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Pilfered Pallbearers posted:Depends. If you’re playing at 1080p it’s not worth it. At 1440p you will see a pretty decent jump with a new GPU, but a much larger one with a full rebuild. By way of comparison: on a GTX 970 and with a i5-6600 backing it up, I can still get consistent above-30-FPS performance in Elden Ring on High at 1920x1200, and I'll be going down to 1080 here with the death of my U2410. And technically that CPU doesn't even meet ER's minimum requirements, in theory. I absolutely assume I'd be heavily CPU-bottlenecked if I tried to upgrade the 970 with a lot of the cheap GPUs now hitting the market, which is why I've been saving up a little bit for a more complete rebuild here in the near-ish future now that GPUs aren't insane and crypto is dissolving. So yeah, Seams, if anything you join me in the "CPU from more than half a decade ago" club in terms of what's really holding your performance back; if you want the new hotness with GPU tech, you'll really want to pair a modern CPU with it.
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Aug 16, 2022 19:27
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Pilfered Pallbearers posted:This is a good idea. Basically. The mom and pop near my folks' previous place was where I got the old machine I launched my career on and where I went for computer parts in the dark days of the noughts. If you're not confident about building your own PC, smaller places usually have pretty acceptable deals on assembled computers.
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Aug 17, 2022 19:35
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So as I begin to gear up to finally replace my war-horse after nearly nine god drat years of faithful service, my main question is: what remains the best retailer for putting all this poo poo together? Is Newegg still king, or have they fallen by the wayside? Is it just a matter of shopping around and sourcing from many different places now? Are there other, smaller retailers I don't know about? This is from the perspective of shopping from the Pacific NW in the USA.
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Oct 27, 2023 22:45
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Helter Skelter posted:You just kinda shop around these days unless you're near a Microcenter (you aren't). Pcpartpicker makes that easy, at least. All right, cool. I know the shape of what I want to actually get (mobo that can support at least two M.2 SSDs + a graphics card, 32GB of RAM, nice fat system drive, up to date CPU + GPU, etc) so now it's just a matter of deciding on individual components (f.ex, Geforce 4060 v. 4070, precise CPU according to my needs, new case vs. recycling my current one, precise PSU required, all that). Time to hit up PCPP, read some reviews over the coming month and come up with something.
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Oct 28, 2023 10:09
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BurritoJustice posted:You are basically in the exact niche for Sapphire Rapids Workstation (Xeon-W). Other posters have chimed in with specific vendor recommendations, I just thought I'd say that Emerald Rapids (Sapphire Rapid's successor) is coming out on December 14. The cores are similar, but they've increased L3 cache per core from 1.875MB to 5MB which is a comically large increase (the 60 core model now has 300MB of L3 cache). Might be worth the short wait if you're going to drop a hundred grand on Xeon-W desktops. Also, total sidebar from the previous page, but laffo what the gently caress. The hot new strat in workstations is going to be running the entire OS from the L3 cache, I suppose. I was noticing that when comparing the 12xxx series to the 13xxx series for Cores; I guess Intel actually is just focusing on absolutely honking huge L2 and L3 caches these days. Butterfly Valley posted:My strong intuition backed up by a quick Google suggests it'll be totally fine. SSDs barely sip power, HDDs aren't that hungry and 12cm fans suck about 4W of juice, and one SATA cable can provide about 54W of power so unless you have a stupid amount of fans it'll be fine. Also, yeah. M2 SSDs use so little power that we're back to just plugging them into boards and having them draw power that way. SATA SSDs use marginally more. I think you'll be fine with your current rigging, Arc Hammer, unless you're trying to power a watercooling motor off a sata connector or something equally wild/dumb.
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Oct 28, 2023 18:21
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As another sidebar, speaking of that image: I guess the glass side panel is just de rigeur these days, huh. Pretty much every case option I've looked at seems to have that.
