Herstory Begins Now posted:

You and I have different idea of what we want from an fps, but yeah that's not in any way wrong at all and if anything, that's explicitly what the game always sold itself as and was designed from the ground up to be.

headcase posted:

Well I don't remember it being marketed as an FPS and only 4/~30 characters have a somewhat traditional ranged hitscan so it can't be. It's more of a challenge mode "you can try to play an FPS in a non FPS game, but good luck with it."

Gravitas Shortfall posted:

Unless you're a support, yeah.

Macaluso posted:

A) I'm really confused about what Soldier brings that Soujurn just doesn't do better. To build off that: B) Soldier now when he fires his gun, the crosshair slowly moves up?? Is that a new change or has that been in for a while? What is that? It feels absolutely SO awful to shoot his gun with that. At first I was like oh weird they added recoil but this is worse. It's like your mouse drifts upwards. It's awful. Yuck. Anyway, maybe his sprint really makes the difference between him and Soujourn but she just seems like a better Soldier. Doomfist is labeled as tank now but it doesn't look like they changed anything

Jezza of OZPOS posted:

So did any supports get a rework? Or am I just begging my dps for peel until I give up and play brig?

Sgt. Cosgrove posted:

So I claimed my key via twitch and restarted blizz launcher but I'm not getting OW2 Technical beta under the version list for regular Overwatch, am I a moron or is something busted?

Countblanc posted:

Weird question but does anyone know what's up with people who don't own OW1 and getting to play the beta? A friend of mine got invited via twitch and it's letting him install OW1 as it says on the blog, but there's no option to play OW2 instead like there is for me (a person who owns OW1). I feel like I'm missing something obvious here.

Wheeee posted:

two hours and still nothing

it is a sign

OtspIII posted:

I misunderstood the twitch drop system, and thought it was taking place on Tuesday (when I was busy all day) and not yesterday (when I was completely free), so I completely missed it. I take it that ship has sailed?

urea posted:

After a few days, I'm not really enjoying OW2. The games often devolve into a deathball where whoever has the most raw damage and healing output wins, and occasionally you can find an opportunity to assassinate a healer, and then you win because your raidboss is now stronger than the enemy raidboss. Games just feel really one dimensional and unsatisfying.

Like, if i can trade my life for an opening pick on a support, I'll take that trade every time, because the force multiplier on the raidboss is worth so much more than my pitiful dps existence.

Herstory Begins Now posted:

Yeah the solution is and has always been 'make support fun' and not add more and more layers of matchmaker mechanics and split the playerbase between different modes because making supports strong enough that people are fine playing them for a match is one change that blizzard simply refuses to make.

KNR posted:

Paladins healers are more fun by virtue of having much higher damage output and DPS characters having various methods of selfsustain so the healers aren't as focused on babysitting the whole team. Overall higher time to kill, slower heals and everyone having short duration antiheal on attacks prevented GOATS style heal blobs.

Herstory Begins Now posted:

I think they probably need to overhaul the roles beyond the scope of what they've currently done or would ever do. Fundamentally if roles are fun people will play them and want to play them and that's the absolute core issue that they have never figured out a way to resolve in 6 years. In competitive contexts that is skewed by people playing what will win over what is fun, but that's where active, regular, and proactive balancing comes in. Limiting roles removes a ton of the potential for game-breaking strong combinations of characters so it should free some player power cap and, as would follow, making the solo tank more powerful (eg fun to play) made more people want to play tank. Meanwhile supports have been unfun from the perspective of 90% of the playerbase for years now and afaik support power has only trended downwards over the last few years since it's peak around the time of brig/bap's introduction.

There are other things they could do beyond just making supports more powerful (and imo the direction to go there is make them more lethal and not to crank up the healing). Adding new supports would be a huge deal. They haven't added a support since March 2019. Beyond/failing that, they need to be proactively cranking the power level around until they find something that people actually want to play. What they have currently clearly is not it. Personally I'd love if they made supports more mobile and made that a core part of the role, particularly since the main target of most team fights is the supports, but that's also my personal bias towards finding mobility extremely fun in FPS games coming out. It's also a way of making weaker characters feel better, but don't tell blizzard that. Zen and anna's hopping back to their teams from spawn getting hacked and one clipped by sombras is definitely encouraging more people to queue up support.

Herstory Begins Now posted:

supports were numerically strong because ow has insane health pools and high hps healing. supports also felt like poo poo the higher up you go on the ladder as the tracers and genjis and sombras and doomfists got better and better at just deleting them. Good at healing large health pools =/= feels good to play.

teagone posted:

Honestly, 100% this and Symmetra. Rework them again to be supports.

