|
acidx posted:Gives a good sense of just how pissed off people are at the Iranian government. Wow. If the U.S. seems good compared to your government, your government has hosed up.
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2022 05:45
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 29, 2024 13:51 |
|
|
The US stands here grinning hard but also sad that they can't have their holy war.
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2022 06:16
|
|
|
Iran can also go hard on the Kurdish cities as a warning to other cities without as much risk of provoking things nationally (albeit that calculus likely is off... the unrest has been largely across ethnic lines). It's basically the Syrian model of attacking one city exceptionally hard to warn the others, eg the Hama massacre(s) in the 1980s or the city sieges early in the Syrian civil war.
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2022 08:40
|
|
|
I don't have much to say other than I continue to be amazed at how hard Iranians are fighting to make positive change to their country, and I wish them well. I also just need to post because having too high of a density of twitter posts makes my pc lag.
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2022 08:46
|
|
|
Toxic Mental posted:What the gently caress is this about? What does Kurdistan have to do with this at all?  
BrutalistMcDonalds fucked around with this message at 09:05 on Nov 30, 2022 |
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2022 09:02
|
|
|
The PDKI sounds pretty cool
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2022 10:36
|
|
|
acidx posted:Gives a good sense of just how pissed off people are at the Iranian government. I'm presuming there's shops selling US flags at every corner when an anti-west crowd wants to burn one, so it's no effort to get one to wave at an anti-ayatollah demonstration. Hungarian flags might be harder to find at short notice though. Samovar posted:Wow. If the U.S. seems good compared to your government, your government has hosed up. I'm sure it's just a symbol of individual freedom against moral police etc. Like someone waving a Soviet flag in an anti-capitalist demonstration does not necessarily support Brezhnevist stagnation and KGB and military quelling of protests. Although it would be quite amusing if there was some closet hyper pro-American guy in Tehran with his home lined with Union Jacks and pictures of Ronald Reagan, and all these years he's just been waiting for his moment to shine. YEEHAA AMERICA AKBAR!  
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2022 11:39
|
|
|
Iranian people were pretty significantly pro-America 20 years ago, particularly younger/urban and that continued as many people grew up sharing pirated american tv shows and stuff. That affinity has definitely not disappeared, though it's no doubt diminished somewhat. It's hard to overstate just how much Iran's government does not in any way represent the views of significant numbers of Iranians.
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2022 12:48
|
|
|
Samovar posted:Wow. If the U.S. seems good compared to your government, your government has hosed up. i would wager this is the case in a fair sized majority of governments on earth. they;'re mostly pretty bad
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2022 14:13
|
|
|
Nenonen posted:I'm sure it's just a symbol of individual freedom against moral police etc. Like someone waving a Soviet flag in an anti-capitalist demonstration does not necessarily support Brezhnevist stagnation and KGB and military quelling of protests. You also see a lot of pro-shah stuff in Iran for the same reason. For the youth he's a symbol of a government that isn't dominated by religious extremists. But I'm sure if the Iranian government collapsed, and everyone was standing around in the aftermath, it's not like they would all be like well what's Reza Pahlavi up to these days? Lets get this monarchy poppin again!
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2022 16:17
|
|
|
Nenonen posted:Union Jacks Jolly good show old chap, the sign of a true blue American bloke indeed! God bless King Charles!
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2022 16:23
|
|
|
Mr. Smile Face Hat posted:Jolly good show old chap, the sign of a true blue American bloke indeed! God bless King Charles! I always forget that the correct nick name for US flag is "Stars and Bars" 
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2022 17:12
|
|
|
Nenonen posted:I always forget that the correct nick name for US flag is "Stars and Bars" Stars and Bars is the confederate flag. Stars and Stripes is the name for the US flag.
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2022 18:14
|
|
|
Nenonen posted:I'm sure it's just a symbol of individual freedom against moral police etc. Like someone waving a Soviet flag in an anti-capitalist demonstration does not necessarily support Brezhnevist stagnation and KGB and military quelling of protests.  But I think the larger point stands, people just don't know or care too much about the details. There were some protests in poland against authoritarianism with crossed out flags of the hammer and sicle, swastika, and... the three arrows.
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2022 18:46
|
|
|
acidx posted:You also see a lot of pro-shah stuff in Iran for the same reason. For the youth he's a symbol of a government that isn't dominated by religious extremists. But I'm sure if the Iranian government collapsed, and everyone was standing around in the aftermath, it's not like they would all be like well what's Reza Pahlavi up to these days? Lets get this monarchy poppin again! Dumb history question. When Iran kicked out the Shah in 79, it was ostensibly a student revolution, right? How did a theocratic government emerge from that? The last thing I can I imagine a bunch of angry students arguing for is more religion in their lives.
|
|
#
?
