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Pener Kropoopkin posted:That reminds me of how top brass are all required to clear ranger school these days, which was probably arrived at to solve exactly the problem being quoted there. lmao staff officers that should be planning are being forced to do exhausting backbreaking endurance courses?
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Jan 13, 2022 20:13
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Can someone explain the special forces tier one operator space marine fetish please? I recall this particular time where a commonwealth doctrine following line infantry regiment straight up smoked a US trained special forces unit in terrain that special forces were supposed to be dominant in. Hell even in pop history books like charlie wilson's war the US brain trust realised that the Soviets using special forces in regular firefights was a huge L because the situation had become too desperate. Smash cut to the entire post 9/11 world and you have so many special forces units running around and creating their own cult following and are returning home to be giga rightwing cranks.
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Jan 16, 2022 22:48
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Rent-A-Cop posted:People are always trying to sell the next book about The War That Changed War, but you always fight with the army you have. Nobody ever said "LOL gently caress professionals, get me some farmers!!" The french artillery was always highly trained professionals who knew how to do things like mathematics. aphid_licker posted:Kinda lol that that corps sized formation has a single shorad bn to its name thats a division no?
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Jan 18, 2022 19:02
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How do trains go across the ocean dumbass?
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Jan 22, 2022 23:36
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Burgers had to fund those SpaceGoku posted:actually we lost to goat farmers gently caress, I found out cattle just means cows.
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Jan 27, 2022 12:51
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Like whats gonna happen when all those F-35s crash due to inclement weather or the newly upgraded fighting falcons get zapped by russian air defenses?
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Jan 27, 2022 13:58
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Weka posted:Politifact rated this: pants on fire So they lost to small business loan backed taliban? Weka posted:Say what you will about the British empire, atleast they knew you invaded places for the food. The british empire also knew when to quit and when to diffuse tensions after 1857.
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Jan 28, 2022 13:09
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If Britain had given India dominion status or an actual pledge of home rule/dominion status as a condition of entering the great war, Queen Elizabeth would probably still have her Empress of India title. Prior to the first world war there was a noticeable undercurrent of socialist thought in the Indian independence movement but the main thrust was still on making the imperial government enforce queen victoria's pledge during her durbar in India. In the run up to the great war, enforcing religious separation through the partition of Bengal backfired on the imperial government. The Swadeshi movement provided a bonanza for the budding industrial capitalists in India to have a social basis for undercutting british products in lieu of local goods. Of course the repression post war doomed any middle class/intelligensia support for the remotest trappings of British rule. Jallianwala Bagh killed off any long term accommodation with the british. That sort of thing was reserved for starving bengali peasants hanging their landlords after making people's courts, not for brave noble sikhs/Pathans who had fought the hun and the turk. The officer corps of the British Indian Army, grown as it was from a bunch of british pedophiles who grew up reading romances of the 1857 rebellion started doing cartoonishly vile poo poo like shooting into crowds with surplus lewis guns. Also it can't be understated how much the existence of the USSR alone radicalized anticolonial movements. There was the tiny wakhan corridor separating a revolutionary state from a land border of the largest colony in the world. The British government was seeing bolsheviks everywhere while the increasingly angry INC was talking about the USSR and how it was a model to be followed. “Almost at the same time as the October Revolution led by the great Lenin, we in India began a new phase in our struggle for freedom. Our people for many years were engaged in this struggle with courage and patience. And although under the leadership of Gandhi we followed another path, we were influenced by the example of Lenin.” - this was from the explicitly violence abhorring section of the INC that eventually came to power. So when Churchill talks about a federation where Indian capitalists and princelings would be accorded the same status as their australian, canadian and british counterparts, the political movement in India is all about how to redistribute land to peasants and follow stalinist 5 year plans to develop industry. After operation Barbarossa, CPI cadre began infiltrating the army which was going through a massive recruitment drive. There would be no military force that the british could rely on for any continued domination of India in the short term.
