Battle Brothers: We're on a Mission for Gold

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Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

Good game about mans that kill other mans. A+ if you even remotely like squad based tactic games

# ¿ Mar 22, 2017 22:04

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# ¿ Apr 28, 2024 06:49

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

RabidWeasel posted:

Semi related pro tip, when you're skilling up mercs to use 2handers make sure that you get all the defensive perks first, rather than going straight for berserk and frenzy. You need to be able to tank like a champ in order to make proper use of the extra attacks anyway. It's kind of boring but I'd probably recommend for the most part not using 2handed weapons until your merc is at least level 8 so you can get reach advantage, underdog and battle forged (I'd strongly recommend waiting until level 9 so you can have footwork as well).

Alternatively, get rotation as soon as you can. Have your 2h hang in the back and then rotate in when the front line did their attacks and chop a wounded dude down. Then chop again next round and rotate back. It's gonna burn a lot of fatigue but I'm in love with this for my early/mid game 2 hand dude

radintorov posted:

The official launch trailer is out:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C5_eSS-NTeU

They probably didn't have a lot of budget/time to make something flashy but this trailer is sorta meh

# ¿ Mar 24, 2017 13:58

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

Lul the other trailer actually flew past me and yeah it's better

# ¿ Mar 24, 2017 14:09

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

FULL RELEASE IS OUT :siren:

quote:

It�s here and it�s done! We�re excited to see the finished Battle Brothers graduate from Early Access and be fully released today, on March 24th, 2017.

Creating this game together with you has been a long and rewarding adventure, and we�re very happy with what the game has grown to become. We hope you enjoy playing Battle Brothers as much as we enjoyed developing it � and given a successful launch, this won�t be the end of the road.

With the game�s release, the soundtrack is now also available as a separate DLC. If you�re the owner of the Deluxe or Supporter edition, it�ll be automatically delivered to you via Steam. The Art & Lore book will become available in the coming weeks.

Let�s celebrate this momentous occasion with our new story trailer for launch and final feature list of the Battle Brothers 1.0 release.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C5_eSS-NTeU

Features
Manage a medieval mercenary company in a procedurally generated open world.
Fight complex turn-based tactical battles with historical equipment and brutal injuries.
Permadeath. All characters that die in combat will stay dead � unless they return as the undead.
All characters come with their own background stories and traits. Want a stuttering ratcatcher, a greedy witch hunter or a drunkard disowned noble?
Character development without a restrictive class-system. Each character gains experience through combat, can level up and acquire powerful perks.
Equipment that matters. Different weapons grant unique skills � split shields with axes, stun enemies with maces, form a spearwall with spears or crush armor with a warhammer.
Diverse enemy roster. All enemies have unique equipment, skills and AI behavior.
A dynamic event system with atmospheric encounters and tough decisions outside of combat.
Three late game crises � a war between noble houses, a greenskin invasion and an undead scourge � add a looming threat along with new contracts, enemies and events.
Two full hours of orchestral soundtrack.
70 Steam Achievements and Steam Trading Cards

# ¿ Mar 24, 2017 18:43

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

RabidWeasel posted:

Does anyone know if there's a relationship between the size of a settlement and how much will be offered for sale at a weaponsmith or armourer in that settlement? My most recent game had an armourer in a mining settlement which was great as it let me grind up to allied reputation and start buying good armour early, but it also seemed like they never sold anything better than scale armour and generally had a smaller selection than the more expensive armourer at a nearby fortress.

Yes. Larger towns will always have a bigger and better range of stuff to find. The way I saw it is that small villages with weapon/armor shops will only spawn high-end gear if they have the "well supplied" status after you led a caravan there

Also, tips for peeps that have problems with contract difficulty. Instead of going only by skulls, try to learn to use the reward money as a hint towards how difficult it will be and if you're able to handle that. 1 skull contracts are pretty safe to take early on when they're around 300-600 gold. This usually means bandit thugs or basic zombos which are easy to deal with even for your scrubs. You can even safely pick up 2 skull contracts in the 500-800 gold range. Those will usually have the same enemies as 1 skull contracts except that there'll be more. 10 thugs and a raider for instance instead of the 7 thugs you faced on a 1 skull contract. If you see 1000 or more gold rewards for 2 skull contracts then you have to get picky and be careful. Bandit raiders will appear in larger numbers for that kind of money and you can't safely beat them with mercs that carry spears and shields. Their armor is too good to beat them quickly and their weapons will cut your own scrubs to pieces. Undead will usually include armored zombos and necromancers at this point and again you don't want to deal with that with spear+shield scrubs. They'll just overwhelm you halfway through the fight. 3 skull contracts are obviously the dangerous ones that you want to pass until you're ready but sometimes you can get a 3 skull caravan escort for hella money. It's kind of a gamble to take these but it usually pays off because the money is based on travel distance and not on difficulty. There's the chance that you'll run into several hostile groups on the way and some of them may be too hard but on the other hand you can also go all the way without doing a single fight. Getting 3k for 2 days of walking is really sweet. And then there's also 3 skull contracts for bandit lairs and those can also be taken if the reward is below 1000 gold or at least not much more cause it means mostly thugs with a few raiders sprinkled in. Goblin and orc contracts should be avoided at all costs(even the cheap ones) until your band is a serious group with chainmail and tier 2 weapons cause it's usually not worth the trouble to go for them otherwise. One specific contract type I also want to mention is the "go to lair and get our artifact back" contract. Those will always pit you against skellies and they can ruin your little band early on. A contract like that for like 400 gold will pit you against 4 auxiliaries and they can cut through your spear+shield scrubs despite what the low amount of gold may make you think. Only go for those contracts if you have some blunt weapons or when your band is starting to get serious.

