some vaguely defined "Freedom" scale the an-cap society would be more voluntary than living in a nation-state.
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Oct 19, 2015 23:27
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Vorpal Cat posted:Lets not even get started on the fun time that accrue when you accidentally discover a whole new continent full of gold and silver and suddenly have your available currency increasing far far faster then your underling economy. Or the fun time the king of a previously unknown country went on vacation and turned the Mediterranean economy into a smoldering crater just by souvenir shopping
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Nov 13, 2015 00:42
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YF19pilot posted:You've piqued my interest. Who was this? Musa Keita I was the King of the Mali Empire during the early 1300's, though Islam had reached West Africa a few decades before that he was the first major Muslim leader in Sub-Saharan Africa. Being such he had to go to Mecca at least once as all Muslims are supposed to. When he did so in 1324 he and his entourage bought so many rugs, scented candles, paintings and other random crap that was for sale in every market from Morocco to Jedda that the price of gold plummeted to almost nothing overnight and stayed that way for at least 10 years. Edit: Beaten because I just had to be wordier.
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Nov 13, 2015 03:40
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Twerkteam Pizza posted:OP should start another thread with an even longer introduction It's what he does. Give it another 2-3 months he'll be back with another glorified street-sermon and rant about how totally notracist his idols are.
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Nov 16, 2015 19:39
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Wait wait wait hold up. Jrod knows who Alexander Ludwig is. Do you watch and enjoy Vikings? Do we have something in common 
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Nov 19, 2015 18:06
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And don't forget often real-life libertarian dream of seasteading, where you make a DRO on an oil-rig and freedom happens.
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Nov 20, 2015 02:06
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bokkibear posted:Rothbard says that agreeing to slavery is only voluntary if you don't later change your mind, therefore "voluntary slavery" is impossible. How does this reasoning not apply to a contract under which I agree to pay you $100 next year? For extra credit: is this what going mad feels like? Or better yet, let's say your DRO has gone to war with my DRO (One side violated the Nonaggression Principle, doesn't matter who). My side wins, and in exchange for not executing you we draw up a peace agreement where you and anyone who joined you works off the financial cost of the war. However I actually do not have the facilities for that many new workers so instead of direct work I sell your contract to another DRO 500 miles away. Oh whoops, that's not just slavery, that's exactly how the Atlantic Slave Trade happened.
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Nov 20, 2015 18:58
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Twerkteam Pizza posted:I use this post to summon back Jrod to answer questions about misogyny and if he believes in the good ole breadwinner family. Considering he thinks the homesteading yeoman farmer is the natural state of humanity, I'm betting he does, but if we ever use the word "Sexism" he'll remind us that women will actually have a billion times more rights in a stateless society.
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Dec 3, 2015 02:05
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paragon1 posted:I want to do another one and for it to be about bitcoin and other libertarian related currency nonsense. How does evening of the 19th sound to people? I was on a plane and had to skip the last one and I will be on a plane and have to skip this one. I don't really have much to add to the discussion anyway but if you're doing a round-table about environmental concerns and how statelessness will gently caress the earth even more than it is currently being ruined hit me up I have a lot to talk about
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Dec 12, 2015 22:24
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YF19pilot posted:I'm probably missing a lot of information about Bitcoin's history, but it seems like it was just some dude's pet project run amok by people who have co-opted it for the reasons you mention. Unless all this lolbertarian crap was the original plan all along. Everyone is missing a lot of information about Bitcoin's history. The inventor is a secretive dude who has yet to make a public appearance, is most likely using a pseudonym and may or may not actually be a group of people. So when the internet persona that unleashed Bitcoin upon the world says "I made this digital currency program just to see if I could" that's really all we have to go on
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Dec 13, 2015 07:08
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So uh... Jrodefeld, you keep going on about how the free market provides better solutions to scarcity. Now you've probably heard the news that my state has a scarcity problem, namely that there's not enough water to go around. My question is, if California was an An-Cap paradise would the drought be less of an issue? And how would it be made easier?
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Jan 19, 2016 02:24
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fade5 posted:You could totally respectfully decline to participate in all of these things. That reminds me, whatever happened to that Libertarian paradise some guy set up on a river island in Croatia? Are they still truckin' along or have they been forced out yet?
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Jan 19, 2016 04:22
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Bryter posted:lol so why have people been debating this guy for dozens and dozens of pages? That sounds like a solid reason to back away from the keyboard Eh that's like asking why a gym has a punching bag when nobody can knock it out. This helps me flex my ideological muscles and teaches me how to be a better environmentalist
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Jan 19, 2016 17:41
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Jack of Hearts posted:It's also amusing because he clearly knew nothing about military strategy, thought Lincoln was an empty suit long past the point where he'd proven otherwise, and was inexplicably John C. Fremont fanboy. But the positives of his reporting vastly outweigh the negatives. Frémont's kinda interesting because he was the kind of general who was good but not great and really shoulda been demoted for being an rear end in a top hat but as it turns out being an rear end in a top hat while holding the rank of general gets the papers talking about you and that leads to the armchair strategists talking about how you're a straight shooter who takes poo poo from no man  I am contributing to this derail because Jrod has yet to respond to 2 of my questions DarklyDreaming fucked around with this message at 05:50 on Jan 20, 2016 |
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Jan 20, 2016 05:42
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Mr Interweb posted:Wait, I have a question. If Jrod thinks that the government should have just paid off the Confederate states to offset any losses that they would incur with the abolition of slavery, where would that money come from? Mutual aid societies and private abolitionist charities.
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Jan 20, 2016 05:55
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GunnerJ posted:I guess... if we're doing ideological introductions Above everything else I consider myself an environmentalist. More specifically I'm a conservationist always striving for greater sustainability while keeping as many people alive and living well as possible. From that I have concluded that most political ideals people consider Left-wing such as equality for all, strong safety nets, public education, and strong regulation of businesses have a proven track record while political ideals people consider Right-wing have led to gilded age nightmares. That's not to say certain left wing governments haven't hosed the earth pretty hard but that's why free expression is so important. People need to be able to say "This is bad, stop it" and be listened to without being told "Well just move somewhere else weaklings  "So to put it in less abstract terms... I... Uh... guess I'm a socialist. Maybe.
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Jan 24, 2016 19:26
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paragon1 posted:From what I've seen of other nerd stores comic accessories means poo poo loads of the Magic: The Gathering Trading Card GameTM trading cards. And hilariously expensive tabletop roleplaying game-sets. Don't forget those
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Feb 10, 2016 06:23
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Closing statements? Well um... I can honestly say I've learned a lot about economics, the American Civil War, morality and the differing philosophies that guide morality, the complexities of international trade, and real estate from this thread. I just learned about them from a dozen or so people who aren't Jrod. He sucks and everyone else here is alright.
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Feb 14, 2016 18:47
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