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Bremen
Jul 20, 2006

Our God..... is an awesome God

Space Cadet Omoly posted:

Their gear sells for SO MUCH, it's like the game wants you to murder them!

Wanting to murder the legion is just the natural state of things, so no surprise there.

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Bremen
Jul 20, 2006

Our God..... is an awesome God

Berke Negri posted:

kind of prefer the Institute's banality of evil to the Legion's ISIS level evil but the latter works cause the legion wasn't intended to be shades of gray evil but either are both thematically fine to utilize

like i don't think 2 or 3 is weaker cause no one (sane) would think "wow the enclave had good ideas after all" but i guess at least in NV you've got the option to join along if you want to (maybe that's a thing in broken steel which i never finished idk)

My problem with the institute wasn't how they acted, it was that the game just decides to never allow you to bring it up. In New Vegas if you don't like House, you can complain to him and he'll defend himself, and maybe you'll buy his justification or maybe you wont, but it's at least an option to talk about. Fallout 4? It usually even doesn't let you talk to the people about that. I usually can't even talk to the institute about at least considering the synths might be conscious, or the brotherhood or railroad about trying negotiation, or things like that. Or if I do, it's a half hearted explanation that the PC doesn't even get the option to disagree with. I found the morality of FO4 interesting on the surface but was repeatedly frustrated that the game's way of adding moral ambiguity was apparently to have the protagonist stick his fingers in his ears and refuse to think about things.

New Vegas, love it or hate it, definitely didn't have "lack of dialog options" as a sin.

Bremen
Jul 20, 2006

Our God..... is an awesome God
30% and the ability to refund the game. If I were a cynical sort, I might suspect they think a large number of users might refund it within two hours.

Bremen
Jul 20, 2006

Our God..... is an awesome God

Berke Negri posted:

fnv is a bit more on rails than 3 or 4 imo. not that that's bad, it's why it has a tighter narrative flow while 3 & 4 are kind of more about wandering and sticking your head into some abandoned building hoping to find glorious, glorious tv dinner trays

I would agree that New Vegas is more linear than FO4 (you're more or less guided on a certain path, with optional sidequests to your left and right, though it does open up more later). On rails can mean you don't have a lot of choices, though, and that's where New Vegas excels; there's dialog options and sometimes quest branches for just about everything you can think of. In FO4 you can go wherever, but when you get there it's mostly just a matter of doing whatever whoever's there tells you needs doing.

Just different ways of looking at it, I guess.

Bremen
Jul 20, 2006

Our God..... is an awesome God

Kaal posted:

If the choice is accepting taxation and democratic government or wandering off into the apocalyptic desert to be eaten by raiders, I know what I would choose!

That's pretty much what my stance always boiled down to. The NCR is basically modern day USA with all of its problems at their worst and more, which would make them a pretty ugly choice by modern standards - but they're not being judged by modern standards. It's NCR, the legion, or a post-apocalyptic wasteland where you can't walk ten feet without raiders trying to kill and eat you. Sign me the gently caress up for "Modern USA, but worse."

Bremen
Jul 20, 2006

Our God..... is an awesome God

LashLightning posted:

I think Rose of Sharon Cassidy, or someone at least, mentions something along the lines of that leaders of toll stations don't have any strict rules about taking tolls and seem to make it up as they go along, and leaders and troopers are swap out and around often so you don't really know what to expect. Legion seem to have their affairs in more order in those regards.

Plus, I kind of get the feeling that it's 'tolls' rather than 'taxes' that are causing the trouble. Again, people have pointed out that taxes don't mean much in a place where barter is still a thing.

I don't remember those lines, but consider who's saying them; Cass has been the victim of a conspiracy trying to drive out competing caravans for awhile, and which may have had at least some support from the NCR government. The tolls might have been messed up because the troops in charge were being bribed to make her life harder and/or the government was looking the other way if they extorted the non-crimson caravans.

Bremen
Jul 20, 2006

Our God..... is an awesome God

Cyberpunkey Monkey posted:

consensual multiplayer that fucks over griefer assholes and leaves them frustrated and sad is a good thing

While I tend to agree with you - not every multiplayer game needs to be PUBG level cutthroat, and even EVE Online took steps to make sure your stuff couldn't be blown up while you were offline - I'm very skeptical that it will work.

