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Tezzor posted:http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/people-are-getting-shot-by-toddlers-on-a-weekly-basis-this-year/ar-AAfstpF?li=BBgzzfc&ocid=iehp How many of those toddlers had proper firearm safety training though?
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Oct 15, 2015 18:14
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-Troika- posted:Actually, brandishing it and telling the guy to gently caress off, but feel free to keep fantasizing about it in your head. Ah, now I can imagine the scene - "Hey dude, can I borrow a cig-" "Get away from me you freak! I have a gun! gently caress off!"
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Oct 15, 2015 18:19
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Because let's face it,IAMNOTADOCTOR posted:4. Most purported self-defense gun uses are gun uses in escalating arguments and are both socially undesirable and illegal
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Oct 15, 2015 18:23
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I'm kind of curious how they defined these "self-defense" uses. Is it where:
That would make a huge difference in the weight of the self defense stat.
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Oct 15, 2015 18:57
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Using self-reported data about macho fantasy scenarios collected from a telephone survey is not going to get you the most accurate information, and I wouldn't be making policy recommendations from it edit: one way OR the other walgreenslatino fucked around with this message at 19:01 on Oct 15, 2015 |
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Oct 15, 2015 18:59
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various cheeses posted:I'm kind of curious how they defined these "self-defense" uses. In the instances of 3, most people don't bother reporting those incidents to the cops because it's going to be a waste of time 99% of the time: in my case, all three incidents happened at night in poorly lit areas and I wouldn't have been able to give a good description, other than "this guy was wearing x", so it would have resulted in "thank you sir" *tosses report into the paper shredder*.
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Oct 15, 2015 19:01
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Dead Reckoning posted:I honestly don't know what you meant, because I'm not aware of any cases that overturned or superseded Heller. Oh, stomping around my ranch or whatever in a tank would be sweet, and I completely agree that if you can afford that, go nuts. I don't think it would be ok to take it off one's own property, though. And hell, if you want to fire off RPG or mortar rounds on your own property, as long as nobody gets hurt, what's the harm? I wouldn't like people firing them indiscriminately at civilians off of rooftops, though. And that's the issue here: the constitution says you can have them, and people will misuse them, so how do we address that? I'll have to get back to you on the exact court rulings when I have more time. Hope the thread lives that long... 
erosion fucked around with this message at 19:18 on Oct 15, 2015 |
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Oct 15, 2015 19:15
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Hm. How many defensive legal uses of firearms are there? On the one hand: logic; studies based on literally anything. On the other hand: an extrapolated number based entirely on unsubstantiated claims; my fear of emasculation. The debate continues...
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Oct 15, 2015 19:17
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Laphroaig posted:just have huge taxation on guns and ammunition so that the poor can't own guns, they are the ones that commit all the crimes, problem solved True story, that's what the National Firearms Act tax stamps on machine guns, sound suppressors, and short barrel shotguns/rifles were meant to be. A way to let the rich have their toys while keeping the majority of the working class from being able to afford them. Luckily everyone's terrified to reopen the question in order to increase the cost of the tax stamps, and $200 is fairly minor today compared to the 1930's. Liquid Communism fucked around with this message at 19:27 on Oct 15, 2015 |
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Oct 15, 2015 19:18
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Tezzor posted:Hm. How many defensive legal uses of firearms are there? On the one hand: logic; studies based on literally anything. On the other hand: an extrapolated number based entirely on unsubstantiated claims; my fear of emasculation. The debate continues... "Centers for Disease Control: Priorities For Research to Reduce the Threat of Firearm-Related Violence " posted:Somewhere between 108,000 and 3 million.
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Oct 15, 2015 19:27
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-Troika- posted:In the instances of 3, most people don't bother reporting those incidents to the cops because it's going to be a waste of time 99% of the time: in my case, all three incidents happened at night in poorly lit areas and I wouldn't have been able to give a good description, other than "this guy was wearing x", so it would have resulted in "thank you sir" *tosses report into the paper shredder*. So you waved a gun at someone taking a walk at night and considered it successfully defending yourself from The Criminal Mind. Astounding.