My personal way is to hunt for combat contracts with bandit thugs as much as possible early on. They give you much needed xp and gear on top of the money. Delivery contracts are poo poo and I would only take them if I desperately need the money to pay my group. I'll also try to snipe random bandit groups without raiders if I see them or travel the map a bit to find bandit lairs. Those can be good pickings if they don't have raiders. Basic undead are also fine to fight but they drop less good gear so I put less value on those contracts/lairs/groups. When I have a group of 8 solid guys in the range of lv 4-5 is when I start to hunt for bandit raiders and their gear. By that point I have mostly ditched spears(60+ melee skill is my mark for the switch) and rock any weapon that does more damage to speed up my kills. The tier 2 spear isn't bad but it still takes too long to kill people imo. Spearwall is a popular early game strat but the fatigue costs will catch up to you once the basic enemies phase out so I only bring out spears against orcs/zombos later on. And even then I don't always do it cause the damage isn't impressive enough. Once I have that part of the game rolling is when I look towards getting 12 good guys that then can take on 3 skull contracts if the money is good enough. Of course there's some rng to all of this due to the random map and stuff but this strat has worked for me since the early days of EA

# ¿ Mar 25, 2017 16:43

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

Gammymajams posted:

This is a really great post, thanks. It sounds like you really cherry pick contracts when playing. Doesn't that burn a lot of time moving between cities to find the right one? And so you'll be falling behind the difficulty curve if you don't find something that fits your criteria? For me it's been kind of ambiguous whether it's worth my while intercepting random groups of enemies on the world map, since there's always a risk of injury and there's less financial incentive without a contract. It seems like you recommend hunting easy stuff/ bandit thugs etc that are roaming the map? I think I'm gonna be more selective from here on when picking contracts and fights. Once I understand exactly what each mission is going to look like from the description that should make things easier.

Yeah my style is slower and very cautious early on but keep in mind that the curve does not just auto-ramp with time. It's also dependant on the strength of your band so it never really outspikes you in that sense. At least I haven't seen it. And I catch up with the curve fairly quickly once I got my band out of their baby status when my core is lvl 4 or 5. Random groups on the map offer less rewards than contracts do, but they offer extra xp wich is super important to me. Important enough that I'll hunt down weak monsters with bad loot if most of my band is still below lv4. The difference that your perks and stats make is very noticeable after you played the game for some time. For instance there is a world of difference between having the shield master perk asap on your line and not having it or delaying it. The extra numbers on your mans really make the difference for what things you can deal with. Raiders suddenly become less problematic if they just whiff their attacks and give you more time to poke them to death with your ragged assortment of weapons. And another early crutch is improving your armor to padded leather or better asap. Tanking a few extra hits is the edge you need to force through early combat contracts with a shabby roster. Also spear+shield on any melee merc early on is the way to go until you have melee of 60 or better. There's honestly a lot of different things that you can do early to give you a boost but a lot of it will come to you with just getting playtime under your belt.

I guess most of the early game strats can be put into 2 styles that have generally been accepted as good. You either play like me where you'll go slow and try to forge a small core of solid guys that then go for higher pay contracts to catch up, or you'll go wide with lots of cheap bodies to force through high pay contracts asap. Trading the lives of two or three random scrubs you hired for 300 gold total to loot a chain shirt or a tier 2 weapon in your first few days actually isn't bad. I don't play like that so I can't really go into details but I do suspect that this strat is more viable for higher difficulties than going slow

marshmallow creep posted:

There is a certain momentum you have to get and if bad luck takes you out at the knees over and over it can be a dead run. But as the tooltips remind you, "Losing is fun."

Truth

Also direwolves are pushovers when you have leather armor or better. It's all about catching them with your shield line and then focus killing them asap. If you get unlucky and run into them real early then yeah it's gonna be rough but if you fight super defensively then you should at least win

Tin Tim fucked around with this message at 19:08 on Mar 25, 2017

# ¿ Mar 25, 2017 19:01

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

Hieronymous Alloy posted:

Ok, bear with me here --

Dude I love that your're doing this please keep on nerding at full force :respek:

Here are some quick thoughts

-I like recover but I don't like it enough to pick early over pathfinder. I don't find myself with fatigue issues at that stage whereas the movement bonus will always be great when it applies

-Brawny is also great but I rather take the shield perk earlier for average line bodies

-Polearm mastery on sergeants is sorta wasted since the fatigue reduction will not really be noticeable with one attack per turn. Maybe worth it if you slot berserk too?