The whole "you do much less damage outside of a duel, and a murderer shows up to everyone and if they kill him they get his caps" seems like the kind of anti-griefing solution developers always come up with, thinking griefers are just normal casual players that like PvP, and they never work. A real griefer is just going to bring enough firepower to kill someone with the damage reduction and/or stalk them until they're at low health from fighting enemies and finish them off, then probably have a multiboxed account to hold all their caps while they go murdering so they don't lose anything. And that's assuming that a Bethesda game somehow doesn't end up with an easily exploitable bug they'll use to get around the anti-griefing measures.

OwlFancier posted:

But that's the whole point of the genre. You build up bases and levels and loot and you use that to have a massive advantage over other people. The whole point of the online survival genre is that you build up power and grief people while having an ever present risk of losing it all.

It won't leave them frustrated and sad, they just won't buy or play the game, and if people don't buy or play your multiplayer game, it's just dead.

That's the other thing, those games live and die by their playerbase and I suppose in theory the lack of servers will help with that, but if multiplayer is such a secondary part of the game then that again begs the question of what it's in there for?

This seems pretty obviously wrong. There's plenty of MMOs that only have opt-in PvP; a multiplayer game doesn't by definition have to be a PvP game.

That doesn't mean Fallout 76 will be a good game, mind you - I'm very skeptical of it. Just that there's nothing wrong with the idea of a multiplayer game that isn't PUBG or its like.

Bremen fucked around with this message at 23:46 on Sep 5, 2018

Bremen
Jul 20, 2006

Our God..... is an awesome God

OwlFancier posted:

The alternative is that it's a multiplayer PVE game which is farcical, how can you possibly make a 1-24 player multiplayer PVE first person shooter game?

Can you loving imagine the stupidity of bethesda bullet sponge enemies except scaled for 24 players? Why are you even playing an FPS at that point?

Doing a multiplayer raid boss or whatever where I do nothing but shoot a minigun at its face for 30 minutes sounds fantastic.

Yes, because I played Defiance.

Bremen
Jul 20, 2006

Our God..... is an awesome God

Arcsquad12 posted:

I don't see how Bethesda's claim that 76 will last "forever" is going to hold up considering their rather horrendous track record for fixing bugs before moving onto other projects.

You can get the unofficial patch.

For $15.

Bremen
Jul 20, 2006

Our God..... is an awesome God
Dead Money always seems to have the most divided opinions. I put it down to trying to turn the game into something different (survival horror).

For what it's worth, I loved it the first time through but found it pretty boring on successive runs.

Bremen
Jul 20, 2006

Our God..... is an awesome God

Eraflure posted:

Building a character in this game sounds absolutely miserable

I just started recently and I'm actually pretty happy with how the game manages to make character creation feel like it matters while still making it very hard to cripple your character long term.

The actual engine is very janky but I think a lot of actual MMOs could take tips on character growth mechanics from this game.

Bremen
Jul 20, 2006

Our God..... is an awesome God

Bremen posted:

I just started recently and I'm actually pretty happy with how the game manages to make character creation feel like it matters while still making it very hard to cripple your character long term.

The actual engine is very janky but I think a lot of actual MMOs could take tips on character growth mechanics from this game.

Just following up on this; awhile back I posted in the modding thread about how I really wanted NV ported to Fallout 4 more than a new game, and a poster told me I should try picking up 76 and playing it as essentially a solo game. I did and surprisingly enough I'm really loving it.

I heard the same horror stories about launch as everyone, and that's why I never bothered, but I'm happy to say that three years of work have greatly improved the game. I just want to wander around a wasteland, doing quests and grabbing loot out of trash cans, and Fallout 76 does that really well. I really enjoy the story so far (I don't care if some people think it's too linear, at least I'm not just running around screaming if anyone has seen my baby), and I've mainly been following the original questline, so there's still two others to try later. I feel like the world is also much more interesting than Fallout 4's, with the different regions all feeling very distinct and with their own enemies - and on that note I love how much diversity there is for enemies. I was running down a highway only to get the shock of my life when a van I ran past turned out to be used as a shell by an elephant sized hermit crab.

As noted above, I have a lot of fun with the perks system too. I feel like it's a nice compromise of decisions mattering while still maintaining flexibility.

I have pretty much completely ignored the existence of other players, except for a few events popping up and one time when I ran into a giant sheep monster and ended up fighting it with another player. I might try more multiplayer stuff later, or I might not, but honestly I've already more than gotten my money's worth from this game just from the solo experience (actually I got it free on Xbox game pass, but I would have gotten my money's worth even if I paid). I don't know if I can honestly say I like it more than NV, but it's a lot closer than I ever expected it to be.

