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Who cares if Hitler was a socialist or not - he was also a vegetarian, does this mean all vegetarians would murder all jews if left unchecked?
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Feb 13, 2017 21:26
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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-politics-38971675 TL;DR: steel workers accept cut in pensions to keep jobs. This is how it starts folks, I've seen this. I've seen this loving same thing before. This is the loving beginning, trust me. Next up: labor "flexibilization" (i.e. "I can fire you whenever the gently caress I want, no severance"). It will come, and would you believe there's more steps? It's a train of misery and pain.
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Feb 15, 2017 16:18
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Hmm yes, some kind of international union with plans to increase proliferation of renewable power sources, nuclear research programs, and the like. Truly that would be a cool thing.
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Feb 15, 2017 17:25
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Never in my entire life has anyone ever given me one good loving reason why you should love your country. Loving your flag is such a ridiculous loving concept that I'm not even going to engage it - the fact that human beings are capable of such a sentiment is a terrible thing all in itself. But seriously, love your country? Basically it's loving a government, because people come and go - humans are migratory in nature, history is full of invasions and counter-invasions. Countries amount to nothing but government apparatus, and seriously, you love that poo poo? Are you loving stupid? Also the world has become a global arena for corporations (incarnations of collective greed) in case you didn't notice, making the concept even more irrelevant.
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Feb 15, 2017 23:10
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baka kaba posted:It's an in-group/out-group thing I know what it is - I know it's misplaced tribalism, the same kind of poo poo that has had us as a species murdering each other since our inception. Us and them, otherizing, etc. But seriously, a country? You can love your community, feel a deep link with it, and otherize whoever is outside it, but you don't even belong to your country - NO ONE belongs to a country because it's not a place, it's not a people, it's just some administrative entity. No one is entitled to own a place - you don't own England because you're not English because no one loving is - we've muddled the lines too much for that and even if that wasn't the case, who the gently caress cares? It's unethical anyway. Nations are unethical by definition.
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Feb 15, 2017 23:24
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hakimashou posted:The same reason people love their family and friends more than strangers. Have you actually read the post you quoted? Because I said quite clearly that feelings of tribalism with human beings you know is something I understand and yes, a part of human nature, but a) it's not the best part - it's responsible for a lot of bad poo poo, and b) "loving your country" is not tribalism with humans you know - countries are a goddamn fiction because there's absolutely nothing linking you to all those million people you'll never ever loving know in your life. You're basically saying that you'd save people from your country before you'd save people from elsewhere, which is such a despicable view once you ditch the lovely racist romance and actually consider how it'd work in action I don't even know where to begin. Have you actually read history books and travelled the world? Because there's so much deep interlinking between all the cultures of the world that it'd be stupid to consider a country a unit of culture - we humans are all too linked together through the migrations and invasions and counter-invasions of history to even make a unit of culture a clear thing. Countries are not groups of people - they're just administrative entities. It's stupid to feel like it's your family, and you're a racist, sorry. Judge people by their individual actions, not by a string of characters in their passport.
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Feb 16, 2017 08:41
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Guavanaut posted:I've seen many of my friends post things about 'We love the NHS'. This is what the poster I was responding to was advocating, adjusted for your use case: "I will put the needs of those who were born in a territory where the NHS operates, before the needs of those born outside of it" You tell me, friend. P.S: in case you didn't notice, I'm not saying that saying "man I love the UK" is racist because surprise, I also have said that on occasion and it has a completely different meaning to what the poster I was responding to meant when he said "loving your country". Pochoclo fucked around with this message at 11:31 on Feb 16, 2017 |
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Feb 16, 2017 11:28
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So, if countries are shared beliefs, why do so many people who share the beliefs of the UK want to expel so many other people who also fully share the beliefs of the UK from the territory of the UK, based solely on an administrative property of these people? Not even birthplace, just citizenship seems to be enough to cause this response. Why? They are their countrymen, aren't they?
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Feb 16, 2017 17:13
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Fangz posted:Because they are douchebags. Sure, but what I mean is that for many many people currently in the UK, the "I just prefer that the country's resources are spent with preference towards my own countrymen" argument they're using is actually, deep down, "I just prefer that the country's resources are spent with preference towards my own countrymen... as long as they belong to my favourite arbitrarily defined (mostly ethnic) group"
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Feb 16, 2017 17:24
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Can we get an actual competent left please? Like, a socialist-democratic party or something I donno. Can't we just import politicians from some nordic country or w/e?
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Feb 17, 2017 22:24
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forkboy84 posted:There are very few people in politics who actually are social democrats at this point. I dunno, maybe it's the curse of a hundred years of increasing eagerness to collaborate with capital (& selling out the rest of the left to work with liberals at pretty much every opportunity) that has ended up with it being a poorly represented ideology these days. While I agree with your sentiment, I also think that the US did a loving great job of demonising communism/socialism (conflated for convenience) to the point where people will automatically go "lol failed ideology, Venezuela, North Korea, Stalin". Nevermind that we haven't actually had a really socialist government in the modern world ever. With social-democrats at least you can point at the (now dwindling) successes of the nordic countries and say "see, these guys did pretty well, it kinda works alright", and people might actually vote for something like that. Again though, I agree, and I'd love some sort of super leftist and progressive mega-charismatic Anti-Trump to pop up and somehow make people stand up for good stuff instead of racism and making the rich richer.
