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That's the one! Added it to my Steam list for when my next paycheck hits, thank you!
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Sep 30, 2022 15:03
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Monster Sanctuary Effortpost First of all, here's an article from Metroidvania Review (a great resource that can go in the OP, imo) that gives a good overview of the game. Monster Sanctuary, in a nutshell, is a cross between a metroidvania and a turn-based monster battler (think something vaguely along the lines of Pokemon triple battles). It sounds like a ridiculous combination, and if you actively dislike turn-based battles then I'll say upfront this isn't the game for you, but I think that it works better than it sounds like it would on the surface. Also, this is genuinely my favorite monster battler outside of Pokemon by a long way, and there are several things I think Monster Sanctuary actually does better. The plot of the game is extremely forgettable. You start by picking your guardian (basically your starter) from 4 different choices. From there, you're slowly introduced to both the battle system and the out of battle abilities. Each monster you capture has an ability that helps you access more parts of the world; some of them basically just amount to keys to specific kinds of doors, but you also unlock abilities like gliders and grappling hooks. While you can only have 6 monsters total in your active party, you can keep as many as you like in the wings and keep access to their abilities, so you don't have to worry about switching out your party between battles to solve environmental puzzles. You also unlock some movement abilities as regular metroidvania powerups you find in the world, so you're not just relying on your monsters for a sense of progression. You get new monsters by battling wild monsters. You get a star rating after every battle, and the higher the star rating, the more likely you are to get rare drops including eggs of one of the species involved in the battle. You can choose to hatch an egg at any time, and when you do the new monster will emerge only a couple levels lower than your party so you don't have to worry about level grinding. The battles are 3v3, at the start of each battle you choose 3 mons from your active team of 6. They can act in any order. Most of the moves hit multiple times, whether they're attacks /heals/buffs/debuffs or what have you. Each hit adds 1 to the combo meter, which adds 5% to the damage of the next attack, so the later hits of multi-hit attacks will be stronger than earlier ones. This also means you want to use non-damaging moves early in your turn to build up combo for your big attacks. You choose your moves from a big skill tree that's unique to every monster, and they all look like this:  There's usually a couple archetypes you can build a mon towards, and there's a lot of team synergies you can dive into especially when you're deeper in the skill tree to really break the game over your knee. There's a lot more monster customization to do besides the skill tree. You can equip each mon with 1 weapon and 3 accessories, which will boost different stats and sometimes have additional effects. You'll want different accessories for your assassin types pumping their crit rate and crit damage than for your tanks focusing on healing and shielding, for instance. You can level these items up to level 5 with materials that drop from monster battles and some that can be purchased in the store. You also have different food items you can feed your mons for bonuses, but only the 3 most recent will apply their effects.  Speaking of which, and at this point I realize I'm barely touching on the metroidvania aspects, but there are so many things about the monster battling part of the equation that really show the care they put into the systems: - Every monster is viable. Sure, there's broadly some degree of tiers when you get into hardcore PvP (oh yeah, there's online PvP) but not nearly as much as you might think coming from e.g. Smogon, it's more just the inevitable result of having over 100 of them. - On a similar note, while there are evolution items that transform monsters into different ones, they're not improvements so much as sidegrades or different archetypes. - No EV or IV analogs; there's a mechanic that unlocks partway through the game that gives each monster 2 additional variations, but those variants are clearly visible. If you know a monster's variant, level and species, then you know its base stats. - As mentioned before, newly hatched monsters start out at a level similar to your existing party. Also, while the skill trees can be intimidating at first glance, there's a pretty cheap and easily accessible item you can buy from a store as well as finding in the world that lets you respec at any time. - Monsters fully heal at the end of every battle so there's no equivalent of desperately running back to the Pokémon center. This is admittedly a question of broader game design; one approach isn't necessarily better, but it meshes with their clear desire to laser focus on individual battles being the main challenge. - Just because I didn't realize this for so long: you can speed up battle animations up to 3x. After you beat the game, you can continue to challenge yourself (besides your standard exploration to find what you may have missed) with the PvE arena where you can test your mons against ever-higher leveled teams and get reward boxes that might drop, say, further copies of rare accessories that you can then upgrade. You can also play PvP, which you'll likely want completely different teams for, but if this really interests you then you'll probably want to join the Discord to set up matches. Unfortunately, there isn't the player base to expect to be able to randomly hop into matches (though it has happened to me). Really unfortunately, there's no cross-platform multiplayer, so if this interests you then you'll want the Steam version and perhaps Switch as a backup. It's out for the PS4 as well I believe, but good luck trying to get a game. I could keep on rambling, but given the point of the thread I'm going to try and drag this post to a rough conclusion. You might reasonably ask, given my description, why this needed