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So I got some serious family drama going on and I'm hoping you can help me with some context. Long story short: My older brother is in China at the moment with his wife and their two children. They are visiting the wife's parents in Yueyang. (Apparently my brother currently only knows for certain that they are 2-3 car drive from Changsha International Airport). His wife is making his life completely intolerable and is basically maneuvering things to make him look like the villain in order to either make him suffer or to get custody of the children while they are still in China She has physical control of all the paperwork that allowed them entry to china, including passport, travel visa and airline tickets. On her insisting, they haven't bothered with getting Chinese cash for the trip, instead relying entirely on visa cards. As well as her ability to draw cash that she had transferred before traveling, plus use of Chinese apps on her phone. I don't know about their personal finances, but it seems like they have somewhat separate bank accounts. Their tickets are worded such that each parent is accompanied by on child each. Their flight home isn't happening until about a month from now. They traveled on a Chinese airliner and had to show a negative covid test on departure from Denmark. He is unsure if the same is needed upon departure from China, whether those requirements would be based on a national requirement or depending on which airline he chose. He has no clue about his options to change the tickets and still be able to leave with both children, since they were all made through the process of him transferring money to her, which she then used to setup her ticket with one child attached. Then she set up a ticket for him with the other child attached, which he paid for directly. He does have some emails from the airline, regarding the order he paid for directly, to prove that this is in fact, his ticket. He has forwarded copies of the mails he has received from the airline to me, in case you think there is anything of note in there. So what I need from you, is help figuring out the culturally different pressure points that I'm just not seeing as a European living in an entirely different style of nation. Can he get by on just a Visa card? How difficult would it be to draw cash from an ATM? Will he need a money order sent from us back in Scandinavia? How hosed is he regarding getting the kids out of the country? They are Danish born citizens and have as far as I know only got Danish citizenship, but I don't know how much that counts for when their mother is Chinese, they are in China and she is in control of the papers allowing them to be in the country. My mom is...not having the best morning and I've promised I'll deal with all this for her until we can get some more people involved (it is 6.09 am on a Saturday here in Denmark and she is not happy to hear that we should give people a chance to wake up if we want them to be at all useful). I'm up dealing with this poo poo at "wtf time is it even" after having recovered from a seizure just last evening, so if we could skip the shitposting stage and go straight to the "serious effort post" or "only continue this in PM with this particular poster", I'd really appreciate it. Edit: Update: He is NOT in Yueyang, beyond that he still only knows they are 2-3 hours car drive from Changsha International Airport. They are in his wife's parents' apartment (which he has paid for, its the first time he has ever seen the place), but beyond that, he has no loving clue where he is, which is...a bit worrisome. SerthVarnee fucked around with this message at 06:29 on Feb 25, 2023 |
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Feb 25, 2023 06:12
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The oldest child is born in China, the youngest is born in Denmark. They are 8 and 6 years old and I'll need to ask him about their citizenships and which passports they entered the country with.
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Feb 25, 2023 07:20
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Thank you all for the replies, I really appreciate all the help and info I can get at this stage.
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Feb 25, 2023 07:51
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Will he be able to put both children on his own airline ticket? They had to attach one child to each adult ticket and buy each adult ticket separately in order to be in compliance with Visa transaction limits. But that sounds more like a banking issue than a Chinese rules issue, since I'm assuming he meant Visa card and not Tourist Visa paperwork.
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Feb 25, 2023 08:09
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I got no clue why he has things set up the way he does. All I got is the somewhat limited info he sent me in a chain of emails. They've been there for 16 days and she has made his life a living hell from day 1. The simpler we can make this for him the better, cause I have never, ever, experienced him telling me that he is too mentally stressed to look up rules himself. He lives for rules.
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Feb 25, 2023 08:32
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Got an update on where he is: My brother is telling me that he is near: Guo Songtao memorial Foelgende er med stavefejl Bydel eller forstad til changsha ved navn Dje mien far yuan translates to: the following is with typos city-part or suburb of Changsha with the name: Dje mien far yuan Any help narrowing this down to a confirmed area of the map would be appreciated.