Dec 3, 2022 04:49
|
|
|
Shah ran away in the very beginning of the unrest. Alot of different fractions was fighting for power, but the military was noticably not calling the shot. People died mysteriously (less radical leaders), and Iran Islamic Republic ended up with a very unique political structure.
|
|
#
?
Dec 3, 2022 04:54
|
|
|
Nissin Cup Nudist posted:Dumb history question. When Iran kicked out the Shah in 79, it was ostensibly a student revolution, right? How did a theocratic government emerge from that? The last thing I can I imagine a bunch of angry students arguing for is more religion in their lives. The revolution was supported by people all of all demographics in the beginning, but Khomeini was the figurehead and leader. Once the shah fell, he quickly went to work with crushing any internal opposition, culminating with the massacres of political prisoners in '88. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1988_executions_of_Iranian_political_prisoners
|
|
#
?
Dec 3, 2022 05:06
|
|
|
Also the Khomeini portrayed himself as not being that fundamentalist. He was actually in exile in France for quite a bit of it, and would talk to western media about just wanting to free his people, and not really wanting power. From what I read Iraq invading not long after he got in also helped stop the other groups from being able to gain support to oust him, as everyone was pretty occupied with not being invaded, and even unpopular governments usually gain support when outside parties are invading them.
|
|
#
?
Dec 3, 2022 05:07
|
|
|
This is all very important and I don't want to limit anything being posted That being said, can we cap videos/tweets to 3-4 per post? The current amount makes it extremely hard to load this page when there's multiple ones. Feel free to double post if necessary
|
|
|
#
?
Dec 3, 2022 05:22
|
|
|
Nissin Cup Nudist posted:Dumb history question. When Iran kicked out the Shah in 79, it was ostensibly a student revolution, right? How did a theocratic government emerge from that? The last thing I can I imagine a bunch of angry students arguing for is more religion in their lives. I also seem (and if this is wrong, please chastise me) to remember reading that it was a response to both the corrupting capital of the West which had for so often undermined Persia/Iran as well as to the secular threat of Communism. It was seen as an alternative that had never been truly tried, and would be specific to Iran?
|
|
#
?
Dec 3, 2022 06:05
|
|
|
Nissin Cup Nudist posted:Dumb history question. When Iran kicked out the Shah in 79, it was ostensibly a student revolution, right? How did a theocratic government emerge from that? The last thing I can I imagine a bunch of angry students arguing for is more religion in their lives. There's lots of different types of students. If anyone's not a monolithic group it's them. A very significant and well-organized portion of students in Iranian were those undergoing religious education, in effect studying to become part of the Iranian ulema. There were alot of these, they adored Khomeini and they had been radicalized by their own leaders' rethoric, anger at Western imperialism and the monarchy's anti-clerical policies. Alot of these students to be noted IIRC also came out of the "bazari" class, the old rural-urban commercial (lower) middle class, who were often seen as conservative and devout and placed alot of value in their children getting a prestigious education in Islamic law and theology. Furthermore that class was radicalized by most of the same issues and also in general by just having their means of work and income under threat in general, as would be the case for a developing country. Also worth noting that Iran is somewhat unique among Islamic countries, in having developed a very hierarchically organized, unified and independent-minded religious establishment. There have been clashes, compromises and the like between the state/monarchy and the religious establishment in other Islamic countries, notably Saudi Arabia (where very notable societal changes occured as a result of that in 1979 and were only recently rolled back), but the Iranian case is still unique in just the sheer organizational size and strength of it. It's the closest thing you get to a "church" in the Islamic world I'd say, the norm is usually much more loosely organized. There had been tensions between this religious establishment and the monarchy since the 19th century really, but it really increased in ferocity following Reza Shah's seizure of power and his ambitious centralist, modernist and anti-clerical reform program. I think there is a tendency in the West to see the Iranian Revolution almost purely as an "external factors" event, focusing primarily on the 1953 coup that toppled Mossadegh and the fallout from that to explain the revolution. This however often seems to fail at understanding the already present internal tensions and the unique position of the Iranian religious establishment that had evolved and its increasingly antagonistic relationship with the monarchy.
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2022 10:30
|
|
|
what's going on https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2022/12/4/iran-prosecutor-general-signals-morality-police-suspended quote:Tehran, Iran – Iran has suspended its morality police as the country continues to deal with two months of protests, the Iranian prosecutor general has suggested. This seems like a sort of victory, but it's not yet clear if this is a permanent change. It's also totally insufficient after HUNDREDS have died in protests. Hopefully it's a sign that the regime's power is cracking and they will rather ease the pressure instead of going full Tiananmen.