I actually never used student myself since it was a crap perk in older builds. Does the xp bonus really outweigh the fact that you're down a perk for most of the game? It just seems like your guys will always slightly underperform until you hit 11

Tin Tim fucked around with this message at 00:29 on Mar 26, 2017

# ¿ Mar 25, 2017 23:04

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

CommissarMega posted:

Is there a console command that reveals the whole map? Muggins here was a moron who picked the 'see every town' Ambition

All the towns are revealed from the start though? Just mouse over each and visit the ones that say "you have never been to this place"

# ¿ Mar 27, 2017 15:29

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

First random unique find of my current run

I don't have the stats of the tier 3 spear handy but this doesn't seem amazing except for the penetration. Sure beats using a boar spear on a fresh recruit though

# ¿ Mar 27, 2017 22:29

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

Hot drat I finally had the wolf bandit event :allears:

I didn't scum for it but the mail armor is deffo worth it and I scummed the encounter to get 2 mail spawns on six bandits. No regrets

# ¿ Mar 28, 2017 22:59

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

You put dudes with with shields in front of them

# ¿ Mar 29, 2017 18:23

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

Nordick posted:

Not sure of other buffs, but it at least gives them a shitload of AP. A Fallen Hero with a two-hander that can make two attacks a turn is quite a thing, lemme tell ya.

Yeah about that

See those four wounded dudes? The result of a buffed fallen hero with a greataxe after going ham for two turns in a row. I was really lucky to safe the 2 dudes that each took 200+ damage :stonk:

# ¿ Mar 29, 2017 22:51

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

This is the wolf mail in my current game and I'm sad if it changes since it's pretty hard to get

Also, 2nd unique find and this one is pretty good

# ¿ Mar 30, 2017 17:30

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

The Bramble posted:

Economics hasn't been discussed too much, but with a little effort you very nicely supplement your income from contracts. In its most basic form, buy trade goods or expensive food (Mead and wine) from small villages, and sell them at large cities. Do this right from the beginning - when you have to travel to the nearby 'big city' before killing Hoggart, buy up the commodities at the starting village, and turn them around for a profit at the bigger town. Easy gold. Later in the game, plan out your routes and financial needs (food, tools, salary) for a few days and hit a bunch of small towns for contracts while you buy their trade goods. End up in a large city (I think regular cities give better prices than massive citadels, need to do more research), and turn a nice profit. It'll never replace contracts, but you can almost feed and pay your guys for 'free' this way, leaving your contract money for recruits and equipment.

You can do even better if you manipulate the current 'status' of the town. Obviously you shouldn't go on a buying spree in a terrified town or one with ambushed trade routes - but you SHOULD go on a selling spree! Selling a stack of Amber or salt in a town not getting any caravans in is a significant price boost over a 'normal' town. And speaking of caravans, those fuckers will buy up commodities out from under you if they get to town first. So don't dawdle and go clear out a bandit camp or other contract before making your purchase, as your competition might beat you to it.

I've seen people bring up trading a few times but for me it's mostly about the issue that I never find enough cheap goods to buy to make me want to bother. Like, getting them close to their base worth usually requires status manipulation or real good relations with the town you're buying from. Sure I can get these three stacks of wood/bricks/copper and expect to make like a 100 bucks profit in the end but it's too much busy work for me. Now if I can get these three stacks for a price where I can expect to make like 50+ on each of them then yeah I'm on it. But the latter case happens far more less to me than the former. There's some big bucks to be made if you can snag high value stuff like dyes and other stuff that nets 150+ profit for each stack but outside of that I simply tend to forget about trading since it's such a meager income without status manipulation. I do agree though that the few extra coins can help out a lot in your first few days

# ¿ Mar 30, 2017 21:28

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

deep dish peat moss posted:

A long time ago in Beta, equipping a war dog would lower your max fatigue. I just realized that's not the case anymore and now that I've been experimenting with them, I need to point out how good they are for anyone else who wasn't using them.

Whoa I had no idea that they changed it. Yeah doggos now shoot up from "sit in inventory until I fight goblins" to "bring along everytime because why not"

# ¿ Apr 1, 2017 21:18

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

theDOWmustflow posted:

Um how do you deal with the ghost units in undead mobs? I have like a 9% chance to hit whereas they only need to do that AoE scream 2-3 times to route my lines.

Also how the hell do you deal with the undead? They keep coming back to life faster then I can kill everything.

Get better resolve on your dudes to protect against geists(I get 50 asap on everyone myself) or crowd around your banner if you have one. The rally perk also can help here.They are hard to hit in melee(and almost impossible with ranged) so use spears or swords if you can. The good thing is that they die to 1 hit from anything(maybe excluding fists?) so just try to hunt them down as best you can.

