USPOL Oct: So this is how the thread dies: with a Star Wars derail

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > USPOL Oct: So this is how the thread dies: with a Star Wars derail

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DivineCoffeeBinge: Mar 3, 2011; Spider-Man's Amazing Construction Company

darthbob88 posted:

A friend of mine argues that Trump would be the better candidate, because of his business experience. Where every other candidate will say "I'm no scientist, but I'll hold forth on global warming anyway", Trump will say "I'm no scientist, but I'll hire one". Even if he's not the best President, he'll make sure that he gets the best cabinet to advise him. Or possibly just the yoogest and most luxurious cabinet.

Because the "he'll surround himself with the best and the brightest, he'll be as much a CEO as a President" plan worked out so well with W...

# ? Oct 27, 2015 00:53

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# ? May 26, 2024 23:24

Evil Fluffy: Jul 13, 2009; Scholars are some of the most pompous and pedantic people I've ever had the joy of meeting.

Nelson Mandingo posted:

Err why would you cut this kind of deal with terrorists? I don't get it. This is an insanely bad deal.

Also that Carson authoritarianism is a thing of beauty. So what happens when the "extremist" thought is right-wing?

Reminder that the only reason we still have Social Security/Medicare is because when Obama offered to cut and cripple them in the past the fringe of the GOP wanted more.

# ? Oct 27, 2015 00:53

radical meme: Apr 17, 2009; by Fluffdaddy

paranoid randroid posted:

BLM's idea for a 7th debate is actually extremely good

No, it's not. BLM is not an organization, it's a meme, a hashtag. The people behind BLM are destructive to their own ideas and their own communities. BLM should be ignored, so they can fade away into obscurity; just like OWS.

# ? Oct 27, 2015 00:56

Heck Yes! Loam!: Nov 15, 2004; a rich, friable soil containing a relatively equal mixture of sand and silt and a somewhat smaller proportion of clay.

Haven't seen this posted yet, a good WaPo article on how we got to where we are.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opin...e830_story.html

quote:

Once McCain put Palin on the ticket, Republican �grown-ups,� who presumably knew better, had to bite their tongues. But after the election, when they were free to speak their minds, they either remained quiet or abetted the dumbing-down of the party. They stood by as Donald Trump and others noisily pushed claims that Obama was born in Kenya. And they gladly rode the tea party tiger to sweeping victories in 2010 and 2014.

Now that tiger is devouring the GOP establishment. Party elders had hoped new presidential debate rules would give them greater control. But they are watching helplessly as Trump leads the pack and House Republicans engage in fratricide.

It�s hard to feel much sympathy. The Republican establishment�s 2008 embrace of Palin set an irresponsibly low bar. Coincidence or not, a batch of nonsense-spewing, hard-right candidates quickly followed, often to disastrous effect.

Nothing we didn't already know, but a good synopsis for how we ended up so far through the looking glass.

# ? Oct 27, 2015 00:57

paranoid randroid: Mar 4, 2007

radical meme posted:

No, it's not. BLM is not an organization, it's a meme, a hashtag. The people behind BLM are destructive to their own ideas and their own communities. BLM should be ignored, so they can fade away into obscurity; just like OWS.

what is it with this trend of turning on activist movements when they fail to immediately produce drastic changes

# ? Oct 27, 2015 00:58

Lessail: Apr 1, 2011; tell me how vgk aren't playing like shit again

p.s. help my grapes are so sour!

radical meme posted:

No, it's not. BLM is not an organization, it's a meme, a hashtag. The people behind BLM are destructive to their own ideas and their own communities. BLM should be ignored, so they can fade away into obscurity; just like OWS.

"A debate focusing solely on the issues facing minorities is a bad idea "

# ? Oct 27, 2015 00:58

paranoid randroid: Mar 4, 2007

even if you believe BLM has failed, we kinda need to have a serious loving discussion in this country about how its basically legal to murder black people, so yeah a debate specifically on that topic is not unwarranted

# ? Oct 27, 2015 01:00

radical meme: Apr 17, 2009; by Fluffdaddy

Lessail posted:

"A debate focusing solely on the issues facing minorities is a bad idea "

paranoid randroid posted:

even if you believe BLM has failed, we kinda need to have a serious loving discussion in this country about how its basically legal to murder black people, so yeah a debate specifically on that topic is not unwarranted

That's not what BLM wants. Read the article I posted and then tell me how the people behind BLM want an honest debate about anything.