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Feb 11, 2022 13:20
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What indian elite? The ICS was full of european officers. The princelings didn't have an army to enforce their monopoly of violence, and the Indian capitalist class was beginning to split with more mainline indian nationalism into hindu nationalism because the former was turning too left leaning. The repression was due to actual german acts of sabotage and the existence of things like the USSR. Early in WW1 there was a diplomatic row between the US and the UK regarding Indian revolutionaries in the USA. Hell the mass civil disobedience thing was the best way to neutralize the benefit that the british had in case of a military conflict. Hard to prove to your american creditors that you are doing a civilising mission when you send uniformed goons to beat people up who are making salt by the beach.Frosted Flake posted:I understand what you’re saying, and I can sort of understand it, but I’m trying to wrap my head around the British happier at being relegated to an insignificant rainy island rather than keeping the Jewel in the Crown? Wasn’t the whole premise of the Civilizing Mission that they turn Indians into Little Englishmen? If the entire point of Liberal Empire was to bring Britishness/Frenchness to these people, and I understand the racist premise and how Liberal Empire was still violent and exploitative, then… wouldn’t the ultimate success of the project be cricket playing Etonian Indian MPs representing Bombay in the Commons? Similarly, if France’s rallying cry was “ici, cest la France!” wouldn’t coffee drinking egalitarian deputies from Beirut and Dakar be testiment to the French national motto? The british did turn indian subgroups into little englishmen. The parsis started off right next to the mughal british factories at Surat and later Bombay and provided a lot of financial capital from their local trade networks during the initial years of the EIC. By the late 19th century they were turning into budding class traitors like Madame Cama who was going around socialist gatherings and talking about colonialism with sympathetic workers movements in continental Europe. The bengali intellectual in anglo indian literature from the latter half of the 19th century writing was essentially the Jew from Der Sturmer. Too europeanized to be a disgusting Hindoo/Muslim ogre, too dark to be shoved into polite company unless your club needed more due paying members. The 20 years before the run up to the first world war required the raj to scientific racism to increasingly justify the unequal position between indians and the british seemingly against the general wishes of the crown. The exigencies of WW1 showed that you needed Indian officers at least up to brigade level because a lot of those romantic Hindustani speaking lieutenants and captains (and their nice subedar sargeants) got mowed down by machine gun fire on the western front. The imperial german army killed off the high point of the raj in the french mud. Also turning people into little englishmen also was introducing intelligentsia to more radical left theories coming out of europe. All that culminated in a bunch of the non martial race intellectuals joining the CPSU after the first world war and then getting purged by uncle joe. It was a wild ride for those fellas. Now there were a lot of true believer libcucks in the civilizing mission of India but they were always treated with disdain by the Anglo Indian ruling strata of the raj. There's a sickening amount of 'british new woman moves to India to find a nice husband with her liberal ideas, sees beastly hindoos/mahomedeans and gets raped/killed by them' literature. Orwell's writing on the raj just strips away all that and shows the actual class dynamics underneath. Burmah Days is essentially him stripping away the mystique of an entire culture that the conservative british intelligensia looked to in Kipling's writing and laying it bare. The indian doctor is the nice liberal who believes in the civilizing mission of Britain. The woman in the story is trying to find a husband because her uncle wants to rape her. The protagonist is a guy who loves the country but is too loving racist to actually see himself as one. The story ends with the indian being sent to a worse backwater, the woman marrying some probably closeted colonial official and lording over servants and the hero killing himself because he is too ashamed.
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Feb 11, 2022 14:06
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Zeppelin Insanity posted:It isn't just about lack of investment in industry: colonialism carries with it a large scale coordinated effort to destroy existing industry and infrastructure. This was a big deal in India. Indian craftsmanship was very prized among the wealthy in Britain, particularly textiles. Initially, this was a massive hit of profit for the trading companies, but they fairly quickly decided to do as much as possible to destroy it to make India dependent on imports of finished goods from Britain. It went as far as cutting off the fingers of textile weavers. Btw, bombay was a major industrial center by the time gandhi started non cooperation, and spinning coarse yarn on the charkha predates him somewhat with the swadeshi movement. All the profits the early opium traders in India made were dumped into processing cloth in India.