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Oct 28, 2023 18:55
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WattsvilleBlues posted:Looking to get a GPU that will allow me to play Spider-Man and Spider-Man 2 at 60FPS on my 60Hz screen, 1920x1200. As said, a Geforce 4060 will Do It, and a 4060 Ti will Very Much Do It if you're willing to get slightly spendier (one should run about £300-350). A Radeon 7800XT or GF 4070 would Extremely Do It, but even the Radeon is drifting a bit out of your price range. The Radeon 7700XT and 7600 would also work (though the 7700 and 7800 are so close in price you may as well spring for the 78), but their raytracing performance isn't nearly as good as Nvidia offerings. Rad 7600s are extremely affordable, though (many can be had for ~£220 or so). My gut tells me you'd be most satisfied with a 4060 Ti, but there's options in that price range and it ultimately comes down to chip-maker tilt and precisely how much over or under £300 you want to go. SpaceDrake fucked around with this message at 12:29 on Oct 29, 2023 |
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Oct 29, 2023 11:15
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OneDeadman posted:It's currently 1080p 75hz, but I'll probably upgrade sometime in the future. So a 4080 is hellacious overkill for 1440p unless you plan on playing at full ultra settings with raytracing after your monitor upgrade. At 1080p especially, a standard 4070 will still go well above 60FPS on most applications even at Ultra settings. If it's an application that can't do raytracing, the 4070 will still give you 60FPS even up toward 4k. And a 4070 costs half of what a 4080 does. Basically, unless your heart is absolutely set on a 4080, dropping down your graphics card a bit will still get you great performance for a long time while allowing you save upwards of half a grand. Also: a 13600K will slightly outperform a 12900K and costs a good $75-100 less. If you want ~wild performance~ there's no reason not to go 13xxx/Raptor Lake at this juncture. --- DizzyBum posted:Had a thought while working on new builds. It's been a while since I've bought anything from Newegg. I remember they used to be the place to buy PC parts from (my first build was done in 2004 using basically all parts from Newegg), but I seem to remember something changed in the last several years about them. Are they still okay in certain situations or should they be avoided now? See my earlier: SpaceDrake posted:So as I begin to gear up to finally replace my war-horse after nearly nine god drat years of faithful service, my main question is: what remains the best retailer for putting all this poo poo together? Is Newegg still king, or have they fallen by the wayside? Is it just a matter of shopping around and sourcing from many different places now? Are there other, smaller retailers I don't know about? Helter Skelter posted:You just kinda shop around these days unless you're near a Microcenter (you aren't). Pcpartpicker makes that easy, at least. Just poke around PCPartPicker and look for who has the least expensive option on a part. It'll vary between the Egg, Amazon, B&H and a few other retailers. SpaceDrake fucked around with this message at 16:32 on Oct 29, 2023 |
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Oct 29, 2023 16:26
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Twerk from Home posted:Is this because of the extra L2 cache, which means that the 13600 non-K doesn't count? Apparently so; from the research I've done gearing up for a replacement, the 13600K just barely edges out the 12900K on most tasks (though by a pretty tiny margin, but again, still a significantly less expensive part). That said, the recommendation doesn't factor in individual discounts or deals one might find (like that one you linked, where the 12900 effectively comes with a free motherboard and RAM, jesus christ), so as it's a slightly older part, it's worth keeping an eye out for those.
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Oct 29, 2023 16:52
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WattsvilleBlues posted:Thanks goons, so would this do the job? Should do. If you crank things to xX~ULTRA~Xx you'll probably have to put up with 30FPS in Spiderman 2 (w/ raytracing), but it'll still work just dandy. quote:4060Ti is about £430 which is a bit more than I want to spend just for Spider-Man. Maybe I should wait a year or two for prices to come down? I have an Xbox Series X which is basically all I game on these days, I just really want to play Spider-Man! Sadly, while we aren't in the hell years of the crypto fury, prices still tend to remain fairly high outside of used parts (which is sketch these days) or full market corrections (like what happened to the 4070). Prices probably won't come down in a year or two; it might change depending on what AMD does, but it'd still be a ~30-50 quid adjustment at the very most. Certainly not enough to bring the 4060Ti or 4070 down to the £300 range. Maybe keep an eye out for sales (with Christmas, or even American Thanksgiving/Black Friday coming up), but if PC Spodermons is a goal, you may as well pick the card up sooner than later.
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Oct 29, 2023 20:04
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DoombatINC posted:edit: and don't forget to buy Windows from one of our sellers in SA-Mart, that'll save you another hundo So since this is probably a bit more appropriate here than in a sales thread: I did not know about this, and it rules and it looks like the sellers rule, but if you're doing a completely fresh Windows install after nine years, how does this work exactly? They just email out codes, right? No physical disks? So if I'm putting together a new PC and don't have install disks on hand, how does one go about doing an initial install?
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Oct 31, 2023 18:43
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Well that's incredibly handy. Thank you all!
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Oct 31, 2023 19:39
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Zero VGS posted:Those codes, to my knowledge, are probably "OEM" flagged codes which are cheap, but not transferable to another PC after you use it. If you want a code your can transfer from machine to machine as you upgrade, you would need to either spend hours on the phone swearing to Microsoft that it is the same hardware to get a "pity code" (hard before, impossible the last time i tried), buy another cheap code from them each time you change motherboard/drive at random, or you would need to buy a "Full Packaged Product (FPP)" copy from a value-added reseller like Insight or SHI, which are like $150 but I've used one from Windows 10-11 over a decade and 6 machines. Probably those codes are the cheapest/easiest bet, but be aware. Oh sure, this fits my use profile perfectly. I'm only interested in doing a single install, so those codes will be exactly what I need.