Jezza of OZPOS posted:

I refuse to believe that winston believes in, much less would willingly participate in capital punishment!!!

Mattavist posted:

What would the PvE mode even be? Does anyone at Blizzard even have experience designing/developing repeatable PvE modes anymore?

It’s a ridiculous question given that this is the company that makes WoW, but then I remember which company it is.

SgtSteel91 posted:

It's really funny arguing about a shooter having a PvP and PvE modes when Destiny 2 proves that its possible to have such a thing and it's still going strong

headcase posted:

I tried to watch CSGO eleague one time, and it was the most absurdly boring 45 minutes of my life. There is nothing to see. Some dude crouching behind a box until 3 pixels that are imperceptible to a spectator stick out into a window. The "twitch faster" game is unwatchable and uninteresting.

OW2 was pretty decent to spectate, but not as good as OW1. There is too much dueling and mobility, and not enough consistent direction of play. OW1 was really interesting with the way play rotates around the tanks, and any deviation made an interesting story.

e: ow2 seems to be the 'corner the healers' game.

drrockso20 posted:

I blame Battleborn getting unfairly matched up against Overwatch even though any actual similarities the two had besides being colorful FPS's was minimal, in a better world Battleborn would still be alive and receiving support and that would satisfy the need for a FPS MOBA(honestly it's a hybrid genre that is surprisingly underserved right now)

DrunkPanda posted:

Well when they super-buff one role, then it makes open queue inherently broken since whichever team has more players on that role wins the game. Open queue is not a viable option for OW2, as a result

Minera posted:

Healing turrets would be sick but giving her a heal on right click as well as taking away her damage turrets would make her one of the most vulnerable support to flankers. I guess playing harder around teleporter resolves that a bit..?

flakeloaf posted:

Don't forget access to the "battle pass" path, which contains only cosmetics, and lasts for a "season" however long that is

teagone posted:

How much are battle passes usually? $20?

[edit] Just to be clear, gently caress Blizzard's pricing model/practices and stuff. I'm just trying to find the sense in value for the $40 asking price for the Watchpoint pack.

Codependent Poster posted:

I don't get why Sym got destroyed by the nerf bat. It's not like she was really ever being played. Why even take away the ammo refill when there's only two tanks who have shields?

BabyRyoga posted:

The TP change is two nerfs: a range nerf, again not sure why this was necessary, and a utility nerf since you can't just leave it at spawn to allow teammates faster return to the point in an overtime control point scenario, or constant access to high ground from the backline. For the cost of these two pretty significant nerfs, you get a change that MIGHT have a small benefit in niche situations in that her TP is faster to place and the CD could be up slightly faster from time of destruction in some scenarios when it doesn't get destroyed immediately. Actually, I forgot, it is three nerfs because TP health was also slashed by 1/3.

flakeloaf posted:

Agreed. Healing sucks cause nobody peels and football isn't fun for the ball, and I just don't get tanking, so I'm a DPS onetrick wheee

Countblanc posted:

I've seen a lot of Strong Gamers say that Junker Queen feels good but her shout ability specifically is busted. This seems to be because if it's ability to shield teammates but that seems weird to me because like, that's what tanks do, yeah? Like I'll see a clip where a Queen's health buff is what makes the difference with a healer surviving and the Queen player will be like "see? That's dumb, I shouldn't be able to do that" but no one is like "wow my Winston bubble, an effective 700 health barrier which requires no more aim than Shout, just kept my teammate who was getting shot at alive, and that's bad and unhealthy for the game".

I have no hands on experience with this beta round - and even if I did it wouldn't be a top 500 level like these people are - so I feel like I'm just missing something obvious.

Field Mousepad posted:

Wait you have to pay to play the beta? What is that poo poo?

teagone posted:

Makes sense they would go with something like the Apex Legends model, right? Where you can either earn in-game currency via wins or whatever to unlock new heroes, or if you don't want to experience THE GRIND, you have the option to just outright pay for the new hero by buying OW coins or whatever equivalent with actual money and then use the OW coins to unlock the hero. Or did Jeff explicitly want new heroes to be free no matter what, i.e., available to everyone at absolutely no cost when they're released?

dogstile posted:

Jack B Nimble posted:

How bad is Apex thought to be in this regard? I have my own internal rankings of the "big Three hero shooters" but it did occur to me that one could have considerably more or less cheaters.

comedyblissoption posted:

avoiding situations where people tell their team "i cant swap to X i dont have her unlocked" was a conscious design decision in ow1 lol

Herstory Begins Now posted:

ow is designed from the ground up that hero switching is a vital and completely intended part of countering characters. beyond just the baseline :eyeroll: at the battlepass, that's why people are focused on that specific point