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2022 12:01
|
|
|
Nenonen posted:what's going on It's a smaller step that it seems. The Gasht-e-Ershad or morality police forces were only established in 2006 by the Ahmadinejad administration to harass people who dress too casually or behave in other ways the ultraconservatives deem inappropriate. As I understand, they're not particularly deeply integrated in the state security apparatus, but rather auxiliaries to the regular police.
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2022 12:48
|
|
|
Here's hoping the uprising doesn't take the bait. God knows there'll be commentators trying to push it as a huge reform.
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2022 12:52
|
|
|
Nenonen posted:what's going on I don’t think the protests are ending anytime soon probably. If they did this a week in, sure. But now is way bigger than just the morality busybody perverts.
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2022 14:05
|
|
|
Nenonen posted:what's going on I don’t think the protests are ending anytime soon probably. If they did this a week in, sure. But now is way bigger than just the morality busybody perverts.
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2022 14:11
|
|
|
Yeah like I suggested a few days ago, the supreme leader could have thrown some middle management moral police to the court to appease the crowd. China did an almost complete 180 on covid lock down policy as soon as the covid protests spread. There were other protests intermixing in it but mainly anti zero covid protests. Does anyone know the employed number of the moral police?
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2022 14:31
|
|
|
Nenonen posted:what's going on It was too late for months ago as others have said. I kind of expected this to be one of the only moves the government would be willing to make, but if they were hoping it would have a decisive effect they were waaay too late. The only purpose this can serve is to possibly be another thing chippin away at the energy of the protests as they are slowly ground down under the boot.
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2022 15:27
|
|
|
Nenonen posted:what's going on This is a move you only make when things have gone completely off the rails.
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2022 16:10
|
|
|
I mean is it better - by which I mean a higher chance of success for the dissidents - for things to de-escalate and carry on as extraction of concessions, civil disobedience and intimidation of local officials? Because it seems there's no hope of winning an open fight and neither the regime nor the protestors want to have one. That said I'm absolutely not one of the quisling bastards pontificating that the Iranians/Syrians/Libyans just need to spend another generation or two in slavery because they're ~not ready~ for democracy.
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2022 16:18
|
|
|
Borzou has been as reliable as anyone on Iran for years. https://twitter.com/borzou/status/1599426939474755584 What I've seen lately makes it seem like Iran is preparing itself for the long haul if anything. Lots of riot gear and equipment coming in. acidx fucked around with this message at 16:58 on Dec 4, 2022 |
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2022 16:53
|
|
|
The morality police has been disbanded. While this is good, it may fuel the fire with some "what ELSE can we change", energy from the resistance Which isn't bad! But it's unknown. Will Iran descend into civil war? Time will tell
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2022 17:23
|
|
|
WAR CRIME GIGOLO posted:The morality police has been disbanded. I don't think its enough, they know something else will take their place.
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2022 17:30
|
|
|
CommieGIR posted:I don't think its enough, they know something else will take their place. And that's what I mean, even though taking the morality police is great and all it's not going to stop the protests. Just because you put a rainbow star on the Gestapo doesn't mean they're still not the Gestapo
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2022 17:33
|
|
|
Jasper Tin Neck posted:It's a smaller step that it seems. The Gasht-e-Ershad or morality police forces were only established in 2006 by the Ahmadinejad administration to harass people who dress too casually or behave in other ways the ultraconservatives deem inappropriate. As I understand, they're not particularly deeply integrated in the state security apparatus, but rather auxiliaries to the regular police. What is Ahmadinejad doing these days besides shitposting on twitter? Retirement?
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2022 20:27
|
|
|
acidx posted:Borzou has been as reliable as anyone on Iran for years. to make this more clear, since a bunch of people posted after talking about the disbandment https://twitter.com/borzou/status/1599396059251253249
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2022 21:01
|
|
|
acidx posted:Borzou has been as reliable as anyone on Iran for years. yeah that's my impression. even Iranians don't seem to think that that report was anything other than a misreading of a confusing statement
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2022 02:07
|
|
|
I just realized that I've not seen this thread in a while. Has there been any major updates.
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2022 15:26
|
|
|
It's still going, but there's nothing fundamentally new I think.
|
|
#
?
Dec 25, 2022 00:14
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 29, 2024 13:51 |
|
|
Samovar posted:I just realized that I've not seen this thread in a while. Has there been any major updates. They made Bush president now
|
|
#
?
Dec 25, 2022 01:55
|
|
