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Mellow Seas posted:There are plenty of good Democrats, this is weird and I don't know why we're buying into the "GE Thread" idea that every Democrat is bad and only Bernie Sanders (or fuckin' 95 year old Mike Gravel or something) was an acceptable candidate. Would the parts of the party currently supporting Biden want to fall behind any of these people? I mean, that's the answer to why Bernie lost in 2016 and 2020 so I don't think in 2024 the moderates will suddenly stomach the idea of backing someone like Bernie or half the names on that list.
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Mar 21, 2022 20:15
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Gumball Gumption posted:Would the parts of the party currently supporting Biden want to fall behind any of these people? I mean, that's the answer to why Bernie lost in 2016 and 2020 so I don't think in 2024 the moderates will suddenly stomach the idea of backing someone like Bernie or half the names on that list. e: His approval ratings among Dems are usually in the 80-90% range so I think it would be pretty hard to knock him off as things stand now - either he would have to choose not to run, or conditions would have to change. Mellow Seas fucked around with this message at 20:21 on Mar 21, 2022 |
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Mar 21, 2022 20:16
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Solkanar512 posted:Wait, so now if you question whether or not your mom or some rando blogger is as much of the Democratic establishment as paid members of the Trump campaign/administration inciting crowds or filing lawsuits are members of the Republican establishment, it's just a "no true scotsman fallacy"? Give a me break. I'll gladly concede the Democratic impotent tantrum in hopes of subverting the electoral college was much more successful than the Republican one was, if that makes it any better they got a whole ten people to go faithless, actually including a couple of republicans!
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Mar 21, 2022 20:21
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Mellow Seas posted:That's not a bad point; I suppose it depends on how unpopular or obviously unhealthy Biden is in late 2023. Yeah, I feel like that's the big unspoken part when people float out names. However you think we got here, manipulation or the will of the people, one of the big supposed lessons from Biden's campaign is that he's as left as the Democrats can go. Any more left and you can't win swing voters and you potentially even start losing blue dog Democrats. Or if you think manipulation is how we got here Biden is the furthest left that will be allowed. Either way If he's as left as they can go then the options are slim.
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Mar 21, 2022 20:21
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I think that Biden was chosen by the primary voters more than anything because they thought he would beat Donald Trump, which was the #1 priority of every single Democratic voter in 2020. I don't think it was because everybody decided that they just love Biden so much more than any other option. I'm pretty sure Biden wouldn't have won out if his opponent hadn't been exactly who he was, and the threat of re-election was so, so deeply dire.
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Mar 21, 2022 20:25
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How are u posted:I think that Biden was chosen by the primary voters more than anything because they thought he would beat Donald Trump, which was the #1 priority of every single Democratic voter in 2020. I don't think it was because everybody decided that they just love Biden so much more than any other option. I'm pretty sure Biden wouldn't have won out if his opponent hadn't been exactly who he was, and the threat of re-election was so, so deeply dire. I mean that's the point though, that shows that Biden is what was needed to form a coalition of voters to get a Democrat across the line. Biden is as far left as a viable presidential candidate can get according to everything we're seeing unless something magical has happened and candidates to the left of Biden are no longer considered automatically dead in the water like in 2016 or 2020. If Bernie was put forward in 2024 as a serious candidate it would be the first time he was running where people actually thought he could win instead of being dismissed as too left, things that happened and played out the last two times he ran.
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Mar 21, 2022 20:32
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How are u posted:Pretty much. When the alternative is Trump or somebody who managed to out-Trump Trump even more so in racism and fascism, well I'll be campaigning for and voting for Joe Biden without a shred of hesitation. We can't afford to lose our democracy to fascists, not if we want a chance of continuing to try to build a better more just and more equitable nation and to tackle climate change. So how are we defining racism and fascism here? Biden kept a lot of Trump's policy and expanded on some of the most openly racist and fascist institutions.