I guess the start would be to ask what weapons/armor you use and at what stage of the game you are but here are some tipps anyway. General undead strats depend on the enemy type. If you have trouble with zombies getting back up then bring more swords/cleavers to get better chances at cutting heads off. Armored zombies are a bit tougher this way but they still aren't too bad. Skellies are best attacked with blunt weapons or flails to bypass their shields and having hammers to crush their armor later on is also great. And you generally want to conserve stamina if you fight undead. Let them come to you instead of rushing towards their line. Don't shield block/spear wall if it doesn't offer an immediate use. Don't use weapon skills early on if you don't have to. And recognize when you can get away with someone taking a bit of a breather so that they can strike hard next turn and allow others to maybe chill for a round.

# ¿ Apr 1, 2017 21:29

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

How do you guys deal with bad morale for your reserve? People tend to get pissed after a few days of reserve and it annoys me to switch them back in for a fight or two while I actually try to train a rookie/my good guys. Frankly, the fuckers should be grateful and lick the ground that I walk on because I clothe, feed, and pay them for chilling out and doing nothing

# ¿ Apr 3, 2017 17:41

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

I would pay cold hard cash for a pre-battle deployment feature

And my wild dream is to have a scenario editor that allows you to chain battles into a custom mini campaign. Kinda like the Fire Emblem games I guess except without all the talking and management because such features would probably go beyond the scope. The fact that there are tutorial scenarios in the game means that it's at least possible to do something like that

# ¿ Apr 5, 2017 21:49

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

Did they disable the option to play without a crisis?

# ¿ Apr 7, 2017 23:57

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

Kris xK posted:

Now I'm sad

Yeah, same. A lot of missed potential here but I guess you can't fault such a small team for their decision.

At least the image in the update post makes me expect a soldier mans game and that's probably great for a jagged alliance nerd like me

# ¿ Jun 17, 2017 12:26

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

Yo I got back into this after hearing about the new dlc and then realized that I dropped it after lindwurm was released. So I bought the next two dlcs first to get fresh with the game again before going for the newest stuff :v:

I've been using FilthyRobot's builds and general content to get back into the swing of things so I'm mostly good but small things still come up along the way.

Is the late-game "meta" still having a bunch of 2h guys in your force except against gobbos? I remember needing the 2h DPR to beat any of the serious late-game fights.

Where the heck do you find a whip? I've been all over the place at day 50ish and haven't seen a single one yet.

# ¿ Sep 27, 2020 18:35

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

rideANDxORdie posted:

Kind of. You're definitely going to still need that dps but the game has been patched to sort of decouple 2h guys from indomitable - used to be able to take a 2h swing for six AP then indom for 3; indom now costs 4 ap so it's not possible to do without berserk proccing. I've found each successive DLC to emphasive non-core stats more and more, resolve especially. 2h slayers are no longer the defacto best unit (tank AND DPS) on the field, you'll need to cover for them in long battles through rotate, taunt or other means. I've found my DPS now comes mainly from a mix of 2h bros, swordlance aoes, and throwing specialists.

Thanks for the info!

The Lord Bude posted:

If you’ve only got warriors of the north then sadly they’re quite rare but you’ll see one turn up in a weaponsmith eventually.

yeah seems that way. Made it to the first crisis and still haven't seen one show up in a smithy

# ¿ Sep 29, 2020 13:37

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

What's the gear strat against schrats? I assume you need longaxes or 2h axes to bust their shield but what weapons do reasonable damage to them once you get past the shield?

I ran into two of them and had to throw away some fodder brothers to flee from that poo poo

The Lord Bude posted:

For what it's worth this has been probably the best expansion in terms of stuff added so you should probably get blazing deserts.

Started a new run and found my first whip pretty quickly!

# ¿ Oct 1, 2020 12:50

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

Thanks! I'll try to stay away from contracts that involve them for now since I neither have the extra gear to swap to nor enough good stats in my line :v:

Current run is going very slow and sorta painful tbh. Fighting for every little gain while the majority of my crew has good defense but awful offense. Really need to roll on some squires/sellswords but my cash stack is rear end and I'm getting an abundance of delivery/caravan missions that require me to travel across half the map. I just wanna stab some dumb raiders for monies is that too much to ask?

E: Annd right away I get a 2k contract for a bandit camp that had a couple of thugs and a leader. This fuckin game...

In b4 bounty hunters jump me on the way back :rolldice:

E2: 4,5k in the bag things are looking up!

Tin Tim fucked around with this message at 15:57 on Oct 1, 2020

# ¿ Oct 1, 2020 14:02

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

Donkringel posted:

Also be careful of hexen contracts, they can charm schrats as their bodyguards.

Oh wow that's rude af

Also those javelins that break normal shields in a single hit? Not a fan. Not at all

# ¿ Oct 2, 2020 12:01

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

So far I've not encountered a hexen fight where I couldn't just snipe them with my archers in the first few turns :shrug:

I mean if they use hex they get to live a turn longer and can maybe make it into some form of cover but so far I've not seen their AI be clever about that sort of thing. Spread your archers along your back-line so that when your front gets charmed they don't bind two of them in melee and you should be good. You can also make your front take a step forward before the charms hit them to keep your archers free but it's not that reliable due to the init order

# ¿ Oct 2, 2020 19:13

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

800peepee51doodoo posted:

I've certainly had a few, usually with multiple Hexe where they cast multiple charms and lock up the archers anyway.