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Feb 25, 2023 09:48
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Porfiriato posted:but like, does he not have any phone with any map app whatsoever? He claims that such a feature does not work in China (I know my brother, this means that he can't figure it out, therefore it cannot exist. If it can exist, then it cannot be taught to him by me, specifically, because I'm his younger brother by 9 years and thus cannot know better than him. I've learned to work around this obstacle instead of trying to brute force my way through that).
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Feb 25, 2023 10:41
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This is of course just his side of the story that I'm getting, but she is dumping all the pent up frustration from having lived in Denmark for 11 years, not coping well with the change, feeling cut off from China, raising two children, hearing about her father going to the hospital for regular surgery over a period of...6 months, being unable to go see her parents due to COVID and finally coming to see them just as her mother has to go into two surgeries in a row for something related to her eyes. So there is a lot of pent up frustration coming out now that she is on home turf and my brother got completely blindsided. The frustration has been unleashed on him for 16 days straight so far and he is mentioning that she is making his life absolute hell, taking pains to do so only in English so the parents and kids don't realize its happening. She is sabotaging his internet to gently caress with his ability to work remotely, trying to throw his wallet and keys out of the apartment and is wandering around occasionally saying things like: "why is he still here? I want him gone when I wake up". Now to be charitable to my brother, he absolutely does his utmost to make this work in any way he can. To be a bit more blunt, my brother's ability to handle...uh...anything...regarding emotions is limited to put it mildly. I can't make any clear judgement on what is right or wrong or what they should do. All I can do is help him figure out where he actually is and what travel options are available to him. He has been to China 2 or 3 times before, he is learning Chinese but is not at all near any level of useful beyond asking where the bathroom is. His idea of emotional commitment is usually to be deadpan and materially focused, which means that his wife is having more stimulating emotional conversations with a dead fish. Dude is emotionally stunted and I could have told him this trip would be a mistake, but older brother obviously knows best. If someone can point out a step by step approach to getting these things setup, I'd really appreciate it. SerthVarnee fucked around with this message at 11:01 on Feb 25, 2023 |
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Feb 25, 2023 10:56
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I'd also just like to sincerely thank you for the map coordinates. I've passed them on to him asking him if that looks about right. He and I don't see eye to eye on a lot things, but he is still my brother and I need him back in Denmark so we can keep calling each other childish names and frustrating my mom with our rivalry.
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Feb 25, 2023 11:04
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I'm sorry if I start to sound defensive or argumentative here. I had an epileptic seizure just before going to bed (small seizure at least, but still hosed me up), got 5 hours of very bad sleep and got woken up at 5am by my mom having some serious anxiety over the latest depressing update from my brother. Since then I've been doing amateur detective work for 6 hours with my hanging over my shoulder asking for updates or spinning up theories ever 5-10 seconds.
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Feb 25, 2023 11:08
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He has responded by saying the map location you picked out seems correct, he now vaguely remembers having seen a sign saying dongmao road. He also mentioned he thinks he has heard the name yuhar before. I'm not sure if he is mentioning a new detail I need to search for or confirming with additional knowledge that the suggested location is correct. regarding the entry papers, he says Both children have entered China on Chinese entry permits. The youngest, who was born in Denmark, has NOT entered on Visa in Danish Passport. I got no clue what the gently caress that sentence is supposed to mean. He seems to be of the opinion that there is hope for their relationship once she has had a chance to properly decompress after a whole decade of feeling stifled. Thanks again for your help. I really appreciate it.
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Feb 25, 2023 11:22
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Baddog posted:It's completely disorienting and he's probably not used to being dependent and treated like a child, yep. And it's causing all this marital strife, he's having a meltdown. Not being able to understand what's going on. I mean, try to figure out if he's actually being abused.... But man, doesn't sound like it. He just was not ready at all, hah! he is used to being given the full bore of her emotions, or whatever constitutes full bore when she is half a planet away from her safe zone. He was not expecting this level of poo poo thrown at him. And yeah, he is used to being in control, knowing the rules, abiding all the rules and planning with the expectation of the rules being set in stone. He does not deal well with feeling helpless and she is most likely giving him a taste of the poo poo she has been through for a decade. Can't say I blame her, really. I just want to make sure they don't do anything stupid that gets them in actual danger.
