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Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

Note to self: This one's the good one



I still think Kinetic Melee has some serious Real rear end Potential with the second wave of ATO sets. On a Stalker you're looking at pretty insane synergy with the Assassin's Strike proccing Hide for a guaranteed follow up crit, the tier 9 recharging Build Up on a crit, and the second Stalker proc recharging Build Up in whatever other power you wanna throw that in.

Put a Gaussian's proc in Build Up and reap the rewards of that double Build Up life.

You could do something similar for a Scrapper as well, keeping Power Siphon and the stacking damage buff going constantly, but I dunno if that makes up for the loss of Assassin's Strike.

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Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

Note to self: This one's the good one



Songbearer posted:

bury me under aegia leaves

Time to go run Whirlwind in the GAHBAGE

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

Note to self: This one's the good one



Milkfred E. Moore posted:

Yeah, it feels like the big thing CoX is missing is a CO-esque Power Armor powerset.

CO also had like, generic Sorcery powers too. I forget if they ever had staffs or wands or anything, but I feel like that's a big omission in CoH.

Getting friends to come try CoH who never did before has been a lot of fun, but it's actually pretty eye-opening when they ask if they can make something like characters they like and there's no good option. Meanwhile, take Kinetics: high-concept as gently caress, crazy good, but I try to think of someone who actually has that ability and I've got like... Sebastian Shaw? Sorta? Not really? And that's about it. And then a lot of really "broad use" powers like Assault Rifle or Broadsword or whatever end up being outclassed.

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

Note to self: This one's the good one



spectralent posted:

My memory of it is that enemies sometimes run away if they realise they're in a bad spot (such as a ranged enemy in melee) or if they know they're standing in the fire (they're very likely to realise they're standing in the actual fires).

I think there are some other more general conditions as well, like annihilating a pack with one AOE making the remaining ones more likely to run away.

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

Note to self: This one's the good one



hit button posted:

I presume that's a change specifically for the test server for ease of testing, rather than something they intend to implement on the main servers.

You can just grant yourself a patron badge on their beta servers. Seems pretty intended to me.

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

Note to self: This one's the good one



tooterfish posted:

They're not more valuable in longer recharge powers, they're exactly as valuable. Although with long recharge you can control when they trigger to some extent, which is handy for certain things (gaussian's build up for example).

Global recharge isn't factored into the proc calculations, which is what lets you cheat them so much. Powers with longer base recharges would see a lot more benefit that way, since they're getting more of a "tangible" reduction in recharge time. It's why the Gaussian's example is great for Build Up, since you're cheating the 1 PPM into a power that fires every 30 seconds.

Also, to look at the original question, AOEs also aren't a bad choice, but it can vary a lot based on the proc.

To take a pair of examples for Foot Stomp, with 3 recharge IOs (99% recharge) shoved into it. This gives it a 10s recharge time, and with a fair amount of global recharge, you can get it to 5s.

Force Feedback +Recharge has a proc rate of 2 PPM, which gives it a 12% proc chance per target. Against 10 targets, odds are it fires once, which is fine since it can't stack with itself.

Obliteration's damage proc has 3.5 PPM, giving it a 21% proc chance per target. Against 10 targets, odds are it fires twice. That's 140~ extra damage per cast, but in a mass AOE scenario you probably won't notice it much.

In any case, procs work decently in AOE powers, assuming you're hitting as many dudes as they allow you to. Having to come up with them against single targets will penalize your chances pretty heavily, though. To reuse the Force Feedback in Foot Stomp comparison, the same slotting in Knockout Blow would get you a 50% chance to proc it, versus that 12% from Foot Stomp. The Oblit proc jumps to 86% in KO Blow versus FS's 21%.

This has basically been a PSA for "hey Force Feedback's pretty good in AOEs."

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

Note to self: This one's the good one



My favorite thing about Mayhems remains boxes making other boxes explode into a chain reaction of box explosions.

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

Note to self: This one's the good one



Hakarne posted:

This is fantastic info, thanks. Where are you getting all the PPM numbers from?

Edit: Also, for the force feedback proc... does that proc work on powers that are already on cooldown? So like if I slot it in Carrion Creepers and it procs 2-3 times after I cast it will the recharge buff apply to Carrion Creepers AND my other powers (e.g. Hasten)?

