|
Jokes going to be on everyone calling formidable a win-more mechanic when it's incredibly easy to activate and 45% of the time it's active you're not even winning because every board in every matchup in standard looks like GW devotion mirrors. Yeah, everyone will sure look dumb then (especially WotC).
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 16:50
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 7, 2024 20:20 |
|
|
AlternateNu posted:Yeah. Between Roast, Ultimate Price coming back, and now enemy hate-sacking, W/u heroic is probably dead. I don't think Ultimate Price will see much play in maindecks and you're going to have to choose between it and self-inflicted wound for SB slots so I don't think these cards will be played all that much. It's not like WU is a T1 deck that everyone has to SB for now...
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 16:51
|
|
|
Spiderdrake posted:Would you step the rhetoric down a notch? The point is it's easy to misread these cards, not a point about evaluation. Let's back up here: perhaps I'm not understanding your underlying argument here.
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 16:53
|
|
|
Spiderdrake posted:Would you step the rhetoric down a notch? The point is it's easy to misread these cards, not a point about evaluation. Okay that's cool, but we were talking about our evaluation of the card so can you not see where he thought that was part of your opinion about it?
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 16:53
|
|
|
This doesn't actually seem that amazing. It's Counterspell when you have your Ojutai in your hand and a really bad Force Spike every other time.
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 16:55
|
|
|
Short of them reprinting Force Spike in Standard, I don't get the rush to compare the two cards.Angry Grimace posted:People tap out sure, but control decks are heavily biased towards consistency and this card is the poster-child for inconsistency. 1 or 2 Dragons is not enough to reliably turn on the part of this card that makes it any good. I totally understand, and I reiterate that it's why I only think it will see play in singletons.
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 16:56
|
|
|
mcmagic posted:I don't think Ultimate Price will see much play in maindecks and you're going to have to choose between it and self-inflicted wound for SB slots so I don't think these cards will be played all that much. It's not like WU is a T1 deck that everyone has to SB for now... People will maindeck Ultimate Price. Every deck has relevant threats that it can kill. Even the most multi-colored deck in the format, Abzan, has Tasigur, Courser, Wingmate Roc. And you can just side it out for that match. I'd say 2 mainboard, 2 sideboard for most black decks. It may even replace Bile Blight entirely unless token decks resurge for some reason.
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 16:56
|
|
|
AlternateNu posted:People will maindeck Ultimate Price. Every deck has relevant threats that it can kill. Even the most multi-colored deck in the format, Abzan, has Tasigur, Courser, Wingmate Roc. I think most decks that have access to white (which is basically every deck playing black except UB control) will prefer Valorous stance. It kills all of those plus Siege Rhino, Butcher, and Anafenza. Though Ultimate price does kill Rabblemaster before it can make a token when you're on the draw, so it has that going for it. It seems like the way they're going with removal in standard is that if you want to remove something for less than 3 mana, you have to choose which restricted subset of things you can hit. I'd be surprised if we get any unconditional removal for 2 or less in the near future, even Pacifism. Entropic fucked around with this message at 17:02 on Mar 9, 2015 |
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 17:00
|
|
|
Entropic posted:This doesn't actually seem that amazing. It's Counterspell when you have your Ojutai in your hand and a really bad Force Spike every other time.
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 17:00
|
|
|
That hate cycle is awesome but Wizards bros where are the rebound cards.
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 17:02
|
|
|
mr. mephistopheles posted:That hate cycle is awesome but Wizards bros where are the rebound cards. Yeah, let's see the draft commons dammit.
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 17:04
|
|
|
Angry Grimace posted:Let's back up here: perhaps I'm not understanding your underlying argument here. My point was it's easy to misread these cards because they don't flow very well. Silumgar is an example because he is currently the only dragon seeing play in control. Ultima66 posted:Jokes going to be on everyone calling formidable a win-more mechanic when it's
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 17:05
|
|
|
Angry Grimace posted:If your hexproof Silumgar is in play, you already won the game. LSV just posted a video where he beat hexproof Silumgar multiple times. With a tokens deck. Admittedly, that's LSV, but still.
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 17:05
|
|
|
Angry Grimace posted:
It also doesn't have the grammatical error in the direct translation someone posted (which was probably a difference in grammar between languages) so I appreciate that they seem to try to do legit translations and not just slap some poo poo in a translator.
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 17:09
|
|
|
Spiderdrake posted:What underlying argument? My evaluation of the card is right underneath the sentence you jumped on. Its just such a removal heavy format that you don't see stalled boards all tha- 
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 17:13
|
|
|
Angry Grimace posted:Its just such a removal heavy format that you don't see stalled boards all tha-  Really? The Silumgar comment was pretty good but this is something else.
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 17:16
|
|
|
...I just realized that in FRF there are no enemy colored cards with their clan keyword (white cards with Dash, for example). In retrospect DTK being about ally colors seems obvious.
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 17:20
|
|
|
Swagger Dagger posted:If all of the "dragons matter" spells were tribal, that dragon counter might be good. 
