|
Yardbomb posted:So what's the defense on this one gonna be, I can only wonder with bated breath. POST REMOVED BY ISRAELI DEFENSE MINISTRY
|
#
¿
Feb 4, 2016 15:10
|
|
|
|
| # ¿ May 12, 2024 07:06 |
|
|
Gotta say, Avshalom Theology needs a wider following.
|
|
#
¿
Mar 1, 2016 02:04
|
|
|
Valhawk posted:So do you think someone at AIPAC poo poo a brick during the Democratic debate last night when Sanders talked about Israel's disproportionate response in Gaza? A ton of news outlets are running with stories today about how it represents a huge shift in the national discussion on the topic. They've had a bad year or three, there were a bunch of very smart Israeli strategy-types who went  when Netanyahu decided it would be a good idea to turn support for Israel into a partisan issue and now a (Jewish!) Democratic Presidential candidate is breaking the seal. 
|
|
#
¿
Apr 16, 2016 02:02
|
|
|
FlamingLiberal posted:Considering Hillary wrote an op-ed saying that she wanted to maintain close ties with Israel (specifically Bibi), this is not likely to result in any real change. I will accept baby steps. More important to me is that this is one more thing where Bernie can help nudge the party in a positive direction.
|
|
#
¿
Apr 16, 2016 06:23
|
|
|
Kim Jong Il posted:They are in the sense that it boils down to "those bad things you mentioned don't matter because other bad things are happening." Don't forget very slow, slightly confused ethnic cleansing in the West Bank!  Edit: by confused, I mean the Israeli government's total inability to reliably tell the settlers to go gently caress themselves, while also not really having a viable option to straight up deport all the undesirables from desirable land, which basically leads to a slow, creeping ethnic cleansing that is temporarily and mildly reversed when the dice come up just so. Goatse James Bond fucked around with this message at 02:55 on May 3, 2016 |
|
#
¿
May 3, 2016 02:51
|
|
|
William Bear posted:I hope this is related to the ice cream thing! gently caress you, we have successfully identified Bibi's only correct opinion.
|
|
#
¿
May 30, 2016 21:31
|
|
|
Patrick Spens posted:You know that there was a vote on the plan right? India? Was that an artifact of both India and Pakistan feeling the other cheated them on their own partition negotiations?  Edit: apparently it was a combination of Indian efforts to not have totally poo poo relations with the Arab world, and India being a major linchpin of the Non-Aligned Movement. Goatse James Bond fucked around with this message at 09:20 on Jun 4, 2016 |
|
#
¿
Jun 4, 2016 09:17
|
|
|
The Jewish exodus from Iran is a particularly interesting little counterfactual to ponder, because a big part of the Iranian government's official position on the remaining Iranian Jews is "of course they're loyal Iranians, all the disloyal Zionist-inclined Jews left to join the colonial state.  " It's easy to imagine a timeline where a significantly smaller proportion of Iranian Jews left around the Revolution and the far-right hardliners had an easier time stirring up the usual bullshit (including literal blood libel, which got tossed around a bit under Ahmadinejad by some of his looney-tunesest supporters).
|
|
#
¿
Jun 6, 2016 23:59
|
|
|
ANIME AKBAR posted:Then surely you'd be satisfied if the Jewish settlers were allowed to remain but the territory containing the settlements would be under the control of the Palestinian state, correct? While sadly infeasible I am really curious what happens in the alternate universe(s?) where this is the decision.
|
|
#
¿
Jun 12, 2016 02:39
|
|
|
The Insect Court posted:On that subject.... How many Palestinians were killed while neither carrying out attacks nor "thought about to do so"? Because if it's greater than a seventh of that total, an evenly applied price tag policy might not make you happy. Goatse James Bond fucked around with this message at 06:31 on Jul 1, 2016 |
|
#
¿
Jul 1, 2016 06:28
|
|
|
Schizotek posted:Why is it even in D&D we talk like a two state solution is in any way a viable option anymore? The idea that Israel will dismantle the settlements and forcibly relocate million of their own people to back to their official borders is loving laughable. Ditto the idea that they'd become citizens of Palestine. Israel wouldn't allow it. The settlers would burn the West Bank down before being ruled by muslims. And the Palestinians certainly don't want the miserable fuckers in their country. So what you'd have is a dozen noncontiguous chunks of scrub brush and some of the Negev with all of their individual borders controlled by Israel. It's literally just a solidification of the status quo. If we assume the settlers are a 100% non-solvable problem, we're effectively left with no solutions that are both palatable and viable. I'm not saying this assessment is wrong, but it's intensely depressing and I'd rather believe there's a slim but nonzero chance of pulling back to not-totally-poo poo borders.  If only because the settlers, while a fairly significant force in Israeli politics, are probably easier to relocate than the Palestinians, and doing so is marginally more palatable to Israel than a single-state solution that doesn't involve (finishing) the ethnic cleansing of rump-Palestine.