to be a metroidvania at all when so much of your playtime is spent in a turn-based RPG. I don't know the language of game design enough to give a more concrete answer, which I know is frustrating, but I really do think it is a core part of the experience. Getting excited about catching a new mon not only for a slot in your team but because its improved swimming lets you access new areas with strong currents adds something that your more standard RPG design does not. Oh, they also dropped a free DLC a couple months back, which among other things adds Randomizer, Bravery (basically Nuzlocke's limited mons aspect) and Permadeath (for your mons; if they all get knocked out it turns back into a normal run) options for starting new games. You can enable them individually or combined. I will give some caveats. Like I said before, and this should be pretty clear by now, but if you just don't like monster battlers then you're not going to have a good time with this game. Also, there are a couple bosses in the game where you'll need to retool your team if you haven't been taking advantage of higher level team strategies and really build towards powerful combos. There are multiple difficulty options and they've tweaked the challenge some, but I've heard several people talk about how they found them to be difficulty walls and gave up. If my description of the game resonates with you then I recommend checking it out. It goes for $20 full price (in the US, I don't know about other countries) and given that I poured 60+ hours into it, I honestly think it's worth full price if it clicks. However, it also goes on sale regularly (it's published by Team17) usually for 66% off, which I think is an absolute steal.
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Sep 30, 2022 15:52
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moosferatu posted:I played almost the entirety of Islets on my Deck while flying from Europe to the US a few weeks ago. I had played a little of the demo earlier in the year, and hadn't loved it. But, I was looking for a game to play on the flight, so I decided to give it a go. I played Islets a couple of weeks ago and also enjoyed it a lot, boss fights included. I loved the 100% completion bonus of Going to a party in your house and seeing all the characters, dead and alive, returning to congratulate you I think also a huge plus for this game is one of the optional upgrades you can find is Breaking the stone curse on the raven who gets petrified by the witch. It was a total shock when we went back to that zone and Their stone statue came to life and thanked us. Sheepo is another game by the same developer duo that I enjoyed playing in january of this year. I think Islets is definitely more refined but Sheepo is still worth a play IMO.
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Sep 30, 2022 16:01
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Blue Labrador posted:That's the one! Added it to my Steam list for when my next paycheck hits, thank you! The same devs did Record of Lodoss War-Deedlit in Wonder Labyrinth-.
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Sep 30, 2022 16:13
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They also made SMT Synchronicity, the Metroidvania where you played as the Jack Bros. that Atlus released as a free promotion in Japan before Strange Journey Redux came out. That one's harder to find these days though, Atlus took it off their site IIRC and it only has a fan translation. It's interesting to see how the basic mechanics of Deedlit evolved from Synchronicity, though, the dual-element system in the former is basically ripped straight from the latter.
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Sep 30, 2022 16:35
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also related to my A Robot Named Fight recommendation it was also just made open source for the more nerdy among us https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/603530/view/3293844171243621529
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Sep 30, 2022 19:10
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woke kaczynski posted:It's better now on switch than it was and I completed it there (with occasional crashing) but it's the worst platform to play on, and after tooling around in it on my steam deck I can't go back. Okay fair. I just remember getting to a particular boss and even though memorizing the patterns and timing often times my inputs would be delayed so horribly that I'd die and I got very tired of that and gave up.
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Oct 1, 2022 02:39
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I was on a bit of a metroidvania kick last year, but I think that kinda stalled out after playing Dread. I'm surprised nobody has mentioned yet the game that invented most of the key bits of the genre and may be the first metroidvania game.
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Oct 1, 2022 04:39
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SlothfulCobra posted:I was on a bit of a metroidvania kick last year, but I think that kinda stalled out after playing Dread. I'm surprised nobody has mentioned yet the game that invented most of the key bits of the genre and may be the first metroidvania game. Honestly, yes. Fantastic. Also, souls games are just metroidvanias with corpse runs. I started up Hyper Light Drifter again recently since I never finished it when I first picked it up and despite the obvious Zelda connections it just feels way more like a MV anyways S.J. fucked around with this message at 05:04 on Oct 1, 2022 |
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Oct 1, 2022 05:01
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S.J. posted:Also, souls games are just metroidvanias with corpse runs. I mean, on the one hand, I get that looping back around to Firelink Shrine is very similar to looping back to Samus's ship in Super Metroid. But the Souls games have like...maybe three whole "abilities" across the games that aren't explicit keys or glorified keys. Of course, parts of the games remind me of Zelda instead, so it's turtles all the way down I suppose. Now, if we wanna talk about a game that, to me anyway, feels a lot like Dark Souls but is also a true blue Metroidvania, well... 