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Nov 1, 2023 15:16
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And also, PCPartPicker will tell you if you're missing any power cables you need.
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Nov 1, 2023 23:19
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Meanwhile, all right. I've been Posting Around The Edges for the past week or so, but I think it's time I finally put the initial draft of my planned new system up for scrutiny. For context: this is going to be a complete system replacement for what is now an eight year old PC, with some parts that would be turning ten next year, that served me faithfully and without complaint during the Great Crypto Insanity, and even now still runs non-raytracing Elden Ring acceptably in most cases. (i5 6600, 16GB RAM, Nvidia GTX970, for the curious.) I am only really considering an upgrade due to Starfield struggling mightily on this system, and knowing that recent heavyweights like CP2077, Baldur's 3 and their ilk would have similar difficulties, which will only increase as PS5-targeted software becomes more common. Parts fatigue (especially with the PSU and the old mSATA SSD) is also a creeping worry. I would ideally like to try to replicate the endurance and longevity of this old system in the new, although I understand that might be a challenge with how raytracing is advancing. In a lot of ways, this is an attempt at recapturing the glory days of the "mid-range" build from when Fantastic Foreskin first made the OP, now that the market seems to support that approach again. What country are you in?: USA Do you live near Microcenter?: The Pacific Northwest is blighted in such a way that no Microcenter will grow here; even our Fry's have withered. What are you using the system for?: Primarily gaming What's your budget?: ~US$1500, though an ideal system would be well below that (so that the money can go toward other enjoyable stuff). The provided part list comes closer to an "ideal" price point, and if it can be squeezed even lower without losing out on quality or performance, that's rad. If you're gaming, what is your monitor resolution / refresh rate?: 1080p, 144mhz. Probably not going to upgrade to 1440p soon, but 1440 performance is (somewhat) a consideration. Going over DisplayPort, but that's a given. How fancy do you want your graphics, from “it runs” to “Ultra preset as fast as possible”?: Ideally, targeting 30 or 60 FPS with good raytracing and high options enabled in current games. This will fall off as time goes on, naturally, but the ideal right now is good (ideally 60FPS) (further emphasis edit: with raytracing) 1080p performance on games designed for the PS5 and its ilk. If you’re doing professional work, what software do you need to use?: Excel, Notepad++ and the like. Largely a non-consideration. My almost-nine-year-old current PC is adequate for it. THE BUILD: https://pcpartpicker.com/list/VCMGJy CPU: Intel Core i5-12600KF 3.7 GHz 10-Core Processor ($196.37 @ Amazon) CPU Cooler: Deepcool AK400 66.47 CFM CPU Cooler ($34.99 @ Amazon) Motherboard: ASRock Z690 PG Riptide ATX LGA1700 Motherboard ($124.99 @ Newegg) Memory: Silicon Power GAMING 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR4-3200 CL16 Memory ($50.97 @ Amazon) Storage: Samsung 980 Pro 2 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive ($119.99 @ Adorama) Video Card: Gigabyte WINDFORCE OC GeForce RTX 4070 12 GB Video Card ($549.99 @ B&H) Case: Fractal Design Pop Air ATX Mid Tower Case ($79.99 @ B&H) Power Supply: Corsair CX650M (2021) 650 W 80+ Bronze Certified Semi-modular ATX Power Supply ($79.99 @ Best Buy) Total: $1237.28 Notes: - OS will be handled in SAMart (thanks for pointing that out, DoombatINC). Add in some thermal compound and that takes the build to right around ~$1250. Other peripherals are extant, fairly new (1 year old or less) and being transferred to this build. - The motherboard has been chosen in part because it lacks WiFi capacity. In fact, this PC does not need WiFi of any kind, and I'd prefer not to have it; my PC will always live about six feet from my fiber modem, so it's completely redundant and the PC will always be wired in with ethernet. Dropping it seems to be a good way to save a few bucks, so alternate mobo suggestions should ideally lack WiFi. - Relatedly, an ATX board is preferred for potential expandability - particularly on the m.2 front. I picked up an m.2 for my current PC in the past year and I love it to bits, and I plan to transfer it (as an additional storage drive, after a format) to this machine once it is ready. Given how large games are getting, it'd be ideal to have another m.2 slot ready to go for expansion in the future, so a board with at least three SSD-capable m.2 slots of some sort would be ideal (and these sadly don't seem to exist in mATX, or are even more expensive). It would also be Nice to have additional RAM slots and a few other PCIe slots ready to go, even if the latter aren't likely to see use. - Speaking of salvage from my old PC, I will be taking an old mSATA WD 2TB platter archive drive and an mSATA BD-RE drive (a WH16NS40, in fact) and putting them into the new machine. The BD-RE has barely seen any use, and I see why modern PCs often drop these drives entirely, but to my millennial-boomer rear end it just feels weird and almost unthinkable to have a PC with no optical drive capacity at all. This has informed the case choice; I would like to have a nice, low-RGB, well-designed case with at least one 