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propatriamori posted:Prop 2: That talk was from me. I would make a scout lance be useful.
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Mar 24, 2024 23:54
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I'm voting for Unit Composition: C Proposed lance setup: E or A and Primary Objective: C We need to stop this false flag stuff at it's core, as soon as possible. There's no better way to do so than directly hunting down and engaging the raiders, ideally capturing their JumpShip(s)/Dropships with our expanded Aerospace compliment. The weakness of any force in Battletech is it's ability to move from system to system, so gearing up to attack that directly seems like the most expedient way to put a stop to the raids. It would be nice if we could reliably try and train up resistance fighters or try and stop attacks in progress, but those feel like playing whack-a-mole or catch up. We're the SLDF, we don't need to mess around with half measures! I think option A would work decently well too. Bases can't pack up and leave, so we have guaranteed targets to hit that WILL force a response or a change in operations. B seems like we'd be getting off track. Hitting the Dracs ourselves doesn't really derail their plan at all, and it just lets them openly field regulars against us, because we're the aggressors.
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Mar 25, 2024 00:26
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Good going GoonLance on completing the campaign objectives!
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Mar 25, 2024 00:41
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PoptartsNinja posted:Notable Salvage A couple other stray thoughts: * We don't have any sweet sweet LAM salvage, though apparently they are common enough that the only thing that struck us as innovative was the Locust Deathtrap LAM. It seems like the other LAMs we saw would be absolutely amazing scouts, able to dicate how and when they're engaged, and if the Fake SLDF is using them doctrinally having our own mirrors of this could be helpful. We can't fake them out every time, but that doesn't mean we can't do it more than once. * Elrika joined up with us, as did her driver! We should reward them with a sweet ride when we think about unit compositions.
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Mar 25, 2024 00:46
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I do think no matter what we gotta get Grandpa rocking something with much more firepower than his old hoplite lol. An LBX10 is good, but, man is it a waste to have a gunnery 2 pilot in a mech with basically one real gun.
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Mar 25, 2024 01:03
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Theo would be an absolute terror in that Stalker, I feel.
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Mar 25, 2024 01:40
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Personal thoughts: Unit Composition: D We have a demonstrated history of working nicely with irregulars/mercenaries and already have a few ready and waiting to potentially sign with us, so keeping that element going is a good idea, particularly when the strategic level goal is "link up enough colonies/irregulars to form a working army". I agree that having infantry capacity might also unlock some interesting goals, and would be potentially useful in the training purpose as well, so potentially a sub of B would be considered - but I do want to call attention to the dropship compositions. Option D doesn't seem to actually have infantry deployment capability, so adding those in would either involve matching the vote choice of swapping out the Lion for a Fury (which seems like a significant downgrade), PTN allowing an infantry refit of the Lion (something which Sarna suggests even the Clans could never get to work right?), or most likely refitting the Union to take infantry instead of fighters which does appear to be a known variant but imo I'd rather have the fighters? Company Composition: E This and C seem to be the best fit for the mechs we have/have salvaged (mostly heavies/assaults with longer range capability, as I understand it), but E will allow PTN to show off what they're planning for scout lances, so I'd go for that. Primary Objective: C+D Anywhere the fake SLDF is attacking is someplace they think has a chance of turning against them, so I vote we take them at their word and make sure they turn against them. Visibly engaging in D will help provide cover for C (less chance of escalating the conflict if we appear to be acting defensively), and again if our strategic goal is building a force that will threaten the border this seems like the most direct/visible way to do that (and as propatriamori noted being visibly key can only be good for our long-term career). It also mixes well with the irregular composition, since we'd potentially have the opportunity to do some direct field training that way.
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Mar 25, 2024 01:45
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Went with Liaison Company and Command Company. Our mechs and skills match up nicely with a command lance's composition. Betting on locals having more than little mechs is foolish. But they are going to be experts at using those Locusts and Wasps to spot trouble and get away in their home turf.
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Mar 25, 2024 02:22
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Training militias to fight a fake empire would probably create militias that have experience and motivation to fight real empire. Best not to get the Periphery ready to fight the SLDF again. Whatever the choice is gonna be it shouldn't be that.