|
|
#
¿
Jul 5, 2016 07:26
|
|
|
NLJP posted:Appropriate time to bring this back up: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immovable_Ladder My favorite part is that it started life as a perfectly ordinary workman's ladder before being sucked into a petty interorganizational slapfight. Well that, and imagining the Ottoman Sultan's "you have got to be loving kidding me" expression when asked to make a ruling about it. Goatse James Bond fucked around with this message at 04:14 on Jul 17, 2016 |
|
#
¿
Jul 17, 2016 04:12
|
|
|
Obama was excessively optimistic about the value of reason and discussion and good faith multilateral action? You don't loving say.
|
|
#
¿
Dec 28, 2016 19:49
|
|
|
FamDav posted:Is US policy towards Israel heavily influenced by our own feelings on the treatment of Native Americans? ...As in, we're for it? Edit: dammit 
|
|
#
¿
Jan 22, 2017 05:32
|
|
|
Avshalom posted:there's nothing on earth that can be compared to the cry of the jewess. my bearded clamshell parts its lips and emits a hollow keening that pierces your deepest loins; instantly you are powerfully aroused and desperately aware of how small and insignificant your penis is in comparison to the vastness of the universe. the hairs rise on the back of your neck. involuntary tears well in your eyes. my breasts are beyond measure and i suffer from a total eclipse of the rear end. i am a masterpiece; i am a sculpture; i am literally the statue of liberty, my thighs straddling new york, and the flaming torch i hold aloft is my ghost lover's impassioned cock that gives me strength and light even in the depths of nuclear winter. (ariel had a bioluminescent cock, the knesset's best-kept secret)  The new moderation is truly monstrous.
|
|
#
¿
Jan 28, 2017 22:23
|
|
|
Maluco Marinero posted:Is there a reason why America has such a large say in Israel's accountability? Like I'm not really that familiar but I'd just as soon assume that the nature of the UN means more than one nation has a say, but is it more that America has the pull on the rest of the major member nations to get what it wants? Security Council members can veto anything of real importance, and the USA has a perma-seat by virtue of the whole superpower thing.
|
|
#
¿
Feb 22, 2017 02:27
|
|
|
Kim Jong Il posted:No, in a peace process you loving compromise, one side getting everything they want isn't how this works. So can I infer that you are, in fact, against current Israeli policy?
|
|
#
¿
Feb 22, 2017 03:45
|
|
|
Miftan posted:An Israeli MK: "Any Palestinian who joins the IDF can vote" is to me, despite being literally Starship Troopers, an acceptable improvement to the status quo. It also won't happen.
|
|
#
¿
Mar 6, 2017 09:28
|
|
|
Miftan posted:That's what he's counting on Yeah, he gets to sound reasonable and advocate a solution that, if somehow passed, would cause Likud's entire delegation to immediately vomit out the wasps that reside in their human skinsuits, whereupon the wasps would sting him to death.
|
|
#
¿
Mar 6, 2017 09:33
|
|
|
hakimashou posted:Hope none of the haters have plans to travel to Israel lol Well poo poo, so much for my spring break plans.
|
|
#
¿
Mar 8, 2017 11:50
|
|
|
I'm not surprised they're bonding, they have similar views about how to handle Muslims.