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Oct 15, 2015 19:39
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stealie72 posted:Split the difference and you've got a 5 defensive uses for every 1 criminal use. Take the lowest number and you've still got a pretty hefty amount of people defending themselves with guns. The low end is based on something, and the high end is based on nothing. "Splitting the difference" is insanely lazy. Also, there are 1.25 million estimated violent crimes per year.
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Oct 15, 2015 19:46
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How many human beings are there in the United States? The low end is a little over 310 million and the high end estimate is 100 billion. If we assume the truth is somewhere in the middle,
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Oct 15, 2015 19:47
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http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonkblog/wp/2015/01/16/the-study-that-gun-rights-activists-keep-citing-but-completely-misunderstand/quote:The authors suggested focusing on five areas: the characteristics of firearm violence, risk and protective factors, interventions and strategies, gun safety technology and the influence of video games and other media. The document is peppered with examples of how little we know about the causes and consequences of gun violence -- no doubt the result of an 18-year-old CDC research ban.
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Oct 15, 2015 19:50
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Lol I just checked and the CDC report you're mentioning doesn't even do any of its own research into the question or make any claim about it, it just says "some people say 3 million, some say 100,000. Who can say??"
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Oct 15, 2015 19:52
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Tezzor posted:The low end is based on something, and the high end is based on nothing. "Splitting the difference" is insanely lazy. Also, there are 1.25 million estimated violent crimes per year. Yeah. The report says that the numbers vary widely, with those being the bookends. That's why I mentioned both. Even if you go for the anti-gun side and side with the minimum, that's still over 100k defensive uses of a gun, standing on contrast to your point that it's just a macho fantasy. Let me write your next post, though: Tezzor posted:Those are probably self-reported numbers by NRA members who are literally jerking off onto their gun as they report them.
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Oct 15, 2015 19:52
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stealie72 posted:Even if you go for the anti-gun side and side with the minimum, that's still over 100k defensive uses of a gun, standing on contrast to your point that it's just a macho fantasy. No? I have never claimed that guns are never used defensively. I have claimed they are used defensively far less frequently than they are used offensively, and the condition for their existence is more crime generally. Perhaps you would agree with more of my positions, were you capable of comprehending them. I am trying my best.
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Oct 15, 2015 19:55
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It's actually really likely that the majority of defensive uses are ones that were useless from the perspective of defending yourself. Given the relative probabilities of muggings versus non-mugging encounters and the issue that people who own guns for self-defense are more likely to report false positives in the first place...
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Oct 15, 2015 19:56
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stealie72 posted:Let me write your next post, though: He'd be at least half right, considering that Gun use in the United States: results from two national surveys posted:Data come from two national random digit dial
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Oct 15, 2015 19:58
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JT Jag posted:You guys are probably right that fixing and improving the NICS is something the Democrats should focus on more. I think the reason Democrats don't do it is that the NICS is 'settled', it's something that is already on the books, and even if it's not working as great as we might like the worry some of us might have is that if we ask to reform it the reply will be "we need to remove the ban on silencers or whatever before we can support that". But if they are honest about wanting to make a difference on gun violence they should.
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Oct 15, 2015 20:00
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Tezzor posted:http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/people-are-getting-shot-by-toddlers-on-a-weekly-basis-this-year/ar-AAfstpF?li=BBgzzfc&ocid=iehp Bad babies with guns can only be stopped by good babies with guns. Arm all babies.
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Oct 15, 2015 20:09
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Tezzor posted:http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/people-are-getting-shot-by-toddlers-on-a-weekly-basis-this-year/ar-AAfstpF?li=BBgzzfc&ocid=iehp Oh poo poo, thanks for reminding me! Reminder for Thursday, October 15th 2015 that some 80 people perished or will perish in the United States of America beause of guns today. There have been a couple shootings on street corners, a bunch of suicides with guns, a few gun-related accidents resulting in death today, and some cops shooting people. A good fraction got killed by people they knew and who had no criminal record. All this to say that the 2nd Amendment in no way precludes intelligent regulation of guns, selective bans, and the registration of gun owners, all of which would contribute to a pacified society and the gradual elimination of this ghastly gun culture.
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Oct 15, 2015 20:13
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We need to give robbers a safe working environment, who is with me!?