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Feb 25, 2023 11:26
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Good point, I'll pass that along.
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Feb 25, 2023 12:09
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I realize this and do appreciate the message. Now I just gotta convince my mom of this. Think I'd have an easier time convincing the republicans to play nice.
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Feb 25, 2023 13:22
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He wants to know how to legally and officially get out of China with as much of his direct family as possible. Getting the wife out depends entirely on her at this point. Optimally, he wants to at least get both children out of China if he is forced to leave. Worst case scenario, he wants to know a way to actually get out of China intact. Peace of mind for him comes with a clear path through his current situation and he is quite aware of how goddamn hosed he is without his passport. So far we have at least managed to tell him where he actually roughly is in China. That's a good start. Plus we've gotten him some contact points, phone numbers and a few anecdotal tier info dumps on his ability to actually get cash out of an ATM and whether he has to worry about scheduling a pcr test before flying out. Once he knows where he is and he knows that he can reliably leave the country safely, he can focus on saving his marriage. Currently he is alternating between fearing for his life, feeling completely caged and feeling like the worst of this has passed and they are on the road to fixing their marriage. I can't do poo poo to help him cope with the life he chose, so I'm focusing on showing him where he is and helping him navigate the paperwork labyrinth. SerthVarnee fucked around with this message at 13:51 on Feb 25, 2023 |
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Feb 25, 2023 13:38
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I've already sent him links to both Danish Consulates and the Danish Embassy, a direct number to the foreign ministry's 24/7 emergency phone line and told him to just let me know if he needs me to make a phone call on his behalf. We'll see what he ends up doing from here. Thanks again for the help everyone.
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Feb 25, 2023 13:53
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yaffle posted:Airasia has a direct flight from Changsha to Bangkok, so he can gtfo if he really feels like he has to. I don't think a COVID test is required to LEAVE china, the real problem will be bringing the kids with him if they entered on Chinese documents... Yeah I think he is proper hosed there and he knows it. So now he is keeping all my info in the back of his mind and focusing on going for a perfect outcome. We'll see in a few days how that went I guess.
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Feb 25, 2023 14:03
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Haystack posted:Is he afraid that his wife is going to try to stay and keep the children? He doesn't have to be certain, even a suspicion merits getting the gently caress out ASAP. She is threatening it a lot yes. She is also in possession of all their documents and he got caught flatfooted by the ferocity of her venting. So he feels forced to consider this might be a serious threat to his family and to his own security in China. Might just end up as a whole lot of venting and then everything is fine, but....yeah.
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Feb 25, 2023 14:17
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Yeah. That seems like the likely outcome unfortunately. Can't say we didn't try our best though.
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Feb 25, 2023 14:22
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Denmark, but yes they have return tickets. They'll be flying home in about a month. Having finally narrowed it down to "good enough to feel like he knows where he is", I can officially say that I've helped my brother out as much as I possibly can from here, and the rest is up to him and his legendary stubbornness. I got him his location, his emergency contacts with the Danish government, checked on flights, visa restrictions and covid test requirements and I can't do a loving thing from here from this point on. Goddamn I'm tired. Thanks again for all the help everyone and yeah I agree his stupid stubborn rear end is screwed. Especially since he is so rules bound that he won't install a VPN to find his own rear end when he is fearing for his life. Good luck brother. I love you dearly and you are dumb as gently caress.
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Feb 25, 2023 16:16
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There was some circumstances involving the father in law being bed-ridden for life at this point and the whole family going to visit them for what could be the last time and I'm honestly so drat tired by now that I'm entirely checked out. I managed to shuffle this whole mess on to my dad and he gets to do the fun song and dance with the Danish foreign ministry's emergency line to work this mess out. I found the fucker. I'm done.
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Feb 25, 2023 16:55
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Will do! For now I'm quite happy to report that this is all someone else's problem and I can go back to my relaxing dayjob of having random seizures from games and then writing about it.
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Feb 25, 2023 18:54
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bob dobbs is dead posted:ima invoke do ut des here and ask for more deets Once more in simpler terms for the massively exhausted people?