If so holy gently caress BRB slotting for easy perma hasten and carrion creepers

Edit edit: And does each proc have a chance to fire separately or is it all shared?

I love learning this poo poo

The PPM values are on the enhancements themselves in-game. I don't think the proc chance values in Pines are accurate (either that or I don't know how to read them.)

The formulas to figure out the exact chances are kinda hosed, but:

Percent chance to fire = PPM*(enhanced recharge time + activation time)/(60*area factor)

Area factor = 1+radius*(11*arc+540)/30000

Special notes being that an AOE's arc is 360, and a cone's radius is the power's range (this might be different for melee cones? Not super sure.) Enhanced recharge time is purely with enhancements, which you can see in your enhancement window for an accurate number.

Force Feedback's proc is 100% global recharge for 5 seconds. Doesn't stack, and more applications won't refresh the duration. I'm not 100% sure on this since Carrion Creepers is a weird power, but my understanding is that since Creepers are a pet, the pet would be the one to benefit from the proc... and pet attacks don't benefit from recharge at all, so that'd be worthless. In general, I know Creepers are one of those powers like Caltrops that used to be really good with tons of procs but got nerfed quite a while ago, but I haven't done any testing to see how it works now. Pseudo-pets are very confusing in general when it comes to procs and how they behave, and Creepers is a pseudopet that summons more pseudopets so who the gently caress knows. I haven't found many hard rules on how that stuff works.

And, multiple procs in the same power would roll separate rolls since they all have unique PPM calculations. In the case of regular pets, each pet ability that's applicable for the proc would have its own calculation. This makes them pretty good in tier 1 MM pets, or Fire Imps, for example, since you get 3 entities that can proc it with every one of their attacks. For Ninjas, it can also mean great utility: Overwhelming Force KB to KD would convert all of a Genin's knockback powers to knockdown, and make every other attack of theirs also have a chance to proc KDs for a lot of soft control.

Abroham Lincoln fucked around with this message at 01:11 on Jun 4, 2019

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

Note to self: This one's the good one



Nonexistence posted:

Also, is LRM Rocket with instasnipe as funny as I hope it is?

I think that's one people brought up since it doesn't seem changed. Hopefully it does, cause Munitions Mastery is hot garbage in general.

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

Note to self: This one's the good one



TalonDemonKing posted:

I missed my chance to ask about procs a few pages back, so I'm going to ask here: What kind of stuff should I be slotting the Brute's ATO procs in?

The regen/end discount one only stacks to 5, lasts a while, and goes off pretty often, so you can pretty much throw that in anything as long as you're using it reasonably often. The Fury proc doesn't have any PPM listed so I've just been using it in my tier 2 attack since I also use that pretty frequently.

Crasical posted:

What's the best blaster primary to use if I want to enter redraw hell as a /Ninja blaster? Dual Pistols, Assault Rifle, or Archery?

In general, I think Archery is the best of that lot, but only since Rain of Arrows is real good. Dual Pistols' would put you close up more often, so maybe there's probably better synergy there with the sword attacks. Just make sure to actually pick the No Redraw options unless you really hate yourself. :v:

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

Note to self: This one's the good one



Brave New World posted:

You just reminded me about something I had completely forgotten about. Near the end, we had a ton of recipes for limited use stuff like guns and baseball bats. Are those even a thing on Homecoming? I haven't seen a single one drop yet. If they're available, you could keep remaking those guns whenever you use one up.

Yeah, all the craftable temp powers are on the P2W vendor. Most of them are pretty poo poo, but you've got stuff like the venom dagger that kills regen so you can solo AVs, or just jetpacks and things to get around.

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

Note to self: This one's the good one



SolidSnakesBandana posted:

I just got a Logitech G600 for $30 on Amazon. This is my first gaming mouse, anyone have any clever ideas for what to do with all these buttons? Sorry if this seems like an ad.

Using them for the Mastermind keybinds seems like a pretty decent idea.

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

Note to self: This one's the good one



World Famous W posted:

In base building, is it possible to fully remove the ceiling and what do the Skies FXs do (doesn't appear to be anything)

Trying to make an outdoor garden.

The highest ceilings have an option for Open Sky, yeah. The FX options are either placeable items to change the skybox for the area it encompasses (with the big green box), or the ones on the Option button to set it for the entire base map.