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Oct 15, 2015 20:32
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various cheeses posted:We need to give robbers a safe working environment, who is with me!? I'm just saying that if you don't want to turn from a gun owner into a gun owned, don't confront burglars in your home  EDIT also yeah if you're not a sociopath, you shouldn't be itching for burglar death
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Oct 15, 2015 20:39
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various cheeses posted:We need to give robbers a safe working environment, who is with me!? *in fascist voice* Long live death! ¡Viva la muerte!
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Oct 15, 2015 20:43
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TheRamblingSoul posted:Bad babies with guns can only be stopped by good babies with guns. This, but unironically.
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Oct 15, 2015 20:52
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Flowers For Algeria posted:I'm just saying that if you don't want to turn from a gun owner into a gun owned, don't confront burglars in your home My goal is to get the guy out of the house, not kill him. This rear end in a top hat shouldn't be in my house stealing my stuff, don't give him the benefit of the doubt over me.
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Oct 15, 2015 20:59
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The lives of burglars are worth more than those of gun owners. Discuss.
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Oct 15, 2015 21:08
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Effectronica posted:The lives of burglars are worth more than those of gun owners. Discuss. Hm. Seems implausible, but as always I keep an open mind. Present your evidence, OP.
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Oct 15, 2015 21:11
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Burglars- avoid killing. Gun owners- talk at length about how they want to kill. Killing is worse than stealing. QED.
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Oct 15, 2015 21:14
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Effectronica posted:The lives of burglars are worth more than those of gun owners. Discuss. What if the burglars are also gun owners??
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Oct 15, 2015 21:17
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Effectronica posted:The lives of burglars are worth more than those of gun owners. Discuss. Burglars are quite unlikely to be violent and almost certainly forced into their actions by an oppressive and apathetic society. Armed homeowners are guaranteed to have money if they have a home and firearm in the first place and certainly willing killers as they chose to be armed in the first place. That the money spent on their weapons was not, instead, donated to organizations created to help stabilize income and housing for the disenfranchised means they have contributed to the necessity of the theft of their own property.
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Oct 15, 2015 21:17
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various cheeses posted:My goal is to get the guy out of the house, not kill him. This rear end in a top hat shouldn't be in my house stealing my stuff, don't give him the benefit of the doubt over me. So instead of taking out your gun, buy an oversized and extremely loud alarm clock that you can remotely activate and you can be sure that the dude will run away if you turn the thing on.
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Oct 15, 2015 21:34
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Effectronica posted:So you waved a gun at someone taking a walk at night and considered it successfully defending yourself from The Criminal Mind. Astounding.
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Oct 15, 2015 21:35
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Pitch posted:Anyone reading Troika's posts should keep in mind that his interest in guns is entirely based on an anime he saw like three years ago. He literally just showed up in TFR on the day it started airing asking a lot of questions about he could buy the same gun that the main character has and has been insufferable about the topic ever since. If you ask him to describe his foiled muggings in any greater detail they're probably the same fight scenes but with the magical swordfights taken out. 
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Oct 15, 2015 21:36
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Pitch posted:Anyone reading Troika's posts should keep in mind that his interest in guns is entirely based on an anime he saw like three years ago. He literally just showed up in TFR on the day it started airing asking a lot of questions about he could buy the same gun that the main character has and has been insufferable about the topic ever since. If you ask him to describe his foiled muggings in any greater detail they're probably the climactic fight scene but with the magical swordfights taken out. Which gun was it
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Oct 15, 2015 21:36
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5 bucks says it's the main character's gun from cowboy bebop The Jericho or whatever CZ knockoff it is. various cheeses fucked around with this message at 21:40 on Oct 15, 2015 |
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Oct 15, 2015 21:38
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James Madison in The Federalist Papers clearly states that I as a law abiding citizen have a right to a revolver that turns my arm into a weird bird laser
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Oct 15, 2015 21:42
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Tezzor posted:James Madison in The Federalist Papers clearly states that I as a law abiding citizen have a right to a revolver that turns my arm into a weird bird laser If you could get one, would you like guns then? Also I"m looking forward to making this thread again in 50 years when we all debate the constitutionality of mech ownership and lasers.
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Oct 15, 2015 21:46
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Thread, what is your opinion on handgun calibers
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Oct 15, 2015 22:02
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