# ? Oct 27, 2015 01:00

Epic High Five: Jun 5, 2004

BetterToRuleInHell posted:

And now, a slice of life (it's MSNBC, talking about politics or something) -- watch what you say around Melissa Harris Perry:

Check your work privilege, motherfucker As a matter of fact, don't even describe people in any way at all because SLAVERY.

Melissa Harris Perry is the liberal that Bill Maher mocks.

I actually work a cushy spot in IT now after a decade running restaurants and I love shooting down whiners with stories about real work, but that's comparing low volume sysadmin duties to working 12 hours in a loving restaurant kitchen 5 days a week.

Long hours and high stakes may not be the same as picking cotton but both are hard work. She'd be better off having a sign that says, "HOW MANY VOTES DID YOU MISS THIS YEAR?"

Mulva posted:

She's right people do use "hard working" as code for white people, especially when talking about economic issues.

And part of it is sometimes I have to be the guy to shut somebody up about minimum wage earners with a cold, "no, he DOES work harder than you. It's a straight up fact."

A lot of people unironically believe that more income = harder working but it's very, very far from the truth.

# ? Oct 27, 2015 01:01

paranoid randroid: Mar 4, 2007

radical meme posted:

That's not what BLM wants. Read the article I posted and then tell me how the people behind BLM want an honest debate about anything.

wait who are these unitary BLM people, i thought they werent an organization??

# ? Oct 27, 2015 01:02

radical meme: Apr 17, 2009; by Fluffdaddy

paranoid randroid posted:

wait who are these unitary BLM people, i thought they werent an organization??

Their not.

# ? Oct 27, 2015 01:03

Heck Yes! Loam!: Nov 15, 2004; a rich, friable soil containing a relatively equal mixture of sand and silt and a somewhat smaller proportion of clay.

It seems to me that a wise candidate could set up a series of town halls across the nation specifically for the BLM movement. It would be a great way to get the topics out in the media. The problem is I just don't see anyone but Bernie actually doing it.

Also, don't think that think it is wise to for people to treat BLM the same way OWS was treated. It's easy to throw movements under the bus for whatever reason, but this one should be treated with a bit of respect as its about trying to stop the police from murdering black people. Yeah, some rear end in a top hat will use the BLM name to do stupid poo poo, but ignore them and focus on the part about not murdering black people.

EDIT: One more for the ignore list. Can't handle misuses of they're.

# ? Oct 27, 2015 01:06

Mean Baby: May 28, 2005

paranoid randroid posted:

what is it with this trend of turning on activist movements when they fail to immediately produce drastic changes

"trend?"

Name a social movement that at the time was not turned on immediately by the majority of the political establishment. They threaten the establishment, so they tend to be demonized by those who are/believe in the establishment. I think it is particularly strong with BLM who are perceived as hurting Bernie Sanders, a "natural ally". OWS I don't get as much, because really they helped Obama get re-elected more than anything.

# ? Oct 27, 2015 01:06

Caros: May 14, 2008

Lessail posted:

"A debate focusing solely on the issues facing minorities is a bad idea "

To play devil's advocate, wouldn't this hypothetical 'debate' be less that and more a great 'sucking of the cocks two hour event'?

I mean I agree that addressing minority issues is great, and it'd make sense to see it in the general, but in the democratic debates? Is there any substantive difference between the remaining candidates on minority groups? That isn't a hypothetical by the by, I'm honestly asking because last I've heard Hillary has the same position as Bernie and no one gives a poo poo about... The one who's name isn't Chafee who I can't remember. Or lawrence lessig I suppose who would probably reply to every question with "Campaign finance reform now, Campaign finance reform forever"

# ? Oct 27, 2015 01:06

Von Sloneker: Jul 6, 2009; as if all this was something more
than another footnote on a postcard from nowhere,
another chapter in the handbook for exercises in futility

From last page, sorry I'm late but

Aurubin posted:

So David Vitter is gonna be governor of Louisiana right?

Joementum posted:

Depends

# ? Oct 27, 2015 01:06

Captain_Maclaine: Sep 30, 2001; Every moment that I'm alive, I pray for death!

Bob Ojeda posted:

Why is the Tortilla Party so opposed to Ex-Im again?

Rabid, reflexive hatred of the existence of government.

# ? Oct 27, 2015 01:09

paranoid randroid: Mar 4, 2007

radical meme posted:

Their not.

so how does BLM, which does not have some unified string-pulling component on account of not being an organization, manage to have ulterior motives

# ? Oct 27, 2015 01:09

Mean Baby: May 28, 2005

Caros posted:

To play devil's advocate, wouldn't this hypothetical 'debate' be less that and more a great 'sucking of the cocks two hour event'?

