UKMT March 2017 - Blame it on the Bourgie - The Something Awful Forums

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > UKMT March 2017 - Blame it on the Bourgie

Poll: Who Should Be Leader of HM Most Loyal Opposition? This poll is closed.
Jeremy Corbyn	95	18.63%
Dennis Skinner	53	10.39%
Angus Robertson	20	3.92%
Tim Farron	9	1.76%
Paul Ukips	7	1.37%
Robot Lenin	105	20.59%
Tony Blair	28	5.49%
Pissflaps	193	37.84%
Total:	510 votes

[Edit Poll (moderators only)]

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

jabby posted:

Ken Loach has written a good article about why blaming the current state of Labour entirely on Corbyn is a ridiculously simplistic view at best. He talks about how neither of the recent candidates were willing to campaign with Momentum or attend their events, and how the PLP as a whole isn't just rebelling against Corbyn but rebelling against his policies. They refuse to talk about them, refuse to campaign on them, and won't even endorse them in interviews. The party is fundamentally paralysed while we have elected representatives who refuse to represent the membership.

Stopped reading the Guardian quite a while ago, so I would have missed this. Thankee.

# ¿ Mar 1, 2017 03:40

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ¿ Apr 29, 2024 15:19

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

Paxman posted:

Why don't people want to vote Labour when choosing an MP? Must be the history of centrist, New Labour neo-liberal policies loving them over for decades.

# ¿ Mar 1, 2017 15:31

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j6EcF-JrZgo

# ¿ Mar 4, 2017 21:34

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

Kurtofan posted:

Corbyn must walk

He does, but for greater distances he owns a bike.

# ¿ Mar 7, 2017 10:52

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

Namtab posted:

While it's hyperkinetic animation style is good, it's absolutely not something for new entries to the medium for many reasons, 4 second butt slapping being among them. If you're going to rec a gainax/trigger work then I can think of at least three that are more suitable for people who don't watch many anims.

The main character is literally raped by a school uniform in the first episode. Kill la Kill is garbage trash that was written on the fly, is full of messaging problems and adds, removes or alters characters from half to half because the creators had no loving plan.

# ¿ Mar 8, 2017 01:05

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

Pissflaps posted:

Look Jeremy even the papers would be on your side

https://twitter.com/MediaGuido/status/839605141120692225

Just say something for god's sake.

He did.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4tvPjLizS-E

How very odd that the papers aren't running with it.

# ¿ Mar 9, 2017 00:49

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

Pissflaps posted:

It's not odd. It's waffly, unfocused bullshit that ignores the single newsworthy point that the Tories broke a manifesto pledge. Corbyn is poo poo.

Nice of you to parrot the media line, thus proving a point.

# ¿ Mar 9, 2017 00:54

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

Pissflaps posted:

You just complained that the media aren't reporting what he said yet now you're saying that I'm 'parroting their line' on it?

Stay consistent with your CDF horseshit please.

No, you're parroting the general media line they've used over the last year or so to downplay Corbyn, when they're just not outright blanking out any policy talk he does, and that oddly you also picked up over the last year or so. It makes you sound like one of those terrible political cartoons you see in the UK politoon thread.

# ¿ Mar 9, 2017 01:02

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

jabby posted:

I'll bite. What do you think the media should be saying about the budget that would benefit Labour more, and what should Corbyn say to make them do that?

Don't bother actually trying to make him engage in substantive policy or messaging talk. He's an empty centrist idiot. Just call a spade a spade and move on.

# ¿ Mar 9, 2017 01:08

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

Oh they think Trump is a shambles. His ratings are the lowest for any sitting President. They just think that the establishment, neo-liberal Democratic party are even more of a shambles. Which they are.

# ¿ Mar 15, 2017 05:10

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

spectralent posted:

Oh, so it's the "Well he's a fascist who might get the world nuked, but at least he's not part of the establishment!" thing?

Joy.

No it was more the "Well the Democrats haven't done poo poo for me and my life has gotten demonstrably worse under them. Hey, Trump says he'll bring us jobs and security while the Democrats are saying WE'LL GIVE YOU MORE OF WHAT YOU'VE BEEN GETTING very loudly. Guess I'll vote for him". Horrible thing is, if the Democrats had actually campaigned properly or even offered the people something other than "Well, we're not as bad as Trump!" then they probably would have won handily. That said, Democratic hubris as well as the American penchant for electoral fraud and voter purging (both parties do it) cost them their firewall in the rust belt and the election.

# ¿ Mar 15, 2017 05:53

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

jBrereton posted:

Scottish labour did so badly because their implicit and explicit values and ideas contrasted with what the much more dynamic SNP who turned into the mainstream centre-left party of Scotland, through hard graft and managing the media.