5.25 drive bay. -- The WD platter (a WD2003FZEX-00Z4S) has seen significantly more use over the years, but it still seems to be holding strong and I'd like to keep it going, especially since in the new machine it'll be almost exclusively for archive use and doesn't eat up an m.2 slot. Especially with platter storage costing $crumbs, this could be replaced with a refreshed part but I'd like to keep the old one for now to keep price down. - Considering all this, the PSU should still be more than adequate; the final power load with the salvaged components comes in at ~520W, and PCPP shows the PSU as having all the necessary connectors for the devices in question with plenty to spare. (I'm not even using any molex connectors (thank god).) That said, if the current PSU is a poor choice, I'm open to something a bit stronger/more reliable; I'm trying to save money where possible, but I know with a PSU that can be a shaky proposition. - The main points of dithering at this point is over the CPU and maybe the motherboard and storage; prices on the 12600KF are amazing right now compared to its original MSRP, but I know the 13600KF will get better performance. I'm just not sure it'll be an additional $80 of performance, especially given what I'm upgrading from and my target performance. 4TB main drives are also a lot more expensive, but I'm constantly  -ing over how big games are getting. And while I think that main board is a good choice, I'm still not sure it's the best choice.And that's it! Please let me know (Also, thanks to Twerk from Home and Dr. Video Games 0031 for recommending I hold off last year, since waiting for the 4xxx series seems to have paid off  and for great advice in general.)
SpaceDrake fucked around with this message at 17:42 on Nov 2, 2023 |
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Nov 2, 2023 17:21
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OneDeadman posted:Ended up buying and building this a few days ago and after a few days of frustration and troubleshooting why I had no POST: Mounting computer parts do be like that, sometimes. I'm gonna be real nervous about mounting the new CPU right, especially not having done it in so long. Heck, I got a little nervous about installing my first ever m.2, despite that being basically foolproof 
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Nov 3, 2023 13:49
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I mean, aside from objections about what you'll use it for, you could get a MicroATX board with the same chipset and all the same features or more for almost half as much but no RGBs, and that is a completely fuckdiculous PSU for that kind of PC. The case is also expensive for what you get. Are you utterly married to MiniITX as a form factor?
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Nov 4, 2023 02:51
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Branch Nvidian posted:I completely just accepted the ITX tax on that build and didn't even think about recommending changes to a more standard sized computer. Also, there's options in 4TB for an SSD that aren't Samsung but would still be pretty reliable (from Crucial, MSI or PNY especially) and are still a bit cheaper than 2x 2TB Samsungs, and would save you an additional m.2 slot. edit: grack posted:The Terra also has minimal water cooling support, limited to a single 120MM radiator. I mean, I don't think they're interested in water cooling (and a build of that sort can be air-cooled in a larger form factor without much difficulty). I was wondering about airflow in that MiniITX compared to Fractal's "proper" tower offerings, though. SpaceDrake fucked around with this message at 03:22 on Nov 4, 2023 |
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Nov 4, 2023 03:16
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SadBag posted:My case only has 2 usb slots in the front, want to add more along with adding a sd card reader. Was gonna look into adding something like this https://www.newegg.com/p/0DS-00DC-00001 as I have an extra 5 1/2 bay. Does that look like something to go for/does anybody have a recommendation for something better? You'd probably notice the RAM speed drop a little, but not that much. True RAM throughput bottlenecking was a problem in the oughts, but outside of a few non-game applications it largely stopped being a problem around the time DDR4 for main system RAM became a thing. That being said, the 2x16GB stick idea is probably better overall. It remains reasonably cheap (especially at DDR4 3200!) and if nothing else, it's newer parts and you can keep the old sticks as emergency backups. As for the USB expansion bay, nah, that looks perfectly fine. These are, mechanically and electrically, pretty simple parts, so unless the engineering is truly substandard (like miswired ports or whatever) it'll be fine. The main thing you should make sure to check is that your motherboard has the necessary open USB headers (a USB3 20-pin and a USB2 10-pin), because otherwise you'll have nothing to plug the USBs into. Most boards should have at least four or so; make sure to consult your board's manual to make sure you know where to connect things.(also, my post a few days ago was so cringe nobody wanted to comment on the novel, huh  )
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Nov 4, 2023 18:20
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Also, instead of my previous novel, here's a simpler question: a 7800X3D can be aircooled, correct? It doesn't run hot enough to require water cooling?