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Feb 25, 2023 19:04
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bob dobbs is dead posted:"i get epileptic seizures for a living" is not a normal job. spread details plz Oh! right! sorry, I'm a bit mushy brained right now. https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3987999&pagenumber=1 Too long, Didn't Click: I get seizures from playing games sometimes.' Instead of being raging and cursing up a storm about it, I write down all the details I can remember and post it as an article both in that thread and on this blog. https://electronicepileptic.wordpress.com/ Over the last two years, I've gone from being an unknown disabled guy in sweden, to being listed by Microsoft as a noteworthy epilepsy consultant and developer resource and have even had a consultancy round with NASA about the James Webb Space Telescope images giving me seizures on about 60% of their released images.
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Feb 25, 2023 19:08
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Well that was a fitting way to end the day. I'll keep that link handy and share it when it isn't going to just shatter my moms mental health entirely. I do appreciate getting the link though.
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Feb 25, 2023 19:47
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Wonton posted:i guess i have a hard time believing “help im somewhere within 3 hours driving distance of changsha” and literally not being able to pinpoint it more than that lol. on your 3rd visit to this place too. does the dude really have that little interest in the world around him that hes never bothered checking where hes been going all those times? it makes no sense at all to me Third time in the country. First time in that town and apartment. And he is mentally incapable of breaking rules (which means he feels it is not an option to use a VPN since that is against the rules in China). Like, I'm fairly certain he'd be severely tempted to retake his driver's license if he ever got a parking ticket. Emotionally dead is sort of correct and sort of not. Dude definitely has waves of emotions. But his father and his father's father basically taught him that emotions can only be handled by putting a lid on them and analyzing them clinically after the moment has passed. SerthVarnee fucked around with this message at 09:32 on Feb 27, 2023 |
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Feb 27, 2023 09:17
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I'm fairly certain her thinking and planning ended at "get back to China, back to the parents, all will be as it was a decade ago when she left the country". She is having a little bit of a mental breakdown due to coming home to reality and knowing her biggest rock of support is a dude with terminal engineer brain. Well, physicist/chemist brain. Super smart at what he does, loving USELESS at everything else. On the plus side, the help I've managed to provide him with the aid of you fine folks, seems to have gotten him stabilized enough to be able to deal with the crisis. He went from fearing for his own life a few times per day to feeling that this crisis has blown over and the next one will be when its time to choose to either stay or board the plane on time. So thank you guys once again for all you've done for me and my stupid, emotionally crippled family. The father in law has been bedridden for the last two years and according to the doctors, he should expect it to stay that way for the remainder of his likely short life. Yesterday my brother send us a message telling us that his kids have been such a positive influence on the in-laws that the father in-law has managed to get out of bed, get out of the apartment to go for a walk supported by his cane and the kids, and then managed to prop himself up against a wall so he could play ball with the kids. This is obviously wonderful news and I'm dead loving certain its going to be used as a reason for why the wife cannot allow herself or the kids to leave the parents in law behind at this time. But whatever, not my life to live and I'll take the good news as I can get it. I lost 7 people in 14 months in 2021-2022. I'm not adding my brother to that list if I can help it. But past that point? Dude made his own choices and gets to live with his own consequences.
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Feb 27, 2023 09:47
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BrassRoots posted:
This part is spot on. He is great at earning money. His solution to any emotional crisis is to earn enough money for her to be able to deal with this crisis on behalf of the whole family. Somehow, and I am dead certain it isn't his accomplishment here, the kids have turned out to be the most wonderful, joy filled and loving kids I've ever seen. The in-laws are also very friendly people who are currently really confused and frustrated by the cold war going on between my brother and his wife. She has a lot of very legit grievances with my brother and he is just not built to deal with them. I expect them to get a divorce or at the very least to end up living separately. I just don't want to see any of them physically hurt, I want them to get through this or get done with this in as amicable a way as possible and then I want to be able to tell my brother to his face that he never gets to call me a waste of society's resources ever again.
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Feb 27, 2023 10:18
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Wonton posted:8 is a very good auspicious number in Chinese culture. Maybe 2023 can make #8 happen? At what point during this conversation, did it feel like a good idea to joke about the potential death of my brother after I told you that I've had 7 people die during the last two years? I recognize you were joking, I just felt the need to point out that you failed to read the room entirely and your joke fell flat.