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Oct 1, 2022 06:37
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Are there any decent multiplayer MVs outside of Guacamelee?
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Oct 1, 2022 08:02
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S.J. posted:Are there any decent multiplayer MVs outside of Guacamelee? Timespinner lets a second player control the pets you find.
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Oct 1, 2022 08:09
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Treasure Adventure World is my rec for a good, medium length search-action game. It has great exploration feels because it actually copies a lot of its design from Windwaker rather than Castlevania or Metroid. I also recently played through Alwa's Legacy which was nice, but a bit underwhelming.
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Oct 1, 2022 08:24
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S.J. posted:Are there any decent multiplayer MVs outside of Guacamelee? No.
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Oct 1, 2022 12:20
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I've played a couple of runs of A Robot Named Fight now and am liking it. I'm definitely not good enough to beat it first go, like someone in one of the steam reviews was complaining about.
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Oct 1, 2022 13:02
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I really liked Maya Star. It's a bit on the difficult side but not to the point of being frustrating.
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Oct 1, 2022 15:25
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i just want more castlevania. more skeleton's.
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Oct 1, 2022 15:27
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Cross-posting my effort post about Astalon: Tears of the Earth, the Meroidvania fan's Metroidvania. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V87xLFNs-EA McCracAttack posted:It's a Metroidvania that looks like every other 8-bit inspired game you've ever seen. Watching a YouTube video won't really convey what's good about it.
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Oct 1, 2022 17:15
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What's the best upgrade in a Metroidvania? My vote is for Ori's Bash, pretty much makes the whole game.
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Oct 2, 2022 03:41
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Plebian Parasite posted:What's the best upgrade in a Metroidvania? Honestly I think it's double jump. It's a staple for sure, but so satisfying once you get it.
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Oct 2, 2022 04:27
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Unsighted's double hookshot and spinner are pretty great.
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Oct 2, 2022 04:30
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Plebian Parasite posted:What's the best upgrade in a Metroidvania? Getting that pink crystal horizontal flight ability in Hollow Knight was where it finally got its hooks in me after like half a dozen attempts where I'd slowly get further in but kept bouncing off.
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Oct 2, 2022 04:31
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SlothfulCobra posted:I'm surprised nobody has mentioned yet the game that invented most of the key bits of the genre and may be the first metroidvania game.
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Oct 2, 2022 04:31
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I'm a big fan of the lab coat in Axiom Verge 1 which lets you phase through 1-block-wide walls. It's simple and elegant enough that you can instantly understand how useful it is, but it's a unique enough upgrade that even having played a bunch of other metroidvanias you probably weren't expecting anything like it or taking note of spots it could be used, so you get to go back and explore with a whole new eye using this weird new power and seeing how it affects the map.
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Oct 2, 2022 04:41
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ExcessBLarg! posted:Zelda isn't a platformer, unless you count Zelda II, or the side-scrolling sections of Link's Awakening, or the Super Metroid parts of the LttP+SM randomizer. Sure, but metroidvania's don't need to be platformers at all.
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Oct 2, 2022 06:06
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Plebian Parasite posted:What's the best upgrade in a Metroidvania? This probably isn't the best upgrade ever, but the first one that comes to mind is the upgrade in Touhou Luna Nights that lets you stand on top of your own throwing daggers during timestop. Which in terms of utility is just a kind of space jump, but the way it works is just funny to me.
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Oct 2, 2022 09:17
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Speaking of really early examples of the genre, and looking at Astalon, I'm reminded of The Maze of Galious (Knightmare II). I played a ton of it on emulator when I was a kid and had just learned about the existence of the MSX. It does look like it still loses out to Zelda in age though, it's from 1987.
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Oct 2, 2022 10:56
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S.J. posted:Sure, but metroidvania's don't need to be platformers at all. Wikipedia posted:The term 'Metroidvania' is most often used to refer to a platforming game that features a single large, interconnected map, generally with discrete rooms or sections.
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Oct 2, 2022 11:45
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Also most Zelda games follow a similar format: an overworld with gated regions that contain dungeons with progression items. Dungeons, once you're able to access them, are intended to be completed in their entirety before progressing in the overworld. There's rarely a need to "go back" to a previous dungeon in Zelda for optional items and I can't think of a case where you need to for progression. I suppose Zelda randomizers do shake up the format though by placing progression items in different locations from where you need to use them.
