Comic Book Movie Megathread: Bubble? What bubble?

The Something Awful Forums > The Finer Arts > Cinema Discusso > Comic Book Movie Megathread: Bubble? What bubble?

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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Speaking of Suicide Squad, are there any really good takes on it? Critical reviews, etc? I've drafted a long-form video essay on it and I want to make sure I'm not missing anything obvious.

# ¿ Jul 25, 2017 03:19

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# ¿ May 8, 2024 23:11

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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HUNDU THE BEAST GOD posted:

Hardly any but I'd love to see your essay on it.

Thanks, I'll be sure to post it in here when it's done. I've got lots of words already but it's a bit of a mess at the moment because my later observations conflict with earlier ones and it's not an easy film to fit an interpretive structure to, like you can see most things in BvS through Snyder's very explicit Paradise Lost thing. There's lots of elemental symbolism in there and that's what I'm building around, but it's not comprehensive - I'm struggling to see how Katana fits in in this way, for instance.

I'm just about to re-watch Dark Knight Rises, which I haven't seen since it was in the cinema, because I think there are some interesting comparisons between Killer Croc and Bane to draw out, but we'll see.

# ¿ Jul 25, 2017 13:33

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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Ideas are just like, in our heads, folks. How can you steal an idea???

Shageletic posted:

Tony Stark is, of course, a member of several public organisations openly dedicated to maintaining the world order.

# ¿ Jul 25, 2017 16:12

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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So I watched Dark Knight Rises;

Oof that is a long film, and it does get a little reactionary at the end; the 10/10 story of Bane symbolically and literally taking Bruce Wayne's resources and using them for radical social change collapses at the halfway point into a much more comic-y one about personal vendettas and hilarious commitments to causing mass death. it's a shame that we don't see more of Gotham post-trauma; excepting that we see the institutions of power have learned literally nothing apart from that they idolised the wrong one out of Batman and Harvey Dent at the end of The Dark Knight, we don't see any consequences of the corrupt upper classes of Gotham essentially being wiped out. S'weird.

Ultimately Nolan just seems like a fairly conservative kinda guy who gets that the system can be (and is) brutally unfair, and within that has a working understanding of how popular unrest can bubble beneath the surface until it expresses itself in ruptures like the occupy movement. That's just where he stops though, his two visions of the future are a status quo which is constantly defended by individual acts of heroism, or annihiliation. It's not even that he effectively denounces collective action, he just literally can't imagine it without a ticking time bomb to bookend it. And the time bomb is explicitly labelled "free energy" or "social media blank slate" or "Occupy Wall Street". The specific morality of any of these things isn't being discussed, they're just threats to the (perpetually on the brink of collapse) existing order and require the individual actions of brave men to mitigate.

# ¿ Jul 25, 2017 20:05

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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UmOk posted:

The movie is better when you see Bane is the actual hero.

Bane definitely is the hero, right up until he's only part of Talia's gonzo plan. It's a shame, the 1h20 up until he absolutely takes Bruce Wayne apart are amazing.

# ¿ Jul 25, 2017 21:15

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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UmOk posted:

He really is just Batman.

They do the same poo poo.

I love Dark Knight Rises.

Batman's Batcave:

Bane's Batcave:

Bruce Wayne's Batcave:

And as a bonus, the Wayne Enterprises building, still stubbornly sporting the nighttime when the bulk of this film takes place in the day:

# ¿ Jul 26, 2017 00:53

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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RBA Starblade posted:

To me, my Lex-Men!

Bald, arrogant, condescending. Checks out.

# ¿ Jul 27, 2017 14:18

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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I caught Amazing Spiderman on Netflix the other day. Bold move to have Uncle Ben die trying to steal someone's gun.

# ¿ Jul 27, 2017 16:41

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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Also comic books are doing loving terribly.

# ¿ Aug 3, 2017 00:38

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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Is there a better thread than this one to bring up Ender's Game?

# ¿ Aug 10, 2017 01:10

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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Al Borland Corp. posted:

I actually liked the characters in Suicide Squad but the movie was incredibly disjointed. The one criticism I've seen a lot for it, though, that the Joker was haphazardly shoehorned in, I disagree with. The Harley origin stuff was good, and his coming after her relentlessly and trying to break her out was good. And it was a very interesting Joker and good performance. It's more the rest of the film that felt carelessly slapped together. Also I had real trouble distinguishing between Rick Flagg and any other white dudes.

Literally the only distinguishing feature Rick Flag has is that he's in love with Enchantress. It's kind of a joke, his superpower is that, for entirely circumstantial reasons, Waller doesn't consider him disposable.

Leto's Joker is so coherent that it makes me wonder what all the backstage poo poo about condoms and dead pigs was, because there's nothing of that in the performance.

