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DJ Dizzy posted:Deathwing is a post-heresy invention methinks. In an organizational sense it is, but in the books the Dark Angels apparently use a different organizational structure from everyone else: almost every character is mentioned to be part of a -wing formation. Deathwing, ravenwing, dreadwing, ironwing, and voidwing have all been mentioned IIRC. There's a funny scene in one of the books where Roboute Guilliman sees the Dark Angels massing on the ground in Legion strength and all he can think is "They're not acting the way Astartes should. They're not supposed to be organized like that. What are those weapons? They aren't supposed to have those weapons. What is going on here? They're not supposed to have that stuff." Cythereal fucked around with this message at 12:44 on Feb 10, 2016 |
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Feb 10, 2016 12:26
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Endman posted:I had another look at the rules and while Armies of Dark Compliance don't get Provenances because they have to take a Legiones Astartes HQ while counting as the same detatchment, using the Sacrificial Offering RoW means that the Militia will be Allies and thus able to take their own HQ, so they would get Provenances. Either way, I think it sounds like a lot of fun to field some marines with a bunch of squishy militia dudes. And Alpha Legion get them as Sworn Brothers too, which is nice. Do note that the new book gives the Ultramarines a new rite that uses Imperial Militia buddies, although it limits said buddies to using the Gene Crafted and Warrior Elite provenances.
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Feb 22, 2016 02:52
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Endman posted:That is cool, but I'm too tempted to run a bunch of crazy warp-addled idiots, maybe led by a rogue psyker who could turn into a possessed at any moment. Fair enough, the Ultramarine rite is themed as the Ultras bringing along some auxiliaries to provide extra numbers, scoring, and fire support. The Ultras have to take a Vigilator, and the militia get infiltrate and implacable advance. Recon squads lose the support squad thing so they can be taken as your compulsory troops, too.
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Feb 22, 2016 03:26
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muggins posted:So I ordered the lightning fighter... I have emperor's Children right now and I am planning a night lords force as well. Can I paint this thing in a neutral imperial air force look so I can use it with both in hh? They're both traitors and it's just one unit. I'd say just paint it up in whatever scheme you'd prefer and when using the other army say it's on loan or stolen or a gift or whatever. Or go all-in for Shattered Legions. One of the 30k nerds in my local tabletop community is putting together a Shattered Legions list combining Death Guard, Salamanders, and Imperial Fists as a loyalist force.
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Feb 27, 2016 02:52
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DJ Dizzy posted:Blood Angels and shattered legions. Thoughts? Is it even possible fluff-wise? It's the Heresy, sure. There are real concerns in the book that the Blood Angels may fall to Khorne - Sanguinius won't, but who's saying there aren't Blood Angels who fell? Or if you're loyalists, not hard to imagine some remnants of other Legions, especially traitors, joining up with the Blood Angels for redemption.
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Mar 1, 2016 15:27
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One of the local players in my area is putting together a Death Guard/Iron Warriors/Imperial Fists loyalist Shattered Legion, apparently built around The Reaping.
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Mar 2, 2016 03:25
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Safety Factor posted:Is the regular, ol' Imperial Army ever going to get rules or are you intended to represent them with the militia list? I realize they'd likely end up as slightly different Imperial Guard, but I'm just curious. There is no singular Imperial Army force in 30k. The Imperial Army as an organization is equal parts Solar Auxilia, Imperial militia, and the like. In the books, Imperial Army forces are incredibly diverse and that's not even talking about the serf-armies from Astartes-controlled worlds that take the field alongside their rulers, like the Spireguard from Prospero and the armies of Ultramar. The formation of a singular Imperial Guard with a standardized roster and capabilities was a response to the Heresy and the shattering of the Imperial Army. Cythereal fucked around with this message at 03:23 on Mar 9, 2016 |
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Mar 9, 2016 03:21
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Mango Polo posted:It definitely feels a little like a relic of the initial heresy vision, what with everyone having their own traitors. I imagine the Black Library will eventually get around to re-explaining it. Also the current 30k books, which explain that every legion was so huge that there inevitably were traitors from every loyalist legion, and loyalists from every traitor legion. In Unremembered Empire, there's even a loyalist Word Bearer who still worships the Emperor as a god and regards Lorgar and friends as heretics.