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Mar 21, 2022 20:32
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Mellow Seas posted:There are plenty of good Democrats, this is weird and I don't know why we're buying into the "GE Thread" idea that every Democrat is bad and only Bernie Sanders (or fuckin' 95 year old Mike Gravel or something) was an acceptable candidate. Your inclusion of Raimondo on this list is...really something. Nobody gets anywhere in Rhode Island state level politics without the approving nod from the remnants of the Patriarca crime family.
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Mar 21, 2022 20:36
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Lib and let die posted:Your inclusion of Raimondo on this list is...really something. Nobody gets anywhere in Rhode Island state level politics without the approving nod from the remnants of the Patriarca crime family.
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Mar 21, 2022 20:57
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Mellow Seas posted:Fine, then there's 22. I know you have a vendetta (fake e: Italian loan word unintentional) against RI politicians and from what you've said it seems like you have really good reasons for it. I don't even know that much about her, honestly, as I don't follow RI politics, I just know she was governor of a state I visit often and find pleasant enough. gently caress 'er! poo poo, I didn't think it'd be that easy of a sell. You gotta try the cleah chowdah next time you're in town if you haven't already! eta for content/new viewers: my aunt is a 20+ year veteran elected democrat in the ri state house of representatives. in her time there she has used her connections to bury a slam-dunk case against her son who failed out of cop school and became a corrections officer at the juvenile facility, raped a 16 year old girl while she was in his care (insomuch as any CO has the best interests of the imprisoned in mind), had the video evidence disappeared, had his disciplinary record sealed, and then went on to vote against a bill that would protect abortion rights on a state level months after pressuring her (now ex-) daughter-in-law into aborting her child because it early testing showed it would have downs' syndrome - let me repeat that - an elected democrat, descended from the patriarca crime family name coerced her daughter in law to do a eugenics and then voted to weaken abortion protections in her state so long as the smallest town in the smallest state retains an accepted and beloved member of the democrat party with such a horrendously disgusting set of moral stains on her character, not a single upstream democrat will ever have my support because the fish rots from the head down. Lib and let die fucked around with this message at 21:09 on Mar 21, 2022 |
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Mar 21, 2022 21:02
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Lib and let die posted:poo poo, I didn't think it'd be that easy of a sell. You gotta try the cleah chowdah next time you're in town if you haven't already!  !(I mean of course it's fine if you're into it but there's no selling me on that stuff.  )
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Mar 21, 2022 21:05
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Mellow Seas posted:Oh God I hate that poo poo, although I still prefer it to "Manhattan chowder" (the tomato juice kind). Creamy New England or Don't get it somewhere bourgie like Providence, you gotta go down into Richmond or Narragansett (not the touristy parts) to get the real good clear chowder where they make it the same way the tribe did back before we did a genocide on them.
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Mar 21, 2022 21:10
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Lib and let die posted:Don't get it somewhere bourgie like Providence, you gotta go down into Richmond or Narragansett (not the touristy parts) to get the real good clear chowder where they make it the same way the tribe did back before we did a genocide on them. I'll consider it, most of my exposure is in Westerly (which is also very touristy, of course) or homemade versions from CT (very popular at town fairs in the eastern half) which I'm sure aren't the gold standard but have been made with plenty of love and attention. I didn't know it was a native recipe! Sometimes I go to a chowder competition in Mystic, CT and almost every year the Westerly High School culinary club wins... with a creamy recipe.  (Of course that's mostly CT palates doing the judging, and also they cheat by giving out free clam fritters with every cup.)\/\/\/\/ yeah I mean geographically based food preferences tend to make stereotypes out of most of us. Fun derail, dems good or whatever Mellow Seas fucked around with this message at 21:18 on Mar 21, 2022 |
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Mar 21, 2022 21:13
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Mellow Seas posted:I'll consider it, most of my exposure is in Westerly (which is also very touristy, of course) or homemade versions from CT (very popular at town fairs in the eastern half) which I'm sure aren't the gold standard but have been made with plenty of love and attention. Creamy does in fact own, but me being the walking, talking sterotype I am (reference) I can't deny the superiority of a thin broth for busting open a clam cake, dipping it in the chowder, and letting the warm, fluffy dough suck up a bunch of broth anyway uh, dems bad I guess, sorry for the chowder derail
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Mar 21, 2022 21:16
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Lib and let die posted:poo poo, I didn't think it'd be that easy of a sell. You gotta try the cleah chowdah next time you're in town if you haven't already! time was you could argue that people like this were outliers, but, well. democratic elected officials at all levels have long since proved sex crimes are not a matter that concern them. I wonder what the next step of the Cuomo Comeback Tour is going to be.
