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Young Freud posted:They were shock artillery units, largely meant to conduct terror attacks on civilian centers, but they had a horribly short range for artillery: the TOS-1 had an effective range of 3km. For comparison, the man-portable Javelin guided anti-tank missile has a effective range of 4km. I mean they are perfectly suited to gently caress up targets in an urban environment, but no they aren't "largely made for terror attacks" they are made to gently caress up fortified positions or targets in openish area, which they can do pretty well if they can get shots off. Telsa Cola fucked around with this message at 15:34 on Apr 9, 2023 |
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Apr 9, 2023 15:32
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HonorableTB posted:We got a lot closer to Clancychat than was admitted or reported at the time. Remember that British surveillance plane that had a missile fired near it? I would dearly love to hear your explanation of reasoning for the bolded.
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Apr 13, 2023 19:59
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HonorableTB posted:Deliberately targeting and downing a NATO plane with 30 NATO troops on it seems like a great on-ramp to escalation over a single pilot fighter where the pilot can eject. Surveillance air craft, and even fighter craft get "accidently" downed all the time and the worst that happens is concessions get made or the country who downed them gets loving walloped in the diplomatic spehere. In the grand scheme of things 30 people on a spy plane isn't worth entering ww3.
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Apr 13, 2023 20:06
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Owling Howl posted:I think a major problem is identifying the specific holes, in a shell blasted hellscape full of craters and holes, that enemy soldiers are occupying. You need to be able to locate most if not all of those trenches and then hit them accurately with artillery to clear them out. It may simply not be a capability Russia has. I don't know that anyone has it really? US has those missiles that basically blanket a location with ball bearings, which could probably hit enough of a trench line.
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Apr 20, 2023 23:57
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Rust Martialis posted:If you have better numbers, present them. No one has better numbers, that's the point. Combat causalities in conflicts is pretty much always a crap shoot because both sides lie through their teeth and often the only time you actually have real numbers is when total cauasalties are <1000 because it's way easier to track.
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Apr 28, 2023 18:00
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Willo567 posted:So other than the F-16 being more modern than the MIG29, would it really enhance Ukraine's performance in the upcoming counteroffensive? As mentioned, they could use Western missiles, which would give them additional capability, but tbh with how saturated the entire area is with Anti-air poo poo no one is likely going to be able to do much of anything with them. I would not want to be a pilot in this conflict.
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Apr 28, 2023 21:41
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It's pretty easy to repair train tracks. I think the only thing that causes moderate long term delays is blowing bridges or loving with the electrical systems.
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May 1, 2023 16:59
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Nelson Mandingo posted:Kadyrov wearing a pulse oximeter is a legitimate curiosity. Why would he be wearing one? Either he's slaying out and crushing epic mega weights or something is abnormal about his health. Not defending him and got no skin in the game on this but he's got health issues, its been reported on before.
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May 7, 2023 02:29
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Pope Hilarius II posted:I would like to propose the Global Defense Initiative EDF
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May 11, 2023 01:57
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Shes Not Impressed posted:His gimmick is to live in an alternate fear ridden reality where one of the most popular war leaders in history making aspirational statements about his country's future is "bad politics" and the end of the world. His gimmick, which he has sliiightly toned down because the mods got tired of it and started probing him, is to constantly fear post about every event being the one event that will tumble the dominos that will lead to him personally being nuked (well his city rather), which is where the joke about nuking his balls come from. Ulf posted:I've been reading this thread since the invasion but without a background in the area's politics the names that appear and re-appear in this thread sometimes just wash over me. For example the above, I know who Lukashenko is but without Belarus being an active player in this conflict for nearly a year I re-read the post two or three times before I remembered. I think it's kinda a bit odd when you could just use google, if you are reading the forumns its like right there.
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May 14, 2023 22:43
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Tesseraction posted:...is he located in Ukraine? If so then I'm curious why the harshness against optimism, if not, I'm curious why he fears being personally nuked. No, and the particular brand of fear posting started up under the Trump admin with that flare up with N. Korea iirc.
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May 14, 2023 23:03
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If you are not breaking out the munsell book you are not trying. Or getting your moneys worth.
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May 30, 2023 17:34
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Nenonen posted:SMO has finally successfully denazified Ukrainian soil! Stuff gets pulled out of mud (or really lots of types of soil) in good condition all the time, doubly so after flooding or massive earth moving events. WW2 and WW1 wardead in decent condition are found in Europe somewhat frequently. That being said yeah someone with actual credentials should confirm it, but its not really super suprising. Source: Im an archaeologist.
