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lenoon posted:I agree, but you're firing on where they are, not where they will be - turn one fire should absolutely be there in case win the initiative, but moved towards the front of the line in case we don't. They're either there or not. The Germans seemed to have halted completely after contacting our infantry. I'm assuming this means they will need to successfully issue a change of orders before they can move again. With their communications all hosed up, they could easily fail and remain in the same positions. We blast them with indirect fire in that case. The alternative is to randomly blast around the forest. In that case, we'll probably kill like 1 or 2 chits, so who cares? It's a minor risk for a possible high reward. Tehan posted:I was under the impression that artillery in the Vallee couldn't direct fire out of it. Either we want all our artillery able to direct fire into the forest, or we want them all out of possible line of sight in the Vallee. That order gets 5/6 guns able to direct fire, in 4 turns. My view is that if the Germans actually start attacking, we need those guns re-oriented as fast as possible. That's the best we can do to have fire support in 4 turns. In 5 turns, we can have 8 guns capable of firing... But that one turn can make a lot of difference. Reminding everybody again that this is a game where the average engagement finishes in 3/4 turns. AbortRetryFail posted:My infantry either need to be supporting a current brigade with additional rifle fire, providing spotting targets for artillery, or night raiding. Then resting at dawn. I don't really know what the plan for your brigade is. Wasn't it just a joke?
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Apr 2, 2017 02:11
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The boche were probably in the same position as us. Leftover indirect arty missions directed to hit likely positions. They did a pretty good number on My Dad's brigade, but not much anywhere else. I'm expecting that if the boche attack, they will attack through Effyaders. It's the one spot where their bombardment was most effective, and the last sighted position of the bulk of their infantry. While we shelled the poo poo out of effyaders last night, the Germans are probably stronger in Effyaders than anywhere else.
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Apr 3, 2017 02:41
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Loel posted:The more I look at it, the more pleased I am. Theyve really started to narrow their range of options. They thought we wouldnt see them in the forest, but now they are trapped in the woods and surrounded. The longer they stay, the more forces they are going to lose - we are just going to bombard the entire forest the rest of the week. Meanwhile, if they try to move up arty to support, we knock them out. What are their options? Moving west or south both lead to layers of our trenches. I don't see why you think this way? We have no information on what the boche formations are like inside the forest. We probably inflicted casualties on the one brigade we targeted, but the rest of our shots were were just random. We have a weakened, stretched-out infantry brigade defending the entire western edge of Effyaders woods. Don't you see that if the Germans make a concerted attack, they will assuredly break through?
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Apr 3, 2017 03:17
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Hunt11 posted:A question involving brigade movement. If in battle stance how precise can a brigade move across the battlefield? As in can they slip through gaps that are about a chit wide or will they run right into the obstacle? You would need absolute knowledge of the terrain to make orders as specific as that. If the crossing is contested though, an awkward single-file brigade formation would just get shredded because of bad unit frontage so why is this an issue?
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Apr 3, 2017 16:44
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my dad posted:It's not about crossings. It's about barbed wire at a defensive line in the rear. Check the roll20 maps once you've got the chance. I didn't mean a river crossing. If the enemy is forced to adopt a useless battle formation for the purposes of not touching barbed wire, the wire has still accomplished its goal. It makes the enemy assault ineffective.