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Mar 23, 2016 22:48
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Zaphod42 posted:But Gulliman didn't even write the Codex Astartes until after the events of 30k, right? So before that I guess they were just 'lawful stupid' types? In Know No Fear, UMs are portrayed as very inflexible - they're very smart, very thorough, and believe in having a plan for every eventuality. Give them a situation they haven't thought about and prepared for, and they're massively on the back foot. Taking the XIII Legion by surprise isn't easy, but they're shown to be extremely rigid in adhering to established doctrine and tactics. That's why they suffer massively during the Heresy. The Ultramarines are completely unprepared for treason, daemons, and fighting fellow Astartes.
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May 3, 2016 20:05
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Hencoe posted:Its the Ironfire rite of war! Before I moved a few months ago, my area's Alpha Legion player started off playing Death Guard and Salamanders. She didn't repaint them when she switched to Alpha Legion, and painted new models as whatever other Legion she felt like at the time. 
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May 9, 2016 21:48
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Kind of odd to be getting the model for Leman Russ when his rules and legion haven't been released yet. Maybe they have different teams working on each primarch model and Russ's team finished first of the current batch?
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May 14, 2016 14:03
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Fearless posted:Every single traitor primarch has poor self esteem and daddy issues. Magnus doesn't. Thinking entirely too much of himself was the core of his problems.
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Jul 4, 2016 17:05
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BULBASAUR posted:Each and every Mary Sue legion Personally, I'd single out the Emperor's Children and Ultramarines here.
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Jul 5, 2016 22:24
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SRM posted:I feel like every gaming group has a story like this. I doubt many are true but I enjoy them all nonetheless. I know of one that did it specifically because they heard the stories, played with it a bit, and decided it wasn't actually that funny and both groups went back to playing normally.
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Jul 13, 2016 20:28
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In the Horus Heresy books, the orks and eldar seem to have the same tech and capabilities they do in 40k, but they're not big players on the galactic scene. The Heresy books seem to prefer featuring unique and extraordinarily advanced xenos and human offshoots unrelated to any 40k faction. Besides the orks and eldar, the only xenos race active in 40k that comes up in the Heresy to my knowledge is the necrons, who are lurking around the edges here and there.
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Jul 21, 2016 16:22
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DJ Dizzy posted:99% of Necrons wouldnt have awoken yet. The Silent King is still on his emo voyage. Yep, but Necron stuff has appeared a few times here and there in the Heresy - an important plot of Mechanicum is revealing the truth of the Void Dragon, and the Deceiver is strongly implied to still be active. Alpharius also has himself what's implied to be a Necron weapon, and one member of the Cabal could be describing a Necron Lord. Even in Horus Rising there's a description of what sounds awfully like a dormant Tomb World.
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Jul 21, 2016 16:31
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tallkidwithglasses posted:Why doesn't he have a large majestic beard? Immersion ruined. Same reason Mortarion doesn't have a rebreather despite being described as wearing one in virtually every fluff appearance.
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Aug 8, 2016 17:57
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SRM posted:Also kinda surprising that all 18 primarchs are clean shaven. Older artwork of Rogal Dorn usually gave him a bitching mustache, kinda sad the art in the 30k books dispensed with it. Scars gives Khan a sizable goatee, though.
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Sep 24, 2016 18:42
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DJ Dizzy posted:fluffy is what you decide. All the legions did everything. Even RG fought wars of attrition on occasion. The books suggest, though, that the Thousand Sons' typical thing was a huge emphasis on combined arms and psychic coordination with psykers goddamn everywhere throwing around fire and lightning and precognition.
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Oct 10, 2016 03:24
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Lord Twisted posted:Who is the weakest? Corax? Corax is on the weak side in primarch-on-primarch violence, but that's not what he's built for. He's the most mobile primarch around (right now, there's indications Lion will have a jetbike option, Sanguinius might be a full-on flyer, and the Khan is almost certainly going to have a bike of some kind) and is built for wrecking the rank and file wherever they're weak.
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Oct 21, 2016 23:08
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Safety Factor posted:Given the Wolves' general ice theme, I'm surprised they didn't go with endothermic. Could be a screw-up from whoever wrote that, or could be deliberate. Equal odds, I think - would make some thematic sense if the rest of the wolves are ice themed and have helfrost weapons, while Russ himself has a fire thing going on. As far as I know, though, the only mentions of what unique units we'll see from the Wolves and Sons are enhanced destroyer squads for the Wolves and psychic prescient assassins for the Sons. Wouldn't be surprised by something like a helfrost predator, though, or every Sons sergeant being an ML 1 psyker.