Yeah okay I guess you can get screwed like that if their numbers are high. My highest so far was three of them so maybe I'm overestimating the archer impact

800peepee51doodoo posted:

The thought behind having that build I described is that Hexe tend to try to charm the closest bros so even if they don't make it to the witch before the archers can roll some hits, they can tank the charms. I have no idea if it would work and, like I said, is likely not worth it even if it did but it seemed like a way to try out some different specialist/gimmick builds

I didn't mean to prevent you from trying a wacky build :v:

According to the mechanics it should work like that yeah but you also got to consider that the chaff enemies will likely go for your charm tank too if he's out front and stuff like unholds/schrats will gently caress them up

Also, tfw you raise a wildman tank and he turns out great except for the one stat that matters

# ¿ Oct 2, 2020 20:14

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

What backgrounds(other than hedge) for 2h guys do you like to roll on after you've moved into a solid midgame position? I used to like sellswords but they might got nerfed since I last played because I'm seeing a lot of low health and stam bases with them. Wildmen also used to be a staple for me but their base in Matt/Mdef hits them hard quite often without top stars and rolls. I also like rolling on farmhands but it takes ages until you find one with Matt/Mdef stars and decent base in Matt/Res

# ¿ Oct 4, 2020 18:55

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

The Lord Bude posted:

On perks; I give archers the following (not necessarily in this order):

Student
Fast adaptation
Crippling strikes
Executioner
Bow mastery
Footwork
Nimble
Berserk
Killing frenzy
Recover
Gifted or colossus depending on the starting stats of the bro.

I really don�t want to cut any of those. Possibly I could cut recover but I do tend to use it - 3 quick shots per turn add up - and if i did cut it I�d be more likely to take pathfinder than bullseye.

Isn't crippling strike absoulte rear end for the player? Like the effect is so minor since wounds don't matter when targets die a round or two later(or even on the same turn since you said you want archers to kill asap) and you also still have to rng into a wound that actually would make a meaningful difference. Easy replace for bullsye imo since pathfinder is also super weak as a perk. It never really matters outside of fringe cases and the few fights you're forced to take in swamp during your campaign. Also recover is real good but it's less noticeable on archers until you hit serious fights with 20+ enemies

The discussion between FA and BE is interesting but I feel like people focus too much on sniping casters when explaining why they pick BE. Yes that is a thing that you sometimes do but usually it's better to thin the ranks faster and then be able to charge the casters. For me the value of BE comes from having comfortable chances to quick shot pikes and 2h users that creep towards your line with a shield or other body in front of them. Or doing the same when they can use some terrain cover during their approach. Someone out there probably crunched the numbers between the two perks for such a scenario but to me BE is the solid choice that will "always" apply while FA is fickle since you lose the stack on scatter and on hitting blocking terrain

TheBeardyCleaver posted:

As far as rotation goes, yes you don't need it if you're a master chess player who can think 20 moves ahead (or probably even 2 turns), but it is nice for flexibility and peace of mind.

Rotation saves lives. Pick it it on everyone that stands in the front and never look back. Even if you're a god tier strategiest you will eventually see your dudes eat an unlucky pike, bolt, 2h to their health pool and then they're dead if you can't quickly dig them out of their spot. Or you just use it to save the guy who has been tanking five orcs on your flank for the last ten rounds and can't tank any longer. There's also some nice utillity with it where you use it to rotate a 2h to the front, have them hit and rotate back the shield guy to tank. It's a stamina burn but that's why you run recover. Honestly can't see myself ever not running rotate on the front because you can never really plan in such a way that your few rotate guys will always be in the right spot to save the dying brother

Tin Tim fucked around with this message at 12:51 on Oct 5, 2020

# ¿ Oct 5, 2020 12:47

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

The Lord Bude posted:

I would actually argue that Recover isn't nearly as good as most people think it is, EXCEPT on archers and some other builds - you very rarely use it, and often on a melee bro once you run out of stamina (and I invest very heavily in stamina) you're better off mathematically switching to the single target attack (which does more damage than the AOE in any case) than you are wasting a turn on recover. I cut recover in favour of pathfinder on my 2handers and so far I'm not regretting it.