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Jun 13, 2023 23:28
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I'm gonna be a little skeptical until some field archeologist or anyone at all has gone to look at the said skulls. It's absolutely possible that there would have been bodies buried in the reservoir area only found now, but my gut feel is that stuff that has been buried in mud for 80 years is going to look more like a blob of mud than anything recognizable, and it's also more likely buried deep in the said mud.
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1000 a day is a very large number and you should be asking for literally any kind of proof when people start throwing numbers like that around.
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Jul 1, 2023 18:57
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Speaking as someone who has to deal with UXO for work way often then you would think given my job I would rather deal with mines then cluster munitions when dealing with clean up.
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Jul 7, 2023 18:51
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Electric Wrigglies posted:Do you work on a copper mine in Laos or something? Archaeological surveyor. UXO removal in the states is generally done federally and because of this they are generally legally required to have an archaeological consultant on hand as the removal is 90% of the time ground disturbing and has a chance to impact cultural resources. The project area has to be surveyed before they do any digging, heavy equipment moving, etc. Sometimes you have EOD folks with you who check everything out/clear a path, sometimes they just give you a ppt that's "Don't pick up or kick metal poo poo" and let you loose. I think I've walked up on 1 UXO per year worked. My favorite so far is the shell we found full of mustard gas. Telsa Cola fucked around with this message at 19:15 on Jul 8, 2023 |
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Jul 8, 2023 19:09
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buglord posted:eyy fellow arch major. actually had no idea the states had that much unexploded stuff still laying around. Heya, always good to see another arch. It's generally known where it's all at, mostly artillery/bombing/testing ranges. The thing is, you still gotta do work in those areas. Xiahou Dun posted:It’s off-topic, but I would love to read as many words as you care to write about your job. I've debated putting together an A/T thread about it. The archaeology thread/outdoor worker thread are both pretty dead which is a bummer. Umbreon posted:That sounds incredibly intense. Was that any where remotely close to what you thought you'd be doing when you signed up for that job? Hah, it's alright, I've had more anxiety working in a problem bear dumping area than in UXO areas. As long as I can see everyone is taking the safety talks seriously It's generally fine. Not really, but what we do varies based on the contract and client needs. UXO ones are pretty clearly marked. For the record, I don't primarily do UXO stuff. It just comes up once in a while, and I have experience with it and am willing to deal with it.
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Jul 8, 2023 20:03
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Chalks posted:Can you elaborate at all on why you'd consider mines to be easier to clear than cluster munitions? Would be really interested to know how they differ from that perspective I wrote up a longer post about it but exited out without saving it. The TLDR (not an expert or authority) is that cluster munitions add in more variables and unknowns (and more ordnance) and that even if they have built in safety features that doesnt really mean poo poo until the EOD person has proven that said feature has kicked in and its disarmed. poo poo bounces, disperses weird, gets buried on impact, gets covered with soil over time, gets stuck in a branch or bush and all that poo poo complicates things. Telsa Cola fucked around with this message at 21:32 on Jul 8, 2023 |
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Jul 8, 2023 21:13
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People are not defining their terms and you are arguing in circles as result of it.
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Jul 9, 2023 18:15
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I don't really think there's a sound argument to be made that cluster munitions can't make the situation worse. They will just on the simple fact that there is now more UXO in one area that now has to be dealt with before the area can be opened up safely. Just because an area is already hosed from an access standpoint does not mean you can't make the situation worse from a removal standpoint. I think the argument is more "Is this worth it in the long run" which is tricky and I dunno if anybody has posted any figures on this. IMO this would ultimately hinge on things that are basically impossible to know at this point in time like how much quicker does the war end with the introduction of cluster munitions (shorter war, less civilian deaths), how long would it take to clear out all the UXO areas? How many people die in that period of time from the UXO? Ukraine seems to think the calculations work out in their favor for using them. Telsa Cola fucked around with this message at 22:18 on Jul 9, 2023 |
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Jul 9, 2023 22:15
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Public information/safety campaigns do help but no public information campaign is going to have a 100% saturation rate, you are always going to have people who ignore it (kids) and or people who are just not aware or care. We had some people recently out in my neck of the woods target shooting in an old artillery range who were completely unware they were shooting in UXO land because the signage sucked poo poo. Yes, it would help lessen deaths though, and yes I think we are going to argue about it endlessly because it's the current hot topic and not much news is coming out to switch our focus. Telsa Cola fucked around with this message at 22:36 on Jul 9, 2023 |
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Jul 9, 2023 22:30
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Dull Fork posted:Certainly! No public awareness campaign will be perfect, no law will be followed by everyone, people are fallible. While I dont necessarily disagree, UXO has been a relatively discussed topic and humanitarian issue worldwide for years, so it's understandable, imo, that this generated more discourse than other weapon shipments. It wasn't as intensive, but there was a somewhat similar discussion when land mines were brought up early on for similar reasons. My argument isn't necessarily that Ukraine should not use cluster munitions. My argument is that there are legitimate concerns and downsides to using cluster munitions and that people should be aware of said issues. These issues should be acknowledged and discussed before going with cluster munitions. An example of something I take issue with and have posted on is the "Well its already hosed so a little more wont have an impact" which I don't really believe is true because it really is a number's thing and more is bad. Physical removal of poo poo is still very much hands on, even if it's plowing through poo poo in an armored bulldozer. I've seen an interesting paper on chemical detection, and you can use magnetic sensing for poo poo too and the technology for that has developed/become more accesible. Telsa Cola fucked around with this message at 23:43 on Jul 9, 2023 |
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Jul 9, 2023 23:39
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Also, I'd wager that, at least in some cases, the improvements in material technology and production since Vietnam has made detecting UXO more difficult with increased usage of non-metal parts and such.