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Apr 3, 2017 19:48
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Trin Tragula posted:
Just a reminder to everybody, there are German entrenchments in the Tallis douche and they are not reflected in the roll20 map. sullat posted:I agree, that southern bridge is ours now. They haven't shelled your guys yet so they may not realize anyone is there! They will soon, though. They did shell us in the South, though whether that was just a guess is unknown. Also, question for Trin: Are those infantry company reinforcements available? Slim Jim Pickens fucked around with this message at 01:14 on Apr 4, 2017 |
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Apr 4, 2017 00:59
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Bacarruda posted:That doesn't fit with their current fireplan at all. North does it fit with the current location of their arty. They're clearing focusing on the north. I agree with this general sentiment. We've no idea how successful our artillery bombardment in Effyaders Woods actually was. At last report, there were 2 German brigades in the woods, but as we all know, German divisions have 4 brigades. Effigies has made an enemy strength report, but conspicuously missing are 2 infantry brigades that would fill out a normal division of Fritz. Since we haven't seen any Germans at all, or new trenches, I thought to create a map of what we are capable of spotting.  It's a bit low-res, but my point should be clear. Having seen no Germans whatsoever, we can make some predictions about where they could be. It strikes me as very unlikely that the Germans have holed up fresh brigades in Stethoscope or Taillis Douche. It's certainly possible that they have something there, but there simply isn't enough room for more than 1 brigade. We know that yesterday, massed German troops (4 brigades total) entered Effyaders Woods, albeit in piecemeal. We also know that last night, we disrupted German communications and made it impossible for them to redeploy troops out of Effyaders, at least for a while. The three cases we have are thus: 1.The Germans are no longer attacking and are content to bombard us from across the Middle River. Their line brigades have retreated. 2. There are German troop concentrations in Effyaders, potentially very close to our own. 3. The Germans have retreated from Effyaders and are preparing to attack in the Centre or South. I see no reason to care if the Germans have retreated. Nor do I see any particular reason to care about a German attack in the center or South, we have a good position and the Germans would take all 8 turns to get forces into position before even starting to attack. However, we are weak in Effyaders Wood. The Germans sighted our Northern trenches last night, as they clearly bombarded those lines for hours. It's very possible that the Germans are aware of the Northern gap, a gap made worse by artillery attrition. This is the emphasis point I would like to make. The Germans may be aware of where our trench lines are in Effyaders Woods, and aware they don't cover the Northern edge. The bad thing about Effyaders Woods is that a German attack can be made instantaneously. We would not have any chance to react until the start of next round, which could allow the Germans to break (or sneak) through the North. This also means that any engineers we send to wire up the gap would be too little too late. I disagree about shuffling troops. I think it's too late to be useful, and our prexisting trenches are zeroed, and insufficently long anyways. All we'd be doing is hurting 24th brigade for no good reason. We should set up some specific conditionals orders in case of a boche attack towards Trois Freres, or a complete boche breakthrough in Effyaders. 24th brigade would be in a good position to flank (Counter-attack Germans exiting the Effyaders Wood, no counterattacking will fail if the Germans occupy our trenches and don't leave.), but would need to move out of their trenches to do so. Our artillery and engineers should set up concrete fallback positions, probably best in Saucisson Vallee. I don't know if we can count on Belgians or French Marines anymore, but if we can, we might be able to trick the Germans into triggering their appearances. Slim Jim Pickens fucked around with this message at 07:08 on Apr 4, 2017 |
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Apr 4, 2017 07:05
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Now that we've definitely lost sight of exposed boche brigades, we should probably cut back on indirect fire missions for the near future. By my rough estimate, curly has 10 rounds left, and lenoon has ~6.quote:
We're getting another division of reinforcements, the boche are probably getting one of their own. Ho hum. Our lines are rather spread out right now , they could do with some filling out, but I don't think quicker reinforcements are necessary.