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Feb 18, 2017 00:21
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In 5 years each and every single politician in the UK will be running on a "rejoin the EU" platform anyway, just wait and see.
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Feb 18, 2017 19:28
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Rigged Death Trap posted:In a breach of the usual sobriety in international political discourse, all of Brussels erupts in rancorous laughter. You'll be glad to say goodbye to the pound after it gets devalued all the way down to peso levels, trust me. I for one will convert all my saved up pounds to dollars/euros before I go work in Amsterdam/Berlin, around two years from now, when the poo poo hits the fan. I'll be happy to see the euro strengthen after the UK's devastated yet recovering economy joins it.
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Feb 18, 2017 20:23
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On the one hand, global misery and suffering after a devastating WW3 that will plunge human civilization back to the dark ages and leave it unprepared to deal with unstoppable climate change. On the other hand, finally immigration will cease to be a problem, good job. Real estate prices will not go down though.
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Feb 18, 2017 23:36
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namesake posted:Presumably the near total destruction of global industry and most life would quickly net out to be an overall positive in stopping greenhouse gas emissions? Well, the Earth biosphere will recover of course, but it will be pretty bad for primitive agrarian mankind, that's for sure. Hopefully Coleoptera Sapiens or whatever succeeds us will not have right-wing government.
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Feb 18, 2017 23:50
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forkboy84 posted:'d have guessed most of the emphasis would have been on white more than anything else. Most of Europe is white as gently caress though so it kind of begs the question, are the racist brexiteers going to be happy once they realise that most of the immigrants they didn't want actually come from outside the EU?
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Feb 19, 2017 14:10
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What needs to happen is full socialism now. Some kind of epidemic disease that affects people and makes them care about others?
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Feb 20, 2017 01:17
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hakimashou posted:Thats not the direction things are going in Britain. You don't say. I hadn't noticed!
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Feb 20, 2017 01:27
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Fatty posted:On the subject of the housing crisis, have you guys seen the goon with a second London house for his wifes hoard? I was about to have an aneurysm, but then I remembered that the russian oil-lords are like ten billion times worse, and my head exploded like that scene in Scanners. Also, what's the deal with the Lords trying to ping-pong amendments back? I'm unfamiliar with how much power they have, if any - any chance the EU citizen rights amendment sticks?
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Feb 20, 2017 20:39
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Pissflaps posted:Yes. You don't? Oh come the gently caress on. You can say a lot of things about Corbyn, mainly about his competence as a politician, but he's definitely not posh; he doesn't have "lineage" and he certainly doesn't have large amounts of accumulated capital. And this is coming from someone who experienced actual poverty in a third world country at a time it was deeply submerged in an economic crisis - subjectively speaking I see my present self as posh as gently caress, but you need perspective - people on salaried incomes will never truly be "posh" compared to the capital class. Pochoclo fucked around with this message at 08:39 on Feb 23, 2017 |
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Feb 23, 2017 08:37
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It's almost like "working class" is a much broader term than the rich capitalist class would have you believe, huh... almost... almost like they want the working class earning less to hate the working class earning more (and viceversa!), when it's all peanuts compared to the rich fat bastards running the media machine making us all hate each other instead of uniting against them.Pissflaps posted:Ah because 'working class' means 'has a job'. I see. Well yes, it means you depend on income you receive in exchange for your labor (or would do so, if you had a job). It doesn't really include rich fuckers' sons that get an income in exchange for being daddy's boy. But if you're doing a job and you get £300k annual income out of it, guess what you're still working class, at least until you save up enough so you can live off your accumulated capital. Then you stop being working class. Pochoclo fucked around with this message at 08:52 on Feb 23, 2017 |
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Feb 23, 2017 08:47
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JFairfax posted:u have a southener running ur football club and you are top of the league and about to get promoted?! how can they be all bad ?! Going by that definition I declare myself the most southerner of all brits in this thread (unless we have a Falklander).
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Feb 23, 2017 08:55
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The media has done a super good job of making half the working class hate the other half. You're not gonna get through centuries of conditioning.
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Feb 23, 2017 09:03
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Pissflaps posted:I'm not sure - does he have a job? He makes about £2 million a year out of his shares in one of his main companies, and owns real estate to the tune of 30-50 million or more. That means that no, he's not working class because even if he has a job, it's not what he depends on to live.
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Feb 23, 2017 11:24
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Pantsuit posted:The public are pure evil and hate all that is good in the world. That's why they hate foreign people and Jeremy Corbyn. Don't chalk up to evil what you can chalk up to a simple combination of stupidity, selfishness, apathy and lack of a broader perspective.