If you enable room clipping, you can also just use the open sky option to fly above the room and start building things above or below the room. For that, I'd recommend floating something really big, like the largest tile surface, and using that as your foundation to build off of.

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

Note to self: This one's the good one



Tommy 2.0 posted:

Spines comes with the stipulation it stops dead once a boss or higher shows up. I honestly don't get the spines/x love.

It's real good at that there farming and can do it on its own 2-50.

Claws is alright with it too, but it doesn't have that second damage aura.

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

Note to self: This one's the good one



Thundarr posted:

Is the alpha slot damage buff worthwhile for a beam rifle defender if I've already got all my buffs on perma, don't have consistent holds (but when a hold does land it lasts basically forever), have no problem hitting things, and already have as much endurance as I could ever hope to need? None of the other alpha slot buffs really seem to apply in my case.

According to the incarnate guide in the old thread, Incarnate Threads can be used to make the alpha slot stuff that you normally use Incarnate Shards for, but I can't find where in the menus to do that? They only seem to convert to mats for the 2nd tier of slots.

What primary set are you running? Defenders suffer from the same logic as Brutes where Musculature isn't quite as potent (even worse than Brutes - 0.65 ranged versus a Brute's 0.75 melee modifiers.) Some of the radial paths on the alphas might have multiple benefits that could help out, but. If there's really really nothing else, Musculature is still an okay pick. It'll increase your Lore pets and Judgment damage, so there's always that!

And all the alpha slot abilities can be crafted using shards or threads, you just have to scroll down on the creation menu to see the threads option.

The only time I would use shards is for the alpha tier 4s, though. If you run a Weekly Strike Target you'll get a Notice of the Well. Put two of those together for a Favor of the Well, and you'll only need around 50 shards or so for the whole deal.

Abroham Lincoln fucked around with this message at 20:33 on Jun 9, 2019

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

Note to self: This one's the good one



Yeah, Time has a big variety on effects so one of the radial paths will probably wind up being better suited. You may want even more recharge to get permanent Chrono Boost and Hasten if you don't have that already, so Spiritual looks okay for that. Musculature and Intuition's radial paths both boost damage and a pretty big variety of Time's other debuff effects, so I think both of those are worth looking at as well.

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

Note to self: This one's the good one



LordSaturn posted:

are damage auras more effective at aggroing mobs than non-damage negative auras?

Depends on a few things. Tanks and Brutes both have a taunt component built into their damage powers, and both generate more threat than other ATs. Taunt duration also plays into how strong it is. A regular Tank/Brute damage power, including their auras, is mag4 taunt, for 13.6s. Scrappers in particular have no taunt component on their powers, and have weaker taunt effects on their auras and just in general. Debuff effects will also increase threat even if they don't specifically have a taunt effect on the power.

For specific auras, Willpower's is really weak as a taunt aura, while Shield and Invuln are extra strong (and Shield wins out for having a debuff effect.) I think everything else is pretty standardized for taunt effects to match an any other attack from a Tank/Brute. For best results, use a set like Bio or Dark or Ice with multiple auras to make things be your best friend forever.

Hakarne posted:

Speaking of shield is it really better on a scrapper (or tanker) as opposed to a Brute? I saw a thread on reddit I think that said Shield Charge is wonky and actually uses an invisible pseudopet to do damage and therefore doesn't benefit from Fury or damage modifiers as well on Brute.

I have no idea if that's total bullshit or not though :shrug:

That part is true, yeah. Pseudopet damage caps lower than a Brute can get to, and the +dmg on a Brute from AAO is less valuable in general.

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

Note to self: This one's the good one



Do the base hospitals still work? I remember trying it and it being one of the ones that said it still needed power, but even powered it didn't seem to do anything.

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

Note to self: This one's the good one



Hakarne posted:

So my kid (7) wants to play this but COH can be a bit... complicated. What would be a good, simple AT for them to follow me around with? I'll be on a Brute so probably something ranged, but hardy (literally as I type this sentinel pops into my head). Something with flashy/fun damage, survivable, and maybe a few useful heals/buffs/debuffs for when I PL it for them.

Any suggestions? I'll run a few suggestions by them so they can "choose" their powers.

I would try and gently guide them but still ultimately let them pick. I think encouraging creativity and letting them go with what sounds cool is probably the best route.