Bremen
Jul 20, 2006

Our God..... is an awesome God

Mr Hootington posted:

More and more people are saying this.

I think the lesson here is what most Bethesda games really need is 3 more years of bug fixes, content additions, and quality of life tweaks.

Bremen
Jul 20, 2006

Our God..... is an awesome God

ASenileAnimal posted:

is there any place to reliably farm gatling guns to learn mods? its become my main weapon and i want to make it kick even more rear end.

There's a mine full of cultists that has one spawn with one, that's how I did it. Lucky Hole Mine, but it's just one per run.

Bremen
Jul 20, 2006

Our God..... is an awesome God

Orv posted:

Just a handful of clips while doing my every so often clear out of shadowplay files. I was planning to document more funny ragdolls but then I got into end game stuff and it turns out everyone walking around with TSE this and that means they sort of lose their uniqueness after the fifteenth scorchbeast flies into the sunset.

https://i.imgur.com/BtxZo4o.mp4

The superman UA explosion and the ghoul opening the door to dodge the grenade were just :staredog:

I still have no idea how this one happened, I just walked into a camp and the guy glitched out and died like this without me doing anything.



I guess that's why you used to need power armor training. Don't be that guy.

Bremen
Jul 20, 2006

Our God..... is an awesome God

surf rock posted:

Alright, I just got a Series X and have three games: this, Cyberpunk, and Halo Infinite.

I just asked the Cyberpunk thread if that game's been fixed and got a very swift "No" so I'm here with the same question for Fallout 76. If this one's a no as well, I'll be off to Halo land. Thanks!

I played this game recently and had a lot of fun. I just treated it as a single player game and it worked well, with an interesting main quest and a fun and flavorful map instead of Fallout 4's bland same-yness. I'd say give it a shot.

Bremen
Jul 20, 2006

Our God..... is an awesome God

galenanorth posted:

Does A Tale of Two Wastelands let you play Fallout 3's storyline and quests? None of the A Tale of Two Wasteland websites seem to actually explain what A Tale of Two Wastelands is

Yes. You (by default) start playing normally through FO3, and once you get deep into the capital ruins you find a working train to New Vegas, at which point you can go back and forth and progress through both storylines as you like.

You can choose to never take the train if you like, which would mean basically playing through FO3 in the New Vegas engine.

Bremen
Jul 20, 2006

Our God..... is an awesome God

Chatrapati posted:

Oh wow. That looks quite complicated. I think I'll soldier through it regardless since no-one's said anything positive about Fallout 1 or 3, and I'm not really interested in building, or playing a "3rd person shooter" like Flesh Forge described. Cheers guys, I'm looking forward to see if war ever changes!

Fallout 3 isn't really a bad game, but it's technically inferior to 4 and can't stand up story wise against New Vegas as one of the best written RPGs ever, so it kind of gets neglected.

I realize this probably won't win me many internet points but I never could really get into Fallout 1 or 2. When I tried them it seemed to be all about pixel hunting for a few important things you were supposed to find to figure out what you were supposed to do.

Bremen
Jul 20, 2006

Our God..... is an awesome God

Sensenmann posted:

You can't. Gold Bullion becomes only available after you finish the last Wastelanders quest. Before that the machines either don't exist or do nothing when you access them. Can't remember which.

You can, however, farm the Notes before you finish Wastelanders, the requirement for them to only become available as event rewards once you finish the last quest has been ditched with Steel Reign.

I was definitely able to both exchange my notes and spend bullion before finishing the quest when I played FO76, since I never finished the Wastelanders quest.

Bremen
Jul 20, 2006

Our God..... is an awesome God

Sensenmann posted:

You sure you didn't raid the vault? Unless that's been drastically changed with one of the last big patches the vault raid is the requirement for the machines to work and for the gold vendors to sell you stuff.

Positive. I'm actually less sure that I redeemed the certificates and bought stuff with gold, but I'm pretty sure I remember using the machines and then spending the gold at that trader that alternates cities and sells stuff on a rotating cycle.

twistedmentat posted:

So i went to the Camp where I can get the real backpack, and uh the Supermutants that infest that area are pretty hard to kill with my current gear/SPECIAL. Like it would take one full clip from my combat rifle to take one down. Any suggestions on how to increase my damage? I've been getting the perks that increase my rifle damage, but that doesn't seem to be increasing it that much.