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Oct 22, 2016 01:24
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Aesaar posted:The biggest inspiration is modern Russian Army steppe camouflage, just with more tan and a browner khaki so it doesn't look too close to Cadian 8th camouflage. There's precedent in the Fists for companies having wildly different heraldry from the base yellow (the Black Templars got their color scheme from Sigismund's company/chapter). You could just say this chapter/company of the Fists uses different colors in its heraldry from the bulk of the Fists.
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Nov 16, 2016 03:01
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Sivores posted:On a further note, does anybody see any loyalty indicator on thousand son stuff in Inferno? I can't find one and I know they believe themselves to be loyal at this time. Nothing seems to specify Loyalist or Traitor for them, which does make some sense given that the only intermediate stage between loyalist and Rubrics-and-Sorcerers is the Battle of Prospero itself. I'm not sure the Thousand Sons actually participated in the Heresy on the side of Chaos outside that one battle.
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Feb 4, 2017 04:40
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SRM posted:My dice were godawful and that thing's creeping barrage rule or whatever is gross. He said he had a second but he doesn't use it games under 2500 points because he wants to keep friends. That's probably Crawling Fire you're thinking of, and it's a property of phosphex rather than the gun so any phosphex weapon will do that. 
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Feb 8, 2017 20:22
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panascope posted:Every time Bjorn isn't on screen the other characters should be asking, "where's Bjorn?" I wouldn't be surprised if there's a dataslate in the works for more special characters from the legions, like Bjorn, Argel Tal, Horus Aximand, and Zso Sahaal. Hell, make it something on the order of "Here's two new special characters for each legion, one loyalist and one traitor." That particular idea would be worth it just for the howling over traitor Space Wolf and Ultramarine characters.
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Feb 17, 2017 05:08
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Safety Factor posted:Honestly lore veterans like myself and alot of others around here don't like the crusade era Space Wolves and Russ. Everything cool about Russ is done better with Angron. And everything cool about the Fenryka is done better with the World Eaters. Prospero Burns is a good book.  Sure, it's The Thirteenth Warrior in space, but it got me liking the Crusade-era Wolves.
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Feb 18, 2017 13:45
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tallkidwithglasses posted:Stormwing, firewing and dreadwing have all been speculated about but aren't really known yet. Deathwing are the vets and might just be represented with Pride of the Legion or might get its own rite some day. The other wings have been mentioned briefly as far as the basic ideas go, or at least Lexicanum says so. Firewing is heavy on Devastators and weird ranged guns, Stormwing is assault marines and drop pods, and Dreadwing is Destroyers.
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Feb 22, 2017 04:20
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BULBASAUR posted:And Russ is impossible to fit in a list, because he's a huge point-sink and all he feels like is a big beatstick and nothing more. Angron says hi.
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Mar 1, 2017 04:43
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ThNextGreenLantern posted:All this 40k vs 30k equipment talk has me wondering- Were 40k style missile launchers in use during the Heresy? I need to take my mk IV Heavy Support Squad from 5 to 10, but trying to get more of the Calth missile launchers is a big ol' pain. Yes, missile launchers were in use during the Heresy.
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Mar 8, 2017 20:14
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JBP posted:I want some alphas just because I like them, but I wasn't aware of this cool rule. To clarify since no one answered this: it's not a default part of the alphas, it's a part of their Coils of the Hydra rite.
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May 31, 2017 19:05
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I wonder how common playing loyalist members of a traitor legion and traitor members of loyalist legions are. I know there are rites set up for both situations, and a few characters set up for precisely those circumstances, but I'd be curious how common it is in actual practice. The notion of traitor Ultramarines amuses me.
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Jun 3, 2017 16:10
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It was mentioned in the 40k threat, but I'm curious what kinds of new alternate legions and units we could see in the future as FW advances the timeline. They've certainly alluded to doing so. I'm wondering if they might be introduced with completely different legion rules. Say, Emperor's Children stay as they are right now, but then there's a post-Istvaan EC featuring Daemon Prince Fulgrim and the full-on CSM style thing they've got going in the later Horus Heresy novels. Or adding Raptors to the Raven Guard, Daemon Prince Angron, etc.