A good Labour leader needs to be media savvy, hard working, and they need to surround themselves with similar people. You can't take the shadow cabinet meeting off because you were on the Marr show at the weekend. You can't not have a snappy, media savvy response to this disastrous national insurance gently caress up and expect to succeed. It's a genuine crisis.

As someone who was disappointed in the PLP calling for a leadership election after the Brexit vote instead of seizing on the government's weakness, it has clearly taken so much energy out of Corbyn and his backers that he is no longer tenable as a leader, unfortunate though that is.

Corbyn could be whip-smart media savvy Jesus and would get exactly the same coverage as now because the people that run the media will never allow a proper left wing view see the light of day. If the answer to getting more press is "Don't be left-wing then" you can go jump.

# ¿ Mar 16, 2017 16:31

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

Pissflaps posted:

You're deluding yourself.

Not as much as you are about how politically dead your right wing version of centrism is.

Spangly A posted:

http://www.lse.ac.uk/media@lse/research/Mainstream-Media-Representations-of-Jeremy-Corbyn.aspx

facts aren't delusions

On this day in 1968, a platoon of American soldiers brutally kill between 200 and 500 unarmed civilians at My Lai, one of a cluster of small villages located near the northern coast of South Vietnam.

Kokoro Wish fucked around with this message at 16:49 on Mar 16, 2017

# ¿ Mar 16, 2017 16:45

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

Pissflaps posted:

A 'no you' and a 'you're a Tory' in one sentence. Lovely stuff.

It's "Blue Labour" now, you center-right dolt.

# ¿ Mar 16, 2017 16:56

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

Pissflaps posted:

How do you know New Labour alienated those people?

Probably something to do with their appalling electoral performance and then replacement of their New Labour leader with a left wing alternative over the New Labour candidates?

# ¿ Mar 19, 2017 16:00

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

Guavanaut posted:

Was there a reason for this? Is Zootopia an existing bestiality movie with copyright?

�In the UK we decided to change the US title to Zootropolis to merely allow the film to have a unique title that works for UK audiences,� - An actual quote by an actual Disney rep apparently.

# ¿ Mar 22, 2017 10:12

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

quote:

EU chiefs have warned airlines including easyJet, Ryanair and British Airways that they will need to relocate their headquarters and sell off shares to European nationals if they want to continue flying routes within continental Europe after Brexit.

Executives at major carriers have been reminded during recent private meetings with officials that to continue to operate on routes across the continent � for instance, from Milan to Paris � they must have a significant base on EU territory and that a majority of their capital shares must be EU-owned.

The development, coming days before the triggering of article 50, potentially makes it more likely that the carriers will act to restructure, with economic consequences for the UK, including a loss of jobs.

The tough line from the EU may encourage the UK to reciprocate with its own nationality rules, which would leave EU-owned airlines facing equally difficult choices, potentially dampening their investment in the UK in the short term, although some may seek in time to establish their own British subsidiaries.

The ability of companies such as easyJet to operate on routes across the EU has been a major part of their business models, and there may be a renewed willingness among airlines to invest outside the UK to maintain market share.

Some airlines have already started to seek alternative headquarters, and to examine how they might ensure that their shareholding is majority-EU owned, possibly through the forced disinvesting of British shareholders.

But others have appeared, until now, to hold out hope that the European commission would be flexible on the rules in the current aviation agreement.

EU officials in the meetings were clear, however, about the rigidity of the rules, amid concerns at a senior EU level that too many in the aviation industry are in denial about the consequences of the UK�s decision to leave the bloc.

Representatives from easyJet, along with the British Airways owner IAG, Ryanair and the Tui Group, whose portfolio of airlines includes Thomson, met the EU�s Brexit taskforce last week. That followed a meeting the previous week between the taskforce and executives from Air France-KLM, Finnair, Lufthansa and SAS, as part of the EU�s efforts to engage with stakeholders.

Thomas van der Wijngaart, an aviation expert at the legal firm Clyde & Co, told the Guardian there could be significant economic consequences for the UK with airlines changing their financial and operating structures, and building a stronger presence on the continent.

�It might be that carriers choose to have domestic flights [on the continent] operated by their new European operating licence, which would probably mean a reduction in staff in the UK,� he warned.

Britain is a member of an aviation agreement based on 35 shared pieces of EU legislation, a common regulator in the European Aviation Safety Agency, and a court acting as a referee on the shared rules, the European court of justice (ECJ).