I actually find myself using recover in almost every fight that's bigger than like a random group of raiders. I too invest in stamina on almost every level and only skip once or twice if I get a poo poo roll and have to feed a few rolls into health/res. Recover comes into play for me on my 2h brothers and tanks more than any other build but those dudes tend to need it to push on halfway during the fight. It mainly shines against large zombo groups or orcs/unholds/chosen where your tanks have to keep indom and taunt up a lot. There's a little trick with adrenaline where you pop it on a tank that's getting close to fatigued to have them start first and pop indom+taunt so that the others brothers around them can recover and then push next turn when the tank then recovers. Archers have already been mentioned but I find that when you're like halfway through your second quiver is where you can run out of stam for aimed shots so that's when recover does work. There are deffo a lot of fights where recover isn't needed(especially against average human groups) but I find it to be one of those toolkit perks that I always regret not having when I think I can get by without it

# ¿ Oct 5, 2020 14:14

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

One important thing for the recover discussion is also what difficulty you play on I think. If you just play for casual fun then it's likely that you don't really need it because the game rarely throws large enough groups to fight at you(outside of zombo hordes). But if you're playing on higher difficulty settings then I have a hard time seeing how you get through 20+ gobbos/orcs/ancient undead regularly without popping at least a few recovers after ten turns of constant combat

800peepee51doodoo posted:

One thing I have been doing in the new expansion is auto-picking Colossus on literally everyone.

With the increase in armor pen attacks the perk deffo has raised in value, even before the new dlc. Archers/hybrids don't need it imo but everyone else is a canidate. I think you pick between gifted/colossus depending on the starting health pool. If two or maybe three good rolls can get you to your target range then get gifted but otherwise yeah beef it up.

TheBeardyCleaver posted:

This is pretty much where I put recover as well. On archer/throwers I have to choose between footwork/pathfinder and this though, and I'm not sure what I like best yet. It really depends on the fight.

Pathfinder is a waste outside of that stam neutral 2h build, don't pick it. The effect is miniscule and almost never ever makes a difference. You're picking a perk that does nothing in nine out of ten fights only to have it do a tiny bit in that tenth fight. It's a waste. Footwork also falls into the same category but I understand why some people pick it. However once you understand how to play the game its value plummets hard for archers/hybrids. With indom on your front the enemies will never push into your backline. And with tanks on the sides you can tie up like five enemies with each of them to stop them from flanking. The rest comes down to smart positioning and anticipating how the next round will go. It's a crutch perk for new players imo and should be ignored once you got a handle on the combat. The only build I run it on is my banner because I build him to be a bit tanky for emergencies so that he can rotate in, take a mean hit and step away next round.

TheBeardyCleaver posted:

I need to look at the numbers on CS again. Haven't really been paying attention to injuries properly, but I have executioner on a couple of guys since they didn't really need gifted or an extra weapon (yes, i know most bros could do benefit from a polearm in the pocket).

I'm generally not a fan of the executioner/CS combo but saying that somebody doesn't need gifted really rubs me the wrong way. Bigger numbers are everything in this game :v:

The Lord Bude posted:

As for colossus I always take it on front liners but I usually don’t on back liners because I can get to my desired hp target without it unless their starting hp is super bad. you raise attack and stamina every turn; you take resolve to 50 ish; and after that there’s nothing really to do with your stats but raise health every turn; my archers usually end up in the high 70s or low 80s. Yes colossus is really good but there is still a point where you don’t really need more health.

Uhh back line doesn't need resolve. Like not at all. All my back line(except for the banner obviously) is at like 32 and I'm on the way to my second crisis in the run. Resolve is a waste on them and seriously not worth the points if you just do it for the confident morale start. Archers get Ratt/def and stamina every level with a few dips to get their hp to 60. With nimble that has always been enough for me. I mean you can say "oh but what about when that sneaky orc beserker manages to jump around your flank??" but my reply would be that it's your own fault for letting it happen and not having someone to rotate/taunt for them.

The Lord Bude posted:

Also: saying crippling strikes is bad because archers have low armour pen is staggeringly dumb. If a bro has low armour pen crippling strikes becomes more useful because they need the extra help to cause injury. Again however; I’m well aware it’s the least impactful perk but there really isn’t a better option.

I don't have the numbers available but I would assume that if you have low armor pen then you also don't do enough health damage to trigger wounds even with the bonus?

Tin Tim fucked around with this message at 18:36 on Oct 6, 2020

# ¿ Oct 6, 2020 18:14

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

The Lord Bude posted:

Back line needs resolve if you are using fearsome. With gunners and warscythes you can mass apply fearsome and it does huge amounts of work. I put it on everyone that carries a gun, a polearm or a 1h weapon. I can have those large 20+ groups of orcs all fleeing by round 3. I took out a party of over 40 orcs when I attacked a camp at the same time a roving band of orcs was just close enough to be dragged into the combat. Fearsome is insane now. Outside of that I think you should still maintain a minimum standard so you don't have your archers breaking

Tbf I don't have the new dlc yet so I guess that's why I was so bewildered by you putting resolve on your backline. Sounds like a fun strat though! Never had my archers break though outside of geists and then my banner always gets them back into shape

The Lord Bude posted:

ranged defence is the big waste that people invest in, it's pretty pointless - once you have around 15 or so enemy archers will mostly just target something else, and between nimble, bone plating, and the fact that enemy archers have poo poo accuracy it really doesn't matter if your archers eat an arrow every now and then. Almost 1k hours put into this game, and even now playing on expert I've never bothered to give anyone more than mid teens ranged def and it's never, ever been an issue.