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Mar 21, 2022 21:17
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Mellow Seas posted:e: Also if Biden can run at 80 why not Bernie at 81? "Super old left wing chief executive" worked out okay for California. The Castro brothers are the only ones there who give a good impression. But yeah, bringing up Bernie's age when compared to Trump and Biden was majorly disingenuous.
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Mar 21, 2022 21:40
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As a New Englander I can confirm Rhode Island is very corrupt, famously so. I wouldn't trust any politicians from there.
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Mar 21, 2022 21:48
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Mellow Seas posted:There are plenty of good Democrats, this is weird and I don't know why we're buying into the "GE Thread" idea that every Democrat is bad and only Bernie Sanders (or fuckin' 95 year old Mike Gravel or something) was an acceptable candidate. The Democrats are hosed.
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Mar 21, 2022 22:09
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Can I be on the list? I promise to make all policy decisions via SA forum poll.
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Mar 21, 2022 22:11
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Gumball Gumption posted:As a New Englander I can confirm Rhode Island is very corrupt, famously so. I wouldn't trust any politicians from there. As awful as it looks from the outside, I cannot effectively communicate to you in words the level of depravity they reveal and, in fact, revel in, when they think they're in a safe place with their family and can drop the mask. Things like...leaving her 60-something year old late-stage Parkinson's-affected husband in the care of her 90 year old, hard-of-hearing mother while she herself was sitting in the fanciest loving hospital room at miriam loving baptist hospital getting the 5 loving star local loving celebrity treatment because she had a facelift go sideways and get infected while she left two elderly citizens, who EACH need their own personal care professional...in the care of each other at home.
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Mar 21, 2022 22:20
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punk rebel ecks posted:The Democrats are hosed. Probably, but a lot of it doesn't have anything to do with the bland humans they can run
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Mar 21, 2022 22:20
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Lib and let die posted:As awful as it looks from the outside, I cannot effectively communicate to you in words the level of depravity they reveal and, in fact, revel in, when they think they're in a safe place with their family and can drop the mask. Things like...leaving her 60-something year old late-stage Parkinson's-affected husband in the care of her 90 year old, hard-of-hearing mother while she herself was sitting in the fanciest loving hospital room at miriam loving baptist hospital getting the 5 loving star local loving celebrity treatment because she had a facelift go sideways and get infected while she left two elderly citizens, who EACH need their own personal care professional...in the care of each other at home. Not to turn it into a huge derail but one of the things I always want people to understand about solidly blue places like MA or RI is that a lot of the people here vote blue for the same reason lots of people in solidly red states blue red, you're expected to culturally so you do. Democrat machine politics dominate Rhode Island and often looked very little like what national Democrats look like and have survived on the backs of "you vote Dem because your family votes Dem, you've always voted Dem". Edit: to give more content here is a good piece I read recently from Jacobin about Rhode Island local politics, what things can look like at a state level in solid blue states, and what local progressives are doing and not doing about it. https://www.jacobinmag.com/2022/01/reclaim-rhode-island-bernie-left-machine-politics-local-government Gumball Gumption fucked around with this message at 22:31 on Mar 21, 2022 |
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Mar 21, 2022 22:26
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punk rebel ecks posted:The Democrats are hosed. To continue on that theme, here's a post-mortem of a Minnesotan Democrat going through all of the typical motions once they lose an election. Highlights include: Democrats cannot fail, they can only be failed. I supported Trump's wall and they still didn't like me. The party moved left and radicals like AOC made me lose. https://www.inforum.com/opinion/mcfeely-democratic-party-didnt-leave-collin-peterson
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Mar 21, 2022 22:39
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Here we go again... https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/video-shows-wisconsin-officer-kneeling-neck-12-year-old-girl-rcna20826 An off-duty police officer in Kenosha, WI working as a middle school resource officer intervened to break up a fight between two girls. As he was pulling one away, the other girl kept attacking. So, being a cop from Kenosha, he restrained that 12 year old girl the only way Wisconsin cops apparently know how - by kneeling on her neck. And it was caught on surveillance cameras. Article in full: NBC News" posted:
Like, holy gently caress, it's a 12 year old. You don't need to put your body weight on them to restrain them, and there is no reason to loving handcuff them. Teachers used to break up fights on occasion when I was in highschool and they managed to do it without throwing someone to the floor, kneeling on their neck, or handcuffing them. And then the rear end in a top hat gets put on vacation as a consequence and has the gall to whine that this is all very hard on him. gently caress cops always, forever and a day.