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Jul 9, 2023 23:52
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Dirt5o8 posted:A lot of systems these days, hand held and vehicle mounted, use ground penetrating radar. It's effective against just about anything that has a cataloged signature. It's very exhausting to use though (or it was in 2013 when I last used one) since you have to be able to read the output and make a determination if something is dangerous or not. And doing that while sweating bullets looks for explosive hazards is always stressful as balls. I used a "hand held" one last year for several projects and the are indeed exhausting as gently caress to use. It's a neat technology but there are a lot of caveats to using GPR effectively, primarily to the condition/type of ground you are using it on. Definitely a good tool to consider though.
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Jul 10, 2023 02:12
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Xiahou Dun posted:Exhausting as in “tedious and methodical”, “stressful”, “requiring great mental strain”, “physically taxing” or…? Like would you describe it as “exhausting” in general, even if it wasn’t UXO and just a bunch of potsherds? Tedious and methodical since you are trying to work in a grid and keep a steady pace, physically taxing because at least the unit I was using was heavy as poo poo and unfortunately the ground is not always the easiest to go over with a rig. You can hook them up to a GPS unit (we used a trimble, so we had submeter accuracy) and record your readings. The two can be related later to figure out where a specific reading was. This is nice because sometimes you miss poo poo and it can be reviewed at the office or camp or whatever. Icon Of Sin posted:Water content of the soil fucks up GPR before anything else gets a chance, iirc. Magnetometry is nice, but can only tell you if something ferromagnetic is in your search area. Any remote sensing tool is going to be better than a shovel and old map, though Yeah water content fucks it up but also depending on the soil type if its too dry and cracks you get air voids which will also create returns. We were using it for subsurface feature detection on essentially sand, and we got quite a few false positives. You can get really nice returns off it though, it's just not guaranteed. ^^Also yeah recalibration is a pain if the ground changes and I cannot imagine doing that while getting shot at. Ours screamed at you if you went too fast and I can't imagine having to go "gently caress I need to redo that" I was an idiot and volunteered to be the only other person trained to use it. It was a neat experince but for our purposes it was too slow and too prone to false positives in our soil environment that I believe we finally convinced the client to use traditional (but more invasive) site testing measures to save everyone involved time and money. Telsa Cola fucked around with this message at 03:12 on Jul 10, 2023 |
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Jul 10, 2023 03:06
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Charliegrs posted:Whatever happened to the Leopard 1 tanks Ukraine was supposed to get from Germany? They got a small batch of them a few days ago according to the news articles, they likely have not been deployed yet. I think yall are mixing up Leopard 2s and 1s.
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Jul 24, 2023 00:18
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daslog posted:Has anyone invented self burrowing mines that you can launch from a plane or missile? An army could launch a few on a cleared path and create real problems. Idk (I think they aren't) if they are self burrowing but they exist as well as in artillery shell format.
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Aug 15, 2023 14:37
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Lum_ posted:Because there is no consensus that a genocide is taking place, thus it's an argument. "Russia's actions don't merit the term 'genocide'" is not the same as "The Holocaust didn't happen". Demanding it be treated as such shuts down any discussion not rabidly pro-Ukrainian and we might as well start using terms like "Ruzzians" and "orcs". Quiet a few of the international bodies who deal with genocide and quiet a few researchers on the topic have the position that while investigations are needed to confirm its reaaaaaaaaallly looking like genocide. So yes, there's not a official report that is saying "Yes, this genocide" but that's probably going to come out sooner or later.
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Aug 17, 2023 20:04
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Ynglaur posted:Opinions <> facts. "Order of magnitude" means "multiple of ten". This is not subject to opinion. It is just a fact based on math. FFS While I think he was way off base in his usage of the word and his subsequent reasoning for using said word this framing is almost as bad given the technically incorrect yet still commonly used and accepted usage of decimate and, related, the use of the word literally. This is way off topic though.