That said, Brute if they wanna punch stuff and Sentinel if they wanna shoot stuff I think are both good choices. It'd probably be hell for you, but Energy Blast on a Sentinel sounds like it'd fit the bill for flashy and silly since knocking poo poo all over the place is good stuff. I think Water Blast has some really cool looking effects, too.

I dunno how well versed in computer games they are, but Mastermind could maaaaybe be an okay idea if they seem really interested in it. If they're still struggling with the controls and all that, having minions that are mostly autopiloted could still help them feel useful, but it might be too boring or too indirect if they do have a good handle on it, or they just aren't interested in that support/management role.

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

Note to self: This one's the good one



Harrow posted:

Honestly I think it'd make more sense if it worked as you described and the AH really did automatically attune IOs. As it stands, it's just that each set IO listed on the AH goes into a common pool and its level (or whether it's attuned) is determined when someone buys it. That this applies to attuned IOs as well as normal leveled ones may or may not be intended, I dunno. I'm fine with the effect it has on the game, but it does feel weird that you can basically waste influence buying level 50 IOs when you could've gotten them attuned for free if you just knew the trick.

The difference being that you can't apply boosters to attuned IOs, so there is actually a use case for non-attuned IOs if you're underslotting a power to go a bit crazier on min-maxing (also because you never wanna attune PvP or Purple IOs.)

That's also especially relevant for sets that cap out sub-50 but still have good set bonuses, and you'd want to boost them to just get more value.

Arguably the default behavior should be to attune them and you'd have to specify if you want regular ones, but I'm guessing something that impacts the game that much isn't an easy change to make.

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

Note to self: This one's the good one



LordSaturn posted:

and tankers, because tankers don't give a gently caress about dealing more damage

Honestly I was real excited to make Staff work on a Tanker but the damage was so abysmally low that it just took ages to solo anything. I was around level 24 or so before I gave up with it, since even with IOs my Sands of Mu was doing more damage than my actual attacks.

I guess it'd be okay if you never planned on soloing anything. The extra reach and AOE was nice for keeping things aggroed, but my next Tanker attempt was Ice/Ice and everything sticks to me like glue and the damage feels much better.

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

Note to self: This one's the good one



metasynthetic posted:

Is it possible to make a reasonable (say, 80%+ performance) elec armor farmer vs fire? The only fire armor concept I have that I like probably wouldn't be great at it where a rad / elec brute sounds kinda fun thematically.

/Elec can do alright, but the big deals on /Fire are Burn and Fiery Embrace and there's no real comparing it to anything else. I'm sure someone with more farming experience could speak to it better, but I feel like the next closest non /Fire options are maybe only around 50% if I had to put a number to it.

Rad/ would also be a late bloomer for doing it so you wouldn't be doing it from level 1, but you'd have a good all-arounder on your hands anyway.

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

Note to self: This one's the good one



Merilan posted:

could you make Repel great by slotting KB to KD on it

I wouldn't say great, but it'd be less poo poo? You'd still have to be really up close to anything to make it work and it'd be constantly sapping your endurance on top of the toggle's gigantic end cost as it is, and both of those are probably things you don't want.

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

Note to self: This one's the good one



Crasical posted:

I'd been given to understand that disabling inspiration drops other than X doesn't actually mean X drops more often, just that it blocks every drop but the one you selected. IE; if it determines you'd roll a green, you instead just get nothing instead.
It seems like an inspiration conversion macro (or just disabling Awaken inspirations and eating the candy as it drops) would be a better option.

That is true, yeah. I think the team inspirations and dual inspirations work the same way; they don't add any additional chances for things to drop, they're just added to their pools. ie, enabling team and dual inspirations would make it so dual or team dual purple+oranges have a chance to drop whenever a purple or orange is slated to drop. Disabling just oranges means you disable dual and team dual purple+oranges, but you'd still have team purples.

fwiw I just disable awakens and break frees and mash insps every so often. I could do a combine macro to be more efficient, but I like having the dual and team inspirations on and you can't combine those.

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

Note to self: This one's the good one



Freakazoid_ posted:

I would like to see a list of the most popular builds and a breakdown why they are.

Count me is as one of those blaster haters because they used to be squishy. I still made one but he's group only, just in case.

I can cover a couple, though maybe some others would wanna chime in and mention ones I forgot or I don't know as much about. It's not exactly scientific and not all of them are insanely popular anymore, but mostly just standouts that I remember.