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Mar 25, 2024 06:46
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quote:The Proposal (Part 1: Unit Composition) This seems like the best force composition to me. Three lances of SLDF regulars gives us a full company of trustworthy pilots, all of whom will be piloting battlemechs of proven quality. AeroSpace fighters have a lot of utility and will give us the ability to call in airstrikes and bombing runs, while also being useful for threatening and/or disabling enemy DropShips. Losing access to the auxiliaries is unfortunate, but their loyalties as former pirates / mercenaries still aren't 100% assured. quote:The Proposal (Part 2: Composition) These two seem to be the most versatile options. We definitely want at least one Scout Lance for recon purposes, and Battle Lances are going to be our bread and butter once the shooting starts. quote:The Proposal (Part 3: Primary Objective) I'm going with these two. Option A is obvious, we know where all the bases are and destroying them will cripple the Fake SLDF's supply lines, making further action against them much easier. Option E will give us more insight into the Fake SLDF's tactics, and as we all know, information is ammunition.
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Mar 25, 2024 07:05
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I think these primary objectives are not crazy enough, so hear me out: We should paint our mechs to be fake Kurita and also raid the periphery, to unite them in their hatred of Kuritas. They will never expect this and thus it is the best plan.
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Mar 25, 2024 09:33
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PoptartsNinja posted:That talk was from me. I'd like to request the addition of a special recon lance to our task force. This will be an additional Leopard CV carrying 4 lams and two support fighters/bombers (or just 6 lams). This necessitates the inclusion of more dropship transport capability and this represents the 'big ask' of our general: Either an upgrade in jumpship to a Star lord or Monolith... or the additional inclusion of a Scout class jumpship. Land air mechs are useful, actually available in era, and I like the idea of taking inspiration from our enemies. They make a lot of sense in a recon scenario, and both the stinger and wasp lams have sldf unique versions. Tldr, I'd like to see our recon lance be an air recon lance. if you give me a little bit i'll see if I can't make it a formal proposition
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Mar 25, 2024 13:06
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Voted EEE: as we’ve shown, the ability to recruit our opfor can be very valuable; want to see what scout lances can do, and finishing the E combo
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Mar 25, 2024 14:15
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propatriamori posted:Prop 1: B+D Gwaihir posted:We need to stop this false flag stuff at it's core, as soon as possible. There's no better way to do so than directly hunting down and engaging the raiders, ideally capturing their JumpShip(s)/Dropships with our expanded Aerospace compliment. The weakness of any force in Battletech is it's ability to move from system to system, so gearing up to attack that directly seems like the most expedient way to put a stop to the raids. I wanted to say that these two are an inspiration. Here's what I got: Proposion Ambition. This is going off of the current trends in polls and a consolidated action plan that encompasses most of the high notes, but may change as poeple weigh in It makes several assumptions, such as 'we're not getting expensive, rare or in demand assets (like the aformentioned unless its justifiable), but there IS a little negotiating room for making do with current assets. (ie, we're not getting another union either, but if we use current salvage instead of demanding new units, then we get some consideration) Prop 1: Reinforced Irregular, with a twist Prop 2: Command Company (command lance, mixed battle, scout) Prop 3: Seek And Destroy = Big Game hunt > recon in force Unit Composition: Irregular Company 1 Star lord, or Monolith class jump ship, as available, or the addition of a Scout class jump ship to a more common Merchant or Tramp -type. (4 or greater docking collars required) 1 Union-class dropship, 1 Aqueduct-class dropship, 1 Leopard Carrier Version-class DropShip(LAM or ASF carrier), 1 Intruder-class dropship(light vehicle carrier refit;wiki page mentinos this is a thing, otherwise Fury or Lion( as available 2 lance of SLDF regulars, 1 'lance' of sldf airmech royals, 1 lance of recruited mercenaries. Spares vary based on which infantry carrier we get assigned. An intruder type also has two asf slots. Several Platoons of infantry and Light Vehicles depending on assigned dropship capacity.