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Feb 11, 2022 14:08
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In many cases the churchillian dream worked out. The tory party seems to be full of clowns like rishi sunak who work like the ideal of the liberal imperial project.Frosted Flake posted:I know in Canada, and even earlier when the American Colonies were trying to push into the Ohio Valley, that King George/The Great White Mother Across The Sea scandalized the colonists by taking treaties seriously, it was this huge point of contention. The treaties gave then the right to petition the Crown directly, bypassing Canada and apparently it infuriated the Canadian government. I wonder if the same dynamic was happening in India? Anglo Indians as a class, especially the ethnically pure britons defined themselves as a group in opposition to the teeming Indian masses ruled over by the imperial government. They would be the white equivalent to the native princes that stayed loyal in the 1857 rebellion and who raised huge amounts of money for the viceroy's administration whenever there was a war scare with the Russian empire during the great game. Without a British Raj Anglo Indians would be superfluous. Even in the most marginally franchised electorate they would be negligible compared to the Indian professional managerial class and bourgeoisie. Independent India gave anglo indians a vastly inflated seat count of 2 MPs in the indian parliament of 543. At the same time due to their proximity with the ruling structures of the raj gave them a vastly bigger say in the cultural sphere of the metropole. Tankbuster has issued a correction as of 15:01 on Feb 11, 2022 |
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Feb 11, 2022 14:47
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Frosted Flake posted:I realize their awfulness was the result of material conditions in some way, I just can’t put my finger on how. I understand it’s useful to have your middlemen at the sharp end of exploitation hate and despise the locals, and I realize for them this kind of visceral distain made doing the exploitation easier to bear on their conscience. I suppose I’m wondering how this kind of enmity formed, and how large a barrier this group of people was to any sort of fair or decent treatment of Indians. British rule was ostensibly around to keep indians from murdering each other across religious lines. It made for amusing flashpoints like bengali middle class women clashing with anglo Indian women when it came to legal matters - specifically indian judges who could potentially judge the rape cases of european women after the victoria proclamation. But yes as a whole the entire class skewed conservative except in edge cases.
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Feb 11, 2022 15:34
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Frosted Flake posted:And of course, look at the consequences for India! More than anything, the fall of Singapore sent shockwaves through the British Indian Army. I know someone said earlier that the army of the Raj with Sahib and Subedar was lost in Flanders, and I agree, but after Singapore the great British Indian Army was a shadow of itself until Imphal and Kohima, and the army that won those battles was a very different one. Proud, courageous, probably the best Indian army ever under arms, but no longer a politically reliable one, and of course, why would they be? By the time the British built up an Indian Navy worthy of the name, it mutinied, and it was right to do so. Well the entire reason the BIA existed in the shape it did was to prevent a 1857 again. The moment British intelligence realised how deep the leftist infiltration into their precious armed forces had been the glory of empire and it's profits was up. The Royal Indian Navy didn't just revolt over bad food. They raised the red flag and ran around bombay with photos of Lenin and SC Bose, demanded that the british remove their compatriots from places like egypt and indonesia. The revolt wasn't put down by loyal soldiers but whatever British Units they could scramble to put it down. It doesn't matter that the army was a significantly better fighting force than it was in 1939. What mattered was the huge number of non martial race soldiers who were going around reading passages from the communist manifesto to the men under their control.
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Feb 11, 2022 19:00
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i say swears online posted:the portuguese eventually realized brazil was way neater than their peripheral shithole so the upper class just packed up and moved across the atlantic. the uk was too stupid and proud and inbred, rip The UK was significantly more industrialized than lets say portugal and the jool in the UK's crown wasn't a settler colony.
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Feb 11, 2022 21:43
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So what you are saying is that the US needs to make the shields from dune.
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Feb 18, 2022 00:13
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Well he was a career soldier.
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Feb 18, 2022 00:37
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Frosted Flake posted:What’s funny, and I know you eluded to is, this already happened! What was the issue with Pershings in Korea? Its better known that the Pershing derivative Pattons got penetrated by Centurions a bunch of times in the Indo-Pak wars with the blame being placed on tank tactics by the user while the US technical inspection was more circumspect. Chawinda and Asal Uttar caused huge amounts of attrition and created a cool tank graveyard but that was it.
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Feb 18, 2022 14:58
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Hey isn't this one of the gags from Robocop 2?
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Feb 18, 2022 15:40
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Memes aside how did the Abrams fare in Iraq? Any good reading about it would be interesting. All I know is that 1. The Abrams is Invincible to RPG fire 2. It guzzles a lot more fuel than anything else.
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Feb 18, 2022 17:54
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So you are saying that AFV operators in the US wear furry undergarments as part of their combat gear?