|
|
#
¿
Jul 7, 2017 00:00
|
|
|
Grouchio posted:What exact sentiments (besides Pakistan) do Hindus have against muslims, to refresh my memory? I'm not talking Hindus or Indians, I'm talking Modi specifically. Dude is the head of a Hindu nationalist party and, more importantly, did exactly gumball when a bunch of his supporters launched pogroms in the state he was governing at the time. He's a very interesting character and I don't disagree with him on everything, but his Muslim rights record is Bad. Edit: tried to write fuckall thanks autocorrect
|
|
#
¿
Jul 7, 2017 23:53
|
|
|
Fiction posted:I hope the settlers get thrown into the Mediterranean but we can't all get what we want. Oh come on. I want them to become citizens of and fall under the jurisdiction of Palestine in a two state solution.  I mean, it's not my TOP choice (that's probably a one state solution mediated by unicorns and fairy dust), but it's at least one that's more compatible with the rule of law and international norms than the current situation. Edit: although I guess throwing them into the Mediterranean is a solid example of nonlethal ethnic cleansing since they can just wade back to the Israeli shore
|
|
#
¿
Jul 21, 2017 22:17
|
|
|
GaussianCopula posted:Around the same time the Russians, Czechs, Greeks and Polish had their ethic cleansing campaigns - yet the people in those cases largely have learned to deal with it instead of building an ideology that is centered about their eternal refugee status. I bet I can think of another non-Palestinian group that was ethnically cleansed in the 40s you didn't mention that developed strong feelings on the topic and took drastic action around it. also when I look for a nation that doesn't harbor strong feelings towards a past foreign oppressor, I too think of Poland
|
|
#
¿
Jul 25, 2017 16:48
|
|
|
I think I see where Alhazred is going here. Al Saqr (and, you know, everyone else in the thread), how would you feel about e.g. a one state solution with 100% full right of return that also has the current non-resident Jew immigration policies? This strikes me as a really interesting argument in terms of, uh, talking to Jewish supremacists or slightly less unpalatably those who are worried about a one state solution leading to ethnic cleansing of Jews: turns out, if Alhazred is accurately describing things, that it could feasibly lead to a Jewish minority anyway, disaster avoided Related question: how important is it that Israel in whatever form be forced to discard its Jew-focused immigration policy?
|
|
#
¿
Sep 21, 2017 02:24
|
|
|
Kim Jong Il posted:
Realtalk why do you dislike Morsi? There are some good reasons (maybe not compared to Sisi), I'm just curious which if any you cite.
|
|
#
¿
Sep 21, 2017 02:50
|
|
|
R. Mute posted:Congratulations on continuing to make the most tedious of points on a regular basis, absurd What's wrong with tedious? Al Saqr:  We are basically on the same page on this when you aren't understandably angryposting, I think. I am basically alright with foreign Jews receiving citizenship and am strongly supportive of whatever Palestinian right of return can be made to happen.
|
|
#
¿
Sep 21, 2017 03:07
|
|
|
Kim Jong Il posted:I'm mixed on him, but I think you were misreading my point. I was saying that he was a Muslim Brotherhood member, who won in a democratic election. Who, once in office, proceeded to do a lot of empty gestures on Israel while substantially changing not much. He of course had a better relationship with Hamas, but it didn't substantially lead to anything. You could argue that his hands were tied because of the military establishment, but I think it's silly to think that widespread democracy would be a panacea for the Palestinian cause. We're 15 years past everyone thinking that it would be a panacea for Zionism. In reality the two issues have nothing in common. Oh, I see. I did misunderstand where you were pointed. I wonder if this is a useful argument to have in the back pocket in support of Arab / Middle Eastern democratization (when talking to the wildly pro Israel).
|
|
#
¿
Sep 22, 2017 02:09
|
|
|
Xander77 posted:Sadly, the Israeli lobby controls both major parties in US politics, and the United States is subservient to the Zionist government. This is a silly overstatement (or mildly silly hyperbole), and I'm solidly of the opinion that we need to give waaaay less priority to Israel than we do. (Also something about apartheid atrocities and so on but that's not the only thing factoring into strategic priorities) Fake edit fb, by the guy who put it more along the lines of "Israeli lobbies are unduly influential and there is no serious counterbalance whatsoever". One does wonder what the path of least resistance to a counterbalance would be. Maybe just the population (or the left) getting fed up with Israeli occupation policy? Which is conveniently sort of happening a little bit?
|
|
#
¿
Sep 28, 2017 04:28
|
|
|
toc, I'd say you're blowing your cover, but at this point your cover is well on its way to Great Britain
|
|
#
¿
Sep 29, 2017 00:42
|
|
|
fool_of_sound posted:He’s claiming that forcing settlers out of the West Bank is ethnic cleansing They're quite welcome to stay under Palestinian administration.