(varies, 4/4-8 The reason for this change up in logistics simple: Everyone wants to go after the raiding forces directly, and if we manage to go after another dropship again this leads to a challenge: But sir, how do we get it back, and well, we need infantry for that. Most of the fighting will be done with mechs, with an emphasis on -fast- recon with infantry support to capture, hold or deny territory as appropriate. Alternatively, recon LAMs can fit in an intruder (2x) without requiring a Leopard at all, or leaving it as a dropship interdictor. Proposed refit: STG-A1 stinger lam: Replace a pulse laser with recon camera for flyover, or both pulse lasers with a BAP+recon camera. Salvage use: Up to the thread, but If we're going with the irregular volunteers then Elrika and Marcus need rides. Stalker and Catapult seem best, but we might want to give one of them the sentinel anyway. Tldr; In return for going with what we've got, we ask for expanded jumpship ability. If we can justify that, we can ask for less in demand assets, like leopards. I should also probably say i'm advocaing for expanding the different types of units we have on the field - I'd like to see more combined arms, since we didn't get to that in lets play alpha strike, but its more intended to flex different mission objectives than put more units on the field. Example: if we're not going after a city fight, the infantry may stay at home, but if we want to board a dropship again we need them on hand and can't necessarily rely on locals a second go round. Overall, I think its more likely we get a Scout than upgraded in jumpship tho. Side question: Is it possible to add some infantry platoons to a lion? Its got a TON of free cargo, and together with a union it represents a -ton- of firepower in 2 dropship slots. if it had some infantry on it, it'd be almost perfect. TheParadigm fucked around with this message at 14:46 on Mar 25, 2024 |
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Mar 25, 2024 14:24
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I guess I misread the vote stuff. I could've sworn Prop 3 was vote-for-one
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Mar 25, 2024 20:14
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So why are the star league and combine antagonists anyway? I don't know the lore that well but I always thought the SLDF kind of did what they wanted and it would be stupid to go up against them as a single house.
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Mar 25, 2024 21:13
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Xarn posted:I think these primary objectives are not crazy enough, so hear me out: Best would be to paint our units as Kurita and focus on fighting the fake SLDF, for maximum "Spidermans pointing at other spidermans" effect. Mechanically, what is the difference in company composition between having mercs/auxiliaries and not? Does this mean no more recruiting enemies / locals? Does having access to mercs mean that we gain some flexibility at the cost of knowing exactly what our unit makeup will be?
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Mar 25, 2024 21:23
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I just wanna do Rogue Squadron but with Mechs!
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Mar 25, 2024 21:33
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Fuzzy Mammal posted:So why are the star league and combine antagonists anyway? I don't know the lore that well but I always thought the SLDF kind of did what they wanted and it would be stupid to go up against them as a single house. The Star League of this era was very much a tinder box, and it's not all or even mostly thanks to The Amazing Stephan and Boy Wonder Richy. There had already been 3 Shadow Wars. Those wars caused a hell of a lot of disruption, and exposed a foundational problem with the SLDF: it only really had the tools to deal with open and blatant rebellion. When it came to actually upholding what Star League was supposed to be, and maintaining the peace between supposedly peer members, it was okay, at best. As for Kurita in particular, it was involved in all three Shadow Wars and had basically taken every opportunity to test what was allowed, or could be gotten away with. It was so bad that for the first half of the Amaris Civil War Kerensky was avoiding moving through DC space because he had to take in the possibility that Kurita was the true mastermind.
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Mar 25, 2024 21:41
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TheParadigm posted:1 Star lord, or Monolith class jump ship, as available Some of the force comps already have an upgraded JumpShip. I didn't give it to all of them because I value the Lion and its extra spares pretty highly, because it means if you pick up a great pilot in some periphery trash 'Mech you can trade them into something good straight away. I might let myself be argued up to a Merchant-class for all setups, but I'm afraid you're probably not getting anything bigger than that in the deep periphery. Anything bigger would be dedicated to hauling a Battalion around and the odds of a Company Commander getting a second JumpShip are near zero. SirPhoebos posted:It was so bad that for the first half of the Amaris Civil War Kerensky was avoiding moving through DC space because he had to take in the possibility that Kurita was the true mastermind. And there was a strong possibility that the Kuritans would decide to attack them even if they weren't, considering House Kurita and House Amaris were on far friendlier terms than House Kurita and House Cameron ever were. Most of the Great Houses didn't really have too many issues with Amaris's rule, it was only once it was clear he was going to lose that they started considering "helping to liberate" the Terran Hegemony. PoptartsNinja fucked around with this message at 21:55 on Mar 25, 2024 |
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Mar 25, 2024 21:46
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Amaris also took a member of the Kurita family on Terra hostage and promised they would die if the Combine took offensive action against his new Empire. That was only known after the fact, so the Coordinator acted in a confusing and equally provocative manner to both sides of the conflict. The Combine's foundational purpose is to conquer everyone, so they were pressured into joining the Star League after realizing the alliance of other houses would overpower them, and while in the League they were the habitual line-steppers.