However, asked during a select committee hearing last week whether the UK would continue to be part of the �open-skies� agreement after Brexit, the secretary of state for exiting the EU, David Davis, said: �Not that agreement ... One would presume that would not apply to us � doesn�t say anything about whether there would be a successor.�

The industry holds out hope that the UK and the EU will be able to seal an early deal during article 50 negotiations that ensures that damage to the industry is limited.

However a hurdle on progress on a new agreement is Theresa May�s intention to remove the UK from the ECJ�s jurisdiction, which currently has the key role in adjudicating over conflicts between parties to the agreement.

A number of member states may also have interests in standing in the way of Britain�s attempts to strike a new deal. Spanish diplomats, for example, say they will not sign any international aviation agreement that recognises the airport on Gibraltar.

The UK could react to the imposition of EU ownership rules on airlines by developing ownership rules of its own, which could prevent carriers such as the Ireland-based Ryanair from flying UK domestic routes, as it does today.

EasyJet is establishing an EU operating company � on which an announcement is expected within weeks � so that it can obtain an EU air operating certificate. The company insists, however, it will continue to be headquartered in the UK.

# ¿ Mar 22, 2017 12:13

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

jBrereton posted:

Well since the whole thing is being done under a massive cloud of secrecy I suppose we'll just have to see what TTIP brings to the continent.

Didn't both TTIP and CETA look to be dead as gently caress back in late 2016?

# ¿ Mar 22, 2017 12:56

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

His Divine Shadow posted:

The last page is a p.good example of what Mark Blyth talks about here:

http://www.readcube.com/articles/10...iogDvuklQ%3D%3D

In this article he also trashed the stats people have brought out to support culture over economics argument.

So, so this.

# ¿ Mar 22, 2017 14:09

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

Here's a great speech by Chris Hedges. It's got a US bent, but is actually about general trends of facism, neo-liberalism, how the two are linked; the failure of the liberal centrists and how they've actually just pushed the corporate agenda, corporatism, nationalism and a whole bunch of other isms.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Na_jAtxpmiI

# ¿ Mar 22, 2017 15:52

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GE17PfSGoiA

# ¿ Mar 23, 2017 13:52

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

Pissflaps posted:

Is the problem with this that he's said US rather than American?

Stay classy Piss Flaps.

# ¿ Mar 23, 2017 14:20

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

Pissflaps posted:

Me neither. Unless people are reading US as 'us' with emphasis. Unless that is what he's actually doing?

This reply doesn't make any sense.

Guavanaut posted:

It's ~~a bit~~ tacky and comes off like "the great thing about London is that you can injure people from so many different cultures just by driving down one pavement."

I wouldn't have used magnificent in anything relating to that event.

Stay classy Piss Flaps.

Kokoro Wish fucked around with this message at 14:36 on Mar 23, 2017

# ¿ Mar 23, 2017 14:34

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

Im guessing it's a way they see to wrestle back control from "new media" and in the long run, push the government into harsh controls on internet access.

# ¿ Mar 24, 2017 01:23

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MoCrBuOBwGQ

# ¿ Mar 29, 2017 04:22

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

Using "Cool White" corn bulb LED lights here ourselves. Cheap, give off a bright white light with much less artificial flavour than a flourescent, and only rings in at 6W.

# ¿ Mar 29, 2017 10:46

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZNMZwYZZJOE

# ¿ Mar 29, 2017 13:31

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

Oddly enough, when Corbyn was running his leadership election the second time, with a team of on-board momentum organisers, the press response was snappy and complimented on by the press at the time. It's almost like the ideological splits that permeate the party are a detriment to messaging. Guess we really need to eject some of the previous guard's members.

# ¿ Mar 31, 2017 09:38

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

Pissflaps posted:

I think you're making this up.

Well, since you're down with BuzzFeed now it seems, here:

quote:

�Since the campaign started, there has been a step up in the professionalism of the comms side of things compared to the day-to-day running [of the] leader�s office,� said one online political reporter who deals regularly with the team.

Another political correspondent agreed, saying �they�ve run a very sharp operation this time�. This was noticed, for example, when deputy leader Tom Watson attacked the leadership in a Guardian interview and a response to the claims landed in journalists� inboxes less than two hours later.

One person on Corbyn�s team says it�s because they are finally at liberty to work away from �uncooperative� teams at Labour HQ, freeing them from the existing Labour structure, which is distrusted by Corbyn�s office.

Kokoro Wish fucked around with this message at 10:41 on Mar 31, 2017

# ¿ Mar 31, 2017 10:38

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

Panzeh posted:

So, is pissflaps some kind of Tony Blair superfan?