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Jun 21, 2017 04:17
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JBP posted:The 7.5 rulebook is going to have rules for occult poo poo and daemons so I assume there will be more of that poo poo happening. To what extent did the daemon princes participate in the HH proper though? I thought it was only Fulgrim that ascended during it, but he was all gently caress you got mine and just went away leaving the rest of the EC doing random fun stuff. Angron also went daemon prince during the Heresy. It's in Betrayer, one of the best HH novels - it's strongly implied that Lorgar deliberately orchestrated Angron's fall to Chaos and rise as a daemon prince specifically so they'd have someone besides Horus who could face down Sanguinius at Terra and have a shot at winning.
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Jun 21, 2017 04:26
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PantsOptional posted:Yeah, but did he participate in the war any more after that? I haven't read anything with Angron in it after Betrayer, and he gets locked away at the end of that. The HH series has been allergic to starting the Siege of Terra, so the plot's stalled at the moment. We did get Rogal Dorn no-poo poo-for-real killing Alpharius, though.
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Jun 21, 2017 04:39
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JBP posted:I need to read some more of the books. I read the drop site ones, Legion and Fulgrim. I started Descent of Angels (for some insane reason) and haven't been back. I might grab Betrayer if you think it's a cool read. Is there anything else I should grab? The First Heretic, Know No Fear, Betrayer is an excellent trilogy by Dan Abnett and ADB that flow smoothly together, focusing on the Word Bearers, World Eaters, and Ultramarines. Covers the fall of Lorgar and Angron to Chaos, the first possessed marines, the Word Bearers' attack on Calth, Angron's rise as a daemon prince, and does a wonderful job of humanizing the Ultramarines and Guilliman by giving them believable strengths and flaws. Prominent characters besides the primarchs include Kharn, Erebus, and the only possessed marine you might genuinely feel sorry for. A Thousand Sons and Prospero Burns are two companion novels about the Thousand Sons and the Space Wolves, respectively, that conclude with the assault on Prospero and remain the main books to date to focus on those two legions. Thousand Sons focuses on Ahriman and Magnus, Prospero Burns is a 40k adaptation of The Thirteenth Warrior and is about the Wolves and Leman Russ from the perspective of an outsider. Mechanicum is an interesting one that has virtually no power armor action and focuses purely on events on Mars. If you want an interesting story about Mars and the Mechanicus at the outbreak of the Heresy with a guest appearance by the C'Tan, this one's for you. Legion is somewhat hit or miss. It's the Alpha Legion book but doesn't actually tell you much about the Alphas - it's told mainly from the perspective of ordinary humans caught up in the Alpha Legion's machinations. Also introduces John Grammaticus and makes the best use of him compared to his later appearances - he reappears in the First Heretic trilogy along with Olanius Pius. Angel Exterminatus is derided by some, but I personally enjoyed it. It's the Iron Warriors book and also includes the Emperor's Children quite heavily, including Fulgrim's ascent to daemon prince.
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Jun 21, 2017 04:55
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Lord_Hambrose posted:Other than the ADB books, I think Scars is probably the best one I have read so far. It does a good job of showing why the early Heresy was so confusing, and that not every Legion is not some colossal hive mind. I enjoyed Scars, but I feel it's not as good as the others I mentioned. Also if you like White Scars, this is the book for you. All the Dark Angels books are kind of weird and off doing their own thing paying no mind to the rest of the Heresy. As for daemon prince Angron as mentioned before, Lorgar tells Horus that he knows the traitors will be facing Sanguinius at Terra, Sanguinius holding nothing back with nothing to lose. Lorgar believes there are only two in the entire Heresy who can stand against that Sanguinius: Horus himself, and Angron. That's half the reason Lorgar orchestrates Angron's ascension to daemon prince. Lorgar gets his rear end kicked every time he fights a primarch in the books, which is refreshing.
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Jun 21, 2017 16:03
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TTerrible posted:Where is Bjorn I'd kinda like a small book that's just about adding more special characters from the books. Bjorn, sure, but also Zso Sahaal and Torgaddon and Garro when he was still a Death Guard.
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Jun 21, 2017 18:51
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tallkidwithglasses posted:Bjooooooooooooooorn Honestly, Zso Sahaal is the one I want to see rules for. Lord of the Night was the first 40k book I ever read.
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Jun 21, 2017 19:34
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BULBASAUR posted:Paul Atreides in da houseeeee Nice to see Forge World getting in on the vibrator market.
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Jul 23, 2017 00:58
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PantsOptional posted:Ultras for that Betrayer feeling. Dead Space Wolves would also be quite fitting.
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Aug 2, 2017 19:07
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