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Mar 25, 2024 22:32
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DeepThrobble posted:The Combine's foundational purpose is to conquer everyone, so they were pressured into joining the Star League after realizing the alliance of other houses would overpower them, and while in the League they were the habitual line-steppers. One Coordinator jumped the Hegemony border to kidnap children that he thought were his offspring. Kerensky also wouldn't be where he was as fast as he was if not for the fact his family had a hereditary title they got when that same drunk Coordinator pulled a knife and tried to kill the First Lord with it. We know from some of the Star League-era sourcebooks that the SLDF leadership prior to the Amaris Crisis were operating under the assumption that they'd be in a shooting war with the DC within 20 years. So if the PCs go high enough up the chain eventually they'll hit someone who is actively planning to fight them RIGHT NOW.
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Mar 25, 2024 22:57
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evilmiera posted:Training militias to fight a fake empire would probably create militias that have experience and motivation to fight real empire. Best not to get the Periphery ready to fight the SLDF again. Whatever the choice is gonna be it shouldn't be that. That's the wrong type of long term thinking, preparing more militias to fight for centuries and centuries is how you turn your officer insignias into a vice presidency at New Earth War Profiteering Incorporated, there is nothing quite as delicious as the prospect of "full circle", the perfect virtuous circle, someone else puts meat in and you get money out, forever, there is no possible drawback.
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Mar 25, 2024 23:00
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Defiance Industries posted:We know from some of the Star League-era sourcebooks that the SLDF leadership prior to the Amaris Crisis were operating under the assumption that they'd be in a shooting war with the DC within 20 years. So if the PCs go high enough up the chain eventually they'll hit someone who is actively planning to fight them RIGHT NOW. I think all of the House Lords were in full asshat mode. I mean, if the Chancellor of the Capellan Confederation (Barbara Liao) is the most sympathetic...
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Mar 26, 2024 00:55
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PoptartsNinja posted:Some of the force comps already have an upgraded JumpShip. I didn't give it to all of them because I value the Lion and its extra spares pretty highly, because it means if you pick up a great pilot in some periphery trash 'Mech you can trade them into something good straight away.
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Mar 26, 2024 01:37
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Vanigo posted:That's an upgrade? A Merchant only has two collars, the Tramp has three. I could've sworn it was four; but you're right. I thought the Tramp and the Merchant were comparable but it's the Tramp and the Star Lord. So I guess those options all come with a Star Lord instead.
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Mar 26, 2024 01:47
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I went with aerospace support and the campaign options for putting them to use. LAMs are generally inferior to mechs on the ground. They're hilariously inferior to fighters in space and if that Union was indicative of the enemy's aerospace assets an actual factual Squadron of SLDF regular fighters is likely to carve a comically large swathe through anything they put in space. EDIT: for context, a Corsair is equivalent in thrust and maneuverability to the Stinger/Wasp LAMs, but has more gun and armor than four of them put together. As one single fighter. Strobe fucked around with this message at 02:51 on Mar 26, 2024 |
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Mar 26, 2024 02:38
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I went for maximum weird locals. I like 'em and it's funny to have the Star League functioning as a bus service for Periphery yahoos.
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Mar 26, 2024 02:39
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SIGSEGV posted:That's the wrong type of long term thinking, preparing more militias to fight for centuries and centuries is how you turn your officer insignias into a vice presidency at New Earth War Profiteering Incorporated, there is nothing quite as delicious as the prospect of "full circle", the perfect virtuous circle, someone else puts meat in and you get money out, forever, there is no possible drawback. I do not remember this monologue in metal gear
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Mar 26, 2024 02:58
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Strobe posted:I went with aerospace support and the campaign options for putting them to use. LAMs are generally inferior to mechs on the ground. They're hilariously inferior to fighters in space and if that Union was indicative of the enemy's aerospace assets an actual factual Squadron of SLDF regular fighters is likely to carve a comically large swathe through anything they put in space. as someone who watched both Robotech and Macross I don't understand what you're saying
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Mar 26, 2024 03:14
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propatriamori posted:as someone who watched both Robotech and Macross I don't understand what you're saying Don't worry neither did the people who designed LAMs.