Ice/Fire Blaster: gently caress off amounts of AOE. Blizzard is lowkey the highest damage nuke out there. Burn is insane. You've got plenty of other AOE attacks to cycle through, and a good amount of control that comes in Ice. You can pick up Mace or Cold mastery to softcap yourself to smashing/lethal without too much trouble.

Fire/Kin Controller: one of the classic farming builds, though I'm not sure how it measures up to the modern superstars. Fire is a very offensive control set, with a spammable AOE immob to help set up for the Controller's inherent double damage against CC'd targets. Hot Feet, Bonfire, and Fire Imps are all stars for damage. Kinetics is independently insanely good, but the idea being that you damage cap yourself and your lovely little imps as they run through everything like buzzsaws. Ice Mastery gives you more AOE and a way to softcap smashing/lethal.

Illusion/Rad Controller: premier AV and GM soloing machine of yore. Phantom Army is the real culprit here, summoning 3 invincible tanks that taunt everything for a set duration. You need a ton of recharge to make them permanent, but between your invulnerable army and Radiation's huge debuff potential, it lets you whittle down anything you want.

Dark/Dark/Dark Defender: D3s aren't really huge these days anymore, but I feel like it's still somewhat noteworthy. Dark Miasma is ridiculous and controller-lite territory, while you're also debuffing the tohit rates of enemies through the floor. Soul Drain in the APP lets you keep your damage up, all your attacks debuff tohit even more. It's just really solid, even if Defenders can feel outclassed by other ATs at times.

Titan/Bio Scrapper: most likely the top single target damage in the game, and pretty good AOE to boot. Needs copious amounts of recharge to make its attack chain function at that level, lots of ways to deal with endurance, and is a pretty significant late bloomer. Dubiously one of the more "skill intensive" sets since missing attacks means nothing out of the Momentum mechanic and you have to improvise. Bio is independently insane, and its Offensive adaption hurts your resists while boosting the Scrapper's already high damage and adding a global toxic proc, plus debuffing resists (along with -res procs in Titan's attacks.) Defenses are fairly reactive, but you can still hit some defense softcaps and plug up any endurance issues easily.

Electric/Shield Scrapper: super fun on a Scrapper, possibly even better on a Stalker. Lots of AOE goodness, though the ST damage lacks a bit (which is why the Stalker version looks even greater.) Shield pretty easily softcaps positional defenses and provides tons and tons of offensive utility with a stacking damage boost on its taunt aura, and Shield Charge. Plus you get to teleport around like an idiot.

Spines/Fire Brute: also Super Strength was very strong in this combo, too. Really, most things and /Fire will do you good. The strength is really in Fiery Embrace and Burn, with the double damage auras and Spines' AOE and Cones doing good work too. For Super Strength, it's double stacking rage with Footstomp and the Force Feedback proc making your poo poo recharge real fast. Primarily these excel at farming, but they can be built for general purposes, though Spines lacks a lot against single strong targets.

Street Justice/anything Stalker: pretty strong contender for one of the top single target melee sets before Titan Weapons came along. Still a deal more accessible than it. Combo system plays nice with the innate one that works with Assassin's Strike, and it just tears through tough targets real fast. Secondary isn't so important here, but something with endurance management or extra recharge could help. Bio or Energy Aura are my own recommendations.

Bots/Traps or Rad or Time or Cold or something Mastermind: also a good contender for a strong AV/GM killer. Bots have some innate -regen in their attacks, and come pretty sturdy. Any of the mentioned secondaries pack some amount of -regen and some help for keeping the robots alive.

Fire/Time/Soul Corruptor: kitted out, its pretty disgusting. Very solid all arounder, using Fire's strong AOE and single target plus Time's grab bag of good poo poo to keep alive. You use Power Boost with Far Sight to dramatically boost its defense for the whole duration, Hasten and Chrono Boost to keep each other permanent and providing oodles of recharge, and you've just got a package that's bringing damage, support, control, and is pretty sturdy to boot. Can be pretty high maintenance, but the reward is good.

Plant/Fire Dominator: plant is a very solid control set. A big cone confuse that's up for every pack, Carrion Creepers being this weird everything-at-once power, a pet, and good damage in its AOE immobilize. Fire brings lots of damage with a Fiery Embrace power and strong single target, with just a bit of AOE. Your ancillary choice can either add more fire AOE if you wanna live on the edge, or Ice for softcapping defense and a still solid amount of AOE.