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Mar 21, 2022 22:43
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As someone who has worked in a field of where at times you needed to restrain teenagers, I never in my wildest dreams understood why you would kneel on someone’s neck.
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Mar 21, 2022 22:49
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punk rebel ecks posted:As someone who has worked in a field of where at times you needed to restrain teenagers, I never in my wildest dreams understood why you would kneel on someone’s neck. there's really no reason to do it in any field unless you're some kind of sadistic rear end in a top hat who loves hurting people also known as "a cop"
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Mar 21, 2022 22:52
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Hope that table wasn't too badly damaged.
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Mar 21, 2022 22:53
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Yinlock posted:there's really no reason to do it in any field unless you're some kind of sadistic rear end in a top hat who loves hurting people Edit - Misread post. punk rebel ecks fucked around with this message at 23:06 on Mar 21, 2022 |
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Mar 21, 2022 22:59
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punk rebel ecks posted:You’d be extremely surprised. Especially when people start flat out attacking you when politely asking them to leave or escorting them out. It’s hardly an everyday thing but restraints have their purposes. Certainly not in a public school with a 12 year old unless the girl presented substantial danger, like was about to stab somebody. I think you might want to read that again because I think you both agree. Nobody should be kneeling on necks in any sort of restraint situation.
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Mar 21, 2022 23:04
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Jaxyon posted:I think you might want to read that again because I think you both agree. Nobody should be kneeling on necks in any sort of restraint situation. You’re right. Sorry I’m phone posting.
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Mar 21, 2022 23:06
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So how bad is the Ketanji Brown Jackson hearing going.
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Mar 21, 2022 23:35
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Velocity Raptor posted:Here we go again... Oh my God they're literally slap fighting it's a slap fight between 12 year old girls. What cowards.
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Mar 21, 2022 23:39
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Jaxyon posted:Since apparently the only part important about the last time I mentioned this seemed to be specifically which tool the CBP was oppressing minorities with: The Ukrainians are being paroled into the US as refugees, this means that they are given a set period of time to be in the US before they have to apply for admission, which is the term for being legally allowed to be in the United States, versus entry, which is being physically present in the US. That being said, were you aware that most of the Haitians picked up at Del Rio were allowed to stay in the United States? And that President Biden gave temporary protected status to over 100,000 Haitians last July? https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/watch-live-mayorkas-joins-white-house-briefing-amid-scrutiny-of-u-s-treatment-of-haitian-migrants https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2021/08/03/2021-16481/designation-of-haiti-for-temporary-protected-status
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Mar 22, 2022 00:13
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Velocity Raptor posted:
So? He kneeled on her for all of 30 seconds, can't tell if it was on her neck since the video resolution is so low. And handcuffing is the easiest was to control her. Getting rid of resource control officers has done nothing but increase violence in schools. https://who13.com/news/parents-continue-to-raise-concerns-about-violence-in-des-moines-public-schools/ WHO posted:DES MOINES, Iowa – More parents are speaking out about violence in Des Moines Public Schools. Last week, they brought their concerns about a lack of school resource officers to the school board. The board did not do anything about it, leaving some parents feeling frustrated and fearful to send their kids to school. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Mar 22, 2022 00:24
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PeterCat posted:The Ukrainians are being paroled into the US as refugees, this means that they are given a set period of time to be in the US before they have to apply for admission, which is the term for being legally allowed to be in the United States, versus entry, which is being physically present in the US. Hey, did you see this post from last thread? shimmy shimmy posted:Hang on, Jayxon didn't say they whipped them. He said they were horseback cops with whips, which is also what the article says. Or am I misunderstanding something? More details on the click-through since I can't figure out how to reproduce the post with the links in this thread, but I was wondering if I was misunderstanding something about the situation you were talking about.
