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Will Perez force the dems left? This poll is closed. |
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| Yes |
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33 | 6.38% |
| No |
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343 | 66.34% |
| Keith Ellison |
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54 | 10.44% |
| Pete Buttigieg |
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71 | 13.73% |
| Jehmu Green |
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16 | 3.09% |
| Total: | 416 votes | ||
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I'm getting the feeling from some Democrats that they think the Russian stuff is what they need to focus on and it will sink Trump. It's frustrating since absolutely no one is going to vote based on that. Independents don't really care and Republicans already consider Russia our greatest ally. It's more of the same "well the rules say that if you collude with a foreign government it will cost you exactly 6% elect-ability points and thus we deserve the next election" when the wonky political rules don't matter anymore if they ever did.
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Mar 6, 2017 14:10
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She better just mean that she is going to go back to working on her charity or something. There's literally no reason for her to return to politics. I'm not saying that out of spite, but I just don't see what she can do to help when she's hated now by Republicans, leftists, and a good deal of independents who see her as corrupt due to successful Republican character assassination.
Eggplant Squire fucked around with this message at 12:49 on Mar 19, 2017 |
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Mar 19, 2017 12:12
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Yeah poo poo like that is exactly why the Democrats should have no more use for Hillary. Regardless of how "fair" it is, if she gets back into any sort of power within the party the media is going to laser focus on her and all of her scandals, legitimate or not and take away any momentum from people actually trying to get Democrats in elected positions. Trump will do something stupid and five minutes later the New York Times will be dredging up some ancient bullshit because the Republicans decided to start talking poo poo about her again. It doesn't help that she can't help but self own herself as well. I think it was Vitalsigns that said it right; the cheating almost certainly didn't matter which is what made it so stupid. She didn't gain anything from Brazile helping her, but she is so obsessed with this idea where she has to have the perfect answer (and was clearly rattled because she didn't think that she was actually going to have to participate in a real primary) that she opened herself up to validating the perception that she was crooked.
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Mar 19, 2017 14:26
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Half of it wasn't even Trump saying anything, it was AP and NY Times daily stories about "what if THIS is the thing that catches Clinton" so that even though it was all bogus swing voters got the impression that she was just as corrupt as he was. The media got Trump elected by smoothing off his edges whenever he went too far and giving the constant impression that there must be something Hillary is doing if there's all this smoke we are making. The only thing that REALLY got them offended was when he got them together to talk about Obama's birth certificate and used their dumb asses to give a commercial for his hotel and then left. I agree that wouldn't have worked nearly as well on Sanders but it's moot now unless the Dems are truly stupid and go back to the Clinton well. Eggplant Squire fucked around with this message at 23:59 on Mar 19, 2017 |
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Mar 19, 2017 23:57
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Dead Cosmonaut posted:The Democrats can't win with just their own base. Let people outside the party have a say on who gets elected. How many states require proof of party? In my state they didn't require it when I voted in the primary and Bernie lost there anyway. I don't think he really ever had a chance of winning, the institutional inertia of Clinton running for the position for a decade was just too much to overcome. The fact that he actually bloodied her nose a bit when everyone in the party assumed it was all just a formality is where the Clinton campaign and the DNC should have started believing the people saying there were some problems and they weren't just going to walk into the Whitehouse followed by a Senate majority. They need to actually address the issue of their party's unpopularity if they want to actually get back into power at any level.
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Mar 20, 2017 12:12
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I think that the Senate was potentially winnable but yeah wasting time thinking the South was at all going to refute Trump and at the expense of the rust belt was absolutely stupid.
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Mar 21, 2017 15:12
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mcmagic posted:The senate not turning blue was an even bigger upset than Trump winning. They lost senate races that were just completely stunning to anyone who had been paying attention. Has there been any analysis into why that was the case? I agree it's probably the bigger upset (and if the Democrats had taken it Trump's Presidency would be an even bigger joke) but there's a lot more people talking about the Presidency since that election was much more visible.
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Mar 21, 2017 15:24
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Crowsbeak posted:Hmmmm... Maybe it had something to do with you're sainted Hillary not actually covering policy in her ads. I remember in the primary she had a bunch of surprising economically leftist ads in my area but once the general rolled around they transitioned into how much of a jerk Trump was.
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Mar 21, 2017 19:59
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I can't watch at work but did she really say Clinton was a standard bearer for the party? Obama, even though he's basically disappeared, I can understand since he was a president and still popular.
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Mar 22, 2017 17:46
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Yeah I can GET Obama because he's a massively popular President and rode in a wave in 2008 so that at least makes sense. Clinton was a Senator a decade ago and failed twice to run for president. If that's the best they have, yeah it's not looking too rosy. It's also worrying that "who is a standard bearer of the party?" apparently isn't a concern that enough that she had a prepared answer, especially when the DNC plan seems to be hope that they can get elected with a candidate on image alone. Eggplant Squire fucked around with this message at 17:53 on Mar 22, 2017 |
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Mar 22, 2017 17:50
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Clinton SHOULD have won. The national polls ended up being pretty accurate. The issue is the public for the most part had no idea as to how truly inept her campaign was being run, especially when Trump's was a dumpster fire as well. That combined with people saying how amazing her strategists were led to no introspective until the 11th hour when everyone started to realize what was going on. The people that "knew" she was going to win were clearly not paying attention since even in the rosiest scenarios Trump was a legitimate threat; however I don't think it was wrong to think that it was going to be a close election in the Democrat's favor. Now the people that thought they were going to have a Reagan-esque wave and take back the South... those guys need some serious perspective and reflection. The canary in the mine was how well Bernie ended up doing instead of assuming that since she was able to beat a guy that threw together his primary run in the last minute in order to make a statement she was definitely going to win the general. Eggplant Squire fucked around with this message at 19:41 on Mar 27, 2017 |
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Mar 27, 2017 18:12
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"America is already great!" has to go down as an amazing example of political incompetence. Not only was it a lame way to cry "hey I'm here too!" and piggyback on Trump's slogan but it totally showed she misunderstood the mood of the country. It also was lame transparent jingoism that anyone could see though.