If I recall correctly the Super Mutants in 76 have considerably higher physical damage resistance than energy so you could try using an energy weapon if you have one.

Bremen
Jul 20, 2006

Our God..... is an awesome God

The Wonder Weapon posted:

Oh yeah as soon as I got out of the vault and my quick save button wasn't working I looked up why. Instantly googled where to find a bed, then immediately installed a save mod. Some of us have kids, we can't be dealing with that nonsense.

While I would loathe it, only being able to save at beds isn't inherently awful. But you can't have that, and no fast travel, and fatigue. They're lumping too much on at that point. To say nothing of how it will feel as a new player who doesn't know where to find beds settlements and water.

To give FO4 survival mode some credit, it still saves on exit. It's just backup saves you can't make (the save on exit gets deleted as soon as you load it).

But yeah, I consider a save mod pretty essential.

Bremen
Jul 20, 2006

Our God..... is an awesome God
So, I see there's a big sale on Fallout 76. I played it awhile back with the Games for Windows subscription and actually kind of liked it, so I was thinking about picking it up on Steam (I know I'd have to restart which is fine). What's the Pitt DLC thing getting me? Is it the actual content like other Fallout games DLC, or is it just a bundle of premium stuff like paint and the fusion core recharger that I don't really care about?

Also any general comments on the current state of the game/warnings to flee while I still can are welcome.

Bremen
Jul 20, 2006

Our God..... is an awesome God

Another Bill posted:

The Pitt DLC was fun for about a month and then it died and I don't think anyone does it anymore.

F076 is fun but I played it to death. The endgame has gotten any more interesting or developed.

Oh, to clarify I meant the DLC in the steam store. Do I have to buy it to get the ingame content, or is it just a collection of bonus stuff?

Bremen
Jul 20, 2006

Our God..... is an awesome God

Flesh Forge posted:

any game you get more than a hundred hours of entertainment out of, and come away from it with any fondness at all, is a pretty good return on investment

And I mean, I just bought it for $8. So yeah, I'll play it for the missions and maybe have some fun MMO-grinding out of it as my mood suits.

I played it a few years ago and ran through the basic campaign, all the way through infiltrating the nuke silo and taking out the SBQ, and have reasonably fond memories of that. So when I saw it on sale I figured I was up for trying it again and maybe doing the new stuff too.

Bremen
Jul 20, 2006

Our God..... is an awesome God

Bremen posted:

And I mean, I just bought it for $8. So yeah, I'll play it for the missions and maybe have some fun MMO-grinding out of it as my mood suits.

I played it a few years ago and ran through the basic campaign, all the way through infiltrating the nuke silo and taking out the SBQ, and have reasonably fond memories of that. So when I saw it on sale I figured I was up for trying it again and maybe doing the new stuff too.

So, I've been playing for a bit, long enough to start accumulating atoms. Any must buys for a new account?

Also I'm strongly considering 1st, mostly for the scrapbox.

Bremen
Jul 20, 2006

Our God..... is an awesome God

Another Bill posted:

I always used atoms to avoid grinding out the last 20 levels of the scoreboard.

I was mostly thinking about good utility items. Maybe the ammo machine thing, that seems like it would also help with storage space given my tendencies in fallout games to grab everything not nailed down.

Bremen
Jul 20, 2006

Our God..... is an awesome God
I played it on Gamepass a long time back, finished the original main quest and had a lot of fun. Picked it up on Steam a few months ago when there was a really good sale and did it again, but then dropped it, because while I loved the exploring and doing the main quest the idea of running events and what not to get hundreds of levels and tricked out legendary equipment just doesn't seem to interest me.

I still think the main quest and worldbuilding might be the best of a base Bethesda game since Morrowind though.

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Bremen
Jul 20, 2006

Our God..... is an awesome God

pmchem posted:

1. How is the game on PC these days? I have paid zero attention to it. What fun level we talkin' here compared to release, which was widely panned?


If you just avoid other players and play through the original campaign (following the Overseer, basically), I think it's a pretty fun Fallout game.

I didn't particularly enjoy trying to play it as an MMO, but I'm not big in to MMOs while I do enjoy Fallout games.

Bremen fucked around with this message at 21:08 on Apr 20, 2024

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