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silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

Aw yeah get me killed chief.

losername: silentsnack
class: murderbot
appearance: as absurdly bright/garish/mismatched as possible



(edit: also could go with "snack machine" or whatever you find appropriate)

silentsnack fucked around with this message at 01:43 on Apr 14, 2020

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silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

FairGame posted:

The nickname field won't support that much. You remain "Lightning," I'm afraid. As for pistol sharpshooter, that's not a problem. I basically don't bother with rifle sharpshooters until later (at which point I can just re-train a couple pistoleers.) I really hate riflemen.

Yeah, this is correct. A good sniper is very handy to have on certain missions. It's just that those missions tend to be few and far between, and basically non-existent during the first couple months of the campaign. When we start assaulting research facilities where we can take as much time as we want and set up on a nice rooftop, I'll absolutely be bringing a rifle-specced sniper.

WOTC gave a couple of buffs that help Sharpshooters/Specialists more than other classes because you can take both perks from a rank instead of choosing pistol spec OR rifle spec. That and the Hunter chosen's overpowered unique sniper rifle can fire with only 1 action instead of 2, in addition to its built-in weapon upgrades and good stats, so sharpshooters aren't quite as lame as they were in vanilla xcom2. Though they still don't get quite as much hilarious superhero bullshit as Rangers/Grenadiers and the faction heroes. :v:

A warning though: if you overuse the guerrilla action that lets you stack an arbitrary number of "+1 movespeed" boosts on a single soldier, in order to make a Templar that can combopunch every enemy on the map in one turn, at least on PC the game gets really laggy when trying to render their movement grid.

silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

Kibayasu posted:

Is it possible/a good idea to farm these zombie missions for experience? Or do zombies not give any.

Lost give a smaller amount of XP than other enemies but it's nonzero.


In a totally unrelated note, FairGame what's your policy on giving guns stupid names?

silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

SugarAddict posted:

It seems like you really should be using the mimic beacon. Especially if it draws out flame grenades which at this point of the game when it's usually an advent guaranteed death and will probably continue to be for the rest of the game for anyone that isn't fireproof.

AFAICT ever since the nerf it just forces enemy AI to use only basic attack, which always hits, and unless damage rolls extremely high or low the hologram can generally survive the first attack but never the third.

silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

e: nope, I'm wrong.

silentsnack fucked around with this message at 14:36 on Apr 21, 2020

silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

Peachfart posted:

Letting the Lost and Advent battle it out is always useful. Works even better with a Reaper and Remote Start, so you can weaken the Advent and summon more Lost to chew on their forces.
Oh, and I have seen large Lost swarms murder Chosen before. It is hilarious.

It can work against you sometimes. One time when playing (without integrated-DLC option) I had a mission where I finished the primary objectives and cleaned up all the advent I could find, and Lost swarms stopped spawning, but the mission still refused to end. It took an inordinately long time to search every building and eventually I found out that the problem was a literal corner case of bad mechanical interactions: the Archon King had patrolled down a very obscure alleyway and got trapped between a dumpster, the edge of the map, and a Lost clowncar. Presumably that's where they had been for the past ~45min while I searched, just maliciously loitering at one another like the world's laziest mosh pit

Luckily it was a Reaper who spotted them, so I got a chance to set up a nice grenade+overwatch ambush through a wall, which partly made up for the fact the squad was really not set up to deal with the most bullshit enemy.

silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

FairGame posted:

ehhh...that's like 99.9% correct

I'm going to explain it here because I already talked about capture mechanics on covert ops.

Sometimes your soldiers get captured. Either off-screen in a covert op, OR one of the chosen just nabs 'em whilst they're dazed on a mission. You will eventually get an opportunity to rescue that POW (whether as a covert op OR as a "rescue the VIP mission").

But during that period of time, the recruitment options will treat them as "dead" because it just checks your active roster of soldiers for "how many reapers/templars/skirmishers do you have."

So if you wanted to cheese it, you could intentionally get a faction hero captured, recruit a dude real quick, and then jailbreak the original dude. So you could, in theory, 3/2/2 rather than 2/2/1.

It's not worth it remotely, in practice.

I can't remember, do injured soldiers have their wound timers negated if they go MIA due to getting behind on a forced-evac mission? Because that's a separate way to get your dudes captured temporarily.



Also something cool about sparks' inability to take cover is that they also never count as flanked for triggering the 'anti beaglerush-maneuver' potshots, so you can overwatch the whole squad while concealed with the robot positioned just outside enemies' detection range in order to activate on the alien turn (assuming they patrol into you). Especially if you've got a Kill Zone sharpshooter. Though such cheesy tactics may be against your principles. :v:

silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

Munin posted:

That was nuts.

It really showed off how potent explosives are. Grenades and missile are as dangerous in your hands and in Advent's.

It also demonstrated that the target indicator will sometimes give you a bonus hint when you can shoot an explosive and damage enemies that you haven't even discovered yet.

silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

Dead Reckoning posted:

Holy hell, Silent Snack, you're getting the full Spark experience.

Say that after I miraculously survive tanking an entire mission's worth of unlucky activations, then die to fall damage caused by a burning floor after all the enemies are down.


Or if the spark is the one receiving the Snack Experience, it'll be dying due to an acid/burning Avatar teleporting into cover behind bulwark.

silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

I think the reason the game feels hardcoded to place 1~2 officers on most normal missions is because you need one to complete that central plot step. :thunk:

And once you've successvully brainspiked an officer, you'll notice almost every mission will have 1~3 codices as well.


Neither of these seems to apply to to missions with the 'horde' sitrep, which has zero advent/aliens so it's just xcom2's engine struggling to emulate They Are Billions via infinite lost spam.

silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

Akratic Method posted:

Yeah but they make that neat WUB.... wub sound when you activate them. :downs:

I dunno, count me on the side of "treats them as a non-threat like sectoids because their first move never hurts", especially since it's a mind-control where you're allowed to just murder your buddy to end it, but any level of bullshit is amplified massively by being encountered on a 3-man mission.

Yeah my last surgical/trainraid mission ended up being mostly a solo operation because two of my soldiers were constantly mindcontrolled or shadowbound. Because not only are mindcontrol/shadow bullshit, they have functionally-nonexistent cooldowns as well.

silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

Robert Deadford posted:

Loving the primo Reaper bullshit, FG. Keep it coming!

And this is where Sharpshooters start to become useful. Megane didn't get Face Off, which is a rather tasty Sharpshooter skill. Once your pistoleers get that and Bluescreen rounds, mechanical enemies lose some of their threat. High aim, range bonuses, damage bonuses and free actions leads to dead Advent MECs. Of course, Bluescreens on grenadiers are good, too.


I agree with you about the natural role of the Grenadier - they set up the turn by destroying cover and the quicker, more accurate troops clean up. Grenadiers just can't get the high aim values to make them purely cannon-focused. Are you planning to put your Grenadiers in the EXO or WAR suits for added fun? Or will it cost you an item slot?

You lose an item slot when equipping a heavy armor suit, but at the same time you gain a (single-shot) heavy weapon, which can benefit from some of the grenade-based skills. And since grenadiers can only equip two grenades (+1 use on the grenade-only slot making it 3 grenades per mission) that can be a very beneficial tradeoff.

For deleting heavily armored enemies, nothing beats acid grenade + salvo + shredder + rupture + volatile mix, before having your ranger rapidfire it.


Also I've noticed a few times that FairGame likes to panic about enemies wandering into a firefight and taking a cheap shot on a flanked soldier, but I think that only happens if they activate from idle/patrol state by detecting a concealed/shadowed soldier. At least I've never seen the "Spotted FLANKED enemy!" message any time other than losing stealth. Or it could be a joke I'm missing?

silentsnack fucked around with this message at 07:50 on May 1, 2020

silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

Gothsheep posted:

I mean, if you're concealed then they'll only be able to see you if you don't have cover from them. So they only see you if they walk into a flanking position or you aren't in cover. But once you aren't concealed, it goes back to the X-COM 1 method of 'a pod activates the moment you get vision on it' and since they get a free move (or rarely, Overwatch) when activating, if you activate late into your turn they can get their free move, then move again on their action, and then fire, all before you can do a single thing about them.

Yup, with a few relatively rare exceptions (burrowed chryssalids, etc) the normal sequence of actions means aliens don't get to attack before you've had at least some chance to react to them. And the anti-beaglerush-maneuver mechanic was named as such because it was designed to counter an egregiously cheesy tactic favored by a youtube/streamer nerd who was semi-internet-infamous for his cheesy tactics... aforementioned tactic was [intentionally cause your concealed soldiers to be discovered so as to trigger mass overwatch(concealment) and effectively get 2 risk-free turns to curbstomp the first pod of every mission]

So (unless I'm wrong in my analysis of how that mechanic works!) what I'm suggesting is that once you've broken squad-wide concealment, the only units at risk of a surprise attack are phantom/shadow scouts.

silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

Dead Reckoning posted:

Not quite: the trigger for the suicidal stand and shoot, 'stead of scurry, is a soldier being not in cover from the perspective of the activated enemy unit.

If, for example, you're in a room, setting up to breach a door, and an enemy pod walks through the other door (super awkward for everyone, fortunately two out of three died to mass overwatch) they might decide to take potshots at your flanked units instead of running to cover.

This is to keep someone with a Reaper or Phantom Ranger from using the visibility indicator to run revealed units up to the last tile before visibility and setting overwatch to get a free round of shooting (unless they can find cover while doing it, or use a sharpshooter to spring the trap.) It rarely comes up, because most Xcom players are loathe to leave their units out of cover for any reason.

Weird. Like I said I'm willing to admit being wrong about a vague hypothesis, but in 200+ hours of xcom2 I should have been proven wrong enough times to force me to revisit my assumptions.

Unless there's some other confounding factor like whether it only counts the first soldier the aliens 'see' when they activate on their turn, and/or if non-stealthed units have a lower chance of provoking the attack.

Gothsheep posted:

Wow, I honestly thought the game would not let two directly contradicting traits to happen on a Chosen. Specifically the Immune to Melee/Vulnerable to Templars, one. I did get a Chosen that was Immune to Melee/Vulnerable to Close Range though, which was annoying. But at least I always had the shotgun option.

Even better is having a "weak to melee" chosen get the "immune to melee" perk from training.

silentsnack fucked around with this message at 09:21 on May 2, 2020

silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

eating only apples posted:

I hope we see an ambush at some point, I've only done one before and they're hard.

I've done a lot and they're easy because they're so predictable. :v:

It's always a Lost City map with a handful of humanoid Advent patrolling in unusually small pods (like 1~2 dudes each)

If you've got 2+ soldiers you can just move-overwatch to slug your way through after the inevitable turn-2 advent drop-in.

If you've got a Reaper or a stealth-Ranger, just know that enemies all hang out near the centerline of the map so you can avoid detection by moving near the edge.

If neither of those applies, you either screwed up or got such a bad selection of covert actions that you had to screw up. It helps to know you can almost always cheese Lost by standing at the top of a ladder. So grenade the first car you see to summon the Lost wave early, sit on a ladder the turn they spawn so they can't surround you, then just haul all the rear end while Advent are distracted fighting your zombie train. Spider/Wraith armor for dodge+grapple and Stasis/Plated/Hellweave vest for extra survival. I wouldn't recommend this unless you don't have any other options besides sending a single soldier on an op with a chance of ambush.

Munin posted:

Also, Snacks has been a pretty solid shooter for a robot. Did they get buffed from base game Xcom2?

Sparks aren't in the base game IIRC (they're in Shen's Last Gift dlc) but yeah they were more recently buffed by WOTC(?) enabling them to use weapon upgrades.

silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

King Cohort posted:

That overwatch was strange--isn't concealed overwatch supposed to only trigger if you or your squad is revealed? Did the Viper King flank and reveal SugarAddict, or somebody else?

That's only if the shooter is concealed. It doesn't consider whether taking the shot will activate aliens and immediately blow someone else's stealth.


edit: FairGame, I think you have to do the skullmining foundry project if you want to use the skulljack outside of completing those two plot objectives. Otherwise the item seems to be 100% useless.

silentsnack fucked around with this message at 21:58 on May 4, 2020

silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

Gothsheep posted:

That's some really bad damned luck with that hill, though. That's going to do more than just neuter the turrets, it's going to make your whole defensive line have trouble, and give your enemies high ground when attacking.

Wait "defensive line"? This isn't like the Avenger Defense mission from vanilla xcom2, where where it's a valid tactic (if boring and cheesy) to set up for a stationary siege next to your turrets and kill incoming enemies until they run out of reinforcements, before going out and destroying the mission objective. Try to do that here and you'll lose, because those objectives are bombarding your airship.

As usual the game tries to exaggerate the drama/urgency of the situation so as long as you're actively clearing the map the time limit won't become an issue. Enemies having high ground will be a minor and very temporary issue.

What the hill is gonna do is stop FairGame from being able to use spammable 8x/turn low% squadsight shots to trivialize the entire challenge of "take a double squad and fight ~3 missions worth of baddies in a big open-ish field, plus a Chosen and a time limit".

silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

Dead Reckoning posted:

Wait, you can do that? I thought they were infinite, and always cheesed it the other way: running a Phantom up to LoS and annihilating it with Squadsight, SPARK bombardment, and blaster bombs.

The reinforcement drops don't completely stop, but once all the wandering pods have suicided into your defenses there isn't a risk of surprise activation so you can leisurely conga to the objective and instakill each airdrop with overwatch.

silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

There's something amusing/annoying about how civilians react (like around ~23:00)

Squad of weirdos that got kicked out of a larp convention, having a shootout with alien spacepolice? Cool, imma cower over here.

Someone standing within 2m of me? AHH! LEISURELY STROLL AWAY!!

silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

Does having a skirmisher captured by advent mean FairGame can recruit a second one, or does that only work when they're kidnapped by Chosen? (and/or got patched out?)

silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

Peachfart posted:

Actually, his roster is pretty dang thin for Legendary, and now that will get even worse. So, maybe?

Yeah unlike long war it's looking like he's gonna need extra troops just to dilute the willpower drain, because this fatigue/trauma/neurosis spiral is starting to look like Rimworld.

silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

Yeah, and from experience having "a rough month" turn into "three rough months in a row" doesn't always turn the campaign into a still-winnable-but-torturously-unfun meatgrinder slog, but it isn't necessarily bad to insure against it.

silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

Something else to notice when Roth glitched out of cover, she was multiple tiles away from the van but still had the "open door" action available.

silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

Peachfart posted:

That glitch in XCOM2 is purely a visual one, it happens on the PC version also.

She should be "in full cover but flanked" due to standing by a closed door (assuming she were at the position where FG's cursor was when she started moving) yet the UI shows half cover but flanked. Which contradicts the theory it's purely visual.


Unless you're saying the entire UI has bugged out, which is not entirely implausible.

silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

Munin posted:

I did that on a PC and it works.

And yeah, that Chrissalid behavior did look wonky and I didn't see them do that in my (non-WotC) game. Burrow and ambush in an annoying way, yes. Charge two thirds of the way across the map and try and chunk someone, no.

Maybe having a reaper with Target Definition flag them as 'permanently visible' breaks the logic for checking LOS to determine when to make their ambush attack?

silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

Grapplejack posted:

I don't believe they did, and I assume fairgames strategy of dealing with him is to avoid him completely or use 'the forbidden technique'

Seeing as he took a moment in this recent video and explicitly mentioned the necessary items and foreshadowed the final component of the combo ...I'd say we're likely to see animation sequences glitching out and absurd ragdoll comedy, because xcom physics.

silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

Xelkelvos posted:

I wonder how the five Squaddie sharpshooters feel seeing the new recruit immediately get the training to go up to Sergeant while they've been benched. Same with Squaddie Specialist KW and newly recruited Sergeant Tuxedo Ted

Eh getting demoted to placeholder-duty (for resistance ops that just need +1 warm body) is relatively safe assignment.

It's rare for a Filler Guerrilla to see combat at all and when they do they're usually being escorted by a superbadass living weapon. That or they discover they've been further demoted to zombait.

silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

A while back you mentioned not wanting to waste weapon upgrades on like a second rifle/cannon/etc but once you start getting advanced/superior mods the lowest-tier mods are good to fill that niche. Especially for operators sent into potential ambushes and/or a spare upgraded weapon for classes that you only occasionally double up on missions.

Also if you're at all concerned about your stealthed ranger/reaper getting exposed by a blind jump, maybe have another unit move first to make sure it's clear?

silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

eating only apples posted:

Does that not counteract the entire point of having a stealth ranger/reaper?? They're meant to spot, and mostly can always conceal again


I had the same issue as FairGame in vanilla Xcom 2 in that jumping off a building would sometimes find a civilian, who has a tiny discovery radius, but apparently screams loud enough to blow the whole squad's cover. Apart from that, stealth is so good.

The reaper is entirely another issue and should not be considered in any of this discussion, their discover range is so small. SugarAddict is one of our best guys right now.

It's a calculated risk for the first blue-move on turn 1. If you're gonna activate enemies would you rather do by having your phantom ranger accidentally trip over a civilian, or with a specialist?

And yes it's a low probability but reapers dropping from a roof can land right in a civilian's detection range. Seeing it happen one too many times is what inspired the Xzibit scouting technique.



There's also the option of blowing 12AP on Scanning Protocol if your specialist is a genius/savant.

silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

What caused that surprise reverse-ambush activation was the fact that when you had Din shoot the node, the shot clipped through the edge of a wall, destroying the piece of terrain that had been blocking your lancer from having step-out view on the aliens.

silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

Dead Reckoning posted:

Can you give grenadiers a grenade in their second item slot?
You can't, so the only way to get 4 booms is with EXO/WAR armor taking up your second item slot.

silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

Grapplejack posted:

I really wish the plasma guns didn't look like toys. The plasma minigun is the worst offender imo, it looks so lovely.

Aren't goofy impractical retro-scifi weapon/armor/alien designs kinda iconic of the xcom series though? Though I'd agree that they don't really fit very well with the serious duct-tape-and-supertech (kludgepunk?) grunge aesthetic of xcom2's resistance theme.

silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

W.T. Fits posted:

I love that you've gotten so used to the Serpent Armor's Frostbite missing that you completely failed to notice that you successfully froze the Purifier right before you put an axe through the Shieldbearer's face. :allears:

Or the fact that the frostbite pulled the purifier out of cover, and somehow glitched him down through the floor. Which is why it took so long to get LOS again because it was in a completely unexpected location.

silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

Kibayasu posted:

Oh yeah I was going to ask what that grenade was and why it didn’t do anything. We’ve probably seen it before but it’s been a while. Is it basically a super flashbang that also sets people up for capture?

Yea Hunter's flashbang causes 'daze' and he decided to toss it at the two units on the map which can't be dazed, even though he could have hit 3+ meatsquad instead. Gonna guess that the AI's grenade targeting really heavily prefers armored targets, even for non-damaging grenades?

silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

I think that mystery fire was because Din's whiffed overwatch shot (avec Dragon Rounds) coincidentally hit some terrain.

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silentsnack
Mar 19, 2009

Donald John Trump (born June 14, 1946) is the 45th and current President of the United States. Before entering politics, he was a businessman and television personality.

Crazy Achmed posted:

Yeah, thanks! This has been really entertaining and we all appreciate it that you hung in there to see it through. I hope this year treats you better than the last!
[edit]Also that null lance being unable to hit both avatars was bullshit

Speaking of x-com-likes, I've been keeping one eye on phantom doctrine recently - it looks interesting, has anyone played it?

Yeah, it's... okay. Can't remember too much of it except a couple of the voices being incredibly irritating. Wouldn't really recommend it unless you really want a janky coldwarpunk Invisible Inc

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