Fire/Psi Dominator: for the same reasons Fire is good on Controllers, it's good here. Psionic Assault offers pretty good single target damage, along with Psionic Shockwave as a solid AOE and Drain Psyche as a huuuuge boost to your survivability. Seriously, that power is dumb. Mix with an APP of your choice (probably Ice because the Dom version is probably the best APP in the whole game) and you're set.

That's about all the prolific meme-y ones I know about from the base ATs. Nobody plays Peacebringers, Warshades have a good triform "MFing Warshade" that you can google. Soldiers have some good build variety, though I think Widows are narrower with their useful powers. I don't know enough about Sentinel to say what's great or not, other than it having the best version of more than a few blast sets by virtue of its (slight) redesigns on them.

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

Note to self: This one's the good one



Remora posted:

Hey, so - what would people say the top 4 MM primaries are? I seem to remember that Thugs and Bots are the top two?

Thugs are very high damage and mild defense from their own pet-leadership, Demons are a good all-around mix of damage, survivability and control-y/debuff effects, and Robots make sturdy AV/GM killers but have lower than average damage.

The fourth is kinda hard to qualify. I think Ninjas have the highest damage potential, but their suicidal melee tendencies make it hard to pull off. I've heard stories of people using KB to KB IOs to make them strong soft-control machines, but mileage may vary. I don't know poo poo about Beasts other than "hey maybe they have high potential too" but I think it's even harder to pull off than Ninjas. Necro and Mercs both feel decidedly :mediocre: but Necro has a bit of control-y stuff to it that I think makes it pull a little ahead.

Remora posted:

Just a few discussion questions before I go to bed, because I'm debating secondaries now.

I can't really speak on Empathy or Pain (though I think they're both below average), but I think Pain might be a somewhat better idea for a MM? Empathy's big selling points are a regen and recovery aura, both of which I don't think are gonna help low HP minions much. Pain exchanges that for some +dmg effects which will probably work better.

Sonic, Storm and Kinetics are all pretty fun. Sonic I believe works better for something with melee minions, since it has a -res aura you put on an ally. Storm is a late bloomer and requires a fair amount of finesse, so maybe not great on a first outing, but the control-y effects are potent in the right hands. Kinetics is absurdly strong, though Speed Boost's extra recharge won't help your pets at all. For Robots specifically, I might recommend /Dark, /Time, or /Traps instead, though I think Storm could be pretty fun with them too.

Time is also very independently good and I think it works well with anything, Mercs included.

And the only total garbage secondary (at least in my opinion) is /Poison, but even then it's still not that bad. Anything else will probably serve you better, though.

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

Note to self: This one's the good one



HPanda posted:

It's too bad the game didn't survive to the Antman movie. We totally could have gotten a size-based power set.

People were asking for Mr. Fantastic stretching and size changing sets since about day 1. The engine isn't built for the former, and the latter goes from "yeah that's totally doable" to staring in horror at the hundreds of indoor mission maps and narrow environments.

Cheeseman posted:

I could have sworn someone posted a link to updated vidiot maps here in the thread, but alas, I must be blind because I can't find it.

Anyone have the link?

This has the originals and the issue 25 update.

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

Note to self: This one's the good one



Inzombiac posted:

The CoT Lasher (?) has a stretchy tongue power. It doesn't look great but they were trying it out.

Yeah, there's a lot you can "fake" with cool animations/FX when the model is static, but it just crumples when you have to factor in body sizes and costume pieces and everything.

I was always disappointed we never got a good "blur" trail like Synapse has, but once I did the Who Will Die part 1 on a villain I remembered that Synapse's blur effect is faked in similar fashion and made specifically for his costume's colors and pattern.

Gynovore posted:

The engine can't handle huge players either. One time, a GM was changing a bunch of players into different models. When he made us into the Avatar of Hamidon, the camera was inside the model unless zoomed really far out, and the model jumped around like crazy when not on level ground.

Yeah, I think the most viable increase is like, up to 10-12 feet or so? Roughly? Which isn't that impressive for a powerset and may as well just get added back to the character creator.

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

Note to self: This one's the good one



Harrow posted:

So what's everyone's take on Tankers?

I've been considering making a Tanker but it seems like there's a general idea that they fall off terribly in usefulness at max level/once IO sets let Brutes tank just as well while doing a lot more damage. Are Tankers still useful or should I just go Scrapper or Brute instead?