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Mar 29, 2017 19:40
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At a certain point pointing out how bad he was resulted in incredibly deminishing returns. Everyone knew he was trash by September, it was just if you care, didn't care, or were down with his misogyny and racism. Continuing to point it out via TV ads wasn't as useful as actually pushing her platform.
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Apr 1, 2017 23:31
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VitalSigns posted:I can just see the 2020 debates now.  At least a lot of other Dems aren't as rah rah on this. Eggplant Squire fucked around with this message at 12:17 on Apr 7, 2017 |
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Apr 7, 2017 12:15
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Secretary Clinton: Last week on the campaign trail you discussed our ongoing ground war in Syria, quote "The mistakes in Syria are not the responsibility of our men and women in uniform but of their Commander-in-Chief. From the decision to rush to war without waiting for diplomacy to run its course, to the failure to send enough troops and provide proper equipment for them. To the denial of the existence of a rising insurgency and the failure to adjust the military strategy. To the continued support for a government unwilling to make the necessary political compromises. The command decisions were rooted in politics and ideology, heedless of sound strategy and common sense."
Yes that's right
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Call Me Charlie posted:At least the behavior is accurately attributed to a Republican. I don't get the use of voting in Democrats that act like Republicans in every sense except social issues (when it's politically convenient to support them) Look at the Hillary's DAPL comments of needing mutual respect and safety after police attacked the non-violent protesters with dogs and didn't feel the need to update it after they started shooting water cannons and maiming people. It's like she somehow saw that Pepsi ad from the future and thought it was a great message to send to people being abused by authority they couldn't fight back against. That's after her (admittedly unintentional) gaffe where she offended Native Americans by saying "off the reservation" allowing Trump to talk about how she was insensitive to the "Indians." We need to be standing up for people like that not trying to find the most political way of not pissing off either side, which just ends up making everyone mad anyway.
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Apr 7, 2017 16:18
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Trump will stand in front of a hanger full of flag covered caskets and blame the Democrats for their deaths by agreeing with him to commit troops to Syria and how only he truly respects their sacrifice. Then the New York Times will call him the most presidential man in the country. I'm hoping they don't fall for the obvious trick of supporting a GOP led invasion only to get hosed when it goes tits up but D.C politicos of all stripes love dead soldiers and missile strikes. Eggplant Squire fucked around with this message at 13:30 on Apr 10, 2017 |
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Apr 10, 2017 13:25
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Ytlaya posted:I don't think we're going to actually invade Syria (or anywhere else for that matter). I mean, there have been plenty of times in the past when the US has stuck to "only" bombing countries. Yeah I really hope not but the Trump administration doesn't seem to be bound by a lot of conventional politics.
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Apr 10, 2017 18:05
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The idea of decency in politics has always been a fantastic lie. In the 1800s a man was beaten with a cane in his office by another Senator while that guy's thug friends stopped anyone from intervening and that Senator became a hero in the South. The fact that modern Democrats live in a fantasy land is pretty much to the detriment of everyone in this country as they don't stand as a reasonable counter to the Republicans which understand that power is meant to be used, not bargained away in order to look fair. They seem to FINALLY be getting it since 2016 couldn't be written off or ignored like 2014.
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Apr 10, 2017 18:15
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Ardennes posted:I think the biggest reason the Democrats won't change is if anything ideological, most establishment/centrist dems don't want to move leftward because they honestly believe it would be destructive to the country. I lived in DC for a while, and many if not most of those beltway types are true believers. Yeah as someone that's lived in the DC area for decades this is totally true. These kinds of people really can't comprehend the country not just collapsing if leftists somehow took over. People talk about "ideological purity" from leftists but it's just as strong if not stronger from the ones that are committed to the status quo and they won't cede any ground without a big fight. I'm not sure how to really fight against that since those people have all the power and are more than willing to lose elections rather than re-evaluate their beliefs. Seriously though any person saying that the DNC getting involved would have made things worse should be advocating for the entire party to be gutted from the top down. If they are so toxic that they are loving over elections just by having candidates associated with them they are worse than useless as a political party. Of course that's not actually the truth and the reality is that this election is a slice of the standard Democratic strategy of ignoring risky elections to dump money into safe ones (which are coincidentally those of high ranking party members). The problem with this very close loss is that the Republicans will learn the right lesson that they are not popular and need to try to win elections with monetary and political support to get out their voters while the Democrats will learn the wrong one that they have to do nothing and Trump will deliver them congress and the Presidency. Condiv posted:https://twitter.com/TomPerez/status/851960464582037504 Good. Even if a close loss is indicative of a bright future because of Republicans making GBS threads the bed he needs to wake the gently caress up and actually do something instead of falling back on the Democratic instinct to do nothing and hope people vote for them out of fear. I can deal with this loss if it means that maybe they will learn but 2016 should have shaken them to high heaven and it clearly didn't so I doubt that they will do much. Eggplant Squire fucked around with this message at 12:37 on Apr 12, 2017 |
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Apr 12, 2017 12:28
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