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Nov 4, 2023 23:07
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So 12600KF, 13600KF or 7800X3D. The question is, do I want to spend $200, 300 or 400 on a processor, and what deals might be available on Cyber Monday. And how well would each one keep up with a standard 4070 (which, post-price cut, is about as spendy as my blood wishes to get on a video card). This is combined with increasingly leaning toward getting a 4TB main SSD instead of a 2TB, because lord knows games aren't about to get smaller.
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Nov 4, 2023 23:38
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A 12600 does not need a liquid CPU cooler, lmao. Even if you overclock like a fiend. (Fake edit: ofc the problem is that actual aircooling requires a mATX/ATX form factor for room.) A 12600KF (which doesn't include the built-into-CPU GPU) costs $30 less. Also, as with a build on the previous page, you will pay a premium for ITX form factor. Are you absolutely certain your apartment cannot comfortably fit a microATX case? Also please love yourself and get a PCIe 4.0 SSD for two dollars more. Also the 4060 is not terribly strong and doesn't have a lot of VRAM for modern applications. Finally, you can get valid, OEM codes for Windows 11 off of SA Mart for ~$20. So that saves a hundo. https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3898368 https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3768345 Here's that build but slightly cheaper in ITX. https://pcpartpicker.com/list/3hw8ZJ And here's that build far cheaper (comes in at under $1000) in mATX. https://pcpartpicker.com/list/pJdvRK (EDIT: To be clear, the point here is that microATX is still reasonably small in most applications and it will save you an additional hundred or so, which can be applied toward a far beefier graphics card in particular - you'd be better served by a RTX 4070 or a RX7800, and even if you went with those in the mATX build, you'd still be under budget.) And remember that we are weeks away from Black Friday/Cyber Monday. At this point it is worth waiting a few weeks to see what deals crop up. SpaceDrake fucked around with this message at 00:08 on Nov 5, 2023 |
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Nov 4, 2023 23:58
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LionArcher posted:Thank you! This should be solid for gaming on one monitor too I assume. Effortlessly. That PC will crush anything current under 4k even with raytracing maxed out. EDIT: gently caress, I might even say that a 4070 will struggle to keep up with that much processor, but past the 4070 GPUs really start getting out of control, pricewise. I'd still consolidate down to a 4TB drive instead of 2x2TB and have room for more drives in the future, but it's up to you. SpaceDrake fucked around with this message at 00:17 on Nov 5, 2023 |
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Nov 5, 2023 00:11
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If the boss is paying in full, no reason not to go with a 7950X3D. The main question, even for the stock model, is cooling, as both the 13900KS and the 7950X3D pull a lot of wattage and require an equal amount of cooling.
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Nov 5, 2023 19:07
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clockworkjoe posted:What's a good 27 inch 4k monitor with a good refresh rate? I have a 2060 super GPU. Price is ideally $600 max. Using it for editing video and photos and some gaming. This sort of question is exactly what Movax's House of Monitor Chat exists for. (But, yeah, 27" 4k is a bit difficult. The Monitor thread will have more info.)
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Nov 5, 2023 21:03
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Just to be clear, are you looking for a desktop or a laptop?
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Nov 5, 2023 23:11
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Pink Mist posted:For a desktop. Portability isn’t a factor anymore. $900 PC. Not a whole lot of gaming power by modern standards, but it fulfills your requirements, should still be reasonably sized, won't use a ton of electricity, and between the backplane and the case, should give you 8 USBs to play with. You can also plug in something like this to the front of the case (you'll have to remove a fan to do so, but not a big deal in this build) for $30 and you'll have support for every kind of card and USB media known to Man and Christ. This also leaves you with $1100 for the monitor, though needs on that can vary a lot more and you should consult the monitor thread about that aspect of things. And of course, if you need more firepower the CPU and GPU can scale up for $$$, and this may necessitate a different motherboard as well, which could be both less and more expensive, depending. EDIT: And of course, the note about Black Friday+ still applies. A few weeks' patience could net dividends. SpaceDrake fucked around with this message at 23:52 on Nov 5, 2023 |
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Nov 5, 2023 23:46
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Box wine posted:No, the whole 8x/8x is for sli/crossfire. Running two gpus in other words. Running m.2s should have no effect whatsoever on the mode your graphics card runs at. Though you are correct in realizing the lanes can become a limit and if you read the manual there's a bunch of asterisks saying, if you run this usb header this other one is shut off and if you run these m.2s your sata is disabled and so forth. A bit notable on this front is that, going by posted specs, a lot of especially modern boards (ones made with Raptor Lake-adjacent B760/Z790 chipsets, or Raphael/Storm Peak-adjacent B650/X670 chipsets) actually have enough lanes going to run pretty much everything, even if you max out the slots. I know Intel B760 has some of its own limitations (limited-at-best overclocking for one) but especially depending on board layout and form factor compared to chipset, it appears that the annoying slot-juggling you can sometimes face is becoming less of a thing. I know I had to worry about slot nonsense with the ancient motherboard I'm currently using and its sole, then-rare m.2 slot. TLDR, if you go shopping for a new motherboard today, make sure to do a little research and see if it's still facing any slot limitations. Higher-end or smartly engineered ones should be mostly free of those problems at this point.