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 17:20
|
|
|
What's w/ all these Formidable references to Onslaught cards? (Dragon Roost spit out 5/5s)
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 17:22
|
|
|
Rinkles posted:What's w/ all these Formidable references to Onslaught cards? (Dragon Roost spit out 5/5s) Wow a card that makes dragons, in the dragon set, what's the deal with that
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 17:25
|
|
|
Spiderdrake posted:
The joke is that formidable will actually be an incredibly powerful and nearly unconditional mechanic because WotC wants all of standard to look like this:
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 17:27
|
|
|
Ultima66 posted:Jokes going to be on everyone calling formidable a win-more mechanic when it's incredibly easy to activate and 45% of the time it's active you're not even winning because every board in every matchup in standard looks like GW devotion mirrors. Yeah, everyone will sure look dumb then (especially WotC). You'll be the king of the forums when everyone sees how truly great your prediction is
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 17:27
|
|
|
I think I am understanding the formidable hate... it is not that the mechanic is weak or bad, or that cards with formidable abilities might as well not have abilities, it is just that those cards are boring in the strategy. Getting a 3 mana 8/6 from your 8 1/1s is cool, but Seraph of the masses already does that in a more interesting way that inspires deckbuilding. Formidable is basically Wurmcoil engine with a color restriction?
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 17:28
|
|
|
bhsman posted:Short of them reprinting Force Spike in Standard, I don't get the rush to compare the two cards. People are comparing them because force spike would be pretty underwhelming in this environment full of midrange haymakers and this card is worse. On turn two you'd rather be holding up Ultimate Price, it guarantees that you'll be holding a dead card in the midgame, and in the lategame the mana savings isn't particularly relevant. It's not like people will even go out of their way to play around it unless it doesn't cost them meaningfully to do so, since even if they run straight into it you're no better off then if you'd just put a better card in your deck in the first place.
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 17:28
|
|
|
Ultima66 posted:The joke is that formidable will actually be an incredibly powerful and nearly unconditional mechanic because WotC wants all of standard to look like this: Doesn't that look like fun, though?
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 17:28
|
|
|
Ultima66 posted:The joke is that formidable will actually be an incredibly powerful and nearly unconditional mechanic because WotC wants all of standard to look like this: This is Ma- Oh whatever, you know the rest
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 17:29
|
|
|
I like the Formidable dude. It's playable without that ability, which is just gravy, and it's going to turn on and do some work more than once in a blue moon.
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 17:31
|
|
|
Assuming you see 27 cards (seven starting hand, six draw steps, and two Dig Through Times) by turn six, your Silumgar's Scorn will be online 55% of the time if you run one dragon or 70% of the time if you run two. Seems like too much work instead of just running Dissolve.
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 17:32
|
|
|
 Somebody in R&D loves Cauldron Dance as much as I do.  This guy is such an rear end, and his buddy cop movie with Boneshredder will be an instant classic.
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 17:34
|
|
|
I actually like how that formidable is designed, even if the card itself is not good in the abstract that kind of ability is neat in a sprout swarm way.
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 17:38
|
|
|
Guys I don't think you've realized the synergies between Silumgar's Scorn, Mutavault, and Nameless Inversion.
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 17:40
|
|
|
AlternateNu posted:People will maindeck Ultimate Price. Every deck has relevant threats that it can kill. Even the most multi-colored deck in the format, Abzan, has Tasigur, Courser, Wingmate Roc. And you can just side it out for that match. I'd say 2 mainboard, 2 sideboard for most black decks. It may even replace Bile Blight entirely unless token decks resurge for some reason. I don't think so. You can't have an Ultimate Price in your hand when they play a Siege Rhino.
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 17:45
|
|
|
LGS got their Dragonfury board in the post and the whole thing's surprisingly fun for what amounts to a cheap sideshow game. I hope it becomes popular because more silly rear end games like that would make Pre-Releases so much more fun.
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 17:45
|
|
|
Sampatrick posted:Guys I don't think you've realized the synergies between Silumgar's Scorn, Mutavault, and Nameless Inversion. So, Slum's UU turns into 1UU in modern (not good), or you have to have NI in your hand (not played). Nooooooope
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 17:48
|
|
|
bhsman posted:
Silumgar comment?
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 17:56
|
|
|
It's obviously an object lesson in how inefficient and pointless a feeling scorn is.
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 18:02
|
|
|
Attorney at Funk posted:It's obviously an object lesson in how inefficient and pointless a feeling scorn is.
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 18:03
|
|
|
mcmagic posted:I don't think so. You can't have an Ultimate Price in your hand when they play a Siege Rhino. TIL there are no monocolored cards in the decks w/ siege rhino
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 18:05
|
|
|
Zoness posted:TIL there are no monocolored cards in the decks w/ siege rhino You can't have a removal spell in your main that only hits half their relevant threats.
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 18:07
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 7, 2024 20:20 |
|
|
mcmagic posted:You can't have a removal spell in your main that only hits half their relevant threats. Bile blight?
|
|
#
?
Mar 9, 2015 18:10
|
|