This is something I feel I'm coming around to. I built my current archers with Rdef but found myself asking if it's really needed once you go above 20. My current logic is that ranged attacks are pretty much all that can injure my backline so I'm buffing against that. I'm done with the second crisis and I never had my backline take any serious melee attacks in the whole run so far. Not a single time. Because indom on the front and good play I guess. They get a fair amount of arrows or throwing weapons directed at them though once my front is enganged so that is the one real threat I feel. But yeah I started to doubt if I really need Rdef above 20 and will try to dip a few more rolls into health on my next campaign to see how it feels

TheBeardyCleaver posted:

After 10 turns you've broken through and killing individual targets, making taking 2-3 shots every turn unlikely/inefficient, or you're in some deep poo poo. This according to my playstyle at least. If you manage to slow down a fight and take less damage that way, it may be a thing.

My comment was more directed towards your front. Especially 2h users stam out quickly if you have to open with indom against an orc charge and then use your aoe skills once or twice or use all the extra attacks with berserk. Those fights are a pure dps race so I find myself needing to recover halfway through pretty regularly. Tanks are sorta in the same boat when they also have to throw up taunts along with indom

TheBeardyCleaver posted:

It means walking takes less stamina, thus a boost, and it also takes less AP, meaning more movement/more attacks, also a boost. Getting into the right position and being able to attack is everything IMO.

This is true but still not enough to warrant a perk point. The stamina reduction is really minor and the extra movement looks good on paper but in reality it's not that helpful. The average fight doesn't actually involve a lot of movement before the lines clash. And after that you only make real moves again when the majority of enemies are already dead. It's just not enough benefit for the cost of a perk to me and probably never will be. 2h users are the only exception because they do benefit from being able to move twice and strike. But I don't have any perk I could cut from them and already achieve the same by having a tank step forward and rotate them ahead

# ¿ Oct 9, 2020 13:45

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

If you're stuck in a cycle where they keep hex up for a long time then you can dagger them if you're willing to take the damage on some of your brothers. Have only healthy people near them, stab them, move the wounded dude far away so that they don't recast hex on them and repeat. Otherwise I just bring a bunch of archers with my highest resolve frontline and try to snipe them in the first two rounds

Southpaugh posted:

Best way to deal with them is to ignore them until they get fatigued or try to one shot them with your warbow guy.

This can take a while though. Just yesterday I had a fight where a single hexe survived and kept up hex for five rounds straight. That's when I got fed up and did the dagger thing

TheBeardyCleaver posted:

They can either charm or hex in a turn(I think)

They can do both but sometimes decide not to

The Lord Bude posted:

I just make do with the +4 necklace from killing nachos. Those are a dime a dozen. And a training hall will take care of xp boost needs. It’s not like money is in short supply once you make it past the early game

The +6 is pretty nice though. With some veteran levels I easily got my front to 60 resolve that way despite aiming for 50 on non-tank brothers in the front. And the xp potion does give +100% for three fights which is a lot better than the training hall. It can be a neat time saver once you hit the part of the game where you grind through recruits to level your perfect boys. But it also needs a schrat heart which is a rare drop so sadly it's not really something that you can utilize consistently. And of course you don't want to make addicts either.

Tin Tim fucked around with this message at 15:43 on Oct 14, 2020

# ¿ Oct 14, 2020 15:38

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

Just a reminder to be careful when nobles want you to destroy camps

Decent pay for a random orc camp, right? Except that I already discovered that place and know that it's a sea of tents with 30+ orcs...wtf we are allied bro

Also, the saddest famed drop

I mean I put some lindwurm scales on it and use it as a decent armor for fresh hires that I level but I'm still sad

# ¿ Oct 15, 2020 15:09

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

The Lord Bude posted:

When you accept a contract that is 2 skulls or less it will replace whatever is in the location with new enemies scaled to the contract difficulty. 3 skull contracts always use whatever was originally there.

It’s important to know because if you accept a 1 or 2 skull contract to wipe out a location that spawned at the beginning of the game with a good named item you’ll lose the item. I always try not to take contracts of one or two skulls that want me to destroy a location once I’m in a financial position to pick and choose what to do.

Huh, I didn't know that! Gonna keep that in mind from now on

# ¿ Oct 15, 2020 18:21

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

What are some good strats for the late game xp grind now?

I'm at the point where I only look for excellent recruits and need to judge their final stats in comparison with my core bros. And even with the training hall it takes a long time to lvl after you hit like 6. I assume there must be some fights which are more desirable than others in terms of xp yield vs threat/effort. So far I've tried to prioritize large zombie/raider fights since those allow you to feed easy kills to recruits on top of the kills they get during the course of the fight. But I'm not sure if that's really the best method so yeah hit me with your strats if you have some

# ¿ Oct 15, 2020 20:45

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

The Lord Bude posted:

Similarly good tanks are easy to find - if he can get to 80 matk and 130+ stamina and isn't super low in both health and resolve he's tank material. My tanks end up with 100 health, 60+ resolve (with a +4 trinket and +5 from arena) 80+ matk and as much stamina as I can give them. If you hire farmers or lumberjacks you can find dudes that will hit 140 plus. I notice Walter has way to much health and not enough fatigue - I don't know what his attack score is, but if he can't get to 80 he doesn't get hired in my company.