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Apr 6, 2017 02:52
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lenoon posted:Hmmmm. Two things spring to mind: I think you're alright. You're still entrenched, and the Germans have lost a bunch of arty pieces so I don't think counter-battery is a big deal right now. lenoon posted:2. What the hell was that waste of a brigade 
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Apr 6, 2017 07:37
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lenoon posted:Slim are your guns all set up for counterbattery this turn? (Thanks got the reassurance) We'd have to work out where they are, but hopefully we can finish what we (hopefully) managed last update. I think it might be time to really worry about the howitzers. Unless I killed them all. I don't have any guns (yet)! I think that you at least got a few German guns. I don't think they know where you are right now, so unless they're keen to waste some ammunition bombarding trenches at random, you should be safe. By my reckoning, you have about 6 rounds of direct fire left, but you're in a useful spot. I think you ought to make some specific supporting fire rules, to limit waste. For example, random boche infantry in trenches are not really a priority target. my dad posted:Moving west does not magically make our guys stronger. Keep the entrenched brigade supported by artillery where it is now. True, Sullat's brigade survived the entire night under 7.7cm bombardment. His position is vulnerable though, it's not oriented to face a threat from Effyaders Wood. I propose this monstrousity of an order.  I still don't really understand what the movements rules are in these tight quarters, but there's plenty of space for that sullat's chits to shuffle around without actually changing position. Also, sullat's Brigade HQ gets pulled back somewhere safer than right on the front lines. AbortRetryFail posted:It was an unfortunate but necessary sacrifice on the altar of comedy. So goes the BEF, died for laughs
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Apr 6, 2017 09:47
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lenoon posted:I'm just a little concerned that now they almost certainly have worked out where I am that I'm going to have some very pissed off howitzers wanting revenge for their hopefully many slain buddies. And once I'm gone, we have no artillery that can quickly reposition to hit anywhere to the south. I mean, there's only a few places the boche guns could even possibly be if they were capable of counter batterying you. We could pre-emptively bombard them, if you're so worried (At the cost of precious, precious, indirect fire rounds).  The stethoscope gun park is out of range right now. Lenoon, 7.7cm guns are pretty ineffective against entrenched chits. We ought to have murdered most of the German howitzers too. I say you sit tight, and only respond if you need to.
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Apr 6, 2017 09:57
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lenoon posted:I think the gamble here is going to be who hits who first. As their spotter plane was essentially hovering over me, they know where I am. If they can get some guns on me at the start of the update then that could be trouble. If they do something else and SJP is right on where they are, then they are hosed. I am feeling pretty confident right now about getting them though. You're the one in trenches, while they are most likely having to dig their own. I think you're going to be okay. I'm more worried about a German infantry attack then a limited counter-battery.
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Apr 6, 2017 14:40
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Hunt11 posted:So was the turn overview for the last turn wrong? Trin Tragula posted:Engineers update; see attached map with up-to-date erections (but no Germans, you know where they are) I believe you are referring to this map? [quote="Trin Tragula" post="470961979"] And you now get an overview.  Turn 15 [/quote]
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Apr 6, 2017 21:34
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lenoon posted:ooooooooohhhhhhh I highly recommend you limit blind artillery strikes to two fire orders or less. Your guns can only support 25th brigade (In the Blob) through Indirect Fire right now, and it seems clear to me that Fritz is angling themselves for an attack on the center. Not only that, your guns are the only ones in range of the Southern Ford, which is now bereft of men. We have more than 24 turns left until resupply, and you have ~7 indirect fire missions left. We are receiving reinforcements at 2000, and we don't know how many the Germans have. Furthermore the enemy artillery has already been subjected to a real rear end-kicking in its howitzers, and they're the only ones really capable of damaging entrenched units like your own.
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Apr 7, 2017 17:45
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Hunt11 posted:Orders:  sullat posted:What's up? They are still bumbling around in the backfield. If they want to attack out of Effyaders with their super-sleepy brigade, let them. Our arty should see them off nicely. You may want to check the current arty's orders.
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Apr 7, 2017 18:51
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sullat posted:Don't we have two arty brigades, though? Curly's brigade is out of range for even indirect fire.
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Apr 7, 2017 19:17
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Goddamit, I can't believe we just wandered engineers up to a possible boche position without taking any steps to secure it. We traded alright in the center I guess. We're getting more artillery, and with the every encroaching pace of entrenchment, the small calibre arty pieces aren't all that effective. The Germans shot for 4 rounds and only got 2 chits. Loel posted:I wonder if they abandoned Effyaders. The only boche we spotted were in Effyaders Woods?