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Feb 27, 2023 13:41
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Siblings can be a source of infinite strife when kids grow up. I'm quite certain I was being a dick to him in general as a kid too. But yeah...His wife has improved his personality a LOT over the years.
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Feb 27, 2023 14:44
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Oh that is very good to know, Thanks a bunch!
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Feb 27, 2023 14:46
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Oh the undiagnosed mental illness part is very simple to explain. You see, he doesn't believe in there being such a thing as mental illness. Brain damage? Sure that's real and a physical thing. ADHD? nah, just lazy. Depression? nah, just lazy. Schizophrenic? nah, just acting up. Pointing out that he has this tick where he sniffles every time he gets agitated? gently caress you, he has a cold (which apparently he has been having for...45 years now) Epilepsy? ehhhh....might be faking it for attention. Unable to support yourself due to factors like these? Should just lie down and die in the gutters and not be a burden on society. He has gotten better with time and his wife wearing away at his stubborn brand of stupid, but yeah. Can't fix what doesn't want to admit its broke. Edit: I'm willing to cut him a lot of slack on the lack of ability to find his position, since he basically hasn't had a moment's rest to find solid ground to stand on for the entire first 16 days of his arrival to China. Trying to think rationally when you are jetlagged, keeping track of two kids and getting shat on by your wife at all times while also having to work from "home" is going to mess with anyone's head. Getting helpful advice from his youngest and traditionally most helpless little brother is just not something he can process at that stage. SerthVarnee fucked around with this message at 22:40 on Feb 27, 2023 |
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Feb 27, 2023 22:36
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On the plus side, it seems like things are going better and better for them for every day that passes at the moment, so it looks like the crisis has been avoided or at least postponed for now. Marriage might still end up in the dumpster once its time to go back on the plane, but it seems like the rest of the vacation plan is going to hold and be somewhere between tolerable and enjoyable. So I'm quite pleased with the outcome of this event. Don't think I've had such a lovely weekend in....20 years...though.
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Feb 27, 2023 22:50
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SerthVarnee posted:On the plus side, it seems like things are going better and better for them for every day that passes at the moment, so it looks like the crisis has been avoided or at least postponed for now. Somehow my brother has managed to get himself back from China in one piece, with both children AND the wife coming back with him. Even more surprising is the fact that all of them are wearing big genuine smiles (the less surprising thing is that they also look quite exhausted from the Changsha -> Beijing -> Copenhagen flights) So either my brother's wife managed to get all of those pent up frustrations out and went back to being okay with living in Denmark, or...actually, no I think that is about it for options, because the thought of my brother managing to sweet talk anyone or opening up his emotional side is completely alien to me. Anyways, can't thank you lot enough for the help you gave me back when everything was going to absolute poo poo (according to the information provided to me by my brother, who knows what was actually going on).
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Mar 23, 2023 22:05
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Yeah I got no clue how the gently caress that shitshow ended up as a perfect outcome, but I'll take it and not worry too much about the details.
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Mar 23, 2023 23:09
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That would be the most hilarious long con in the history of Denmark and if he managed to pull that off I'd salute him. And probably smack him once or twice.
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Mar 24, 2023 07:18
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Hahaha I think that depends on whether you ask my brother or his wife. Answers will vary between "loving NEVER AGAIN" and "hopefully soon"
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Mar 24, 2023 09:58
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bob dobbs is dead posted:doing a full proper accounting, ive seen it 7 times and this is the second time where it didnt end in no-recourse-for-the-white-guy taking the kid Even more impressively, my brother seems to have actually learned to show affection and display positive emotions in public settings or even surrounded by his siblings and parents. Something we have never seen him do ever before.
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Apr 17, 2023 22:10
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That would imply accepting there are entities outside of China's control and that would just be weird.
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Jun 3, 2023 14:01
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Speaking of going back. Guess who is going back in February. Yes his wife and kids will also be going. No I don't know how they are handling the paperwork this time. At least this time he'll actually know where the gently caress he is. Plus they do seem genuinely happy again these days. SerthVarnee fucked around with this message at 20:02 on Jan 4, 2024 |
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Jan 4, 2024 19:57
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