I mean I agree that addressing minority issues is great, and it'd make sense to see it in the general, but in the democratic debates? Is there any substantive difference between the remaining candidates on minority groups? That isn't a hypothetical by the by, I'm honestly asking because last I've heard Hillary has the same position as Bernie and no one gives a poo poo about... The one who's name isn't Chafee who I can't remember. Or lawrence lessig I suppose who would probably reply to every question with "Campaign finance reform now, Campaign finance reform forever"

Remember when CNN asked one questions about race relations and it was "Do black lives matter or do ALL LIVES MATTER?"

They are trying to make it is a focus of the campaign.

# ? Oct 27, 2015 01:09

Heck Yes! Loam!: Nov 15, 2004; a rich, friable soil containing a relatively equal mixture of sand and silt and a somewhat smaller proportion of clay.

Von Sloneker posted:

From last page, sorry I'm late but

I missed that too. I miss the simple days where we could make diaper jokes. Now we have to worry about Trump. Not nearly as much fun.

# ? Oct 27, 2015 01:11

Nonsense: Jan 26, 2007

Don't Republicans have a fundie debate that some candidates don't even go to, but it's still a "GOP-social debate", DWS isn't going to let anything expand the debates window.

# ? Oct 27, 2015 01:11

Bwee: Jul 1, 2005

Black Lives Matter is actually extremely good

# ? Oct 27, 2015 01:12

abelwingnut: Dec 23, 2002

Nonsense posted:

Don't Republicans have a fundie debate that some candidates don't even go to, but it's still a "GOP-social debate", DWS isn't going to let anything expand the debates window.

that was the debate where bachmann poured water for all the participants, right?

# ? Oct 27, 2015 01:15

SpiderHyphenMan: Apr 1, 2010; by Fluffdaddy

So is there anything good about the budget being passed right now beyond "well at least it's not a default?"

# ? Oct 27, 2015 01:18

Mitt Romney: Nov 9, 2005; dumb and bad

Has anyone read Axelrod's book? Is it worth reading?

# ? Oct 27, 2015 01:23

Solkanar512: Dec 28, 2006; by the sex ghost

NNick posted:

Name a social movement that at the time was not turned on immediately by the majority of the political establishment. They threaten the establishment, so they tend to be demonized by those who are/believe in the establishment. I think it is particularly strong with BLM who are perceived as hurting Bernie Sanders, a "natural ally". OWS I don't get as much, because really they helped Obama get re-elected more than anything.

I think this is a rather facile argument that is used to ignore anyone who puts up specific arguments against specific tactics used by members of BLM.

# ? Oct 27, 2015 01:23

Swan Oat: Oct 9, 2012; I was selected for my skill.

Sword of Chomsky posted:

EDIT: One more for the ignore list. Can't handle misuses of they're.

lol

# ? Oct 27, 2015 01:23

Mitt Romney: Nov 9, 2005; dumb and bad

SpiderHyphenMan posted:

So is there anything good about the budget being passed right now beyond "well at least it's not a default?"

It actually seems like a pretty reasonable budget that takes care of a few outstanding issues.

# ? Oct 27, 2015 01:24

ComradeCosmobot: Dec 4, 2004; USPOL July

NNick posted:

Remember when CNN asked one questions about race relations and it was "Do black lives matter or do ALL LIVES MATTER?"

They are trying to make it is a focus of the campaign.

But BLM is right in saying that that question is a terrible one because it a) did nothing to explicitly spell out the issues of BLM for the public, b) was a nasty coded question (because "all lives matter" basically downplays the BLM movement's complaint by making their lives equal to everyone else without acknowledging the fact that blacks are unfairly targeted by current police tactics) and c) was a lovely gotcha question (either you're "for" Black Lives Matter, and thus presumably against the idea that police lives matter, too, losing you white votes, or you're for "all lives matter" and, as mentioned above, presumably think that the BLM movement is bogus, and lose black votes)

And that's to say nothing of the awful pandering in the choice of questioner itself ("Oh, we'll let noted African-American anchor Don Lemon ask the question that African-Americans care about. Now back to the white anchors for the other questions.")

The question was bad, like everything else that comes out of CNN.