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Nov 6, 2023 18:07
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Salt Fish posted:This PC (7700k) actually isn't showing it's age at all except when I built it I used a 480gb SSD and a 2TB RAID10 of HDDs. This was perfect for OS drive and then all my hobbyist A/V content. Games today however are now 80+gb and the latest releases want to stream assets while you turn the camera(!). Good luck running Talos Principle 2 off a HDD basically. So that's been an interesting way for a build to age. Yup. See also: even moreso than the precise CPU or GPU I pick, the biggest hem-hawing point on my current planned Christmas build is between a 2TB m.2 SSD, or a 4TB SSD of similar caliber and read/write speeds which might cost upwards of three times as much, but the idea would eventually be to fill all three m.2s with these 4TBs over time as my needs expand (versus just policing what I have installed on smaller, less expensive 1-2TB drives and hoping installs take a good while longer to crest much past the 200GB range). Games are not going to get smaller, on balance, and evidently streaming assets straight from the SSD is now just going to be a standard Thing because the PS5 and XSX can do it, so the age of platterdrives for anything other than pure archival storage well and truly seems to be at an end. I actually picked up a WD Black SN770 as a stopgap game holder back in August or so, and it's worked well enough (to the point that it will go on to live in the new system as the preliminary secondary drive), but it's also just made clear how much the rest of my system is on its last legs and the time for a general upgrade has come. It really is an end-of-life state I didn't quite see coming, even if it is incredibly obvious in retrospect. m.2 SSDs in particular just offer so many obvious advantages over any other storage solution that it was a little foolish to think that developers wouldn't eventually start requiring that technology and the benefits that come with it.
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Nov 6, 2023 19:31
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So, as another Specific Build Question: precisely how much cooler does a 12600KF, 13600KF and/or a 7800X3D actually require? I know they're air-coolable from a previous question, but is it possible to get away with just a ~$35-40 cooler like a Thermalright Peerless Assassin or Deepcool 400, or at those wattage levels, even if they aren't as extreme for the 12600, do you need to start thinking about something heavier like a Deepcool 620 or a Be Quiet Dark Rock? I've been out of the CPU game long enough that I no longer have a good "feel" for what kind of CPU requires what, exactly, and I'm not quite sure how much I should spend on a CPU cooler vs. what's actually needed.
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Nov 6, 2023 22:16
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Twerk from Home posted:The Peerless Assassin is an outstanding cooler for the money. It's just a real winner. It is absolutely an appropriate cooler for those chips, you wouldn't be giving up on much potential at all. Cool! I was thinking the PA just looked like "that's a 620 or Dark Rock, but for like half the money, what's the catch", but if it really is just That Good and the gimmick is that Thermalright is just willing to slice their competition off at the knees, hell, I'm all for it.