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Feb 18, 2022 18:20
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Frosted Flake posted:Looks like the AGS turret was already kicking around. I think they could have made MGS work if they treated it like a Gun Motor Carriage or those German halftracks, but any design that requires a furry cooling vest is a failure. German halftracks with those HE guns on them were the furry cooling vests of the second world war. Stugs were the functional underwear.
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Feb 20, 2022 03:13
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Gas Masks with Juul pods attached.
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Feb 23, 2022 20:35
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When was the last time australia used tanks in war anyway?
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Feb 27, 2022 05:01
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Mantis42 posted:Why would you use [ code ] instead of [ quote ]? He is a putinbot.
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Feb 28, 2022 00:52
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I almost got to the jet planes a long time ago before realising my planes were all british.
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Mar 20, 2022 15:23
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Stairmaster posted:theres also a huge chinese fandom for the hoi4 post-axis victory cold war mod the new order. lots of long yun hype any game with modding by definition will have a huge chinese fandom because of the large market and necessary translation. Its not just HOI.
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Apr 27, 2022 09:27
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Man that architect was either really subversive or really loving dumb.
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May 16, 2022 01:42
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they might as well be targets for emplaced atgms.
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Jul 15, 2022 17:14
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indigi posted:that drat 70/30 rule If FDR hadn't blown his gasket that would probably have happened.
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Jul 31, 2022 04:33
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indigi posted:I don’t think it would have outlasted Eisenhower in any case. and I bet Mcarthyism still happens Things like that have their own momentum.
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Jul 31, 2022 12:00
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Palladium posted:ain't doing so hot = having eastern ukraine in the bag and have western powers shoot themselves in the foot over sanctions Yeah, the PLA is the same army that it was in Korea.
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Jul 31, 2022 12:01
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Can I get some sources on the industrial production stuff? I want to slack off at work tomorrow.
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Jul 31, 2022 13:43
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Pryor on Fire posted:You believe Japanese colonialism was trying to be productive? And the problem with their plan was that they used kid gloves and maybe would’ve won if they killed more? What? I always thought that korea was a major source of rice and raw materials for japan and necessity forced the japanese to coopt local landlords into making stuff like agriculture and industry more productive.
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Aug 1, 2022 08:37
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tazjin posted:There were reports a few months ago of PLA soldiers secretly embedding with Russian Allied forces to witness some real-life street fighting in Ukraine; never heard anything more about that, wonder if it was true. The PLA gets plenty of XP getting into shoving matches with the Indian Army at high altitude or alternatively exchanging cigarettes. Rutibex posted:so basically the western world has been desperately trying to prevent an Asian empire from becoming a peer for the last century. by stalling out Japan and kicking the can we have given China free reign. Raising the big alarm about yellow races became a thing immediately after the first sino japanese war and began reaching a fever pitch afterwards. There were plenty of riots in the PNW on both the US and american side.
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Aug 1, 2022 11:14
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Thats true in terms of military spending.
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Aug 6, 2022 12:29
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lmao, do they want a repeat of the japanese attack on tsingtao concession?
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Aug 7, 2022 16:10
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Frosted Flake posted:lol as much as talking to Brits about the Scots Greys and Aussies about the Light Horse is annoying, the American cavalry tradition is the plains wars and then stuff like that so, I’ll take upper class twits in jodhpurs talking about their grandfather’s time in the Bengal Lancers any day. They were doing similar stuff my mans.
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Aug 12, 2022 02:22
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US culture generally tends to glorify the glamorous bits of imperialism too much. The 30s did have a decent amount of major raj films shot by hollywood with characters that would make their contemporaries in the british film industry blush. By the 80s the US had advanced to the place the UK was in the 30s.
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Aug 12, 2022 02:33
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Weka posted:How many genocides did the British do in India? Half a dozen or a dozen at a wild guess? Chicken feed in comparison. A mass famine every decade. The difference between Native americans/Red Indians and the Indian Indians was that there were no exotic diseases introduced which destabilized society to the core. British Tax collection was turning the mughal zamindari system into full fledged tax farming and short term profix maximization. The one famine the british managed to prevent, they complained that profits were too low and returned to the older system. Tankbuster has issued a correction as of 13:53 on Aug 12, 2022 |
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Aug 12, 2022 13:49
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tbf nepal was an independent country, and the UK has a brigade's worth of gurkha soldiers currently.
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Sep 20, 2022 10:07
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