I think they're fun enough in the sense that playing any AT is pretty fun. You get to be a walking, talking indestructible brick! ... that will slowly whittle away everything. It depends on your secondary set, but some of them feel the lessened damage more than others (ie, /Staff, which I will never do ever again.)

For the most part, I think they do pretty well on either extreme end. For low level play, I think they work out better as their initial group role of "being a tank" better than Brutes will. And at the very high end, for being a tank in a Hami raid or incarnate trial, I think they do their work far more reliably since not every Brute is going to be necessarily equipped on their own to handle the poo poo that a Tanker can. The difference being, if you just buff the poo poo out of a Brute, well, yeah. They're sorta better in nearly every way, then, and the delta isn't so enormous as it probably ought to be.

It's one of those ATs that I think could have used some evaluation near the end of the game's life to find itself more of a niche or some other kind of benefit that it could bring. But that's all kinda looking at it at the high end, and I think the average group is still gonna like that assurance of having a super sturdy and reliable tank. I know I definitely relax when I realize there are tanks in iTrials and my Brute gets to take it easy. :v:

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

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hup posted:

Energy melee sucks, right? Can it not suck?

iirc it used to be great (like Regen) and got the Regen treatment (like Regen.)

I'm sure at some level it's serviceable but I don't think there's too many upsides I'd recommend it for.

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

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I AM THE MOON posted:

also hear me out Dual Pistol Stalker where it's all just emptying your guns into people point blank+pistol whipping. Executioner's Shot would be the Assassin's Strike it would be cool as gently caress

We're finally free of the old devs and their "GUNS CAN'T BE SHORT RANGE" weird poo poo and all their other bizarre design biases, so may as well go even further.

Titan Weapons Stalkers? gently caress, why not. Super Strength on Scrappers? Just nerf Rage! Energy Melee as a good powerset? We have the technology!

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

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Hakarne posted:

Hey thanks for this. Didn’t i24 do a balance pass so the pets are mostly equal? I'm torn between warworks, arachnos, longbow, and rikti. Are any of those poo poo or substantially better now?

I don't thiiiink so? The only i24 notes on it I could find were that they added more types, and i25 added another variety too.

Paragon Wiki has some DPS test results, though there may be a more recent source for test results.

Also Banished Pantheon deserve a special mention, since their immortal support one has a solid recharge/endurance buff, and I think is the only immortal pet that actually has attacks with an AOE rain power that debuffs damage. Real good fire farm pick.

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

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Hakarne posted:

Yeah it actually says on the source page that those are out of date and links to a forum post saying they did a balance pass. So they should be closer together.

https://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Lore_Slot_Abilities/Otiosus

Edit: ^^ Yeah what he said.

The original data is out of date, though the one from my link was slightly more current (the sub-page data was from July of the previous year, the dev post is from March, and the main page's charts were from May.)

If issue 24 or the SCORE team did a bunch of rebalancing though then I really don't have a clue what changed. The only documented notes I saw were that they fixed some of the pets not ignoring recharge buffs. :shrug:

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

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Nehru the Damaja posted:

I don't know anything about anything but it's slightly disappointing that blasters best incarnate options seem to be damage oriented, other than with Interface. I guess that matters for trials, but it'd be neat to get more tools and tricks and nuance rather than just big numbers.

People talk about “best” in a min-max sense because it’s what they’re interested in or find fun. Getting weird with builds is cool too, if that’s what you wanna do.

For incarnate stuff, the radial paths tend to give more variety. Judgment powers can have some CC or debuffs on them, Interface has some variety, Destiny is your pick on buffs, but I think Hybrid in particular sounds like what you’re looking for? There’s a branch that makes your powers all proc CC, one that helps you stand up in melee range, or one for bringing more support for your team.

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

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clone on the phone posted:

Yeah I was just hoping there were some resources with recommendations etc rather than just “figure it out for yourself “ and if you stuff it up you’re out the cost of a respec and the IOs you bought/crafted because they were wrong/bad/didn’t do what you wanted.

I guess I will just figure it out! I have pines, so I’ll just have to get used to that.