# ? Oct 27, 2015 01:24

Mean Baby: May 28, 2005

ComradeCosmobot posted:

But BLM is right in saying that that question is a terrible one because it a) did nothing to explicitly spell out the issues of BLM for the public, b) was a nasty coded question (because "all lives matter" basically downplays the BLM movement's complaint by making their lives equal to everyone else without acknowledging the fact that blacks are unfairly targeted by current police tactics) and c) was a lovely gotcha question (either you're "for" Black Lives Matter, and thus presumably against the idea that police lives matter, too, or you're for "all lives matter" and, as mentioned above, presumably think that the BLM movement is bogus)

And that's to say nothing of the awful pandering in the choice of questioner itself ("Oh, we'll let noted African-American anchor Don Lemon ask the question that African-Americans care about. Now back to the white anchors for the other questions.")

The question was bad, like everything else that comes out of CNN.

Oh yeah I agree with their strategy and the need for a debate on racial justice issues . I was trying to make your point just more dickish

# ? Oct 27, 2015 01:26

Nissin Cup Nudist: Sep 3, 2011; Sleep with one eye open

We're off to Gritty Gritty land

NNick posted:

Remember when CNN asked one questions about race relations and it was "Do black lives matter or do ALL LIVES MATTER?"

They are trying to make it is a focus of the campaign.

NoLivesMatter

Dehumanize yourself and face to upcoming defualtpocalyspe

# ? Oct 27, 2015 01:26

Solkanar512: Dec 28, 2006; by the sex ghost

ComradeCosmobot posted:

But BLM is right in saying that that question is a terrible one because it a) did nothing to explicitly spell out the issues of BLM for the public, b) was a nasty coded question (because "all lives matter" basically downplays the BLM movement's complaint by making their lives equal to everyone else without acknowledging the fact that blacks are unfairly targeted by current police tactics) and c) was a lovely gotcha question (either you're "for" Black Lives Matter, and thus presumably against the idea that police lives matter, too, or you're for "all lives matter" and, as mentioned above, presumably think that the BLM movement is bogus)

And that's to say nothing of the awful pandering in the choice of questioner itself ("Oh, we'll let noted African-American anchor Don Lemon ask the question that African-Americans care about. Now back to the white anchors for the other questions.")

The question was bad, like everything else that comes out of CNN.

Yeah, this is absolutely correct and it was shameful as gently caress, but then why was an offer of town hall debate turned down? Do they not like the format, or was it literally going to be some closed door affair?

# ? Oct 27, 2015 01:27

Teriyaki Koinku: Nov 25, 2008; Bread! Bread! Bread!

Bread! BREAD! BREAD!

TheRamblingSoul posted:

Good loving luck with that.

In a lot of states, sex ed amounts to "100% abstinence no questions asked, now look at all these horrible STIs you'll definitely get from pre-marital sex!" But that's a separate discussion, I suppose.

Don't forget helping upon helping of "you don't want to be a chewed up piece of gum" bullshit for the ladies!

# ? Oct 27, 2015 01:33

SpiderHyphenMan: Apr 1, 2010; by Fluffdaddy

Mitt Romney posted:

It actually seems like a pretty reasonable budget that takes care of a few outstanding issues.

Yeah I refreshed Google News and it went from "Increase military spending and get the money from social programs" to "Increase spending cap on both those things."

# ? Oct 27, 2015 01:35

ComradeCosmobot: Dec 4, 2004; USPOL July

NNick posted:

Oh yeah I agree with their strategy and the need for a debate on racial justice issues . I was trying to make your point just more dickish

Ah I thought your "they" was talking about the DNC and Democrats ostensibly trying to downplay the movement by diluting its questions and influence, not BLM trying to point out why it's wrong to do so.

# ? Oct 27, 2015 01:36

darthbob88: Oct 13, 2011; YOSPOS

DivineCoffeeBinge posted:

Because the "he'll surround himself with the best and the brightest, he'll be as much a CEO as a President" plan worked out so well with W...

I was thinking more of Reagan, who did surround himself with the best and the brightest and the evilest. Still though, Trump would be strictly preferable to Carson.

# ? Oct 27, 2015 01:47

Teriyaki Koinku: Nov 25, 2008; Bread! Bread! Bread!

Bread! BREAD! BREAD!

CommieGIR posted:

http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-show/carson-sketches-out-plan-monitoring-campus-speech?cid=sm_fb_maddow

That seems... Awfully similar to encouraging students to report on teachers/professors for not adhering to Maoist orthodoxy during the Cultural Revolution. :china: