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Captain France
Aug 3, 2013

Amuys posted:

The main problem I see with the next banner is THREE greatsword users.

As someone who feels like greatsword is pretty much necessary and geo is bad at reactions, I honestly think that is the best part of the next banner.

I love Noelle, but man do I need that slot for another element.

Fischl and Sucrose are my favorites and Keqing is my only 5 star, but Geo/Electric/Electric/Wind seems like a pretty bad element spread.

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Captain France
Aug 3, 2013

kater posted:

Dear everyone saying you can’t do it: geo loves you and wants to be your friend and every reaction drops shields and you aren’t interrupted when you have a shield.

Man you're not kidding, it's also worth noting that Noelle's sword during her ult is big, covers a wide area, and does a lot of damage.

Pairing her up with Ningguang to charge her it has worked so well, plus the wall blocks projectiles.

Even without her, though, Noelle's shield is very good.

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013

Archonex posted:

People used to be interested in talking about this stuff, but it seems like there's some folks that take offense to it. So should I just stop?

I'm enjoying the synopsis of the batshit insanity that is likely at the edges of the setting/story, even if I would prefer it never go too far past the edges.

But then I loving love both convoluted, pretentious meta poo poo and loosely connected strings between different stories. So this is entirely my jam.

Thanks for the Thanksgiving distraction.

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013

Ytlaya posted:

One other lore thing I noticed is that the descriptions for the elemental shards/gems give what is obviously a perspective of their respective Archons (with more text revealed for each higher stage material).


Why does she have a...Texan(?) accent?


If you read the text for hilichurl masks, it mentions there possibly being a reason why they all cover their faces.

Speaking of hilichurls, another commission gives more evidence to the "the way people treat hilichurls is hosed up" idea. There's this one where a guy in that one Liyue hotel is like "get rid of these hilichurls because they're an eyesore." So literally without any provocation or concern of danger, just wants them gone.

I once got a quest to kill a bunch of hilllichurl for "practicing marine combat," in loving Guyun Stone Forest.
If they can't live and learn to swim on an island in the middle of nowhere, then where the hell are they supposed to live, Adventurers Guild?

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013

TV Zombie posted:

Height is overrated! (I don't have any of those characters and am on my fifth dupe weapon).

You still have Kaeya.
You all still have Kaeya.

Also Sucrose 4 Lyfe, she collects bones and has SO MUCH AOE.

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013

frajaq posted:

whats up with plants in this world

everything around the loot mechanics is about Resin, and you either use it on dead rear end trees or seeds
we feed creepy red crystals to an unknown tree in Dragonspire that seemed to be sealed beneath?
we track down the other crystals to unlock the new domain because it blooms ice flowers around them
Albedo got his hands on literal seed from another world (?!?!)

Also worth noting, and I didn't see it mentioned lightly skimming the lore posts (I haven't played all of Dragonspine yet, don't wanna spoil too much), that, that there is something (The wiki says a dragon) older than the current gods sleeping in/under the big tree in Nantianmen, loving with ley lines through the roots. So while some of the stuff with plants is probably multiverse-related, some of it is also likely a bit more mundane.

I mean. For as mundane as "An ancient evil older than the gods is merged with the tree it was sealed with and is loving with ley lines" is.

(God, I remember when this was the biggest checkov's gun in this game that I was aware of. You'd think Dark Souls would have me conditioned to read the item descriptions.)

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013

Nakar posted:

Just make a catalyst character who is actually a brawler and the catalyst just kinda floats next to them while they fight, doing nothing.

Also any of these Zhongli buffs still won't make him less awkward to use so I guess they gotta make him OP because making him actually fun would require a massive redesign. By contrast, everything in Albedo's kit feels so fluid and easy to use, so I can swap him in and out without it taking eight years to power pose and generate a shield.

His meteor and autoattack are fun to use, and the stele SHOULD be. I feel like the debuff should be linked to them if anything, and their energy generation shouldn't be so horribly hosed. They don't need to be Albedo good, but right now their energy regen just feels like garbage.
The funnest thing he has besides the meteor is knocking stuff forward with the stele and then bouncing them back into it. It'd be cool if they did something with that, like an extra pulse or physics damage when you knockback something into it.

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013

Ciaphas posted:

yeah I'm just working on basic game mechanics here


So far, I'm enjoying this game for the artwork, character design and the gameplay itself; but sometimes I see the numbers-go-up man behind the green curtain, or a grind reminds me of it, and it just stone-dead kills my will to play :v:

Pre-Venerer Sucrose, you give her instructor's or scholar's, put an element on something or a group, then use her E to do a bunch of damage, spread the element if there's a group, and pull everything together.

Especially if you have her C1 and ESPECIALLY if you have Sacrificial Fragments, she does a lot of damage and is spammable.

Her normals being anemo and like half or more of her damage coming from Swirl makes her do pretty good damage alongside Oz (Fischl's E) or any other elemental damage that stays on the field, but her real draw is the huge aoes.

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013
I can get under 1:30 on the weed pretty consistently, but drat do I wish I could 1 cycle it.

n'thing the "bring Amber" recommendation for anyone who can't burst it down immediately, she cuts down on the waiting so much.

Besides that, it's just bringing a DPS that can use the Festering Desire, some quick pyro application, and I've been bringing a shield for consistency because no matter who I use, I can't get it in one cycle and I'm way overshooting two.
(Keqing, Bennet, Amber, Zhongli. Diona might actually be better because he shield is frost, and if you run DPS Bennet he can probably fill Keqing's role too.)

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013

kater posted:



I'm just wondering, how good do things have to be before you bother putting juice into them? Like neither of these are particularly good, but eh. Eh?

I dunno I answered my own question just looking at them like this. I think I need to make a spreadsheet to track artifacts, its so hard in game. Hell its hard to track all the different progressions. Wait that is the entire game.

Pretty sure artifact feeding has like 90% efficiency, so I've been putting juice into whatever and just feeding it to new stuff later on.

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013

RareAcumen posted:

I have broken the seal and am no longer F2P

I did too, after spending all of my f2p primos on this banner hoping for Sucrose constellations, and instead winding up with my Bennet at C3. Fischl at C4(after shop), The Flute, and Keqing getting her C1.

I now have a C5 Fischl.

Uninstalled my phone version to keep me from making that mistake again.

Yes I know what I got is objectively more useful than a bunch of Sucrose constellations when she's already C1, but a good sword, the Best Boy, the Chuuniest Chuuni, and the edgelord the Chuuni wishes she was are not a science waifu who collects bones for reasons unrelated to science.

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013

RareAcumen posted:

I didn't even do it because I ran out of gems, I was just ready to get a Serpent Spine and all those other extra resources from the battle pass.

Also I too am at C5 Fischl now. Better to get it now while I can than wait and expect her to show up while I'm trying to get something else like Ninggaung's been doing beforehand.

Battle pass probably would have been a better deal than $15 in gems with a first time bonus. On the other hand, C5 Fischl is one away from C6. I feel like I shouldn't complain, even if it's not what I wanted.

Speaking of, my latest "lucky but not a Sucrose constellation" pull from today's quests got me The Stringless. I assume that's better than Rust for Fischl unless I try to use her as a carry?

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013
sn

BlackPersona posted:

I only started playing about a month ago or so, still FTP, and the only 4* characters I'm missing are Beidou and Xingqiu. I kind of want another Hydro character that isn't Barbara, so Ganyu's banner is looking pretty good in my books, all things told.

Though, while we're on the subject of that banner, I've seen a few people in here say that Noelle is pretty good, but I kind of left her behind early on in favor of some other characters. As someone whose hardly played her, what makes her good?

There's only one thing Noelle does well, which is tanking, but besides elemental reactions and crowd control, she does everything.
Smash geo shields/constructs/mining? Big sword.
Stagger? Big sword.
Go past wooden shields? The big sword seems to smash away small wooden shields easily enough, the big ones are more trouble but sometimes she can hit around it.
AOE? Her swings are pretty wide, and her ult hits a HUGE radius.
Burst damage? Her Ult does good damage and hits a huge radius.
DPS? She's not great, but not really needing to dodge helps with that some, and she's not horrible because, again, big sword.
Healing? Hers is a bit RNG and requires her to be on the field, but she heals pretty well, especially since not a lot of characters heal, and she brings all that other utility.
Shield generation? I think she might have the strongest shield in the game.
Tanking? Noelle is loving invincible. I have had her stand right in Dvalin's wind breath with her shield up hacking away, and he flinched first.

Noelle isn't the best at much, but man does she tick a lot of boxes at once.

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013

RealFoxy posted:

I'm a little over level 20 now but I still don't really know what I'm doing as far as party comp goes.

So far outside of the 4 default characters I've ended up with
Barbara (x2)
Noelle (x2)
Sucrose (x3)
Xiangling (x2)
Diona
Xingqiu

idk why I keep getting so many duplicates but other than the last two that I just rolled, I've been using Traveler/Amber/Barbara/Xiangling. I'm only spending money on the $5 pass thingie so I'm not going to sit around and whale for the perfect team or anything, I just don't know enough to know what good combos I've got.

gently caress it I'm up I might as well try and help.

Don't worry too much about leveling the wrong people until you start hitting the 50s, you're going to need two teams eventually and everyone is good except arguably Amber, Lisa and Barbara, and they can still do work. Most teams want a carry (a DPS who is on the field most of the time) and a healer, and once you've got that you're free to pick supporting people. If you run a physical carry, which all of your carries are, unfortunately, you probably also want Superconduct. You make it with Cryo + Electro and it debuffs enemy physical defense by a whopping 40%.

Unfortunately this means that unless you have the stardust to buy Fischl from the store, you probably want Lisa on your team. I can't tell you much about her besides "does electro, hits things that are hard to hit, can hit crowds well if you don't mind standing around charging for a second." Also if you have enough stardust to buy Fischl then DO IT SHE'S ONE OF THE BEST CHARACTERS IN THE GAME, WORKS AS A CARRY OR A SUPPORT, MAKES SUCROSE ABLE TO CARRY, AND IS SUCH A CHUUNI THAT THE GODS SENT HER A TALKING RAVEN, EITHER IN CASE SHE'S NOT FULL OF poo poo OR BECAUSE IT'S FUNNY.

For carries you have Kaeya, Xiangling, arguably Noelle, and maybe Traveler? I don't know poo poo about Traveler except that as Anemo they can run the amazing Anemo debuff set and as Geo they make a good battery for other Geo characters. Also not a lot of first-hand experience with Kaeya or Xiangling as anything but supports, so grain of salt / anyone else feel free to add or correct me.

Kaeya, in addition to having good autos, has the fastest Cryo skill in the game. His skill hits a decent area for decent damage, and at higher levels generates a lot of energy. His ult lasts a long time, charges fast, and stays around even when you switch him out. Also, as a cryo character, he brings 1/2 of Superconduct on his own, and as a Tall Man he walks/runs faster than normal. He's also cool and good and I wish I'd kept him up to pace sooner.

Xiangling has good autos and access to a pretty broken weapon in the Crescent Pike. Her active deals decent pyro in a decent area, hits more than once for shieldbreaking/elemental reaction purposes, and sticks around a good long time when she's off screen. Her ult charges fast, does good damage in a wide area, and ALSO sticks around when she is off screen. As a pyro character, she also has 1/2 of the very good Pyro Resonance if you want to build that into your team--two pyro characters gives you a 25% attack boost, which is not the same thing as a 25% damage boost but is still pretty good. Obviously, everything I just said but the crescent pike makes her a really good support too, so there is zero way for her to be a waste of resources and I wish I'd built her sooner.

I wrote a pretty big post on Noelle before, but the short version is that she can do a lot of different things, albeit she's not a great carry without a battery setup--I hear Noelle + Geo Traveler works, but my Traveler is perma-Anemo so I can have the Anemo speed/stamina bonus on my gathering team. Her normal attacks are pretty strong, and they do great stagger because it's a big loving sword. Her ult turbocharges them, making her sword glowing and enormous and glorious and adds a bunch of geo damage, much of which is based on her defense stat. Between that and her shield that also lets her heal, she can be basically invincible and facetank through attacks without dodging. I have done this to Stormterror before. Unfortunately, her ult charges super slow, her shield has good uptime but is bad at doing geo damage, she is bad at generating energy, and geo's one reaction, crystalize, does nothing offensively besides helping with the aforementioned facetanking. Especially because shields don't stack. Still, I used her as my main carry until I hit endgame, and did not regret it.

For healers, you have Barbara, Noelle, and Diona. I talked about Noelle already, but as a healer you want to focus more on her defense--it affects her healing rate and lets her tank better.

I don't have much experience with Barbara, but she's got a rare and useful element in hydro, and she can sure as gently caress heal. All of the hydro elemental reactions are good--electrocharge does decent dots that jump from enemy to enemy, vaporize multiplies pyro damage by 1.5, and frozen . . . freezes people. Which also enables geo and claymore attacks to shatter for bonus damage. Her ult does a big heal, her active does healing over time, her active can heal outside of battle--healing is what she does. Unfortunately, as I'm sure you've noticed, her active gets you wet which leaves you vulnerable to some of the worst elemental reactions, and she hits like she dipped her hands in the sink and is just flinging water. You also have Xingqui who is better at the hydro thing in every way, but he doesn't heal. Barbara is also cheap to build, because her best weapon is the 3 star Thrilling Tales Of Dragon Slayers, and her main stat is HP, which most other characters don't care too much about.

Diona is a jack of all trades like Noelle. She makes decent shields, she puts out a lot of ice, she's an archer, and she makes an ice field with her ult that does decent healing. I should remind you that Cryo is 1/2 of Superconduct, so with your current carry options you probably want her or Kaeya around--or both, Cryo resonance gives her and Kaeya a nice crit boost. Like Barbara, she's mostly easy to build because she wants HP, but her best weapon by far is the 4* Sacrificial Bow from the gacha, so that can be a stumbling block. Her ult charges kind of slow and is the only way she heals, so whatever you give her, you need to make sure her energy recharge is on point. I might sound a bit critical of her here, but she's good and is always on one of my Abyss teams.

Once you've got those two roles covered, and probably have Lisa in a slot, that leaves you one or two slots for supports. Here, you're looking for things that stay on the field when the character gets off (Kaeya, Xiangling, Xinqui, Amber, technically Barbara but Xinqui does her version of this way loving better), or some serious burst DPS (Sucrose. Put an element on someone, use her special twice, probably three times if you have Sacrificial Fragment, or her ult, and do loving hilarious damage, especially to large groups, while pulling everything together.) Oh, or a battery for someone you have whose ult you're relying on--picking up a particle from the same element as your character charges faster.

Other people can add if I missed anything, but this should have you covered for physical teams. Also non-physical teams except you don't need superconduct for those. To summarize, you want a carry and a healer, and for physical teams you want a cryo and an electro. Once you have that, everything else is flexible.

Someone can correct me if I missed anything. I think I'm gonna watch a youtube video and then try to go back to sleep.

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013

Framboise posted:


Rumor has it that Hu Tao's banner will have Razor, Xingqiu, and Chongyun and I'm SO READY. Give me the cute stabby funeral lady and all the himbo constellations

How sure are we on this? I'm at 74 pulls and I'd rather have Keqing's C2 than Xaio, but I also really want Xinyan's C2. I'd grab it off of Stand By Me, but I'm missing both Xinqui and Chongyun. Being able to pull for them would be great.

I really, really wish the banners had an overlap day or something.

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013

Clarste posted:

I mean there kind of is an overlap day if you're playing on western servers, since the updates aren't synced between different timezones.

True on the "knowing what's coming" front, but not on the "use my pity on Keqing then go back to pulling for Xinyan" front.

Still, good point, I can wait a while on Stand By Me.

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013

Hammer Bro. posted:

Is that 'cause they're bad dudes or 'cause you already have 'em?

I don't have any character sensibilities nor particular aspirations -- I like usin' whichever group of folk seems best out of the people I do have. Though obviously I'm gonna roll bones when I've got 'em.

There are no "bad" characters besides Amber, Lisa, and Barbara. And they're not really "bad" so much as "not as good as everyone else usually."

You already have Bennet and Barbara, Bennet constellations are nice.
Ningguang is in the running for best ranged DPS in the game, plus she makes shields and her pew pew rock missiles are really fun and the other day I juggled a Hilichurl so high in Theater Mechanicus that it took fall damage.
Keqing is possibly the weakest 5 star overall, but she's still good for battle and GREAT for exploration. She's fun, she can teleport and if knockback is something you want she is great at it. Her main problems are that her strongest attack is also the knockback one, and that you can't really assemble a team around her as much as some other 5 stars. She's pretty great for plug and play, though.

If any of that appeals to you or you want constellations for Bennet and Barbara, this is a good banner to pull on.

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013

aparmenideanmonad posted:

Girls are bad at sprinting and climbing according to Mihoyo. So yeah, she's probably among the fastest of the ladies but Benny or XQ will go faster despite being shorter.

At least until you're in water, where they are faster swimmers. But Mona >>>>>> everyone for water travel.

I could have sworn the gender difference on move speed was because of the height difference, and tall girls were faster than short boys?

But then I've got my Ning equipped with Lost Prayer To The Sacred Winds for + move speed, plus she's got two Anemo on her team. For zooming around.

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013
Between Sucrose constellations, Rosaria coming up (I have all 4 stars currently and wanna keep it up,) and maybe Jean depending on my pity when she gets featured, I am legitimately tempted to get Welkin Moon. On the other hand, the though, I could buy other poo poo for the price of what may well be 17 3 star weapons and an extra Razor.

Still tempting, though.

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013

Solkanar512 posted:

So this is based on leaks purported by the 1.5 dev kit leak and posted across a few discords so no promises about changes or whatnot. Feel free to speculate, celebrate or mock as you see fit. Bold is 5*, italics is first appearance.

Patch 1.4
April 6th: Tartaglia, Rosaria, Fischl, Bennet

Patch 1.5
April 28th: Zhongli, Yanfei, Ningguang, Diona
May 18: Eula, Beidou, Barbara, Xianyan

Patch 1.6
June 9: Klee, Xingqui, Sucrose, Rosaria
June 30: Unknown

gently caress.
I really want ice nun, but I have C6 Fischl and I think (top of my head, might be 4) C5 Bennet.

Then again, I also have Keqing and think she's fun to use. Does Bennet's C6 override the effect where her E converts her normals to electro? Pyro Keqing sounds cool but I hate not being able to use her teleport without loving up her normals, that's why I quit running her physical.

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013

Mirello posted:

Is there a rule that kaeya must appear in every monthly event lol? You'd think it'd be diluc since it's specifically about wine or w/e. It was cool seeing 3 characters. I really wish they'd just have all the mondstaters hanging out in the world, but mihoyo seems really hesitant for reasons I don't understand.

They should just do one fetch quest per day for 60 primos instead of 2 or 3 for 20. 20 is a joke, it's basically an additional daily commission lol.

Also all the mini games are fun but it's odd to me that they don't develop more permanent content. I don't mean more world exploration (although that's the best, I know it takes forever to make). Stuff like randomized coopable dungeons. Or that event with the harder world bosses. That should be permanent, no reason for it to be temporary. Just have rewards refresh every week.

If it helps any, Kaeya is both kind of a drunk and Diluc's adopted brother who is not on good terms with him right now, so he's still kinda related to wine.

Also, I'm not sure if Venti requested the three bottles of expensive wine to make Kaeya go talk to his brother, because he just wanted wine, or both.

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013

RealFoxy posted:

If you've read the manga, Kaeya and Diluc are still on the same page, Kaeya likes to operate outside of the Knights too but he just likes to troll....Like everyone.

Diluc has reasons to be brooding and want to be a vigilante, Kaeya just thinks it's funny to make everyone around him miserable including turning Klee against Jean. The only person he doesn't actively antagonize is Lisa.

Huh. I've still gotta get around to reading that.
I remember a scene in game where they had a fight and just figured that was their current default state.

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013

RareAcumen posted:

It's so refreshing having characters around and interacting. I guess a lot of the Liyue VA's are harder to schedule together or something.

I think this is the first event that wasn't started until after they started getting player feedback, so maybe they somehow just didn't know people wanted to interact with playable characters until they were told?

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013
Sucrose did in some voice lines, and I THINK a couple of the knights did too.

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013

Reiterpallasch posted:

C6 Fischl, of course, is an unholy monster when paired with someone who can machine gun elemental reactions like Sucrose.

C6 Fischl and Sucrose is basically my core for my main team right.

Zhongli/Fischl/Bennet/Sucrose shredded today's challenge after I failed twice trying to use Keqing and take advantage of the plunging attack buff.

Hell, Shield/Fischl/Bennet/Sucrose can handle most of the Abyss better than any other team I can put together, including if I put Zhong on the other team and use Diona, Noelle, or Xinyan.
And that's saying something, since I have both a high level Ning, and recently pulled Diluc and got him and Xinqui up and running.

(Also recently pulled Qiqi, and then got Venti the other day. I'd almost swear Blessing Of The Welkin Moon came with a boost to 5 star rates. A little annoyed at that Venti, since outside of my gimmicky Sucrose Main team, he does the same thing as Sucrose but Sucrose is heavily invested and also does science and collects bones for reasons unrelated to the science. I wanted to use that pity rate on Eula. Oh well, need two teams anyways, right?)

Captain France fucked around with this message at 09:28 on Apr 5, 2021

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013

Clarste posted:

Do you... Do you want the random encounters on the world map to be hard? I feel like my entire goal in life has been to waste less time on commissions every day.

I'd like the random encounters in the next region to be hard when it first gets here, at least. Not Abyss hard, but I would rather not go through a whole region with everything dying in seconds.

Then again I guess I could just use a different party for that. Maybe run Xinyan as an overworld carry.

C6 Fischl + C1+ Sucrose is kinda nuts.

Captain France fucked around with this message at 17:39 on Apr 10, 2021

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013

Sanya Juutilainen posted:

Because people watch silly videos of whales generating 1M crits via super optimal setups towards the crit number, ran for hundreds of tries until the number pops up. And they expect these numbers to be standard and are then :surprised-pikachu: that their Mona-Klee (or sth, not sure which megacrit pyro was early game) combo is getting killed, because it didn't process that 5 % chance to megacrit and the enemy is, whoa, still alive!

I figure a bigger part of it with Zhong Li is that he is very much a support, and supports are not as exciting as carries. Add to it that he's really powerful in universe and that he has loving awesome attack animations, and I can see really wanting him to be a carry and being disappointed that he wasn't. Especially since I believe he was the first limited character to not do great damage?

Why Mihoyo decided to make him an even better support while they were buffing his carry potential from "bad" to "okay," I really don't know. They probably could have just given him some bigger damage numbers on his normals and called it a day.

:iiam:

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013
"Kaeya we need to sneak into another country can you help us out?"

"Why would I be able to do that?"

"Because you're super shady."

"I am not shady. . . here's a letter to my pirate acquaintance, her ship should be in Liyue Harbor right now. Bring meat and alcohol."

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013

Trihugger posted:

Could also maybe put Xiangling in the flex position since Fischl turbos off of overload as well. Not sure how much adding in pyro will mess with superconduct uptime.

Could maybe run Xinyan for similar turbo, a phys buff, and another shield? Especially with the new relics coming out.

But then, I'm always looking for a good reason to run Xinyan. :rock:

Captain France fucked around with this message at 07:05 on Apr 18, 2021

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013

padijun posted:

barbara's skill makes everything wet, so if you use it and switch to diluc, his fire attacks hit for 1.5x damage on enemies affected. the downside is the on field character is wet too, so you can get frozen/vaporized if you're not careful. some numbers pretty much covered bennett, he makes you hit harder and has a nice heal

so if you were trying to do massive burst damage, you'd drop bennett's ult, switch to barbara, use her skill and AA to wet up the enemies, switch to diluc, use his ult, spam left click until the red arrows go away

Not really sure myself, but between having Bennett for healing and Barbara not actually being all that great at applying hydro, would Kaeya maybe be better than Barbara? Won't quite get as many elemental reactions, but definitely a small drop on that than swapping away from Xinqui, plus melt being stronger than vaporize per interaction, plus Kaeya having good energy generation and decent damage himself.

Plus lore, which is why my Diluc team outside of Abyss (I ain't loving around in Abyss) is Diluc, Kaeya, Venti, Diona. Turns out Diona has voice lines for all three of her party members, and she is not a fan of any of them.

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013
Also probably worth noting: You have more than one room.

I'm just gonna set up a screen mining rig in a side room and ignore it.

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013

Boris Galerkin posted:

Venti makes it easier but Sucrose probably works too. I used all the energy generation gems, the normal and cryo attack gems, and also the one that does aoe damage when an enemy dies which I’m not sure if it helped or not but I was failing until I equipped it. I had to drop the purple gem to have enough energy to use so many blue gems though but that’s fine cause the purple gems don’t really synergize with my team anyway. Team was Hu Tao, Qiqi, Xingqui, and Venti. But I’m pretty sure Sucrose would have worked too, and Qiqi could be subbed with some other healer but my Diona isn’t geared up yet. I don’t have anyone ascended up to lvl 90, 80/80 is my max. Once the abyss guy gets to like 30% or so he stops spawning adds.

(Side note, do we actually kill the abyss guy? I’ve beat the thing 3 times now and I swear he just disappears as soon as his shield breaks. I’ve never fought them in the abyss dungeon so I don’t know if this is like a lore thing like how some of the treasure hunters “escape” instead of dying.)

I feel like the Noblesse dungeon hates me because (1) it gives me the physical damage set like 75% of the time and (2) every piece of Noblesse I get has DEF% on it for some reason.

Where the hell do I farm white iron ore? There are hardly any nodes in the places the blacksmith tells me to go and I’m completely out of them. These walls won’t build themself :argh:

Can confirm that Sucrose works too!
Don't remember my gems, but Sucrose/Fischl/Bennet/Zhongli worked well, and given the amount of time I had left and just how much SucrOz wrecked the adds, a different shield user would probably have also worked.
OTOH, my Fischl is C6 and she and Sucrose are my two most invested units (still no 5 star weapons on either one) so \/:)\/

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013

Detheros posted:

Sucrose's best weapon is a 4* (Sacrificial Fragments) so don't worry about that.

Yeah, that's what she has equipped, and even as a "carry" I don't think I'd change that.

A 5 star for Fischl would be nice, though.

Also, I am very annoyed at having to choose between TF/Gambler's great set bonus or TF/Glad's actually having 5 star stats. Right now she's got Gambler's, I think the math added up to that being better when I did it?

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013

THE AWESOME GHOST posted:

I started playing this and it seems cool. For now I’m not really bothering leveling any weapons or characters because I assume in gacha fashion everyone I’m using will be useless soon?

Unless you're gonna start using the gacha now (not a bad idea, the current lineup has a pretty good tank/healer that gets much better with dupes, a healer that can do other things, a ranged DPS in the current best element, and THE TANKIEST TANK WHO CAN LET YOU IGNORE ALL SORTS OF DAMAGING poo poo), you might as well level your dudes up, it's cheap in the early game and only two of the freebie characters (Amber and Lisa) don't still have their uses in some team comps. And of those two, Amber is still pretty great for exploration, flaming arrows are so loving convenient for puzzles and having an archer in general is nice to knock things off of towers and disable robots.

Oh also if you get enough Stardust (the gacha pity currency, basically), you can buy probably the best healer/support in the game this month.

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013
5 stars are rarer and generally intended to be more powerful than 4 stars, at least at zero constellations.

That word "intended" is important, though. Bennett being probably the strongest healer in the game, Fischl being the best off screen DPS, and a lot of 4 stars being better carries than Keqing, dps wise, demonstrates pretty well that we're still pretty early and the devs don't have a full grasp on how stuff interacts and how big of a downside certain problems are.

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013

kater posted:

Extrapolating weird bullshit about dev competency is a bit much.


With just how much stuff there is to balance in this game, I'm not calling the devs incompetent when I say that they failed to get the balance for some things how they had intended because they didn't have a full understanding of how everything works together. You know who has a full enough understanding of how everything interacts with everything else in a game this size to get everything balanced exactly how they intend it to be on launch, let alone significantly before intended launch because of COVID?

Nobody. Nobody gets everything right on the first try. That they got as much of it right on the first try as they did is actually really impressive.

Not really complaining too much, either. I loving love Bennett and Fischl, so them also being overpowered is just icing on the cake, even if it does make pulling a 5 star healer suck. Keqing is really cool and really fun and I would love for her to be stronger, but she still does unique things and this game isn't so hard that one 5 star carry not keeping pace with the other 5 star carries isn't the end of the world.

Just, that's the difference between 4 and 5 stars. 5 stars are much rarer, and generally intended to be a bit overpowered and better than a 0-constellation 4 star at whatever they are supposed to do.
There are niches and outliers where that is not the case, but that is the general rule.

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013

SynthesisAlpha posted:

Yeah but eventually, statistically, you'll get all the 4 stars and still be rolling trying to get the 5s. A year down the line you'll be rolling on a banner where you have all 3 4 stars at C6 so any of them you bought in the store is a waste of 5.8 wishes. That can mean mean difference between hitting pity on a 5 star you really want or not.

There are absolutely reasons to buy someone in the shop. If fischl shows up again before she had a banner I'm buying her since i have her at C5.

On the other hand I still don't have Razor, but I'm not buying him with starglitter because I've already got a couple of carries built up. I'm sure I'll collect him eventually but I'm in no rush.

Yeah, but a year from now you might not still be playing, and even if you are, if you picked well and actually used what you bought at the shop, it'll have been worth more than ~7 rolls.
Really, the bar is "would you be happy to get this from the gacha?" If the answer is yes, you should get it. Not getting the pity count sucks, but if the stuff you got on the way didn't matter much them rolling a C7 wouldn't suck.

Mind you, I wouldn't buy Razor right now either even if I didn't have him, I've got a few carries already built up too. If I didn't, though, I hear he's a pretty good choice.

Also
Poor Xinyan doesn't get to be a carry anymore, Eula outperforms her with the same gear while 20 levels lower.
(Xinyan is on the team in Milileth)

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013

CJ posted:

I'm still salty my 30 pulls to get to pity for Eula gave me 2 Xinyan constellations. I'm never going to use them.

Honestly? Still salty that my (80-however many I pulled between Venti and this banner, AT LEAST 40) pulls for Eula got me 0 Xinyan constellations. She's one of my favorites and I just want her C2 so baaaad.

I would gladly trade you a The Bell, a Favonius Sword dupe, and two Favonius Bows for those if I could.

Also Xinyan gives a shield, a phys buff, and a pretty good burst that looks like it becomes loving great at C2, and runs Tenacity Of The Milileth great, which you should have plenty of if you're using Pale Flame for Eula. Definitely worth considering for her team, even if she is very niche otherwise.

Captain France
Aug 3, 2013

Colorspray posted:

I'm still leveling my team but I'm going to try diona, xinyan and fish for my eula comp experiment.

Not for shields but support. Diona generates mad cryo energy with a sac bow and gives cryo resonance. Xinyans skill at C4 debuffs physical res and increases physical damage while shielded. Throwing a sac gs on xinyan and farming a millelith set for the attack bonus. Synergizes on paper but untested.

I'm running Eula/Beidou(C2)/Diona(C-lots)/Xinyan(C1, Whiteblind, GACHA WHY DON'T YOU WANT ME TO SHRED 'TIL I'M DEAD) some right now, mostly farming and daily quests, although they have more than kept up with my Sucrose/Fischl(C6)/Benett(C5)/Flex (usually Zhong Li) team when I took them into floor 12 of Spiral Abyss and cleared chamber 1 before being killed by I don't even know what in chamber 2. Would definitely recommend Diona, Fischl would probably be better than Beidou but she's already max friendship and glued to another team for me, Xinyan is working all right, but not nearly as well as she sounds on paper.

On paper, with a +Def artifact and Whiteblind, Xinyan's lvl 3 shield is 3/4 as strong as Zhong Li's, and with an HP setup Diona's is 1/2 as strong as Zhong's, not to mention Beidou's shield. (at least in my case according to some calcs I did earlier today.) In practice, Xinyan's lvl 3 shield isn't too easy to get and trying to juggle 2/3 shields on a greatsword user is completely infuriating for me, might swap Xinyan and Zhong next time I try abyss, he shield is usually pretty close to sufficient when you add in Sucrose's tossing everything around, plus she brings Pyro resonance. Bonus, one of my Abyss teams would just be my four favorite characters.

I really, really wish I had Xinyan's C2, and really, really wish they made shields stack in some way. A high constellation Xinyan, or even just a C2 so her burst also refreshes her shield would probably make the shield juggling go much more smoothly--with an ER Sands, my Xinyan's burst is ready pretty often.

(Yes, having both Beidou and Xinyan on my team, plus Xinqui being amazing for a lot of things, means that I'm just gonna keep rolling on this banner until it is gone.)

Edit:
And of course, Diona + Eula provided plenty of energy and crit rate, between those two and Beidou's Favonius Greatsword, I am good on that front and could probably stand to drop Xinyan's recharge sands for another defense artifact. If farming up two Millileths and a Pale Flame and then noticing Diona could use a refresh on her artifacts too didn't leave me flat loving broke on junk artifacts to feed off.

Captain France fucked around with this message at 03:32 on May 27, 2021

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Captain France
Aug 3, 2013

Sanctum posted:

Oh I guess I was supposed to go around the mountain...
So why is Fischl supposed to be better than Lisa? I have them both around level 25 and I need to decide which electrical character I'm going to keep leveling. I do more damage from elemental reactions than attacking, and Lisa is a lot better at spreading those elements.

Fischl's elemental skill doesn't even seem useful for spreading electro since oz focuses on 1 enemy at a time instead of spreading electro status around. Fischl isn't even that good for popping the skill and switching since oz will not pursue any enemies outside his small aggro radius. From what I've seen oz just floats in place unless I keep calling him back to where I'm fighting is, which I can only do when I'm using Fischl. At best oz inflicts electro on a single enemy while I'm using a different character.

At higher levels, Fischl gets a skill that makes Oz fire an extra shot at anything you get an electro reaction on. This usually also reapplies electro, for more reactions.
I can see how this might not be as much of a game changer if you're not using swirl to make this AOE, but Fischl is set and forget, which is also pretty great, and I'm pretty sure if Oz triggers a reaction you get extra energy? I'm not 100% on that because I usually use her with Sucrose, the anemo mage, and machine gun electrocute anything in the AOE for her skills and swirl.

Plus there's that extra attack at C6, but that's not until later.

The big thing is just that, especially with that reaction target, she does a lot of damage from the bench. Also, summoning Oz has a decent AOE right there, as does Fischl's burst. Lisa doesn't, and her AOE needs to charge, and feels really clunky to a lot of people, myself included.

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