Giving recommendations in a broad sense is really hard because the build variety is just so wide. Most things are specific to powerset combinations, but then you've also got whatever pools you wanna take, APPs, and incarnate stuff, and all of that's gonna vary on concept and what goals you have for the character. It can also vary a lot in terms of price: for some people, building with purple sets is pretty standard, and for others paying like 20 million for a single enhancement is just fuckin bonkers. Playing with a character builder a lot is generally the easiest solution. Even for builds I've put together, I end up going back and retooling things a few times once I get fresh eyes on it.

I think a good place to start for Pines is just building out what you'd want, and then looking at the sets you can use with those powers. Swap out picks you're flexible on and look at more sets that way. In a very very broad sense, people try to build for softcapped defense (the 45% mark) for whatever types are reasonable for them, lots of recharge to keep Hasten permanent or close to it, and enough endurance to maintain their poo poo. For ATs with native defense, this can be a big variety, but for ones without any sorts (like Blasters!), most people go for smashing/lethal bonuses. Powers that take Resist sets are good for the two unique enhancements that give 3% defense to everything each. Defense powers themselves are great for recharge with the 7.5% recharge from Luck of the Gambler in just one enhancement.

Just keep in mind that some enhancements are unique (Pines will yell at you for trying to slot multiples of those) and you can only benefit from 5 of an identical set bonus at a time (LotG's 7.5% is separate from the generic 7.5% recharge.)

Since you mentioned Fortunata specifically, I have an older and only sorta expensive build saved if you wanted something to look at and modify.

e: also, Pines has a display bug for Widows where it always shows the Hidden damage for attacks so they seem a lot more nuts than they really are.

Abroham Lincoln fucked around with this message at 08:13 on Jun 28, 2019

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

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Inzombiac posted:

I screwed around on an Archery Blaster long enough to think that Devices may be a better pair than Tactical Arrow.

If only for Field Agent. Can anyone comment on this?

All the Blaster secondaries get a sustain power of some kind, and Tactical Arrow's is pretty good. Overall I think the set is honestly fantastic - it's Trick Arrow But Better (And On A Blaster.)

I don't gently caress with Blasters too much but I've got a (real expensive) build that I'm really happy with for it.

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

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Inzombiac posted:

If I was hell-bent on making a Dual Blade character, what would be my best bet?

I think it shines best on a Scrapper. The Stalker version has sliiightly better single target, but it loses a good amount of its AOE.

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

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spectralent posted:

Oh, hey, query: If you have an Interface proc, does that work through pets, and if no, man, poor masterminds.

It does, yeah. I believe the Control and Assault Hybrids work through pets as well.

Masterminds initially did get shafted with the incarnate system because of how the level shifts worked, though: in trials, the MM player received the full benefit of the shifts but their pets got rapidly outclassed because their minion/lieutenant pets were still summoned -1 and -2 to them, so they wound up eating poo poo real quick. They eventually baked shifts into their Supremacy inherent so that all their pets start at 50 before level shifts start taking effect.

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

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The weirdest part of CoV to me, at least thinking about it now, is the idea that the villains just... have their own island chain? And the majority of their poo poo takes place there instead?

Like, "oh yeah, the Joker. He doesn't live in Gotham, doesn't do 99% of his crimes in Gotham, kinda doesn't even care about Gotham. But every now and again he shows up to rob a Gotham bank and punch Batman and then goes back to the Bahamas."

It makes absolutely no sense outside of it being easier for a videogame. And even then, that's dubious. How much more mileage could they have gotten out of letting villains share the Paragon zones and using the expansion to just add more? There's some neat poo poo in the Isles' lore and everything, but in retrospect it's a real bizarre choice. Was it all just for PvP? 'cuz man, that's hosed.

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Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

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SimonChris posted:

When CoV was first announced, the marketing material made it sound like the game would be all about building your secret lair and growing your organisation, while pursuing your evil plots. A lot of people were disappointed when it turned out that the lairs/bases were just guild halls, with no real effect on the game play.

I mean, look at this:



This makes it sound like villains were originally supposed to be way more proactive than they ended up being in the final product.

I believe the initial pitch was that you'd join an existing villain organization based on your origin and work up that ladder, so in true Jack Emmert fashion, you were never the star and always the flunkie. :v: The idea basically was replaced by the one universal Arachnos path when they realized it'd be too much work.

I'm guessing similar things happened to the idea of wandering into Paragon City, and everyone already knows how base raids wound up.

And now I will always treasure forever:

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