|
|
#
¿
Oct 22, 2017 23:56
|
|
|
Absurd Alhazred posted:Also the PLO and Hamas have reconciled again well, I mean, it is Tuesday
|
|
#
¿
Nov 22, 2017 01:36
|
|
|
Cat Mattress posted:They are hostile and irreconcilable only because Israel wants to keep them that way. I mean, by analogy the adequate reaction he's proposing is the Palestinian population violently expelling proto-Israel (plus any Jews who were already there, unless they drop below the "significant" threshold, I guess) in self-defense.
|
|
#
¿
Dec 6, 2017 01:19
|
|
|
dont even fink about it posted:Now you're getting me all
|
|
#
¿
Dec 8, 2017 22:26
|
|
about what would happen if it were standing policy to grant statehood to "conquered" territories.
|
Groovelord Neato posted:president deals is very bad at this negotiating thing. His method of negotiating in the past has been "allow me to dictate the terms of the deal or I will walk away". Well, that and not paying labor until there's a risk of successful legal action, whereupon he settles for less than he owes. Weirdly, this doesn't work as well on the international stage.
|
|
#
¿
Jan 3, 2018 01:00
|
|
|
Kanine posted:hey question, is zionism actually able to be divorced from the racist settler apartheid state that israel is or is there no meaningful distinction between zionism and "supporting the israeli governments ethnic cleansing" Erm. Depends how you define zionism? It's real easy to conceive of even a Jewish-centric state that, you know, allows Palestine to literally exist, never mind various currently-implausible ideas where Israel A) doesn't treat it's non-Jewish citizens as second-class and B) continues to be a haven for Jews in their notional historic homeland. tldr: yes Friendly Factory posted:Of course there's a distinction. Zionism was just a response to a long (long, long) period of antisemitism in Europe. Whether or not you think a two-state solution is unfeasible in the present, it was certainly possible before the Palestinian Civil War to have a Jewish state and a Palestinian one side-by-side. A number of factors prevented this from happening, from extremist groups to the ineffectual exit and lack of any kind of real plan by the British. Zionism as it exists now is just being misrepresented by an immoral government in Israel. I don't even feel as if Zionism directly contradicts a moral one-state solution, so long as adequate protections for Jewish populations are codified into law. Of course, they'd have to do the same for Palestinians, but you should see what I'm saying.
|
|
#
¿
Feb 7, 2018 00:36
|
|
|
Friendly Factory posted:Yes? Zionism seeks a state of safety for the Jewish nation. It doesn't have to be a specifically Jewish-only state. heck i'd argue that the United States approaches being a Zionist state (even in the Age of Trump), it's just that a lot of Jews internationally got a little nervous in the late 30s and entire 40s in particular if zionism were disconnected from geography, anyway, which for the purposes of this discussion it can't, in any reasonably recent historical sense it's centered around a SPECIFIC Jewish homeland edit: that one Soviet oblast was absolutely 100% a zionist project though
|
|
#
¿
Feb 7, 2018 01:17
|
|
|
Nebalebadingdong posted:Actually they kept the anti-semitic undertones quote:In the meeting, Netanyahu said "George Soros is also funding the protests. Obama deported two million infiltrators and they didn't say anything."  this has to be a mistranslation, right? right? even bibi wouldn't use that particular noun?
|
|
#
¿
Feb 14, 2018 23:27
|
|
|
Tacky-rear end Rococco posted:Good odds he's never returning to this thread. If I'd been owned so hard by reality I'd have to abandon my account and create a new one to ever post again. He disappeared and then for nine months people were claiming that half a dozen posters with no discernable relation to his writing style were him in disguise.
|
|
#
¿
Apr 2, 2018 06:08
|
|
|
|
| # ¿ May 12, 2024 07:06 |
|
|
Zulily Zoetrope posted:I know it's a real sophomoric take, but to this day, I am still baffled that the immediate response to nazi atrocities was to establish an ethnostate in a densely populated region in the Middle East. The Zionist project was WELL on its way by the later 1930s, it just got a massive shot in the arm from A) refugees and B) post-war international sentiment. also there wasn't really another credible option for "Jewish majority future state" at the time, so there wasn't really any competition if you accept that Jewish self-determination was a reasonable thing for a subset of post-war Jews to demand well, other than Glorious Soviet Jewish Autonomous Oblast
|
|
#
¿
Apr 10, 2018 06:04
|
|