# ¿ Aug 11, 2017 14:15

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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Detective No. 27 posted:

http://www.avclub.com/article/zack-snyders-300-presaged-howling-fascism-alt-righ-259286
Holy hell, talk about someone being so close and airballing.

I really hope Zack Snyder gets to make his Fountainhead.

# ¿ Aug 11, 2017 23:35

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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Phylodox posted:

I think it's plenty weird, just not the same kind of weird we're used to from him or for this genre. A bombastic space opera being used to tell a poignant, intensely personal story about loss and insecurity and realizing your hopes and dreams were shallow and childish is pretty out there. It's a weird take on both the 30-something manchild learns responsibility and the exciting space adventure genres.

# ¿ Aug 13, 2017 21:22

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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^ hah, I had that exact image saved and uploaded before deciding that Anakin was more of a manchild.

# ¿ Aug 13, 2017 22:47

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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Ehh I think you'd struggle to make the case that things go well for him at really any point once he's Hayden Christensen.

# ¿ Aug 13, 2017 23:39

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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grieving for Gandalf posted:

yeah but what is

Deep Space Nine.

# ¿ Aug 17, 2017 10:17

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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The MSJ posted:

Hahaha, the director of The Inhumans pilot that was shot in IMAX said Marvel hired him because he's cheap and work fast.

https://www.cnet.com/news/marvel-inhumans-fast-and-cheap-director-roel-reine/

About the same time Marvel dropped a new trailer too.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NWd7WNI1dRs

"yeah we want it to be exactly a minute, just bring the dip to black forward on gorgon, karnak and auran"

# ¿ Aug 18, 2017 11:52

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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They're a nice contrast, Steve and Bucky fight over Steve's devotion to his duty, which Bucky can't shake no matter how hard he tries. Lois, conversely, worries her relationship with Clark has been shown to conflict with his duty, and fears that his attachment to her isn't strong enough to overcome this.

# ¿ Aug 18, 2017 20:33

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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HUNDU THE BEAST GOD posted:

Again, another thing Suicide Squad does extremely well is showing why anyone, man or woman, would be intensely attracted to The Joker. Also it's a weirdly kinky film overall.

Batman: "aurrrgh I was tricked into kissing"

But you're right, c.f. everything about the Waller/Flag/Moone love triangle.

# ¿ Aug 19, 2017 08:58

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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The hand is the only remaining part of him that's actually human - he explicitly points out that his brain is not - and it's comically vestigial. The implication, with the long silly way it's rigged up to remain in place while all the mechanical parts depart, is that Gary Oldman seriously thought he was doing the guy a favour in keeping it. That's funny.

# ¿ Aug 20, 2017 11:16

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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I watched the Batman & Harley sequence from Nightwing and Harley fighting to them hooking up and it's absolutely excruciating. Mostly in the terrible hack dialogue but also:

A woman, considering proposing casual sex.

A man, open to the idea.

# ¿ Aug 21, 2017 01:52

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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You may be too physically weak to join the army, but this secret serum I have invented will turn you into the perfect Clown.

# ¿ Aug 23, 2017 02:01

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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Inescapable Duck posted:

Funny thing is this actually kinda fits the comics; apparently, there's THREE Jokers!

Did that terrible cliffhanger go anywhere in the end?

# ¿ Aug 23, 2017 10:42

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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I'll eat my hat if someone manages to get a Red Son movie made. It's a complete non-starter.

# ¿ Aug 24, 2017 01:24

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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SuperMechagodzilla posted:

(And in the case of both Iron Man 2 and Dark Knight Rises, you have a costumed vigilante fighting desperately to kill the superhero).

SMG, if you've got a moment, what's your read on why Bane is subordinate to Miranda Tate? The whole film becomes about Batman's burning need to hold back social progress in any form, but I don't get why Bane (who never really ceases to attempt to blow Batman's brains out) is part of the the al Ghul death/revenge cult, which always seems borderline aristocratic.

# ¿ Aug 26, 2017 13:50

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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SuperMechagodzilla posted:

It's Superman logic. Love for Lois is the both the source of his power and his greatest weakness. If his love loses its universal dimension, Superman regresses into Clark Kent. The entirety of BVS is about this conflict:

"I don't know if it's possible... for you to love me and be you."

Thanks for this, it makes a lot of sense.

# ¿ Aug 27, 2017 23:42

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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That's what will make DC comic book movies a success at last, opaque continuity based around the desire of writers to tell self-contained stories while desperately maintaining 'canon' because ???

# ¿ Sep 2, 2017 05:54

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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The MCU formula, as regularly gets pointed out in this thread, barely has any continuity at all in terms of plot or character. It has continuity... of costumes and actors.