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Oct 2, 2022 11:59
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Weird to bring up Zelda when Zelda 2 is right there and fits the bill much better. Also Castlevania 2, which is the reason SotN exists in the first place. I played CV2 for the first time a couple of years ago and it's actually a really fun and cool game and a clear progenitor to the metroidvania genre
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Oct 2, 2022 12:23
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Oh it's October again, I should play more CV2.
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Oct 2, 2022 13:30
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Recent Metroidvanias I've played and enjoyed: Great: -Timespinner - fairly unique weapon system. Relatively short, but well made. -Ender Lilies: Quietus of the Knights - Still playing through this (got distracted by Xenoblade 3 and now Trails from Zero), but visually impressive, attacks are basically like stands, fairly challenging but also very fair boss design. -Hollow Knight - Great art and sound. Not as groundbreaking-amazing-best-game-ever as everyone seems to think IMO, but really good. -Ori and the Will of the Wisp - Beautiful game, direct attacking is a good improvement over the previous title. Okay: -Chasm - I played 1.0, which was slightly buggy. The game itself is fine, very castlevania-like in its equipment/attack system. Was a bit disappointed since I'd been following its progress for years. -Momodora: Reverie under the Moonlight - Good, but definitely challenging. In looking at this list, I'm starting to realize I haven't beat most of these games. The only game in this list that I actually finished was Timespinner....
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Oct 2, 2022 14:25
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I want SteamWorld Dig 3 but they made SteamWorld Quest instead which loving suuuucked.
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Oct 2, 2022 14:27
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I don't know if this is the case here, but I feel like if someone tries to make the same game again and again except better each time, they will at some point run out of ideas.
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Oct 2, 2022 14:29
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Ender Lilies A+
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Oct 2, 2022 14:32
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ExcessBLarg! posted:I'm not trying to be a linguistic prescriptivist, but both of the archetypal games of the genre are platformers and the term certainly historically has been used as an alternative to "exploratory platformers" as a genre. Yeah. I think people forget about adventure as a genre: Wikipedia posted:An adventure game is a video game genre in which the player assumes the role of a protagonist in an interactive story driven by exploration and/or puzzle-solving. A metroidvania is platformer with adventure elements, where exploration is limited by abilities or items you eventually obtain. It is a modification of the platformer genre, with a persistent, interconnected map instead of the traditional structure (self-contained stages that occur in a specific order). They're also, often, more story-driven than their counterparts. A Zelda-like is an action RPG with adventure elements where exploration is limited by abilities or items you eventually obtain. It is a modification of the already action-modified RPG genre, where stat growth occurs through collecting items and defeating boss enemies (i.e. level 2 sword, heart containers at the end of dungeons and on the field) instead of through experience/continual equipment upgrades, etc. Often puzzle-heavy. So, a game like Unsighted would be a Zelda-like. Prowler fucked around with this message at 14:58 on Oct 2, 2022 |
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Oct 2, 2022 14:55
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"adventure" is by far the worst defined genre name in games, and i can get why people wouldn't use it
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Oct 2, 2022 15:04
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Feels Villeneuve posted:"adventure" is by far the worst defined genre name in games, and i can get why people wouldn't use it Adventure games are the games where you fight against Roberta Williams level nightmare dream logic, and lose, but don't find out until you've spent a few hours in a dead man walking situation Which seems rather opposite to a metroidvania game!
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Oct 2, 2022 15:41
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I will tell you the secret truth that in Japanese game development, "adventure" just means any sequence where you have text boxes and portraits to convey dialog. Like, that's how they name the files and stuff. That is the legal definition of "adventure."
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Oct 2, 2022 15:45
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| # ? Apr 29, 2024 17:10 |
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Feels Villeneuve posted:"adventure" is by far the worst defined genre name in games, and i can get why people wouldn't use it I dunno, I disagree. "Adventure" is just a broad category, same as action, that's used to drill down into subcategories. It's not poorly defined, it just has a large umbrella. Most people think "point-and-click" when you mention adventure, but it can include visual novels and narrative-driven games without any real puzzling elements. -Adventure games are games that focus on narrative, puzzles, interaction with NPCs, and progressing through the story using your brain. -Action games are games that focus on player hand-eye coordination, reaction speed, mastery of game mechanics. --An adventure game that includes action elements is an action/adventure game. Zelda is considered an action/adventure game, because it includes action (obviously) and adventure elements (exploration, puzzles, a narrative). I argue that RPGs are adventure games with combat and stat progression. I don't think it would be controversial to call Zelda an RPG, for example. Prowler fucked around with this message at 15:52 on Oct 2, 2022 |
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Oct 2, 2022 15:49
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