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Nov 6, 2023 22:33
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Holy loving loly, we're back to the early 90s in terms of renting PCs (or at least some chucklefucks are trying it again). I remember my folks got roped into a scheme like this for a bit in ~1990 before realizing it was a scam and they were better off buying a PC. That IBM they bought was the machine I first played Wing Commander and ZZT on But yeah this is hideous predatory nonsense meant to prey on the desperate who cannot do price comparisons or lack access to the ability to do so. Never doubt the late-capital impulse to Seek Rent in any way possible. SpaceDrake fucked around with this message at 03:36 on Nov 7, 2023 |
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Nov 7, 2023 03:32
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Kwolok posted:These days for building a higher-ish end gaming pc, is intel or amd the clear cut ahead of the competition? Or is it still a toss up? It depends. The AMD Ryzen 7 7800X3D is the best gaming CPU on the market. Full stop. It outperforms parts more expensive than it, from both manufacturers, on games and game-related apps, and in its price bracket is the absolute best value you can purchase, dollar for dollar. ... in its price bracket. $400 is still a lot, and while you can pretty easily argue that if you were willing to spend $300 on a CPU, you should bite the bullet and get the 7800 for one benjamin more, if you're looking to spend even less, down to the $200 range or so, it gets a lot muzzier. 12th-generation Intel Core parts (the 12### series) are a bit older, but they're currently priced very competitively. The 13th-gen parts have largely had their lunch eaten by the 7800 (though remain valid-ish for non-game applications), but the result of this pressure is that the previous gen parts - especially the "KF" versions (unlocked, and lacking the integrated on-die GPU) - have seen very aggressive price drops. The i5 12600KF is currently ~$195 on Amazon, and the i7 12700KF is $277. These are pretty aggressive prices for what you get, the 12600 especially - you don't get the huge L3 cache and a few other gubbins that the 7800X3D has, but you still get a hexa-core or octa-core CPU with some additional "efficiency cores" for background tasks, and you still have more than enough CPU to get good framerates at 1080p and 1440p, all for about the same thermal footprint as the 7800. Much more important, though, is that the 12### series is both a slightly older part, and also hasn't sold amazingly well even prior to the release of the 7800 (the Ryzen 7700x and 7600x having also been competitive and affordable parts, as well as the wide availability of the 5#00 series) and so these parts have been seeing some steep discounts this year. There have been several times in the past 180 days where the 12600KF has gone down to $150, and the 12700 has hit all the way down to $215. At those prices, they go from "decent budget chips" to "complete and utter no-brainers", the 12700 especially. That discount puts the 12700 at almost half its debut MSRP, and an octa-core processor with supplementary cores at that price could have a kilobyte of processing cache and still be worth it. (The 12###es have a lot more than that.) Combine this with the 12###'s ability to use slightly slower but less expensive DDR4, and widespread availability of motherboards, and you end up with an incredibly attractive and aggressive budget option. The 5#00 Ryzens struggle a bit to compete there, and the other 7#00 series haven't been discounted that aggressively. Yet. This is why some of us are saying people should really hold off for Black Friday and whatnot. There's a pretty good chance that, over the holiday period, older 12### Intel parts are going to be priced to move, if the past six months have been any indication, and there may be similar moves from AMD to try and compete (early October saw the 7800X3D go on sale for a bit for $349, which influenced the conversation a different direction again). It's really going to depend on your budget and priorities, but there are probably going to be some fantastic CPU deals around the time of November 24th. So: it depends. SpaceDrake fucked around with this message at 05:56 on Nov 7, 2023 |
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Nov 7, 2023 05:48
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Okay, we have a "everyone shut the hell up" moment. (EDIT: Or not, these are almost certainly scam sellers and I am dumb. Do not spend money on this.)Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:Amazon does not have to and will not fulfill the purchase if it's a scam. The best they'll do is give you your money back. And that is 100% a scam. OP for posterity: In just the past... few hours? A seller went live on Amazon with deals on graphics cards. Absurd deals. Deals that seem way too good to be true. Best AMD card prices on Amazon in forever. (And some deals of questionable taste.) Naturally, there's a lot of reason to be skeptical, and certainly shipping will take a while (since it's coming from mainland China), but even if it turns out to be a complete scam, going through Amazon would, I think, still mean that Amazon itself is required to make good on the purchase even if it doesn't initially come through. Folks with more recent Amazon experience can maybe chime in. I'm still having to talk myself out of picking up that 7900 XTX, because if it is legit, that is an absurd deal for $440. Hell, it'd be an absurd deal with a protection plan. At $440, a 7900 XTX would still do better in raytracing than a NV 4070 Standard (even with AMD's less-good raytracing implementation), and would just loving flatten it in non-raytraced apps, and it'd cost $100 less. SpaceDrake fucked around with this message at 18:12 on Nov 7, 2023 |
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Nov 7, 2023 18:03
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Branch Nvidian posted:My sibling in spirituality, those are scam sellers. Do not buy them. I kind of figured . I just wasn't sure how commonplace this was in TYOOL 2023.Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:Amazon does not have to and will not fulfill the purchase if it's a scam. The best they'll do is give you your money back. And that is 100% a scam. Also, just, lol. It's good to know that Amazon is just the wild loving west now, and that unless it's a direct sale from a known vendor, you are 100% taking your money and wellbeing into your own hands with every purchase you make on the platform. Let this stand as an informative lesson. SpaceDrake fucked around with this message at 18:15 on Nov 7, 2023 |
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Nov 7, 2023 18:12
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Trust no one, not even yourself. Especially with the scam listings now having been pulled down; at least someone over there was paying attention, seemingly. I'm very slightly sad, and slightly disturbed, that Maxsun's breaches of good taste appear to be largely sold out in legitimate sales.