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Sep 4, 2023 22:05
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Xiahou Dun posted:There’s a world of difference between normal semantic drift and the misuse of technical vocabulary. In a professional or academic setting where the technical vocabulary is necessary for the level of precision needed to facilitate good work, yeah totally. When people are just shooting the poo poo or whatever, not really. I'm not going to defend someone using it incorrectly in an academic paper or when discussing engineering tolerances or whatever, but this ain't that. Telsa Cola fucked around with this message at 00:00 on Sep 5, 2023 |
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Sep 4, 2023 23:54
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Drones are not going to be able to intercept naval missiles. We have a hard enough time making missiles intercept missiles due to the speeds involved.
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Sep 5, 2023 17:37
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CIWS expend a gently caress ton of ammo because what they are trying to hit is relatively small and moving fast as gently caress. The same system being used on the drones we are seeing in use today would almost certainly require less ammo expenditure per kill than if they were trying to hit a missile going at Mach 3.
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Sep 5, 2023 21:28
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It also helps that the US has incredibly good rounds for said tube artillery which likely drastically lessens the amount you need.
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Sep 5, 2023 22:50
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I'd also argue a force reconstituted with green soldiers is still combat effective, you just can't use them like you did before. Or shouldn't rather.
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Sep 6, 2023 16:25
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MikeC posted:You are turning a system designed to be ultra cheap and disposable to a system that is more costly yet will incur the same, very high attrition rate. This is the past 3 pages summarized. A drone is likely very much not going to be able out maneuver a system designed to track and engage an object traveling at Mach 3 unless it itself reaches crazy high speeds, which is going to be hilariously expensive to implement without tearing itself apart. Telsa Cola fucked around with this message at 02:01 on Sep 7, 2023 |
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Sep 7, 2023 01:48
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The Artificial Kid posted:I don’t think we are getting through to each other. Maybe I can summarise what I’m saying in a way that’s less controversial. A CIWS can also observe and react and if your argument is that drones can be programed to maneuver to avoid the rounds the exact same argument can be made about the target software the CIWS uses, and given that it's already set up to track poo poo VERY quickly I would say the drone is very very disadvantaged in that equation. Things flying in clouds that dense is dumb, poo poo can be fused to explode in the air and you are basically guaranteed to knock out more drones then the round is worth. Very few countries are likely to have to production capabilities of pulling that poo poo off and the command/networking/whatever capabilites to actually make good use of it. You are making some very wild claims about drone capabilities and it would nice if you had some things to back up your speculation rather than just handwaving a lot of very complicated poo poo away. Saying "We dunno what the future will hold" is not a convincing argument because as others are pointing out its equally likely that more advanced drone countermeasures will be implemented. Telsa Cola fucked around with this message at 01:38 on Sep 8, 2023 |
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Sep 8, 2023 01:36
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Moon Slayer posted:Wait, someone thinks that drones can dodge bullets? That's what people have been arguing about? They were arguing that faced with a CIWS, a system which is designed to track and shoot down missiles traveling at speeds like Mach 3, a drone would simply see the muzzle flash and move to the side.
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Sep 8, 2023 01:40
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Mr SuperAwesome posted:How many shells can the US (or west in total) produce annually compared to the Russians? From what I have read in (western) media sources the Russians have not only cheaper production but can also massively out produce the west (like 5x) which is not good news for the west or Ukraine. It's not a fair or apporiate comparison because the west doesn't really go all in on artillery the way Russia does in regards to how we/they do things. Yes, that is an issue for Ukraine because it doesn't have what the West uses to offset this, which is hilariously overpowering air support. Telsa Cola fucked around with this message at 01:20 on Sep 14, 2023 |
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Sep 14, 2023 01:16
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Mr SuperAwesome posted:Also, what is the difference between a so called fancy shell and a regular one? They still go boom and are fired out of artillery guns, the fact that one is fancy really doesn’t make a big difference. You don't really know what you are talking about and it's been discussed previously in thread somewhat at length. If you are still oblivious you can figure it out pretty easily with googling or go ask one of the various military equipment threads. You are basically making a nonsensical argument akin to saying an unrifled musket ball is the same as a "fancy" rifled round because the both go boom and are fired out of guns. Telsa Cola fucked around with this message at 18:24 on Sep 14, 2023 |
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Sep 14, 2023 18:14
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Groggy nard posted:I've heard the ability to bust trenches was a big factor in usizing the autocannon. 25mm had trouble moving dirt, despite bonking Soviet tanks just fine. There's apparently a round type which basically airbursts over trenches which from the testing videos looked terrifying because you could basically just walk it down the line.
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Sep 17, 2023 21:36
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