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Feb 23, 2017 17:38
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HJB posted:Idiotic hypothetical alert: If humanity were to somehow start again, but with the climate as it currently is, would it now be warm enough in at least the south of England for humans to evolve with darker skin? It's not about warmth, it's about UV radiation and vitamin D. Equator: UV rays hit the surface at a perpendicular angle, so you need sunscreen, so you get melanin, so black skin. Poles: UV rays hit at an angle, atmospheric diffraction etc, so your skin needs to produce more vitamin D from less radiation, so you get white skin. This hasn't really changed that much, so you wouldn't. Not that it matters, I don't think we'd get a second chance at this civilization thing. Hope not. Pochoclo fucked around with this message at 18:31 on Feb 23, 2017 |
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Feb 23, 2017 18:28
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Yeah sure, show an England-born indian or arab to most of that 80% and they'll backpedal like an olympic bicyclist on crack cocaine.
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Feb 23, 2017 19:54
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Huh, Labour didn't so much win Stoke as the Tories lost it thanks to UKIP stealing half their votes. I think this is going to be a repeating pattern - Labour will be an eternal 35% while the split between Tories and UKIP will decide if either Tories or Labour win.
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Feb 24, 2017 10:08
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HJB posted:People don't hate immigrants (at least, they didn't and they wouldn't), they hate the negative impact of the sheer number of immigrants on their lives. People want immigration reduced and controlled for the betterment of their own lives, not to spite immigrants. Yes, there are people who are violent and aggressive towards them, but that sort of person will always exist, there will always be racial hatred regardless. We're keeping the country running and when you hunker down and close down the hatches and we start leaving en masse (because we can just hop around Europe looking for better conditions, something you won't be able to do, by the way) all the little racists that say things like "sheer numbers of immigrants! (lives in a village with 0.001% immigrants)" will blame us for the economic collapse, and the destruction of workers rights, and the rampant unemployment. But yeah it was us, evil european immigrants, all along, making house prices high.
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Feb 24, 2017 11:06
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LemonDrizzle posted:https://twitter.com/ONS/status/835095696772591617 It's either people indebting themselves for the next 100 years on a mortgage for a leasehold they won't be able to pass down onto their kids, or investors speculating. Mostly just investors. "First time buyers", well, there's always going to be a first time, right?
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Feb 24, 2017 13:55
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LemonDrizzle posted:
Corrupt EU-schmoozing parasite convinces UK racists to destroy their own country, news at 11
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Feb 24, 2017 14:11
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No single party should have complete control of parliament, they should limit it at like 30% or so. I mean it can't be any worse than the current system.
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Feb 24, 2017 15:11
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jBrereton posted:Look at the Netherlands for what happens when that's more or less the case. You have a Smörgåsbord of neoliberal parties including their Labour party. But none of them ever win many votes, because it isn't an inspiring message. Jesus gently caress, why do Western Europeans out of all loving people have such a huge raging boner for the right-wing?
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Feb 24, 2017 15:18
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Just bribe the Daily Mail to run articles like "Could supporting SOCIALISM improve your ARTHRITIS?" or something
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Feb 24, 2017 16:33
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We need a hardcore socialist with Hitler-level charisma, replacing the madness and evil with actual goodwill of course.
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Feb 24, 2017 18:39
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Regarde Aduck posted:Yes we do need *PERFECT LEADER* to !!!!lead!!!! Labour. Where, exactly, is this *PERFECT LEADER* going to come from? Does anyone like that currently exist within the Labour party? Are they going to be grown quickly in a vat? Some *campers* are not so good for *elections*. We need better *parties*.
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Feb 24, 2017 19:02
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HJB posted:Nothing. As in, nothing will happen in the UK any more. Lol sure, losing 20% of your general workforce and about 60% of your IT workforce is not going to have any serious effects at all. Not to mention lost tax revenue. Unless you mean absolutely nothing, in which case you'd be wrong. You'll still have Marmite.
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Feb 24, 2017 19:53
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LemonDrizzle posted:http://www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/p...y-a3474846.html That's stupid bullshit. First, it assumes "pocket money" is a thing. If your parents give you money as a kid, you're already pretty well off, so congratulations. Second, it says "afford a deposit". Being able to afford a deposit is a long way from actually buying a property.
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Feb 24, 2017 21:41
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ShaneMacGowansTeeth posted:christ, I'm due to move in with my girlfriend at some point this year and we're going to have stay in London for at least two years until her eldest has finished his GSCEs and we're both already terrified about how we're going to cover the rent Yeah, for three people you're gonna end up spending at least £1500 if you want to be near a Zone 1/2 tube station. "Living wage" is a joke by the way, I have no idea how anyone not in tech/fin survives.
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Feb 24, 2017 21:57
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| # ¿ May 15, 2024 17:37 |
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ookiimarukochan posted:If you're getting pocket money at the rate the article assumes (a few grand a year?) so that 1/4 of it would make your deposit then yeah, but getting a token amount of pocket money is hardly a mark of being one of the petit-bourgoise. I come from a very poor background so pocket money seems loving insane to me as a concept, but I will concede that a pound or two a week might be reasonable for average families.
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Feb 24, 2017 22:01
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