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Nov 7, 2023 18:48
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So, a few things, as while I'm guessing budget is nigh unlimited, there's a few things that I do think could be tweaked - As Salt Fish and I ended up discussing upthread, for game purposes the era of the platter drive is more or less actively coming to an end as we shitpost. More and more games are being released that will expect to be able to stream assets off the drive constantly (as in, "reload assets as you turn the camera" streaming) because the PS5 is capable of doing this, and will require streaming from an SSD to operate correctly. So by and large, you won't be able to load up those double 20TB platter drives with games - if you try, they just won't work correctly. I think keeping a single platter drive around as a media & ancient game archive still has merit, but I think the budget here would be far better spent on a single platter drive in the 4-6TB range, and then spend the rest of that money filling your M-key m.2 slots out with 2-4TB, good-quality SSDs (typically Samsung and WD drives, but research can help here). That'll give you plenty of game storage and it will all operate lightning-quick. You've picked a motherboard with plenty of m.2 slots, so you may as well use them. - If this is primarily a game device, I think you'll be better served by a 7800X3D, and you'll save a bit for other things in so doing. (Though if this machine is going to be used significantly for other things, a Raptor Lake refresh makes more sense.) - I've heard some reports that NZXTs can be pretty noisy, especially under load, but other goons will have to chime in on this. - I'm a bit curious: given the rest of it being a bit of a shrine to excess, why the 4080? You can get a 4090 for a few hundred dollars more, and this feels like the kind of build where you go whole hog on everything. Is it a slot-blocking issue? - Similarly: 32GB on this monster? What are we, people who conserve money? This one is easily expandable in the future, at least.- As always, remember that you can save a hundo by picking up Win11 from SA Mart and just putting together your own boot drive on an $8 thumbdrive. And of course, standard caveats for buying mere weeks before the biggest discount season of the year, though I wonder how much utility you'd actually get from that. Otherwise, it looks "fine", though I'm a little curious about the choice of the PRO ART over other, potentially more affordable motherboards. (Quad M-key setups still tend to run pretty rich, but not quite as spendy as that board.)Basically, I'm compelled to ask: are you really ready to spend four grand on a computerbox?
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Nov 8, 2023 07:04
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Comfy Fleece Sweater posted:You know, you’d be surprised how generous one can be when it’s not your money Ahhhhhhhhhhh. Of course. I was kind of wondering, given your previous comments. Well then, by all means So in that case, first off, the 14900 does make a lot more sense, though you still might find that the top-end Zen4 Ryzen 9s (7900X or 7950X) fit your needs similarly well while being slightly easier to justify to the bosses and using significantly less power (as we discussed in the Intel thread, strapping sixteen Pentium 4s to your nominally eight-core processor has some effects on thermal and electrical efficiency) and thus being easier and significantly less loud to cool at load. Prices aren't that far off from each other, though, especially if you go for the 14900KF (because gently caress knows you won't need the iGPU on the standard K in a build like this) so it really is up to you and what you want to prioritize. Also, while this is still going to primarily be a game """testing"""" machine, since it sounds like you will be doing a more-than-nominal amount of dev/media work on it, another set of 2x16GB modules wouldn't cost much, and going to 64GB will help with IDEs and such. Modern ones can be lorge fuckers, and it's nice to give them room to lounge about. Also, here's hoping to your vendor getting a 4090 back in stock. The platters now make a lot more sense (and I am fully aware of how large development environments and the like can get, especially during active dev), so take my previous advice more as a hint: while more than 2TB of SSD will probably be hard to justify to The Benefactors, in practical use you might find it a little thin for a heavy gaming environment, so it might help to spend a little of your own money on an additional m.2 SSD or two. (Do note that the board will disable SATAs 5 thru 8 if you plug something in to the 4th m.2 slot, but that shouldn't be an issue with this build.) Beyond that, it all comes down to what you can justify to the folks footing the bill, so shine on in the hearts of men, you snuggly knit cardigan of a pink diamond. 
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Nov 8, 2023 08:03
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Moreover, the 5600X3D has more or less ceased to exist online, and I imagine fab on non-AM5 parts has either completely wrapped or is seriously winding down, so that might be your last shot at getting a 5600X3D that isn't eBay. If you're near a Microcenter and they're doing that deal, it is extraordinarily worth it.
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Nov 8, 2023 17:25
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Well, TIL! (Doesn't help that I live in a blighted, Microcenter-less land, even though there's a retail space that became available a few years ago that would seemingly be perfect for their purposes. But every day that location (a former Fry's) sits abandoned, it lies potentially exposed to the wet Portland climate and in need of possibly more repair. I know Microcenter is being very cautious about expansion, but it does feel like a few of these old Fry's locations would make excellent store locations. The Portland suburbs one was really busy and successful, up until Fry's hit their general malaise period. It's even right next to a major highway and near a commuter rail line!) SpaceDrake fucked around with this message at 18:10 on Nov 8, 2023 |
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Nov 8, 2023 17:45
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