He's a third way, triangulating centrist superfan. Somehow despite having witnessed its failure globally for some 15 years now terminating spectacularly in the Democratic failure in the US, New Labour's failure in the 2015 election and the precipitous decline in support for it in the EU, causing the rise of left and right wing parties and declining from its one-time high point that just so happened to be the only point in time such an ideology could have flourished.

vv: Dude, they're "Blue Labour" now. Keep up. :rolleyes:

Kokoro Wish fucked around with this message at 11:27 on Mar 31, 2017

# ¿ Mar 31, 2017 11:23

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

Nah, I'd support anyone that sincerely held Corbyn-like beliefs and platform. I'm more of Socialist Defence Forcer.

# ¿ Mar 31, 2017 11:31

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

Oberleutnant posted:

so this is a thing

404 on the article there.

On March 31, 1889, the Eiffel Tower is dedicated in Paris in a ceremony presided over by Gustave Eiffel, the tower�s designer, and attended by French Prime Minister Pierre Tirard, a handful of other dignitaries, and 200 construction workers.

In 1889, to honor of the centenary of the French Revolution, the French government planned an international exposition and announced a design competition for a monument to be built on the Champ-de-Mars in central Paris.

Vive la r�volution, roll out the guillotines, etc.

Kokoro Wish fucked around with this message at 11:36 on Mar 31, 2017

# ¿ Mar 31, 2017 11:33

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

Oberleutnant posted:

Should work now
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/mar/28/homeless-charity-workhouse-workers-rights-exploitation

Thank you for deeply horrifying me. I don't think that people can really deny that some people are trying to return us to the Victorian era anymore with this.

# ¿ Mar 31, 2017 11:40

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

Also, thanks, Big Tone:

That Horrifying Article posted:

In 1999 the New Labour government exempted charities and other institutions from paying workers the national minimum wage if prior to entering a work scheme they were homeless or residing in a homeless hostel. There is perhaps no better demonstration that this country is yet to shake off punitive Victorian attitudes towards the �undeserving� poor...

It is ironic that a Labour government created a backdoor for the revival of workhouses when it was Attlee�s government that abolished the workhouse system. The idea that the poor should be forced to work for board and basic subsistence was once universally condemned, but it has been revived without a murmur of public disapproval.

Such a great leader. New Labour, such a political god-send.

# ¿ Mar 31, 2017 11:45

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

So you don't think homeless people should have also been paid equitably for their work by charities specifically designed to try and get them back on their feet, or that this was basically workhouses under another name?

Breath Ray posted:

What would be left over anyway if they were paid 200 quid a week and had to rent accommodation and buy food?

The knowledge that they are not worth less than the lowest valued and legally paid people in our society, including 14 year olds doing paper rounds. It's that weird "dignity" thing, you know.

Oberleutnant posted:

Haha what a oval office you are

Kokoro Wish fucked around with this message at 12:52 on Mar 31, 2017

# ¿ Mar 31, 2017 12:36

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

Nah, man. It's totes fine that the party of Labour denies the least fortunate people in our society equal pay for equal work. What do you think that is, some kind of tenent or something.

# ¿ Mar 31, 2017 12:54

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

It's an old-rear end spelling of tenet with the same meaning. Not modern. About as old and defunct as the Victorian workh... oh wait a minute.

# ¿ Mar 31, 2017 13:10

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

Yeah, you can literally give homeless people a one room concrete home with basic furnishings for them to own and not have to pay back and it will effectively allow them to become productive members of society again and contribute once more. It's cheaper than all the policing and enforcement you'd have to engage in otherwise.

That means that you'd have to not treat them as an otherised, skiving blight on decent people. You'd have to believe that they were unfortunate people that have fallen on hard times and are in desperate need of help.

Kokoro Wish fucked around with this message at 13:42 on Mar 31, 2017

# ¿ Mar 31, 2017 13:33

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

jBrereton posted:

Absolutely, but many are, as the writer of the article said. Many people are homeless because of untreated/self-medicated mental health problems. I'm not being a oval office by saying that, it is genuinely true, and dealing with homelessness in a long term way requires dealing with every aspect of that, from dealing with the causes of the original trauma to better mental health access and a better housing situation for everyone.

And again, if they had a simple, secure place of their own given to them, not only does the sense of ownership and security lend to their mental health, but it gives them a firm foundation for them to seek further help and is cheaper on society in the long run.

# ¿ Mar 31, 2017 13:45

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ¿ Apr 29, 2024 15:19

Kokoro Wish: Jul 23, 2007; Post? What post? Oh wow.
I had nothing to do with THAT.

OwlFancier posted:

I appreciated your CCCP joke.

# ¿ Apr 1, 2017 00:49

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > UKMT March 2017 - Blame it on the Bourgie