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Apr 8, 2017 02:08
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professor_curly posted:Yes. They sent a brigade south from Foret de Effyaders, across the road after they bombed the poo poo out of those front two trenches. Then the enemy brigade got bit by artillery and machine gun fire, stopped, and ran back into the woods after losing half their infantry companies. I think there's a fair chance the Germans are just going to retreat (or attack), but you have around 10 indirect fire missions left by my reckoning. Go wild. professor_curly posted:
I think that's just a Trin error? Bac may be dead, or all things.
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Apr 8, 2017 02:51
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Loel posted:Im currently thinking spreading out the division evenly, north center south, while we wait and see where the boche want to focus. We're not in dire need of troops anywhere. I think we can just put 1 infantry brigade and 1 artillery brigade in the Blob/South, and that'll be enough for the day.  Here's my proposal. The big rectangles are reasonable positions for our brigades on the defense. The big aura is the range of the Steth arty park. Note, we only need about 5 brigades to cover the entire frontline. We're going to have 6 brigades by tomorrow. In the north, we will need to clear out and entrench the NW corner of Effyaders. We will want to send at least one brigade there. What about the other brigade? Well, we have a total surfeit of men, even after our wasteful Southern attack. We should at least attempt to probe into Effyaders, because we don't want to be stuck defending against ghosts if the Boche attack somewhere else, days, or months, into the future. In Effyaders woods, at night, the Germans have lots of disadvantages. Their brigades are geared for shooting engagements, ours are big infantry blocks. The German artillery has been hit hard over the course of the day, and have spent a lot of ammunition already. Artillery can't fire into melee anyways, and in the night, ambush rules no longer apply. Those trenches we can see right now, are most likely unoccupied, at least of this moment. They aren't in a useful place for the Germans, and unless Effyaders is absolutely teeming with soldiers, they have no reason to be garrisoning those backlines. I propose that the next night, we launch a two-brigade attack into Effyaders with the goal of sweeping through the Germans in the NW, before changing formations into something like this:  With pickets and poo poo, one brigade will keep advancing into Effyaders and try to drop into those Eastern Trenches with orders to retreat if we find lots of infantry. If the Germans are there, well, we'll take a few chits of casualties and retreat. If they're weak, we can burst into their trenches and slaughter them, occupy their trenches, shoot their artillery, and collapse their position with the rest of our troops next turn. We shouldn't attack South. The river is a bitch, and the Germans most definitely have a brigade occupying those nice trenches we dug and abandoned. Their big central arty park is sitting ready, and crossing the river means we lose the ambush bonus. Without heavy artillery, there's no point attacking.
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Apr 8, 2017 22:01
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Nobody has anything to say about a Northern Attack? Our defense plans are calling for the new brigades to squeeze into absurdly small frontages.  That's like, 8/20 chits if we pack them as closely as possible. It's totally wasteful, because engaged brigades will take fatigue points regardless of how many chits enter combat. Furthermore, it increases artillery casualties, and so far that's been the main source of German kills.  Ignore the other markings, just look at the pale boxes. This is about how much space one of our brigades needs to occupy a section of the frontline. Even if we don't want to attack with the extra brigade, keep it in reserve or something instead of packing into the trenches like sardines. Also seriously, no discussion of the Effyaders Woods attack plan?
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Apr 9, 2017 19:49
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Loel posted:Lenoon, when you have time, tell me how arty could do a rolling bombard of Effyaders before infantry moves East Dear god, dear god, dear god nooooooooo We shall not have a rolling bombardment at night time, when orders will fail.
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Apr 18, 2017 21:01
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Loel posted:We cant give them the orders prior and say "at 4am, blow up this forest"? I suppose that might work, although we never had a chance to confirm it last game. I don't think rolling barrages make any sense in our ruleset. It's not like the Germans can react in real-time to shift troops around. Support Orders will accomplish the same thing, with less waste.
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Apr 18, 2017 22:14
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