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Mar 26, 2024 03:23
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PoptartsNinja posted:That talk was from me. Got a link to that?
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Mar 26, 2024 03:31
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painedforever posted:I think all of the House Lords were in full asshat mode. I mean, if the Chancellor of the Capellan Confederation (Barbara Liao) is the most sympathetic... I don't really blame them, the Hegemony had been telling them that they were on their own for decades. When the DC invaded the FS, the First Lord decided to punish both of them equally for fighting each other, rather than punish the aggressor. And when Michael Steiner presented the evidence he accumulated showing the Combine to be behind bandit attacks on his border, Kerensky refused to act because he thought that would be taking sides.
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Mar 26, 2024 06:19
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LaSquida posted:Got a link to that? Here you go.
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Mar 26, 2024 07:25
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PoptartsNinja posted:Sadly, "making recon units more useful" just isn't possible. The size of the maps are too small to make scouting for enemies worthwhile and most recon 'Mechs are fast so they can avoid combat. I wonder if there are any scout-mech-incursions that'd be interesting to fight. Like, rushing in to raid an area while the defending mech lance pilots are trying to get to their mechs, while light defending vehicles harass you. I guess anything like that would still probably be in-and-out so immediately following it up with players in Proper Mechs would make sense, maybe as The Real Raid following the recon/recon-in-force. My memory is shot so I have no recollection of if you've already done exactly this in one of the battletech threads already.
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Mar 26, 2024 08:10
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propatriamori posted:I guess anything like that would still probably be in-and-out so immediately following it up with players in Proper Mechs would make sense, maybe as The Real Raid following the recon/recon-in-force. This is something I've been considering. A scout / skirmish lance could be assigned to harass the OpFor off-screen before the main player force arrives. The OpFor would begin with some battle damage and less than maximum ammunition, and some enemy units would wind up scattered or out of position. In the best case some enemy units could run off in pursuit and only return after a certain number of turns had passed. Of course, there would also be the chance that the skirmishers would encounter stiffer resistance than expected and take damage themselves. In the worst case they might wind up getting pinned down, forcing the players to decide whether to divert resources to rescue them or continue with the mission and trust that they can break out on their own.
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Mar 26, 2024 08:19
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Defiance Industries posted:I don't really blame them, the Hegemony had been telling them that they were on their own for decades. When the DC invaded the FS, the First Lord decided to punish both of them equally for fighting each other, rather than punish the aggressor. And when Michael Steiner presented the evidence he accumulated showing the Combine to be behind bandit attacks on his border, Kerensky refused to act because he thought that would be taking sides. Another place were "almost as stupid as Kerensky" is the perfect insult.
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Mar 26, 2024 13:18
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PoptartsNinja posted:I could've sworn it was four; but you're right. I thought the Tramp and the Merchant were comparable but it's the Tramp and the Star Lord. Oh shoot, hah. I didn't mean to make this a thing, but I was wondering about the collar situation. I was trying to find ships with four docking collars in megameklab and it looks like they basically don't exist, which seems silly. Is there any reason for that? Extra docking collars isn't necessarily a bad thing tho, if you want to leave room to make friends and allies on the way, tho, narratively speaking. I'll have to have a think about this.
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Mar 26, 2024 18:07
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SIGSEGV posted:Another place were "almost as stupid as Kerensky" is the perfect insult. Y'know, I liked Kerensky. Does that make me a mark, because I'm "supposed to" because of the fluff? The Draconis Combine though, throughout the Star League era, just seemed to be looking for an excuse to have a fight. Or overthrow everyone to try and take over. I can't find my books anymore, what were the Capellans up to? I like House Liao more than the Davions, is that bad?
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Mar 26, 2024 20:00
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painedforever posted:Y'know, I liked Kerensky. Does that make me a mark, because I'm "supposed to" because of the fluff? The Draconis Combine's political stance is that no other nations have the right to exist and they should get to conquer everyone. They joined the Star League in exchange for a promise that if the DC ever fought the FS, the Star League would take the Combine's side. The Capellans spent most of the Star League setting up the political and military structure that exists in the current CapCon; during the Reunification War, the Capellans charged a head tax on every Star League soldier coming through the realm into the TC so they got rich off that, but when the war ended, they went into a huge economic depression. They instituted the system of compulsory service to combat that and then began reforming the military and economy.
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Mar 26, 2024 20:15
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