This sounds weird to me. Tanks need Mdef first and foremost and Matk is the last stat they need to do their job. I mean sure the perfect recruit could turn out like that but my early tanks are dudes that start below 60 Matk and I only level that stat if they can reach 60 in like three rolls. After that I look for dudes that can beat my old tanks in Mdef and hit 60 Matk and 70 is pretty much the top tier for tanks. I just find it hard to see how you get enough stats if you level Matk that heavily. Mdef gets rolled on every level and stamina too if the roll isn't absolute rear end in comparison and the third roll then has to be split between resolve and health. Especially hires like farmers and lumberjacks have crappy bases in Matak and need a ton of points to hit what you describe. I guess due to the arena you can shave some points from Res but 60 isn't exactly a great base. It's a benchmark for sure but having a bit more is better when your tanks often get surrounded by multiple enemies to bind them

# ¿ Oct 18, 2020 21:49

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

Disarm is indeed an incredibly good control skill. My banner bro pulls whip duty too and with 80 Matk and the cleaver spec he's real consistent at shutting down high threats like 2h orc warlords. Taking the spec just for disarm is sorta costly since I dropped the polearm spec for it but the banner isn't really doing much damage anyway

# ¿ Oct 19, 2020 00:16

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

The Lord Bude posted:

Perhaps I should call them shieldbros rather than tanks. A purely defensive bro like you describe is not someone I would ever have in my company.

Yeah with that naming it does make more sense to me!

However I think you're vastly undervaluing the impact of a pure tank by focusing on the lack of offense. 1h weapons are by default not very offensive aside from duellists. Even with high Matk you still need several hits(and rounds) to even kill a raider. So to me a sword&board bro is never ever a canidate for damage since the game gimps them in that regard by default. But they have the option to scale their defense way up instead so that's the strenght of the role for me. Like if the choice is between mediocre damage and defense or mediocre damage and excellent defense then I know which role I would take into my group.

I run exactly two tanks in my active group with two in reserve when I have to switch them or bring more to fight unholds/lindwurms. Also I usually switch in a third in the center against orcs. These guys all have 30+mdef before the bonus from shields and rock 300 chest and head armor with enough fatigue to hold indom up for like five or six rounds before they need to recover. They are tough as gently caress and happily draw everyone in with taunts to just waste their time on trying to hit them. So while you're saying you would kill fast by having a few more 1h strikes land, I'm saying that I'm also fast by tying up a bunch of enemies so that my core of 2h bros has less heat and just snowballs through the ranks after frenzy procs. Pretty much every serious fight in the game has you outnumbered by a fair bit and just invalidating a portion of the enemies by having two rocks in my line has been very valauble to me every time. And as said my serious tanks also have 70 Matk which is enough for what I want them to do. They contribute hits against humanoid enemies just fine with that score. No need to lock them to a sword or spear for the extra hit chance. And in fights where their hits don't contribute much anyway they don't lose out on anything by being on strict defense duty until the mop up starts.

The Lord Bude posted:

I level matk every turn (if their starting score is on the better side I'll skip the occasional +1 rolls) and stamina every turn. I level whichever of health or resolve is highest every turn until they hit the level I want; then if they're not at level 11 I raise mdef for the last few levels. Once you add a shield (+18 minimum, and named shields are super common so they all end up with one pretty quickly) they will all end up with at least around 30 mdef. Checking my peasant save; my lowest mdef on a shield bro is 28, and that's because he's using a named shield with 32 rdef and only 15 mdef, everyone else is over 30 and the highest is 42. You really don't need to go higher - they don't get hit much, when they do they all have armour in the very high 200s or low 300s with additional fur padding; and between indom and shieldwall they can survive for ages in an emergency. Plus peasants have extra men so the damage gets spread around with 9 on the front line.

This is something I'm going to contest. No way is 30 mdef enough to realibly dodge orc warriors/ancient undead/chosen hits. And that's the enemies you're mostly building your band towards imo. Also you're completely hosed if they ever break your shield since your natural def is so low. I'm sure your style works out for you but I would never neglect mdef like that in my front

Tin Tim fucked around with this message at 05:17 on Oct 19, 2020

# ¿ Oct 19, 2020 05:12

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# ¿ Apr 28, 2024 06:49

Tin Tim: Jun 4, 2012; Live by the pun - Die by the pun

How much should I be concerned about the durability on this?

I mean no fatigue reduction kinda sucks but it rolled pretty well on the damage

The cleaver I got from the mad barb is pretty rear end by comparision I think?

# ¿ Oct 20, 2020 22:31

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