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Mar 22, 2022 00:31
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PeterCat posted:So? He kneeled on her for all of 30 seconds, can't tell if it was on her neck since the video resolution is so low. And handcuffing is the easiest was to control her. I cannot begin to imagine that kneeling on the neck of a child would be good, no matter how short the amount of time spent is. Nor is it likely to be necessary.
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Mar 22, 2022 00:32
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PeterCat posted:The Ukrainians are being paroled into the US as refugees, this means that they are given a set period of time to be in the US before they have to apply for admission, which is the term for being legally allowed to be in the United States, versus entry, which is being physically present in the US. Your link goes into detail about how 10's of thousands of Haitians are being expelled back to Haiti and the US has been using Title 42 to deny entry to the majority of refugees/asylum seekers not from "white" countries. PeterCat posted:So? He kneeled on her for all of 30 seconds, can't tell if it was on her neck since the video resolution is so low. And handcuffing is the easiest was to control her. "He only kneeled on a child for 30 seconds" oh neat Paper on school cops: https://www.brookings.edu/blog/brown-center-chalkboard/2018/11/08/does-more-policing-make-middle-schools-safer/ NYT artilce on school cops https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/12/us/schools-police-resource-officers.html Study from think tank on cops in schools: https://justicepolicy.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/02/educationunderarrest_fullreport.pdf Police in schools don't appear to have any significant affect at all on safety or school shootings, but what they HAVE been shown increase substantially punishments and arrests of minority children, disproportionately, and they're disproportionately put in schools that are majority children of color. If you're going to make a claim about the positive effects of school cops, while defending a grown person kneeling on a child, you better come with better than a local news story. There's not even any data in that poo poo.
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Mar 22, 2022 00:47
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PeterCat posted:So? He kneeled on her for all of 30 seconds, can't tell if it was on her neck since the video resolution is so low. And handcuffing is the easiest was to control her. 30 seconds is long enough to put someone unconscious. The guy is twice her size, he could easily hold her down with no trouble, without the need for a technique like that. That article has some iffy reasoning. Two of the people quoted talk about it being better when they were kids, which doesn't tell us the causes of increased fighting or even if there really are any. The district is clearly taking steps to moderate the issues that lead to fights. Those steps need a while to work. Background: I practice a martial art that teaches restraints and chokes, as well as working in schools. On the occasions I've had to separate people, I haven't needed to do more than get between them and maybe hold them.
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Mar 22, 2022 00:47
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PeterCat posted:So? He kneeled on her for all of 30 seconds, can't tell if it was on her neck since the video resolution is so low. And handcuffing is the easiest was to control her. Jaxyon posted:If you're going to make a claim about the positive effects of school cops, while defending a grown person kneeling on a child, you better come with better than a local news story. Also, and this is extremely important, you should definitely not defend a grown person kneeling on a child in any circumstance unless your goal is to get people to see you as a psychopath.
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Mar 22, 2022 00:56
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PeterCat posted:So? He kneeled on her for all of 30 seconds, can't tell if it was on her neck since the video resolution is so low. And handcuffing is the easiest was to control her. It's a 12 year old. I worked as a bouncer. There's no need to knee on her neck to get cuffs on her unless they are lovely at their job. (also, LOL at cuffing a girl for getting in a classic slap fight? what the hell?) I had to restrain folks (a lot bigger than a 12 year old girl) and never once did I have to put pressure on their neck. Because it's incredibly dangerous to do so. Why are you defending a hog?
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Mar 22, 2022 01:00
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