# ¿ Sep 2, 2017 07:32

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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I'm very much worried he doesn't have the psychosexual chops for the job.

# ¿ Sep 7, 2017 01:15

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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*nodding, sagely*

# ¿ Sep 10, 2017 12:05

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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K. Waste posted:

*Bob Ross voice* You know what, what the heck? Let's get crazy.

what if thor 3 was in colour?

# ¿ Sep 10, 2017 22:13

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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It's maddening, because the highlights on that shot of the Hulk jumping are really nice, but mapped all flat like that it's all much of a muchness. But someone at Marvel is convinced that flat gamma is their house style.

# ¿ Sep 10, 2017 22:34

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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Chairman Capone posted:

And speaking of the end, as much as I liked the DC, I still feel like the ending was flubbed. Not that I felt it had to be a giant space squid specifically (though I did like the storyline of the Indian woman artist in the comic, and I feel like her story inadvertently became a metaphor for what Moore feels like with how his own creations are adapted by others) but replacing it with Manhattan just doesn't feel as effective. He attacks New York along with the other cities, but he's still the symbol of American superpower superiority for a generation. Ignoring all the armchair diplomatic analysis of what would "really" happen in that case, I just don't feel like the symbolism is the same. Plus, the fear of an alien invasion and belief that the US and USSR would team up to fight one is something that Reagan talked about constantly at the time, so it even worked with the existing Cold War environment Moore was writing in (though obviously not as applicable today/in 2009).

The problem with doing a 'USA/USSR team up to fight the aliens' end in 2009 is, of course, that we now know they didn't and the real ending was that America just 'won'. The change to having it be Manhattan is probably meant to evoke the dominant mover of the last twenty years of world events, America's chickens coming home to roost. It doesn't quite work both because Watchmen is still steeped in Cold War imagery which doesn't match up with that ending, and also that in 2009 a pop culture film which ends with 9/11 being the US's direct fault was probably too out there to portray explicitly. Now, in 2017, kitsch 9/11 imagery is everywhere in film and BvS goes much further with it.

# ¿ Sep 14, 2017 13:00

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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^ snap

Gorn Myson posted:

I remember back when it was released the consensus online was lukewarm. Since then the thing I've seen people say over and over again is that "Snyder copied the comic but completely missed the point of it", and no one has ever elaborated to me what they think the "point" actually was.

People think that he missed that the point of the space squid was to unite the USA and USSR against a common enemy, and that he missed that the superheroes were meant to be pathetic and instead made them 'too cool'.

# ¿ Sep 14, 2017 13:19

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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^ I don't think the point is that the squid would be a technical challenge to depict, more that the logic which animates it is specific to comic books. Cinema doesn't have two-page splashes.

Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:

Yeah, I guess if I was the Soviet Union that a single American TV interview would be enough to convince me that a super weapon from an enemy nation killing 14 million of my citizens and nuking my capital was an oopsie and that I should ally with the American warmachine and global capitalism to defend against the weapon created by the American warmachine and global capitalism.

It doesn't matter what the Soviet Union thinks because in under a decade it's gone.

# ¿ Sep 14, 2017 18:09

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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Nolan evokes it [the two page splash] pretty well in one sense with the use of IMAX in Dark Knight/Rises, but it's always going to be a reinterpretation.

# ¿ Sep 14, 2017 18:23

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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Rorschach's arrest in Watchmen is quite perfunctory:

He jumps out of the window and that's that, he's immediately under the boot of faceless state authority.

All Zack Snyder does is have him subdued by a more cinematic representation of faceless state authority:

# ¿ Sep 15, 2017 10:22

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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Well, from a point of view of 'realism', it's not realistic that unless the fat, lazy superheroes were actually pretty exceptional fighters that they'd have made it through their super-careers to retirement. There are pretty solid reasons why keeping the peace in real life isn't dominated by costumed vigilantes who eschew firearms.

e: which is to say, 'Watchmen' is about corruption and politics seeping into an idealistic world of superheroes, not about 'superheroes in real life'.

# ¿ Sep 15, 2017 13:47

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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The alley fight is presented as noble, glamorous, horrifying and brutal all at once. The two sets of qualities are indivisible. It's a standard superhero fistfight, and standard superhero fistfights are cool, violent and horrible. More abstractly, the entire idea of there being a Superman is terrifying - not just because of incidental details like "maybe he's giving everyone he meets cancer" but inherent in the idea that this God is Like Us, and could get angry and irrational and make decisions which change the world on impulse.

# ¿ Sep 15, 2017 14:41

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# ¿ May 8, 2024 23:11

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
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Do we know what kind of Christian?

# ¿ Sep 16, 2017 00:25

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